Recently, through both the Battle.net forums and Twitter, we have gotten a few updates about how traits will work in Diablo III. When asked about conditional traits, Bashiok had this to say:
Official Blizzard Quote:
There are a number of traits which are too situational to be deemed worthwhile to invest in. A few examples are:
Increases damage against beasts.
Increases damage against demons.
Increases damage against undead.
We agree, and they were removed from Traits a while back. (not that you could have known that) So yay!
We don't want traits (passives) to be boring. Even the ones that are pretty bland stat increase type passives, we try to make them feel weighty. Trait points are fairly rare, so that lets us make each point feel a lot sexier to spend. Even if they're just standard +% stat passives, they're BIG +% increases. But, there's also a lot of traits that are fairly intricate in what they provide, and to no small degree can be game changers. Either way they'll be a crucial component to any character build.
Although the first part of this quote is rather self-explanatory, the rest is considerably more interesting. It appears as though the percentages associated with traits have been boosted since we saw them at the Blizzcon demo, and as a result they have a bigger impact on the build of your character, leading to even more customization possibilities. However, that does not mean traits have become all that much more powerful than the last time we saw them in action. Although the percentages gained from traits has increased, the Diablo III team has also drastically decreased the amount of trait points a character will have at the maximum level.
Official Blizzard Quote:
@spiri7walker We give them out every 3 levels, the first one at level 3, so 19 trait points are available to spend at level 60.
When they were announced at Blizzcon, traits were given out every other level, and the Diablo III team quickly pointed out that they weren't quite satisfied with that setup. In a change that seems comparable to the decision to put the level cap at 60, Blizzard has decided to make trait points more valuable and less common. As a result, characters will probably end up more focused around certain traits instead of being spread out across large amounts of passives.
Despite this more focused approach, it does appear as though there are plenty of choices, including ones that wouldn't initially appear to have a place in a viable combat build.
Official Blizzard Quote:
I'm very happy to hear this, but what of lucky and intimidation? They are also fairly controversial traits that increase noncombat related stats.
Lucky increases gold find by 10%. It's tough to say how that kind of thing will balance out. It wouldn't be worth taking until at least Nightmare, IMO, and even then a trait point is a fairly powerful thing. I don't know if I'd spend it on gold find. But, that's kind of a cool choice then, right?
This is not the first time Bashiok has used gold find as an example of an "interesting choice," so it would appear as though gold is actually important and as a result gold find is something to consider. However, as Bashiok points out, that does not mean theres much room for it, especially if we are only awarded nineteen trait points. In the end, we'll just have to wait for the beta to really see what traits remain and how the trait system as a whole functions.
Update to the update:
Official Blizzard Quote:
@Diablo And will there be any quests, which are not required for main story progression, that will award you additional trait/skill points?
@spiri7walker Currently all skill and trait points are metered out purely through gaining levels.
So it appears that, at least for the moment, we won't be getting traits as rewards from anything other than leveling, unlike in Diablo II where a select few quests rewarded the player with extra skill points.
That's actually really good to hear. I think they are taking the trait, and the level cap situation in a good direction. It seems like a good idea to make these decisions feel weighty.
It is also pretty odd how they do keep mentioning "gold find". Kinda makes you wonder if they're trying to tell us something. I don't think I'll spend a trait point on it, when I could possibly throw on gear with gold find.
Great post, Jackzor. Hopefully as we draw closer to the beta, we'll learn more and more, as promised.
So it was mentioned there was going to be some way of altering past choices on skills. They didn't mention what the cost would be to the player or to what extent changes could be made. Do you think this ability to adjust your skills will be applicable to the traits as well? Have they mentioned anything about this? I can already feel the tension of having to choose which traits to invest in cause they're all so cool, yet limited, and you don't want to make the wrong choice.
I really like the idea of gold being a very valuable trading medium. Even moreso, I like the idea of "Lucky" actually being a competitive attribute - one that people will actually seek out.
Sounds prerty neat! Although I can see the lucky trait being a problem. If gold is as big as there trying to make it then you could make a character focused on just the gold trait farm lots of gold get items send it over to your other character. Unless trade item for item is more popular than gold for item.
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Sounds prerty neat! Although I can see the lucky trait being a problem. If gold is as big as there trying to make it then you could make a character focused on just the gold trait farm lots of gold get items send it over to your other character. Unless trade item for item is more popular than gold for item.
True, but in turn, you might be sacrificing points that could make your character kill monsters faster. So then you would have to decide if it's worth it.
They also reiterated on the forums (Bashiok) that the Wizard's resource is Arcane Power, which has a finite cap and quickly regenerates, corresponding with the wizard's 'bursty nature', WD uses mana which regens much slower. Demon Hunter resource still under wraps, but he said it has been hinted at in other discussions...
Yea, from what he described you would get 20 trait points, at levels 3, 6, 9, 12, 15, 18, 21, 24, 27, 30, 33, 36, 39, 42, 45, 48, 51, 54, 57, and 60 (count them if you don't believe me :P). Bashiok probably just thought of 57/3=19 and thats where his mistake came from. At least thats why I thought it was correct at first glance. Or he described it wrong. Either way its an easy mistake to correct, so we'll hopefully get an explanation soon.
I know i should be exited for all this information and the trait system is going to be a HUGE deal in d3 but every announcement i think will be inferior to the update coming up in the next few months titled "beta key giveaway!"....*drool*
I don't think they'll give a free full respec for each difficulty level like in D2, they spoke about per skill paid reset.
With that in place, a full skill reset could be out of the question because of the involved gold cost.
I think they said it is something much more limited, like you can only respec a point in a skill when it's been there for so short a time or you're so many levels higher or...something. I forget.
Its something like you can respec a skill at a time. There could be other options for traits though, seeing as you'll probably be spread out across more than seven traits.
Anyway, I love the idea of having traits yield big changes in core function. The nickel-and-dime nature of most RPG's drives me insane.. This is a pretty visionary move by Bliz, imo.
I don't see any way they won't let us re-spec, but I don't think trait respec is confirmed, only skill re-spec for now. So we have to wait for more info.
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I thought that as well, but starting at level 3 and getting a point every 3 level ups leads to getting your last point at level 60, which seems to make more sense than getting your last point at 59, or really any other level.
So I was on here reading about the new info on Followers and it suddenly disappeared. Where'd it go? It was talking about the Templar, Enchantress, and Scoundrel....
They said over and again they don't want traits to be under-powered or boring... then things like +Gold find should NOT be a trait. I really hope it's not....
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Official Blizzard Quote:
We agree, and they were removed from Traits a while back. (not that you could have known that) So yay!
We don't want traits (passives) to be boring. Even the ones that are pretty bland stat increase type passives, we try to make them feel weighty. Trait points are fairly rare, so that lets us make each point feel a lot sexier to spend. Even if they're just standard +% stat passives, they're BIG +% increases. But, there's also a lot of traits that are fairly intricate in what they provide, and to no small degree can be game changers. Either way they'll be a crucial component to any character build.
Official Blizzard Quote:
@spiri7walker We give them out every 3 levels, the first one at level 3, so 19 trait points are available to spend at level 60.
Despite this more focused approach, it does appear as though there are plenty of choices, including ones that wouldn't initially appear to have a place in a viable combat build.
Official Blizzard Quote:
Lucky increases gold find by 10%. It's tough to say how that kind of thing will balance out. It wouldn't be worth taking until at least Nightmare, IMO, and even then a trait point is a fairly powerful thing. I don't know if I'd spend it on gold find. But, that's kind of a cool choice then, right?
Update to the update:
Official Blizzard Quote:
@spiri7walker Currently all skill and trait points are metered out purely through gaining levels.
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It is also pretty odd how they do keep mentioning "gold find". Kinda makes you wonder if they're trying to tell us something. I don't think I'll spend a trait point on it, when I could possibly throw on gear with gold find.
Great post, Jackzor. Hopefully as we draw closer to the beta, we'll learn more and more, as promised.
I really like the idea of gold being a very valuable trading medium. Even moreso, I like the idea of "Lucky" actually being a competitive attribute - one that people will actually seek out.
If you want to arrange it
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If we could somehow make this
Christmas thing last
By helping a neighbor
Or even a stranger
And to know who needs help
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True, but in turn, you might be sacrificing points that could make your character kill monsters faster. So then you would have to decide if it's worth it.
I counted this on my fingers. And you seem to be correct.
I guess they don't include 60? Why they wouldn't include 60 eludes me.
It was probably a flub on Bash's part.
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I think they said it is something much more limited, like you can only respec a point in a skill when it's been there for so short a time or you're so many levels higher or...something. I forget.
That was incredibly useful, wasn't it?
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Ding level 1 -> 2 = 1
Ding level 2 -> 3 = 2
Ding level 3 -> 4 = 3 << First trait point
Just a possibility, not sure.
Anyway, I love the idea of having traits yield big changes in core function. The nickel-and-dime nature of most RPG's drives me insane.. This is a pretty visionary move by Bliz, imo.
I don't see any way they won't let us re-spec, but I don't think trait respec is confirmed, only skill re-spec for now. So we have to wait for more info.
-Thomas Jefferson
I thought that as well, but starting at level 3 and getting a point every 3 level ups leads to getting your last point at level 60, which seems to make more sense than getting your last point at 59, or really any other level.
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Ignore this, it just popped back up.