Why not simply always allow respeccing for up to two levels worth of skill points? That cures all this talk about "accidentally" pumping the wrong skill...
If you need more than 2 levels worth of respec then obviously you didn't "accidently" put your skill points somewhere and what you really want to do is restructure your character... which shouldn't be allowed. If you want a different kind of character you should have to start from scratch.
If you want to "test" out certain skills before committing to them, then you have two levels worth of respeccing to test with. Sounds reasonable to me.
Yah I like that idea. At least that way after ur done with your character you can still make a new one and completly differnt from the first
If they add the ability to redo your skills they would have to make it harder to level. There would be no rushing or anything like there is in D2. I get the feeling things like rushes and runs will still exist in Diablo 3 which will conflict with the respeccing ability as you can get to higher level.. get tons of gear for each build and turn yourself into a one man army.
They wouldn't necessarily have to make it harder to level. In fact, if it was equally as easy, the respeccing wouldn't be that big of a deal, it'd probably be a welcomed change. That way if you do mess up one skill point, you just respec. That's not taking away from replayability, that's more like taking away a gamers frustration.
Kind of like you were saying rushing would conflict with respeccing, which seems like a good thing.
Actually, I'm more then pleased with that blizz-response.
ofcourse I can see why respec is a good thing, but it also eleminates the point of replayment somewhat... Its just not right to make a character and then if u change ur mind a silly charge of something-something and a click away and you got a totally new char-spec
but that just my opinion
yeah and its the only place where you can get blizz-response... and people wonders why we're so worried that WoW will influense d3 too much...:offtopic:
hahaha, in all seriousness though, there have been blizzard responses on the battle.net forums.
They wouldn't necessarily have to make it harder to level. In fact, if it was equally as easy, the respeccing wouldn't be that big of a deal, it'd probably be a welcomed change. That way if you do mess up one skill point, you just respec. That's not taking away from replayability, that's more like taking away a gamers frustration.
Kind of like you were saying rushing would conflict with respeccing, which seems like a good thing.
I see how it wouldn't necessarily require harder leveling but my final point is still valid. If you have the ability to respec, any one person could just save up on whatever is required for respeccing, get themselves two sets of gear for two different builds and be able to turn themselves into something else if the situation called for it. I'll use a diablo 2 example.. Say you have a hammerdin full geared and you decide to respec. Then you make yourself into a smiter because of all of the gear you have sitting in your stash for a smiter build. You go in and do your business and then change back into a hammerdin. That ability allows people too much power. The thing I like about Diablo builds is you have to plan for the futures. Save up your points and create your build and if you mess up tough titty.
If i'm not wrong it was said that Blizzard was planning to have quest appear at random in the world of Diablo 3, if that is the case they could make it so that one of those quest rewards you with something like a Reset token that could be given to a special NPC to reset your skills and/or your stats points.
This could become interesting if that quest were to appear not very often, this could also make an interesting bargain item.
If they decide not to do something like that, then my second choice would be a quest in each difficulties to respecs once.
I see how it wouldn't necessarily require harder leveling but my final point is still valid. If you have the ability to respec, any one person could just save up on whatever is required for respeccing, get themselves two sets of gear for two different builds and be able to turn themselves into something else if the situation called for it. I'll use a diablo 2 example.. Say you have a hammerdin full geared and you decide to respec. Then you make yourself into a smiter because of all of the gear you have sitting in your stash for a smiter build. You go in and do your business and then change back into a hammerdin. That ability allows people too much power. The thing I like about Diablo builds is you have to plan for the futures. Save up your points and create your build and if you mess up tough titty.
i think adding a confirm box each time a skill is assigned should help with accidental skill point assigns. respeccing isn't something i'm in favor of, but i can attest that the first time playing without any knowledge of what skills would be helpful or worked well together that a lot of players in the top of the ladder during the first few months after release found out that they couldn't go to lvl 99 with the skills chosen.
i would ask blizzard to make all the top level skills to be really effective and useful, that way once a player goes all the way up on skill tree the top skill in that tree should be good enough to play the game to lvl 99.
I support full respecing but I don't want it to be easy at all. Maybe limit it to one respec every 10 levels and as many as you need at level 99 via some sort of med/hard quest line each time you need it, there have been countless times in D2 where I was filling in skill points and oh - started to lag and accidentally put some extra points into a few places I didn't want them in and I was fucked.
Respeccing is good, I like respeccing. It doesn't have to be instant, and if obviously won't, seeing as that would be more lenient than the system employed in WoW.
However, I do not think any one character should be limited to just a few points, or respeccing on just a few occassions. I think any character ought to, theoretically, be able to respec however many times they want. In practice however, there may be limits such as time, money, or both. However a played should never feel that they can NEVER again respec this character. Which will happen with a limited number of respecs.
I agree with your overall idea Phrozen, but indeed there is a need to make it so that the player doesn't become too abusive with respeccing. One thing I found great in D2 was, as someone said, you have to plan your character, I'm not saying we shouldn't get respeccing but what I found awesome in not being able to in D2, was that the player actually earned experience playing his sometimes badly-built character. It was what happened the first time I played it: I had a paladin and I just balanced all stats and chose as many different skills as possible. In fact that character sucked but even through that freaking madness of having a handful of lvl 1 auras and skills I actually managed to beat the game for the first time and it felt awesome, from that point on I figured I had learned quite well to sort myself out with pretty much any given paladin build and especially a badly balanced one, of course it didn't match anyone in PvP but it's a good challange to any experienced player still. Anyway I think we should have respec possibilities in the game, but I hope they make it hard and costly to the player, and I'll comment on some suggestions here:
Quote from "ansl" »
Respeccing IMO is a good thing. Imagine spending countless hours creating the perfect character, everythings dandy - but then all of a suddon blizzard releases a new patch which renders your build completely useless transforming your semi-boner into a freakshow of STD's.
I beleive that they should allow respeccing but at a extremely high cost. In WoW they have 1g, 5g, 10g, 25g, etc etc etc. so respeccing does become a pain in the ass after you've respecced 15 times. A system like this which starts at a absurd amount of gold would IMO be useable and good. The pricing for this system could be regulated towards your lvl.
made up example: lets say 500 g is a "large" amount of gold in Diablo III, at lvl 10 it would be 2500g for respeccing one talent tree, at lvl 20 it would be 5000g, lvl 30 7500g etc. etc. etc. if you have to respec all 3 talent trees(if there are three) at lvl 30 it would cost 22500g. Everytime you respecc on that char the cost would be doubled. (the numbers are made up to illustrate the idea)
I did like the quest idea though I believe it should be more than 2 skills at a time, the quest idea should be really dangerous and crave many skills - (gl to the hc community).
- ansl
I agree with you in your first paragraph, I feel like that everytime a new patch comes out... and WotLK is just on the horizon...
Back to the point: your idea is very valid. Maybe they could make a system where you pay per skill? That way you wouldn't kill total respeccing but you could make it so that it becomes extremely unfavorable and costly to the player. The prices could increase as the character levels do so that by lvl 99 for example, you're asked a relatvely large amount of money per skill to be respecced, in your example about 2500g per skill?
Quote from "Krauser" »
I support full respecing but I don't want it to be easy at all. Maybe limit it to one respec every 10 levels and as many as you need at level 99 via some sort of med/hard quest line each time you need it, there have been countless times in D2 where I was filling in skill points and oh - started to lag and accidentally put some extra points into a few places I didn't want them in and I was fucked.
Another nice idea, but I disagree with the quest line for lvl 99, maybe you could do so in one of these random events throughout the world? I mean, I can't see the point of respeccing totally at lvl 99 after you've gone so far with your previous spec?
Well i think all that needs to be done is a ''undo button''. Because if people are making new chars for putting 1 more point into something not needed it would be silly to have to start again. Thats why a undo button fixes all, kinda.
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[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
If your insane, but still sane enough to know it, are you insane or sane?
Like others, I hope there's a chance to respec, but not at any given time.
Would make the learning curve of a new character a bit easier, if you misplace skills early on. :cool:
I still say one respec, use it or lose it, when you first unlock nightmare mode for a character, and again for hell mode. No storing them up. Or maybe even just when unlocking nightmare.
i must say, this is some REALLY pleasing news to my ears! I am so glad to hear about their feelings on respecing...as they realize it shouldn't be so liberal and easy to always respec...thank you blizzard for not screwing up diablo :)....oh and the health globes are sounding better and better to me every time.
I still say one respec, use it or lose it, when you first unlock nightmare mode for a character, and again for hell mode. No storing them up. Or maybe even just when unlocking nightmare.
i don't approve of respeccing to try out other builds. respeccing to fix accidental skill assigns or to fix accidentally picking a broken skill should be implemented.
one idea i have about this is that after completing the game at normal difficulty, automatically reset all skill points. then players can fix strategy errors or accidental skill assigns. after that the player doesn't have any resets. that way those players still learning the skill trees can reset if there was any strategic error, but without allowing them to experiment with all skill trees in that class.
one second chance per character seems pretty reasonable from a design standpoint.
I kind liked the idea of changing some skills points, but it must be done in a way that dont make possible a total change of the char type. For example: It starts with a Fire sorc and then when the char is already high level you change it to a cold sorc. I think it would cause players make always the same kind of char to level and then change its type to duel. My idea of it is to make the change possible if you have a few points on Frozen Orb but realise that would be better if it was Blizzard, or put 2 points on a skill that should have only one point.
And i miss a Heath globe argue.
For me its a total crap.
Whats the difference between fighting for a globe and a pot?
I think the choice of using a lot of pots or fighting for them should be made by the player.
Because imo it will still happen with this globe and the emergence healing potion. I think people will buy a lot of pots and forget about the globes, just like happened with D2.
Players will always find a way to take advantage of the game possibilities, i think thats the idea of all games.
But it is too early to crucify the game for this "Mistakes" and i trust Blizzard, even if the team is completely different from the team who made D2.
I still say one respec, use it or lose it, when you first unlock nightmare mode for a character, and again for hell mode. No storing them up. Or maybe even just when unlocking nightmare.
I really like your idea. I don’t want to have to make a new char if I accidentally screw up or every time I want a new spec, but likewise I don’t want to be able to respec however many times I want, regardless of how hard it would be to. being able to respec indefinitely (again, regardless of how hard it would be) would only kill replayability
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Go for the eyes boo! Go for the eyes!
-Minsc
Events in the past may be roughly divided into those which probably never happened and those which do not matter.
-William Ralph Inge
My concern is that respeccing means leveling will take longer and/or be harder to achieve (hence the ability to respec). What if I want a fire sorc and a cold sorc (speculating that's an option)? Right now, one could get to level 90 rather quickly. In WoW, a character is pretty useless until it's max level. In Diablo II, from level 90 on, you're fairly comparable to a level 99 character, so maxing your character level isn't that big of a deal.
In short, I hope this doesn't mean a character isn't viable and/or fun in PvP unless it's max level is reached. They'd be sacrificing fast leveling and the ability to create multiple types of characters in lieu of creating one powerful character with well placed skills (which one could do anyway without respecing, and it's not that difficult).
I hope this will happen. I remember in LOD start when hardcore guys used to kill themselves at the end of the ladder season in order to get to the top. There was too many 99s. But yeah if your 90 lvl is almost as powerfull as 99 as it is now.. i think it is good that you don't get to max level that easy.
How about this: You pick a skill, and it is engraved to your chars memory after its used 'x' amount of times. Which means the more you use a skill, the harder it will be to respec it. And on the flipside, a skill you might have chosen and used only once can be respecced (char forgets skill as never utilised it) - can apply this logic to real life as well
It would be neat if they had a respec item from a drop... for any of you that played DAoC knows that you got a respec stone drops from boss mobs. But make the drop rate very very low as to not be able to horde them!
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Yah I like that idea. At least that way after ur done with your character you can still make a new one and completly differnt from the first
Kind of like you were saying rushing would conflict with respeccing, which seems like a good thing.
hahaha, in all seriousness though, there have been blizzard responses on the battle.net forums.
I see how it wouldn't necessarily require harder leveling but my final point is still valid. If you have the ability to respec, any one person could just save up on whatever is required for respeccing, get themselves two sets of gear for two different builds and be able to turn themselves into something else if the situation called for it. I'll use a diablo 2 example.. Say you have a hammerdin full geared and you decide to respec. Then you make yourself into a smiter because of all of the gear you have sitting in your stash for a smiter build. You go in and do your business and then change back into a hammerdin. That ability allows people too much power. The thing I like about Diablo builds is you have to plan for the futures. Save up your points and create your build and if you mess up tough titty.
This could become interesting if that quest were to appear not very often, this could also make an interesting bargain item.
If they decide not to do something like that, then my second choice would be a quest in each difficulties to respecs once.
i would ask blizzard to make all the top level skills to be really effective and useful, that way once a player goes all the way up on skill tree the top skill in that tree should be good enough to play the game to lvl 99.
Paladin
SanctuaryInsight.com
I agree with your overall idea Phrozen, but indeed there is a need to make it so that the player doesn't become too abusive with respeccing. One thing I found great in D2 was, as someone said, you have to plan your character, I'm not saying we shouldn't get respeccing but what I found awesome in not being able to in D2, was that the player actually earned experience playing his sometimes badly-built character. It was what happened the first time I played it: I had a paladin and I just balanced all stats and chose as many different skills as possible. In fact that character sucked but even through that freaking madness of having a handful of lvl 1 auras and skills I actually managed to beat the game for the first time and it felt awesome, from that point on I figured I had learned quite well to sort myself out with pretty much any given paladin build and especially a badly balanced one, of course it didn't match anyone in PvP but it's a good challange to any experienced player still. Anyway I think we should have respec possibilities in the game, but I hope they make it hard and costly to the player, and I'll comment on some suggestions here:
I agree with you in your first paragraph, I feel like that everytime a new patch comes out... and WotLK is just on the horizon...
Back to the point: your idea is very valid. Maybe they could make a system where you pay per skill? That way you wouldn't kill total respeccing but you could make it so that it becomes extremely unfavorable and costly to the player. The prices could increase as the character levels do so that by lvl 99 for example, you're asked a relatvely large amount of money per skill to be respecced, in your example about 2500g per skill?
Another nice idea, but I disagree with the quest line for lvl 99, maybe you could do so in one of these random events throughout the world? I mean, I can't see the point of respeccing totally at lvl 99 after you've gone so far with your previous spec?
Would make the learning curve of a new character a bit easier, if you misplace skills early on. :cool:
If your insane, but still sane enough to know it, are you insane or sane?
probably diablo 3 will be more difficult than diablo II in leveling your char... so a respec will be understandable.
I still say one respec, use it or lose it, when you first unlock nightmare mode for a character, and again for hell mode. No storing them up. Or maybe even just when unlocking nightmare.
i don't approve of respeccing to try out other builds. respeccing to fix accidental skill assigns or to fix accidentally picking a broken skill should be implemented.
one idea i have about this is that after completing the game at normal difficulty, automatically reset all skill points. then players can fix strategy errors or accidental skill assigns. after that the player doesn't have any resets. that way those players still learning the skill trees can reset if there was any strategic error, but without allowing them to experiment with all skill trees in that class.
one second chance per character seems pretty reasonable from a design standpoint.
Paladin
SanctuaryInsight.com
And i miss a Heath globe argue.
For me its a total crap.
Whats the difference between fighting for a globe and a pot?
I think the choice of using a lot of pots or fighting for them should be made by the player.
Because imo it will still happen with this globe and the emergence healing potion. I think people will buy a lot of pots and forget about the globes, just like happened with D2.
Players will always find a way to take advantage of the game possibilities, i think thats the idea of all games.
But it is too early to crucify the game for this "Mistakes" and i trust Blizzard, even if the team is completely different from the team who made D2.
I really like your idea. I don’t want to have to make a new char if I accidentally screw up or every time I want a new spec, but likewise I don’t want to be able to respec however many times I want, regardless of how hard it would be to. being able to respec indefinitely (again, regardless of how hard it would be) would only kill replayability
-Minsc
Events in the past may be roughly divided into those which probably never happened and those which do not matter.
-William Ralph Inge
RIP: Demon Hunter: lvl 50 | Barb: lvl 60 (plvl 5) | Monk: lvl12 & lvl70 (plvl 200)
How about this: You pick a skill, and it is engraved to your chars memory after its used 'x' amount of times. Which means the more you use a skill, the harder it will be to respec it. And on the flipside, a skill you might have chosen and used only once can be respecced (char forgets skill as never utilised it) - can apply this logic to real life as well