I wouldn't say completely. you do need your proteins to recover after working out or you'll just fuck up your muscles and gain no strength nor mass. Junk food doesn't give the same energy for when you workout as proper food would. For strength gain food isn't very important, for mass it is.
It's good to have a little discussion on each others experience/knowledge, and we both like helping out the newbs
Did you study for this or just been in -the scene- for a while?
eating healthier does give you more energy but its not so drastic to increase your size/str vs. someone who doesnt eat healthy by some huge amount, it wouldnt really even be noticeable until the time span went into years. protein and carbs are most important for gaining size and str. diet is far more difficult then going to the gym. it takes a lot of self control to maintain a very healthy diet.
yea i love helping, i see SO many people in the gym working out wrong but i know people dont like their work out interupted just for some "big shot" giving them tips on what there doing wrong so i dont tend to give much advice in person. online is safer and people take your advice better because there seeking it VS other people in the gym who are convinced there 'doing it right'.
i started working out at about 16 when i was a mere 110 lbs of skin and bone. over the years ive worked out with tons of different people and i sit at my comp and do lots of research regarding specific work outs and supplements before i try anything, then ill test it and see if it actually works. thers alot of scams out there so without proper information its easy to waste money and gain nothing.
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"once the pretty hardcore gamers we had testing inferno found it fairly difficult, we then we doubled it" -trolololol jay wilson
Hold up, with diet i was talking about getting the right kcals (carbs/protein). Long as you get enough of those it's fine. Doesn't matter if you get em from eating 30 pizza's or eggs and bread. With diet i did not mean sticking around X kcals a day. You need to be above your daily kcal need to gain mass, and that's it.
Haha yeah sounds familiar. those people who do their bicep curls so wild, that they even train their back and shoulders with it <_< .
I guess i'm too young to be taken seriously by those people, ain't my problem though cuz they're the one f*cking up their exercise.
Wow that is one damn skinny weight! How tall were you?
I started when i just turned 15 and i was like ... 1 meter 68 on 55kg (121pounds).
I've spent dozens of nights scrolling through BB forums + the rest of the internet and it's been well worth it.
I have a good site for my supplements with various good reviewers, so that helps a lot.
oh i thought you meant someone eating healthier then another person like more veggies. lol.
ya i was about 5'9 ish at 16. im only 5'11 now. OR i hate when people do bicep curls and there only going half way down... <_< ... there ARE work outs where you go half way down and then start at the middle and do it half way again but they are treating it as a "full" rep and only go halfway, its like ok buddy your not THAT strong yet, go down in weight and you'll get there. or they do bicep curls standing up and swing there body to lift the weight its so sad. thats why i ALWAYS do preacher curls for 100% bicep isolation.
internet and personal experience gets you anywhere you need to be. im still growing in size, my ultimate goal is around 250 lbs. hopefully i can reach it sometime next year
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"once the pretty hardcore gamers we had testing inferno found it fairly difficult, we then we doubled it" -trolololol jay wilson
5'11 is about 1.80, which i am as well
Yeah, the people thinking: "If i pick up as heavy as i can possible hold i'll look real tough and will grow just like those big guys who lift this as well!". They then do like 3 or 4 reps swinging their entire body and using momentum to get that weight up... shame on them >.>
Preacher curls are nice, with a barbell/ezbar though. Working out on machines just doesn't work for me. It's one of the only isolation exercises i currently have in my schedule, mass gain ftw. Using all winter to bulk and just gain mass with compound exercises, then when i it's time to cut i'll do my isolation
That's a very nice goal, i'm currently just taking it month by month. trying to gain at least 3kg a month.
haha yea, a lot of people at the gym are so lame.
ya i meant with the bar, i MOSTLY do free weights. i will do the machines to change it up every now and again but more or less 80% of the time im using free weights for most exercises.
my weight fluxuates far too much for me to pay attention to it exactly. also for like the past 2 months ive gained a ton of strength and zero weight because of losing fat at the same time i was liek wtf i weigh the same! lol. 3 kg's seems like a good goal though. when i first started lifting i gained about 22.7kg's in the first 6 months.
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"once the pretty hardcore gamers we had testing inferno found it fairly difficult, we then we doubled it" -trolololol jay wilson
eating healthier does give you more energy but its not so drastic to increase your size/str vs. someone who doesnt eat healthy by some huge amount
Sounds like an excuse to eat junk food
You necrod' so there ya go
if i dont tell myself this. how do i account for the 4 pizza's and 12 fast food runs i eat every week?
Well think about your sodium levels and cholesterol :D.
+ higher sodium increases water retention :
Sodium in most cases is responsible for causing significant amounts of water retention, which makes you look soft and also stops you from losing the amount of weight you so dearly want to shed.
Think of that next time u go for fast food
good info. but good thing im not trying to lose weight nom nom NOM taco bell
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"once the pretty hardcore gamers we had testing inferno found it fairly difficult, we then we doubled it" -trolololol jay wilson
I actually started your begginer's routine this past monday. So far, so good. I do like 1 more excersice per day though, one per muscle group feels like too little. I did biceps and triceps today. I messed up my dips and now my shoulder hurts more than it should, nothing serious though. Any extra advice?
I actually started your begginer's routine this past monday. So far, so good. I do like 1 more excersice per day though, one per muscle group feels like too little. I did biceps and triceps today. I messed up my dips and now my shoulder hurts more than it should, nothing serious though. Any extra advice?
oh what happened when u were doing dips? did you warm up properly? shoulder injuries are no joke. dips is my favorite work out though :D. at first doing 1 muscle group a day isnt enough because you cant do a super intense work out yet, and like i said before you dont have to do a ton of different machines/work outs for your muscles either. like yesteday i only did 1 exercise for my triceps and there extremely sore. i did skull crushers and kept going up n up n up in weight. then i did a drop down set till i could barley do a 50 lb dumbell. and that was my whole work out. when your going up n up in weight you take long rest periods in between so it takes alot longer to do each work out.
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"once the pretty hardcore gamers we had testing inferno found it fairly difficult, we then we doubled it" -trolololol jay wilson
I actually started your begginer's routine this past monday. So far, so good. I do like 1 more excersice per day though, one per muscle group feels like too little. I did biceps and triceps today. I messed up my dips and now my shoulder hurts more than it should, nothing serious though. Any extra advice?
If you do 1 exercise per muscle group while doing all muscle groups its totally fine if you do that 3 times a week.
Also when you start to do a work out, try to never do it for longer than 1 hour, its been said in many studies that after that you will more likely do more harm than good.
If your shoulder hurts, or whatever muscle group, try to let it heal before you do any exercise with that. Light stretching and cardio is fine.
Also to avoid injuries, soreness and infact increase effectiveness of your workouts always warm up and stretch, and after the workout cooldown (which is the same thing as warm up).
From what i know, i suggest having atleast 1 day in between workout sessions, you can do some cardio on that day though if you want.
your first statement is wrong for someone who wants to gain size fast. the rest is correct but ive already stated that info in my OP
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"once the pretty hardcore gamers we had testing inferno found it fairly difficult, we then we doubled it" -trolololol jay wilson
If your shoulder hurts, or whatever muscle group, try to let it heal before you do any exercise with that. Light stretching and cardio is fine.
Also to avoid injuries, soreness and infact increase effectiveness of your workouts always warm up and stretch, and after the workout cooldown (which is the same thing as warm up).
From what i know, i suggest having atleast 1 day in between workout sessions, you can do some cardio on that day though if you want.
Yeah, of course, I'm not gonna excersice a muscle that is still sore. So, I should "warm up" after each exercise, or after the whole "gym day"? And yeah, I'm pretty much following WishedHeHadBeta's beginers guide in the OP, there's no 2-workout-days-in-a-row there.
your first statement is wrong for someone who wants to gain size fast. the rest is correct but ive already stated that info in my OP
He didnt say anything about fast.
And its also a question of what size. Muscle mass, or just mass :D?
HIT workouts can be almost as effective as any other while gaining other benefits, like not gaining as much fat. But when you try to gain weight, ofc gaining fat is unavoidable. But why not try to minimize that?
you said "If you do 1 exercise per muscle group while doing all muscle groups its totally fine if you do that 3 times a week."
this is VERY wrong for anyoen who wants to gain muscle period. if you worked out your muscles enough to be sore it takes 4-5 days for it to FULLY recover. working out all your muscles more then once a week is horrible. this can easily result in injuries and will decrease muscle growth significantly. why? because your just re-tearing the already torn muscles. a rule of thumb to follow is whatever day your muscle group stops being 100% sore, work it out the NEXT day. fully recovered muscles are happy/strong muscles ready to take on the next intense work out. i mentioned this in my OP, you should read it so i dont have to re-type or copy n paste it, lol :P.
basically working out sore muscles = bad
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"once the pretty hardcore gamers we had testing inferno found it fairly difficult, we then we doubled it" -trolololol jay wilson
If your shoulder hurts, or whatever muscle group, try to let it heal before you do any exercise with that. Light stretching and cardio is fine.
Also to avoid injuries, soreness and infact increase effectiveness of your workouts always warm up and stretch, and after the workout cooldown (which is the same thing as warm up).
From what i know, i suggest having atleast 1 day in between workout sessions, you can do some cardio on that day though if you want.
Yeah, of course, I'm not gonna excersice a muscle that is still sore. So, I should "warm up" after each exercise, or after the whole "gym day"? And yeah, I'm pretty much following WishedHeHadBeta's beginers guide in the OP, there's no 2-workout-days-in-a-row there.
please dont listen to other people attempting to give advice, this bothers me more then anything, people giving out false advice. he didnt read any of my OP and is just stating things i already proved wrong in my post. his intentions are good but inexperienced people shouldn't give out advice.
'warm ups' are BEFORE each and every specific work out you do, such as 10-15 easy bicep curls with light weight to warm them up and prepare to do your bicep work out.
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"once the pretty hardcore gamers we had testing inferno found it fairly difficult, we then we doubled it" -trolololol jay wilson
you said "If you do 1 exercise per muscle group while doing all muscle groups its totally fine if you do that 3 times a week."
this is VERY wrong for anyoen who wants to gain muscle period. if you worked out your muscles enough to be sore it takes 4-5 days for it to FULLY recover. working out all your muscles more then once a week is horrible. this can easily result in injuries and will decrease muscle growth significantly. why? because your just re-tearing the already torn muscles. a rule of thumb to follow is whatever day your muscle group stops being 100% sore, work it out the NEXT day. fully recovered muscles are happy/strong muscles ready to take on the next intense work out. i mentioned this in my OP, you should read it so i dont have to re-type or copy n paste it, lol :P.
basically working out sore muscles = bad
I guess i shouldve read OP's post /trollface
But my advice is not false.
If you want to know more about bodybuilding instead of just basing everything on anecdotal experience and the 2 guides you read. Then look up 'High Intensity Training' workouts (HIT) they are good. Instead of working some muscle groups to max once a weak, you train them less but 3 times a week, I could explain in more detail but there are hundreds of guides explaining it. And i also do have experience as well as what some instructors teach beginners by default.
Did I mention HIT training doesn't or at least shouldn't cause muscle soreness. It happens yeah, but once you know how to avoid it its simple. By the way if you are still regularly getting muscle soreness after so much experience, youre doing something wrong.
After reading your OP post, you kind of contradict yourself with cardio days. Cardio is good yes, and its totally fine to do it, but really you are all about gaining weight, and as much as possible, and by your own words cardio robs you of your weight gains - and that is true even on "off" days. And you dont do that for endurance, while it can help you with that, thats not the main reason to do it. And you already build endurance for weightlifting by you know... umm... DOING weightlifting !?
Weightlifting is more science than you think.
But sorry i kinda mixed things up for him, since indeed i hadnt read OP and didnt know what he was refering to.
i AM the OP sir. ive spent years researching and experimenting. many years. if you read my first paragraph you'd know that. when i say gaining size/str i dont mean fat. i mean pure muscle.
by the statement i bolded in your reply you have no idea what your talking about. because its the exact opposite. if your NOT still getting sore your working out wrong. why is your muscle sore? because its very torn from a good work out. if your not sore the next 2 days your doing it so very very wrong. you muscles didnt get a good enough work out is all that means. soreness is the number 1 sign of a good work out. you either didnt push yourself hard enough or havent been changing up your routine, if you constantly change up what machines/exercises you do per muscle group and always push yourself you will ALWAYS be sore, every work out, forever.
the fact that you not only didnt know this but thought the opposite just shows how insanely little you actually know. i dont feel like arguing with another wannabe weight lift guru who knows nothing. begone with you sir, with haste!
EDIT: if you for some reason feel like defending "you wont be sore anymore /supertroll" go google "muscle soreness" and read the hundreds of articles saying what muscle soreness actually is. lol
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"once the pretty hardcore gamers we had testing inferno found it fairly difficult, we then we doubled it" -trolololol jay wilson
I know your op ofc, otherwise you wouldnt have done the "necro" post
And again if you just spent 10 mins doing research you'd know im not wrong.
It seems like you feel a sense of entitlement to be right and your word in the regard is fact because you've been doing this for a long time. But that's really it - anecdotal evidence.
I know most of what you say in the OP post is right, and as you see i actually repeated few things you had already said so its invalid for you to say that I know nothing.
If you prefer to be sore always after training then so be it, but don't say its the only and the proper end all be all way to do it, cause it's not.
And judging by your posts and how you eat, it seems like you are making and developing your theory as you go along to suit yourself, but that is not how facts are created.
Look up HIT workouts.
I studied your beginners guide and I do have some questions about it, in which, again, you contradict yourself, but I'll eagerly await your reply first.
were not talking about body conditioning. were not talking about becoming ripped or increasing muscle endurance. were talking about gaining pure muscle mass and strength to lift heavier and heavier weight. which if your not working out to soreness with constantly increasing your weight and switching up exercises, your gains will be few and far between.
if your CONDITIONING your body like the p90x or insanity work out then ya you'll stop being so sore after awhile because your not constantly increasing your weight. the HIT work outs are not even close to as good for gaining muscle size/str, its more conditioning type work outs, your gains will be WAY less. conditioning work outs do increase your strength but its 10x less effective then heavy lifting to soreness once every 4-5 days as far as gaining muscle str/size the fastest.
if you do know anything then your just simply mixing up what we are talking about then.
also, where do i "contradict" myself in the beginners guide?
EDIT: forgot about what you said about cardio.
cardio is very important for weight lifting, it gives you more energy to lift more and for longer, you'll get pooped out much faster if you dont do cardio, and no it doesnt rob your weight lifting gains if you do it on opposite days. even if it slightly effected gains on off days (it really doesnt) it more then makes up for it by increasing your endurance. and again were not talking about muscle conditioning, were talking about cardiovascular training, EI getting your heart rate up extremely high and keeping it there as long as possible. with long breaks in between work outs with heavy lifting your heart rate should never get above 140-150 let alone 180+ like with your cardio. the going to 180+ will make it so when you work out you can do more at the 140 range.
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"once the pretty hardcore gamers we had testing inferno found it fairly difficult, we then we doubled it" -trolololol jay wilson
"ive been working out a long time and i no longer get that sore" - if this is the case then your a HUGE noob and your working out wrong and/or not good enough. ive been working out constantly for years and i get sore after EVERY work out.
Based on people I know I always though that the longer you work out the shorter period of time your soreness lasts. Completely NOT getting sore is wrong, but you should be able to recover quicker the more experienced you are, no matter what. At least that's what I have heard from people who have been body building for 10 years or so.
Excellent post though. I know my shit pretty well too (partly from having a ridiculously awesome body building friend that has competed and has recently started an MMA career) and everything you wrote is great advice.
"ive been working out a long time and i no longer get that sore" - if this is the case then your a HUGE noob and your working out wrong and/or not good enough. ive been working out constantly for years and i get sore after EVERY work out.
Based on people I know I always though that the longer you work out the shorter period of time your soreness lasts. Completely NOT getting sore is wrong, but you should be able to recover quicker the more experienced you are.
Excellent post though. I know my shit pretty well too (partly from having a ridiculously awesome body building friend that has competed and has recently started an MMA career) and everything you wrote is great advice.
thank you very much. as for the soreness decreasing, yes it does. the initial soreness of working out in the beginning is INSANE or when you get back into it, sore for 5+ days and so on, then once your at the point years later your soreness is far less intense and lasts only 1-2 days. muscle soreness by definition is "your muscles tearing and adapting to become stronger" therefor not being sore at all = not good enough work out.
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"once the pretty hardcore gamers we had testing inferno found it fairly difficult, we then we doubled it" -trolololol jay wilson
doing reps very fast is extremely dangerous, even when properly warmed up you can severely injure yourself by doing reps too fast especially with high weight. doing reps too fast results in improper form and will also cause you to make gains less frequently. proper form is ALWAYS better. on your last couple reps while maxing out using slightly improper form is ok for EXPERIENCED body builders, but id stay away from any type of improper form in any work out. doing reps too slow will burn yes but it will result in very slow muscles and that extra power from the "pump" will increase your muscle size ten fold compared to very slow reps.
You do know what eccentric and concentric parts of a rep are?
MONDAY:
chest - flat bench, 2-3 sets. (all includes warm up as a set)
back - pull downs, WIDE grip. 2-3 sets
back - seated row. 2-3 sets
Bench press, pull down, rows are all compound exercises that means they are not isolated which means they affect other muscles a lot too. With bench press you heavily affect triceps and with pull downs (like pull ups) you affect biceps. And since your goal is to train your muscle groups and not touch them for a week you don't achieve that with this schedule since after you've worked your triceps and biceps on monday (to only a slightly lesser extent) you go train them again on wednesday.
It should look more like this (just reordering):
MONDAY:
chest - flat bench, 2-3 sets. (all includes warm up as a set)
triceps - pushdowns 2-3 sets
i put wide grip on the pull downs, ill put wide on the bench. i NEVER do close grip for either of those work outs because its cheating, your chest day isnt your tricep day therefor stop working them out so much fool! wide grip FTW! close grip just creates the illusion that your stronger then you really are by making half the work out your tri's and same with back days. if your intention was to do half/half then ok, but dont think anyone is impressed by your flat bench if your using close grip. super wide grip pull downs/pull ups and super wide bench press hardly effects your bi's tri's at all, its like 80-85% chest/back therefor its not worth thinking about the effect on your secondary muscles.
also whats your point with the "You do know what eccentric and concentric parts of a rep are?"? if you disagree then disagree, and state why/how im wrong.
EDIT: ah well i think i get what you mean. your talking about "negative" training right? i obviously didnt include every single piece of info needed for body building, the post would be a novel in that case. i could add something about negative training though, but thats not what im saying by "super slow reps" im talking about concentrically going slowly. i see people sometimes in the gym doing this and it just makes me laugh.
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"once the pretty hardcore gamers we had testing inferno found it fairly difficult, we then we doubled it" -trolololol jay wilson
super wide grip pull downs/pull ups and super wide bench press hardly effects your bi's tri's at all, its like 80-85% chest/back therefor its not worth thinking about the effect on your secondary muscles.
You mean more like 60-70, and yes its totally worth thinking about secondary muscles, youre dismissing a valid point.
And what is this "super wide grip" , i got taught "shoulder width" in school dont know about you. And the difference between normal and wide isnt that significant.
After reading your OP post, you kind of contradict yourself with cardio days. Cardio is good yes, and its totally fine to do it, but really you are all about gaining weight, and as much as possible, and by your own words cardio robs you of your weight gains - and that is true even on "off" days. And you dont do that for endurance, while it can help you with that, thats not the main reason to do it. And you already build endurance for weightlifting by you know... umm... DOING weightlifting !?
I'd like to get your thoughts on this.
In your OP post, I dont seem to have noticed you mentioning anything about breathing, or do you hold your breath for your reps? (fuck air tbh) Also i don't see any crunches or anything of the like, you know, the exercises that give you abs instead of beer belly. Abdominals can be trained 2-3 times a week, since they are muscle that recovers the fastest.
Speaking of rep speed, yeah doing reps fast is inadvisable but you can do eccentric movement fast and concentric slow. In fact for mass gain doing eccentric movement fast (explosively, with control ofc) is optimal.
one of the most common misconceptions on pull downs and flat bench is the grip. people think "shoulder width" is correct for both but its not even close. your right it is 60-70 IF your holding it "wrong" (i think its "wrong" since its pure chest or back day). you know the groove on either side of the flat bench bar to match your fingers up is at? you put each hand past that and have your thumb extended out touching it. "super wide grip" if you must call it that, and super wide compared to regular is a HUGE difference. and for pull downs with the long curved bar, you hold the absolute outer edge with each hand like your trying to make a giant 'V' with your arms. this will result in more like 80-90% of it being pure back/chest rather then using more of your bi's tri's.
i edited the cardio talk in one of my posts above.
i agree the 'explosion' is very important for muscle growth. i explode all over the gym..... ba dum tss*
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"once the pretty hardcore gamers we had testing inferno found it fairly difficult, we then we doubled it" -trolololol jay wilson
cardio is very important for weight lifting, it gives you more energy to lift more and for longer, you'll get pooped out much faster if you dont do cardio, and no it doesnt rob your weight lifting gains if you do it on opposite days. even if it slightly effected gains on off days (it really doesnt) it more then makes up for it by increasing your endurance. and again were not talking about muscle conditioning, were talking about cardiovascular training, EI getting your heart rate up extremely high and keeping it there as long as possible. with long breaks in between work outs with heavy lifting your heart rate should never get above 140-150 let alone 180+ like with your cardio. the going to 180+ will make it so when you work out you can do more at the 140 range.
I can't in good conscience agree with that. Cardio while good for health, is important only when youre in cutting/ripping whatever phase. You can use the "10 minute" cardio for warmup and warmdown like you suggested but thats it. I dont agree bcuz thats just not how it works, the calories you spend during cardio can be spent building your weight on the couch and in the kitchen ^_^.
And whats up with "pooping out" what does it even mean? You mean being unable to achieve what you set out to do during a workout (which shouldnt exceed one hour)? And really weightlifting, increases endurance for weightlifting.
In your OP post, I dont seem to have noticed you mentioning anything about breathing, or do you hold your breath for your reps? (fuck air tbh) Also i don't see any crunches or anything of the like, you know, the exercises that give you abs instead of beer belly. Abdominals can be trained 2-3 times a week, since they are muscle that recovers the fastest.
Still waiting thoughts on this
your right cardio does consume the calories and such thats why your eating like a garbage truck to make up for those lost calories, lol.
cardiovascular training increases your bodies ability to use less oxygen and do more with it, so your muscles get more oxygen then without cardio, while lifting weights do your muscles not use oxygen? it also increases your heart strength since after all your heart is indeed a muscle, do you not use your heart while your lifting weights? your heart can pump more blood easier to your muscles the stronger it is.
ill give you an example. i started out with zero cardio (i was a noob once :P)i never ever did cardio and hated it and my gains were decent, but it took nearly 2 years to gain 100 lb's of muscle.
a friend of my was all state track and field all through high school, he was VERY skinny, far skinnier and weaker then me when i started. he worked out for less then a year and then became stronger then me. you can imagine my surprise and anger to see this insane jump without the help of steroids. his heart was made of steel and his bodies ever lasting endurance made it so he could pump harder and faster and make far bigger gains then i did. after that i started doing cardio and never looked back, my gains increased at a much more rapid pace, instead of making big gains every 5-6 weeks i was making them in 3-4.
breathing:
obviously the cliche "exhale as you lift the weight" i use most often, but i only breathe in and out of my nose, breathing through your mouth is horrible, you in take far too much oxygen and your body exhales most of it. controlled very slow breathing through your nose is how your supposed to be breathing at ALL times, even during running. where em i getting this? the guy who trains olympic runners told me this, watch the olympics and you'll see the runners with almost all closed mouths even in an insane sprint. funny how 95% of everyone breathes through their mouth when working out or running, lol.
the science behind it:
breathing only through your nose even during intense cardio deprives your body of oxygen, its starving for loads and its forcing you to want to breathe through your mouth because its a whiny little bitch and is crying (:P), and your body has to "make do" with what oxygen you give it while breathing only through your nose. your body then uses this oxygen to create more co2 in your blood then normal, basically using less to create more. i also thought this was bull shit and had to test this out, i notice drastic increases in my endurance for cardio and overall after about a 6 weeks of training myself to always breathe through my nose.
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"once the pretty hardcore gamers we had testing inferno found it fairly difficult, we then we doubled it" -trolololol jay wilson
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eating healthier does give you more energy but its not so drastic to increase your size/str vs. someone who doesnt eat healthy by some huge amount, it wouldnt really even be noticeable until the time span went into years. protein and carbs are most important for gaining size and str. diet is far more difficult then going to the gym. it takes a lot of self control to maintain a very healthy diet.
yea i love helping, i see SO many people in the gym working out wrong but i know people dont like their work out interupted just for some "big shot" giving them tips on what there doing wrong so i dont tend to give much advice in person. online is safer and people take your advice better because there seeking it VS other people in the gym who are convinced there 'doing it right'.
i started working out at about 16 when i was a mere 110 lbs of skin and bone. over the years ive worked out with tons of different people and i sit at my comp and do lots of research regarding specific work outs and supplements before i try anything, then ill test it and see if it actually works. thers alot of scams out there so without proper information its easy to waste money and gain nothing.
oh i thought you meant someone eating healthier then another person like more veggies. lol.
ya i was about 5'9 ish at 16. im only 5'11 now. OR i hate when people do bicep curls and there only going half way down... <_< ... there ARE work outs where you go half way down and then start at the middle and do it half way again but they are treating it as a "full" rep and only go halfway, its like ok buddy your not THAT strong yet, go down in weight and you'll get there. or they do bicep curls standing up and swing there body to lift the weight its so sad. thats why i ALWAYS do preacher curls for 100% bicep isolation.
internet and personal experience gets you anywhere you need to be. im still growing in size, my ultimate goal is around 250 lbs. hopefully i can reach it sometime next year
haha yea, a lot of people at the gym are so lame.
ya i meant with the bar, i MOSTLY do free weights. i will do the machines to change it up every now and again but more or less 80% of the time im using free weights for most exercises.
my weight fluxuates far too much for me to pay attention to it exactly. also for like the past 2 months ive gained a ton of strength and zero weight because of losing fat at the same time i was liek wtf i weigh the same! lol. 3 kg's seems like a good goal though. when i first started lifting i gained about 22.7kg's in the first 6 months.
if i dont tell myself this. how do i account for the 4 pizza's and 12 fast food runs i eat every week?
good info. but good thing im not trying to lose weight nom nom NOM taco bell
oh what happened when u were doing dips? did you warm up properly? shoulder injuries are no joke. dips is my favorite work out though :D. at first doing 1 muscle group a day isnt enough because you cant do a super intense work out yet, and like i said before you dont have to do a ton of different machines/work outs for your muscles either. like yesteday i only did 1 exercise for my triceps and there extremely sore. i did skull crushers and kept going up n up n up in weight. then i did a drop down set till i could barley do a 50 lb dumbell. and that was my whole work out. when your going up n up in weight you take long rest periods in between so it takes alot longer to do each work out.
your first statement is wrong for someone who wants to gain size fast. the rest is correct but ive already stated that info in my OP
Yeah, of course, I'm not gonna excersice a muscle that is still sore. So, I should "warm up" after each exercise, or after the whole "gym day"? And yeah, I'm pretty much following WishedHeHadBeta's beginers guide in the OP, there's no 2-workout-days-in-a-row there.
you said "If you do 1 exercise per muscle group while doing all muscle groups its totally fine if you do that 3 times a week."
this is VERY wrong for anyoen who wants to gain muscle period. if you worked out your muscles enough to be sore it takes 4-5 days for it to FULLY recover. working out all your muscles more then once a week is horrible. this can easily result in injuries and will decrease muscle growth significantly. why? because your just re-tearing the already torn muscles. a rule of thumb to follow is whatever day your muscle group stops being 100% sore, work it out the NEXT day. fully recovered muscles are happy/strong muscles ready to take on the next intense work out. i mentioned this in my OP, you should read it so i dont have to re-type or copy n paste it, lol :P.
basically working out sore muscles = bad
please dont listen to other people attempting to give advice, this bothers me more then anything, people giving out false advice. he didnt read any of my OP and is just stating things i already proved wrong in my post. his intentions are good but inexperienced people shouldn't give out advice.
'warm ups' are BEFORE each and every specific work out you do, such as 10-15 easy bicep curls with light weight to warm them up and prepare to do your bicep work out.
i AM the OP sir. ive spent years researching and experimenting. many years. if you read my first paragraph you'd know that. when i say gaining size/str i dont mean fat. i mean pure muscle.
by the statement i bolded in your reply you have no idea what your talking about. because its the exact opposite. if your NOT still getting sore your working out wrong. why is your muscle sore? because its very torn from a good work out. if your not sore the next 2 days your doing it so very very wrong. you muscles didnt get a good enough work out is all that means. soreness is the number 1 sign of a good work out. you either didnt push yourself hard enough or havent been changing up your routine, if you constantly change up what machines/exercises you do per muscle group and always push yourself you will ALWAYS be sore, every work out, forever.
the fact that you not only didnt know this but thought the opposite just shows how insanely little you actually know. i dont feel like arguing with another wannabe weight lift guru who knows nothing. begone with you sir, with haste!
EDIT: if you for some reason feel like defending "you wont be sore anymore /supertroll" go google "muscle soreness" and read the hundreds of articles saying what muscle soreness actually is. lol
were not talking about body conditioning. were not talking about becoming ripped or increasing muscle endurance. were talking about gaining pure muscle mass and strength to lift heavier and heavier weight. which if your not working out to soreness with constantly increasing your weight and switching up exercises, your gains will be few and far between.
if your CONDITIONING your body like the p90x or insanity work out then ya you'll stop being so sore after awhile because your not constantly increasing your weight. the HIT work outs are not even close to as good for gaining muscle size/str, its more conditioning type work outs, your gains will be WAY less. conditioning work outs do increase your strength but its 10x less effective then heavy lifting to soreness once every 4-5 days as far as gaining muscle str/size the fastest.
if you do know anything then your just simply mixing up what we are talking about then.
also, where do i "contradict" myself in the beginners guide?
EDIT: forgot about what you said about cardio.
cardio is very important for weight lifting, it gives you more energy to lift more and for longer, you'll get pooped out much faster if you dont do cardio, and no it doesnt rob your weight lifting gains if you do it on opposite days. even if it slightly effected gains on off days (it really doesnt) it more then makes up for it by increasing your endurance. and again were not talking about muscle conditioning, were talking about cardiovascular training, EI getting your heart rate up extremely high and keeping it there as long as possible. with long breaks in between work outs with heavy lifting your heart rate should never get above 140-150 let alone 180+ like with your cardio. the going to 180+ will make it so when you work out you can do more at the 140 range.
Based on people I know I always though that the longer you work out the shorter period of time your soreness lasts. Completely NOT getting sore is wrong, but you should be able to recover quicker the more experienced you are, no matter what. At least that's what I have heard from people who have been body building for 10 years or so.
Excellent post though. I know my shit pretty well too (partly from having a ridiculously awesome body building friend that has competed and has recently started an MMA career) and everything you wrote is great advice.
thank you very much. as for the soreness decreasing, yes it does. the initial soreness of working out in the beginning is INSANE or when you get back into it, sore for 5+ days and so on, then once your at the point years later your soreness is far less intense and lasts only 1-2 days. muscle soreness by definition is "your muscles tearing and adapting to become stronger" therefor not being sore at all = not good enough work out.
i put wide grip on the pull downs, ill put wide on the bench. i NEVER do close grip for either of those work outs because its cheating, your chest day isnt your tricep day therefor stop working them out so much fool! wide grip FTW! close grip just creates the illusion that your stronger then you really are by making half the work out your tri's and same with back days. if your intention was to do half/half then ok, but dont think anyone is impressed by your flat bench if your using close grip. super wide grip pull downs/pull ups and super wide bench press hardly effects your bi's tri's at all, its like 80-85% chest/back therefor its not worth thinking about the effect on your secondary muscles.
also whats your point with the "You do know what eccentric and concentric parts of a rep are?"? if you disagree then disagree, and state why/how im wrong.
EDIT: ah well i think i get what you mean. your talking about "negative" training right? i obviously didnt include every single piece of info needed for body building, the post would be a novel in that case. i could add something about negative training though, but thats not what im saying by "super slow reps" im talking about concentrically going slowly. i see people sometimes in the gym doing this and it just makes me laugh.
one of the most common misconceptions on pull downs and flat bench is the grip. people think "shoulder width" is correct for both but its not even close. your right it is 60-70 IF your holding it "wrong" (i think its "wrong" since its pure chest or back day). you know the groove on either side of the flat bench bar to match your fingers up is at? you put each hand past that and have your thumb extended out touching it. "super wide grip" if you must call it that, and super wide compared to regular is a HUGE difference. and for pull downs with the long curved bar, you hold the absolute outer edge with each hand like your trying to make a giant 'V' with your arms. this will result in more like 80-90% of it being pure back/chest rather then using more of your bi's tri's.
i edited the cardio talk in one of my posts above.
i agree the 'explosion' is very important for muscle growth. i explode all over the gym..... ba dum tss*
your right cardio does consume the calories and such thats why your eating like a garbage truck to make up for those lost calories, lol.
cardiovascular training increases your bodies ability to use less oxygen and do more with it, so your muscles get more oxygen then without cardio, while lifting weights do your muscles not use oxygen? it also increases your heart strength since after all your heart is indeed a muscle, do you not use your heart while your lifting weights? your heart can pump more blood easier to your muscles the stronger it is.
ill give you an example. i started out with zero cardio (i was a noob once :P)i never ever did cardio and hated it and my gains were decent, but it took nearly 2 years to gain 100 lb's of muscle.
a friend of my was all state track and field all through high school, he was VERY skinny, far skinnier and weaker then me when i started. he worked out for less then a year and then became stronger then me. you can imagine my surprise and anger to see this insane jump without the help of steroids. his heart was made of steel and his bodies ever lasting endurance made it so he could pump harder and faster and make far bigger gains then i did. after that i started doing cardio and never looked back, my gains increased at a much more rapid pace, instead of making big gains every 5-6 weeks i was making them in 3-4.
breathing:
obviously the cliche "exhale as you lift the weight" i use most often, but i only breathe in and out of my nose, breathing through your mouth is horrible, you in take far too much oxygen and your body exhales most of it. controlled very slow breathing through your nose is how your supposed to be breathing at ALL times, even during running. where em i getting this? the guy who trains olympic runners told me this, watch the olympics and you'll see the runners with almost all closed mouths even in an insane sprint. funny how 95% of everyone breathes through their mouth when working out or running, lol.
the science behind it:
breathing only through your nose even during intense cardio deprives your body of oxygen, its starving for loads and its forcing you to want to breathe through your mouth because its a whiny little bitch and is crying (:P), and your body has to "make do" with what oxygen you give it while breathing only through your nose. your body then uses this oxygen to create more co2 in your blood then normal, basically using less to create more. i also thought this was bull shit and had to test this out, i notice drastic increases in my endurance for cardio and overall after about a 6 weeks of training myself to always breathe through my nose.