I'd be careful with ANYTHING that comes from this guide, as even some of the very basics are wrong.
For example, it states in the beginning "An elite affix that returns 15%-20% of the damage you deal, onto you". => It's actually exactly 10%.
The rest of this guide is about how to deal with RD by using other skills or health regeneration - which is not the best approach. The best approach to deal with RD is by stacking physical resistance (as reflected damage is always physical, regardless of what damage type you initially were dealing).
Anyways, I'm not entirely sure if I understood OP right, but we're talking about two different things here:
1) Reflected damage by the monsters
2) Reflected damage by players
The first is 10% of the damage you dealt, coming back as physical damage. In terms of mitigation, armor and physical resistance reduces it. So not sure what you mean about "post-mitigation", as far as I know it's not mitigated by the monsters (and to be honest, we have no accurate information about monsters' mitigation anyways), but reflected back to you before monster mitigation.
The second is stuff like Wave of Force, which is difficult to measure as it's really difficult to "target" the reflected missiles (best being done in combination with Slow Time). But again, I have never heard about this being affected by any mitigation, either players or monsters.
Edit: meh, forget about this post. I didn't know that you were talking about Mantra of Retribution, I just saw Wave of Force and thought this was the wizard forum. I'll go and leave now, only have passing knowledge about monk's spells and abilities ;-)
But the concept of a fully reflected attack also pertains to Wave of Force. A Monk's Serenity Instant Karma also reflects an attack (not reflect damage or so it is written.)
I've done some calculation on Mantra of Retribution and it returns damage post-mitigation that's why the reflected damage is very very weak when you've got lots of mitigation.
On the other hand, a Reflect Attack seems very different. I'm assuming the damage done by the monster's attack isn't mitigated by your damage reduction. It's a logical deduction seeing as a reflect attack with Wave of Force never needs to hit you to be reflected so I don't think mitigation is factored in. If it's that way then I think Instant Karma would function the same.
"Reflects Damage - The Reflects Damage elite monster affix has been overhauled. It now works much like the Shielding affix; a monster with Reflects Damage will periodically have a visual effect, and when that's active it can reflect damage. The damage reflected is capped at 10% of the monster's current health."
So it's not a flat 10% of your damage that is reflected back? Uh? Now I'm confused.
Edit, maybe I should start a new thread.
Why the confusion? It's just an addition. Yes, 10% of your damage is reflected back as physical damage. The 10% in your quote are just there to prevent getting killed from outgearing content or overkill damage (for example, your target has only 100k HP left, but you crit it for 2 million damage - which might instantly kill you (200k damage reflected). The cap reduced the reflected damage to 10k.
And yeah, you should start a new thread if you have more questions about this ;-)
There is no mitigation on the monster side. I'm pretty sure of that now because of my test.
I let a Khazra brute hit me, it did 4k~. I switched on Instant Karma, I dodge its first strike, then the second strike the brute was dealt 4k~ damage (plus a little measly 200 thorns).
In other words, based on my results, your statement is correct that the damage to be returned is calculated even before the attack visibly connects.
Thanks for that info. However, this makes Wave of Force a far more curious case.
BTW, I don't use MoR because the damage it provides is too low. I use a heavy-Dodge Backlash build (sometimes I switch to my fun Tsunami Sledgefist). My question came up because I have 2 skill slots open and I didn't know what to put in them and I thought I could use Instant Karma.
What are the differences between Reflected Attack and Reflected Damage?
I know that Reflect Damage returns damage post-mitigation (which makes it a dumb effect because who doesn't want to mitigate damage?)
From my understanding, Reflect Attack returns the damage pre-mitigation, something like Wave of Force deflecting missile attacks.
To clear things
Mantra of Retribution = Reflected Damage
Serenity:Instant Karma or even Wave of Force = Reflected Attack
For example, it states in the beginning "An elite affix that returns 15%-20% of the damage you deal, onto you". => It's actually exactly 10%.
The rest of this guide is about how to deal with RD by using other skills or health regeneration - which is not the best approach. The best approach to deal with RD is by stacking physical resistance (as reflected damage is always physical, regardless of what damage type you initially were dealing).
Anyways, I'm not entirely sure if I understood OP right, but we're talking about two different things here:
1) Reflected damage by the monsters
2) Reflected damage by players
The first is 10% of the damage you dealt, coming back as physical damage. In terms of mitigation, armor and physical resistance reduces it. So not sure what you mean about "post-mitigation", as far as I know it's not mitigated by the monsters (and to be honest, we have no accurate information about monsters' mitigation anyways), but reflected back to you before monster mitigation.
The second is stuff like Wave of Force, which is difficult to measure as it's really difficult to "target" the reflected missiles (best being done in combination with Slow Time). But again, I have never heard about this being affected by any mitigation, either players or monsters.
Edit: meh, forget about this post. I didn't know that you were talking about Mantra of Retribution, I just saw Wave of Force and thought this was the wizard forum. I'll go and leave now, only have passing knowledge about monk's spells and abilities ;-)
I've done some calculation on Mantra of Retribution and it returns damage post-mitigation that's why the reflected damage is very very weak when you've got lots of mitigation.
On the other hand, a Reflect Attack seems very different. I'm assuming the damage done by the monster's attack isn't mitigated by your damage reduction. It's a logical deduction seeing as a reflect attack with Wave of Force never needs to hit you to be reflected so I don't think mitigation is factored in. If it's that way then I think Instant Karma would function the same.
I've also discovered that you Dodge takes precedence over Absorb and Block. So having high dodge doesn't work all that well with Serenity.
I'll have to try out Wave of Force next but that's for a different forum now.
Why the confusion? It's just an addition. Yes, 10% of your damage is reflected back as physical damage. The 10% in your quote are just there to prevent getting killed from outgearing content or overkill damage (for example, your target has only 100k HP left, but you crit it for 2 million damage - which might instantly kill you (200k damage reflected). The cap reduced the reflected damage to 10k.
And yeah, you should start a new thread if you have more questions about this ;-)
I let a Khazra brute hit me, it did 4k~. I switched on Instant Karma, I dodge its first strike, then the second strike the brute was dealt 4k~ damage (plus a little measly 200 thorns).
In other words, based on my results, your statement is correct that the damage to be returned is calculated even before the attack visibly connects.
Thanks for that info. However, this makes Wave of Force a far more curious case.
BTW, I don't use MoR because the damage it provides is too low. I use a heavy-Dodge Backlash build (sometimes I switch to my fun Tsunami Sledgefist). My question came up because I have 2 skill slots open and I didn't know what to put in them and I thought I could use Instant Karma.