If you want to get technical, Pluto is no longer a planet, so there's only 8 planets now.
Pluto and (Ceron or something ... kinda like a double planet w/ Pluto) are classified like big chunks of rock ... or like two moons orbiting around each other.
And as far as our own solar system, I don't believe there are sentient species.
The inherent problem lies not with the number of stars, but how likely any given scenario is to happen. It also depends on whether or not the laws of physics are constant throughout the Universe.
First of all, life as we know it on Earth depends on several key factors. Firs tof all it the size of the Sun. Had it been bigger, it would have died faster, and life could not have prospered as it has. Had it been smaller, it would not have radiated enough heat.
Secondly, it also depends on exacly where the Earth lies. If we get too close, like Mercury, we're toast. If we get to far, like Neptune, it's so freezing cold that live can never reasonably develop.
Third the actual planet orbiting the star in question. Does it have the right composition to house life? Is it solid? What is the atmosphere made up of? What substances exist in large amounts?
Fourth, we have no idea how likely life is to arise in the first place, even is all the factors possible are beneficial. Some say life always develops if it can, some say it's extremely rare. We don't know.
There are tons of other factors. But still, given the fact that the Milky Way alone contains around 200 billion stars, and the fact that the Visible Universe (that's around 15 billion lightyears in every direction from Earth) in itself also contains more than 80 billion galaxies, it is so tantalizingly much that the very prospect that we are unique in this vastness seems ridiculous to me.
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There is no way that anyone could prove to me that other lifeforms do not exist outside of Earth. I refuse, REFUSE to believe that with the universe as large as it is that there is no other planet like Earth in the countless galaxies just like our own.
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GIEV D3 INFOZ NAO!( <---Poster from the official Bnet Forums) "I'm sure that in time, every bit of her will be gone and her death will be a mystery... even to me."-Secret Window
i think aliens exist... there is a whole time span in our history that is just gone. Plus there is a part of history that has sea people... sorry this might be a little off topic, but where did the sea people come from and how come we are missing a span of time in our history.
So if we can't blame it on the aliens then who did it? How come after the span of time that we are missing and history picks back up, groups of civilizations that had no idea how to advance were beginning to. All of a sudden we had the industrial revolution, enlightenment and so for.
Correct me if I'm wrong, but we only have one solar system in this world, that carries all the planets... or anything for that matter.
You'd think that if earth has so many damn species and none could survive the extremes of mars and venus, then there is an extremely small chance anything else could.
But like I said, you might be right. But if probability calculations were made... it'd be 0% chance based on the organisms of earth
LOL. There are many solar systems that have been discovered with planets in their habitable zones. It's just too far to see if there is life on them.
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It's the decisions you make when you have no time to make them that define who you are.
i think aliens exist... there is a whole time span in our history that is just gone. Plus there is a part of history that has sea people... sorry this might be a little off topic, but where did the sea people come from and how come we are missing a span of time in our history.
So if we can't blame it on the aliens then who did it? How come after the span of time that we are missing and history picks back up, groups of civilizations that had no idea how to advance were beginning to. All of a sudden we had the industrial revolution, enlightenment and so for.
What the heck are you talking about? Sea people? There is most certainly not a missing part of Earth's history which is supposed to have included sea people. Please clarify what you mean.
Quote from "AlphaX" »
LOL. There are many solar systems that have been discovered with planets in their habitable zones. It's just too far to see if there is life on them.
Although that is true, the sizes of these planets are much larger than that of Earth. Since we cannot "see" planets in other solar systems, they are always overshadowed by the thing called a star which emits light, we must be more intelligent in detecting satellites. Thus we record how stars wobble due to the effects of gravity. Any object orbiting a star will pull at it, which we can detect.
However, telescopes on Earth have to break through the atmosphere, which causes disturbances, and no telescope in space is large enough to detect these things. Therefore, at present times, we are only able to see planets which are at least 5 times more massive than the Earth, and in almost all cases they appear to be gas giants; not very likely to inhibit life.
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it's in my history book. it is right before the industrial revolution and things started advancing. And yes there is a part of history that is missing because we go from not knowing anything about machinery to all of a sudden advancing in britain and it begins to spread.
as for the sea people they could have been pirates, but then again it didn't state in my history book who they were
it's in my history book. it is right before the industrial revolution and things started advancing. And yes there is a part of history that is missing because we go from not knowing anything about machinery to all of a sudden advancing in britain and it begins to spread.
What are you trying to prove with this? There is no part of history missing right before hte industrial revolution.
And we did not go from knowing anything about machinery to suddenly having the industrail revolution. Clocks had been in existence for along time, the printing press which was an advanced form of machinery for it's time, large boats and their rudders, basic principles of physics such as the usage of mechanical levers had existed for millenia. We had knowledge of mechanics prior to the inducstrial revolution, what happened was we came up with new and more advanced machinery, as well as new ways of powering them, such as through steam power.
Quote from "FrenchKittie" »
as for the sea people they could have been pirates, but then again it didn't state in my history book who they were
Ok, so if they are just regular sea-farers, how do they prove that aliens have been to Earth?
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Mathematical chance for aliens to exist is 100% due to unimaginable amount of stars/solar systems out there.
I saw a video where some prof did a calculation. He took the least likely parameters in account and got a result of that there are 10k, yes ten thousand planets in our Milkyway alone housing life.
Now the first three, average star formation rate, fractions of those stats that have planets, and the number of those planets that are inhabitable are farily straigth forward and can be estimated rather well we can assume.
However, the last four variables are very much debatable. We have no idea how often life develops outside of Earth, simply because we have nothing to compare it to except Earth. Furthermore, we also have no idea how long a civilization, if life does exist in other places, survives. We're the first for all we know, and how long have we been around as a civilization? Around 12-10 000 years I'd say. That's nothing during the lifetime of the Universe.
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Phrozen you can't just say that there are no gaps in history. I know of at least one. There's a period of time when ancient people changed from hunter gather people to farming people. What happened was that people everywhere from Mesopotamia to southern Asia all suddenly changed to farming methods. One theory that for me is highly convincing is that aliens, extraterrestrials, or something came and taught us how to farm. Why would thousands of people that don't really live close together suddenly pick up farming methods that they did not know before.
Another weird coincidence is the colonial town of Roanoke. Roanoke (if you don't know) was built when the Pilgrims came to America. The settlement was on in island in North California. Ships bringing supplies would travel to and from Roanoke from England (i think) but one time they didn't return for 2 years. Once they returned, the entire city was in ruins every colonist was missing, no sign of a battle or struggle, nothing. One theory said that the Spanish massacred them but why is there no sign of struggle? My theory, though it sounds kinda farfetched, would be alien abduction maybe. Also, according to some people, sightings of Native Americans with blond hair occured. Since when do Native Americans have blond hair.
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"I'm like a dog chasing cars." - Joker, Dark Knight
If the universe really goes to infinity, there would be an infinite amount of planets identical to our own. There would be the same history as Earth on an infinite number of planets.
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It's the decisions you make when you have no time to make them that define who you are.
Phrozen you can't just say that there are no gaps in history.
Which I did not say. I said there are no holes in history right before the Industrial Revolution, which extend four hundred years from now max.
Quote from "whiteghost21" »
I know of at least one. There's a period of time when ancient people changed from hunter gather people to farming people. What happened was that people everywhere from Mesopotamia to southern Asia all suddenly changed to farming methods. One theory that for me is highly convincing is that aliens, extraterrestrials, or something came and taught us how to farm. Why would thousands of people that don't really live close together suddenly pick up farming methods that they did not know before.
Well, if that's true, then why did the aliens, one day all of a sudden millions of years ago, decide that they should band together and pick up farming on their homeplanet?
Someone had to be the first, whether aliens or man. Doesn't prove anything.
Quote from "whiteghost21" »
Another weird coincidence is the colonial town of Roanoke. Roanoke (if you don't know) was built when the Pilgrims came to America. The settlement was on in island in North California. Ships bringing supplies would travel to and from Roanoke from England (i think) but one time they didn't return for 2 years. Once they returned, the entire city was in ruins every colonist was missing, no sign of a battle or struggle, nothing. One theory said that the Spanish massacred them but why is there no sign of struggle? My theory, though it sounds kinda farfetched, would be alien abduction maybe. Also, according to some people, sightings of Native Americans with blond hair occured. Since when do Native Americans have blond hair.
Alien interference seems to be very popluar these days, everywhere you turn there's at least one theory explaining strange facts with alien interference.
All alien theories depend on the fact that the evidence is sketchy. There's certainly never anything that proves aliens were present, the only thing ever proven is that we do not know what happened. Which isn't any proof at all.
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ok fine phrozen then explain to me the crop circles... how did they form and where did they come from.... explain to me all the videos out there of people capturing glowing light... why people out there think they were taken by aliens to be tested....
are you trying to say we are just nuts and that we can't believe that other spieces are out there... maybe some of us don't want to feel we are alone... maybe we want to know that there is something out there and maybe they did come down and help us learn....
ok fine phrozen then explain to me the crop circles... how did they form and where did they come from.... explain to me all the videos out there of people capturing glowing light... why people out there think they were taken by aliens to be tested....
Okie-dokie.
Crop circles: Have been made by actual people to stir up the media. It is quite simple and only involved pushing down the wheat or whatever with a board and some ropes.
Videos: Most are crap material and are obviously fake, just as videos of the Loch Ness monster, Bigfoot, Yetis and whatever else you can come up with. And those that are not obviously fake are much too sketchy. Scientific studies are not solely based on low quality film footage by amateur filmers.
Obductions: Well, people can claim anything for fame. If they are truly obducted, for what purpose? And why the heck would obducted people be returned to Earth again to spread rumors of aliens abducting them?
Quote from "FrenchKittie" »
are you trying to say we are just nuts and that we can't believe that other spieces are out there... maybe some of us don't want to feel we are alone... maybe we want to know that there is something out there and maybe they did come down and help us learn....
Not at all. I myself believe, as most of you, that we are not the only place in the Universe which houses life.
However, I do not think that we are being visited by aliens. The sheer size of the Universe and the difficulties on a physical level makes me highly doubtful of such visitors.
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The Sun is too hot for Venus for lifeforms (I mean if there is some lifeform that can stand it, sure yeh) and is too far for Mars, ditto with Venus, if lifeforms can stand it while that's that. But that may play a factor in no other life forms.
Personally I just believe in anything that's on Earth and that's it. Well, and heaven and hell...
ok first off... its not so hot that lifeforms couldnt survive... its too hot for liquid water to exist and we dont know if anything can exist without liquid water... second off there might be life in our own damn solar system... the moon called "europa" is a giant ball of ice with pressure cracks in the surface ice indicating that there is water underneath the surface moving around creating these cracks... before we try to find lifeforms in other parts of the universe we, as humans, need to do our selves a huge favor and first make a macine that can bore/melt its way thru the ice on europa and into the seas below to see if there is any... and i mean ANY... living organisms... from single celled creatures to complex life such as exists here on earth... and to quote the movie contact... "if there was nothing else out there... id be an awful waste of space" i know contact isnt real but its a good line and im posative that there are other life forms in outerspace... i mean cmon... were one fuckin solarsystem out of TRILLIONS OR MORE... and the heaven and hell thing... how can u believe in an imaginary place for "good" and "bad" people but cant fathom there being other life outside of our puny fuckin planet?
Quote from "PhrozenDragon" »
Okie-dokie.
Crop circles: Have been made by actual people to stir up the media. It is quite simple and only involved pushing down the wheat or whatever with a board and some ropes.
ima go out ona limb and say that some of these crop circles are too elaborate and absolutely perfect for human construction... and explain how inside some of the circles there are burns on the corn stalks?
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we actually know of 10
right next to pluto there is a nother small planet that
is from another solar system that goes by every once in a while
But I don't really know so I just say 9.
"Cards and flowers on your window, your friends all plead for you to stay,
sometimes beginnings aren't so simple, sometimes goodbye's the only way."
they had a meeting about it
and they decided to keep it a planet
Pluto and (Ceron or something ... kinda like a double planet w/ Pluto) are classified like big chunks of rock ... or like two moons orbiting around each other.
And as far as our own solar system, I don't believe there are sentient species.
Outside; yes I do.
CyberPunk RP Nexus
First of all, life as we know it on Earth depends on several key factors. Firs tof all it the size of the Sun. Had it been bigger, it would have died faster, and life could not have prospered as it has. Had it been smaller, it would not have radiated enough heat.
Secondly, it also depends on exacly where the Earth lies. If we get too close, like Mercury, we're toast. If we get to far, like Neptune, it's so freezing cold that live can never reasonably develop.
Third the actual planet orbiting the star in question. Does it have the right composition to house life? Is it solid? What is the atmosphere made up of? What substances exist in large amounts?
Fourth, we have no idea how likely life is to arise in the first place, even is all the factors possible are beneficial. Some say life always develops if it can, some say it's extremely rare. We don't know.
There are tons of other factors. But still, given the fact that the Milky Way alone contains around 200 billion stars, and the fact that the Visible Universe (that's around 15 billion lightyears in every direction from Earth) in itself also contains more than 80 billion galaxies, it is so tantalizingly much that the very prospect that we are unique in this vastness seems ridiculous to me.
GIEV D3 INFOZ NAO! ( <---Poster from the official Bnet Forums)
"I'm sure that in time, every bit of her will be gone and her death will be a mystery... even to me."-Secret Window
So if we can't blame it on the aliens then who did it? How come after the span of time that we are missing and history picks back up, groups of civilizations that had no idea how to advance were beginning to. All of a sudden we had the industrial revolution, enlightenment and so for.
So therefore I say Aliens exist.
LOL. There are many solar systems that have been discovered with planets in their habitable zones. It's just too far to see if there is life on them.
It's the decisions you make when you have no time to make them that define who you are.
Although that is true, the sizes of these planets are much larger than that of Earth. Since we cannot "see" planets in other solar systems, they are always overshadowed by the thing called a star which emits light, we must be more intelligent in detecting satellites. Thus we record how stars wobble due to the effects of gravity. Any object orbiting a star will pull at it, which we can detect.
However, telescopes on Earth have to break through the atmosphere, which causes disturbances, and no telescope in space is large enough to detect these things. Therefore, at present times, we are only able to see planets which are at least 5 times more massive than the Earth, and in almost all cases they appear to be gas giants; not very likely to inhibit life.
as for the sea people they could have been pirates, but then again it didn't state in my history book who they were
And we did not go from knowing anything about machinery to suddenly having the industrail revolution. Clocks had been in existence for along time, the printing press which was an advanced form of machinery for it's time, large boats and their rudders, basic principles of physics such as the usage of mechanical levers had existed for millenia. We had knowledge of mechanics prior to the inducstrial revolution, what happened was we came up with new and more advanced machinery, as well as new ways of powering them, such as through steam power.
Ok, so if they are just regular sea-farers, how do they prove that aliens have been to Earth?
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Drake_Equation
Now the first three, average star formation rate, fractions of those stats that have planets, and the number of those planets that are inhabitable are farily straigth forward and can be estimated rather well we can assume.
However, the last four variables are very much debatable. We have no idea how often life develops outside of Earth, simply because we have nothing to compare it to except Earth. Furthermore, we also have no idea how long a civilization, if life does exist in other places, survives. We're the first for all we know, and how long have we been around as a civilization? Around 12-10 000 years I'd say. That's nothing during the lifetime of the Universe.
Another weird coincidence is the colonial town of Roanoke. Roanoke (if you don't know) was built when the Pilgrims came to America. The settlement was on in island in North California. Ships bringing supplies would travel to and from Roanoke from England (i think) but one time they didn't return for 2 years. Once they returned, the entire city was in ruins every colonist was missing, no sign of a battle or struggle, nothing. One theory said that the Spanish massacred them but why is there no sign of struggle? My theory, though it sounds kinda farfetched, would be alien abduction maybe. Also, according to some people, sightings of Native Americans with blond hair occured. Since when do Native Americans have blond hair.
It's the decisions you make when you have no time to make them that define who you are.
Well, if that's true, then why did the aliens, one day all of a sudden millions of years ago, decide that they should band together and pick up farming on their homeplanet?
Someone had to be the first, whether aliens or man. Doesn't prove anything.
Alien interference seems to be very popluar these days, everywhere you turn there's at least one theory explaining strange facts with alien interference.
All alien theories depend on the fact that the evidence is sketchy. There's certainly never anything that proves aliens were present, the only thing ever proven is that we do not know what happened. Which isn't any proof at all.
are you trying to say we are just nuts and that we can't believe that other spieces are out there... maybe some of us don't want to feel we are alone... maybe we want to know that there is something out there and maybe they did come down and help us learn....
but then again i could be wrong...
Crop circles: Have been made by actual people to stir up the media. It is quite simple and only involved pushing down the wheat or whatever with a board and some ropes.
Videos: Most are crap material and are obviously fake, just as videos of the Loch Ness monster, Bigfoot, Yetis and whatever else you can come up with. And those that are not obviously fake are much too sketchy. Scientific studies are not solely based on low quality film footage by amateur filmers.
Obductions: Well, people can claim anything for fame. If they are truly obducted, for what purpose? And why the heck would obducted people be returned to Earth again to spread rumors of aliens abducting them?
Not at all. I myself believe, as most of you, that we are not the only place in the Universe which houses life.
However, I do not think that we are being visited by aliens. The sheer size of the Universe and the difficulties on a physical level makes me highly doubtful of such visitors.
NVM Phrozen beat me to it.
ok first off... its not so hot that lifeforms couldnt survive... its too hot for liquid water to exist and we dont know if anything can exist without liquid water... second off there might be life in our own damn solar system... the moon called "europa" is a giant ball of ice with pressure cracks in the surface ice indicating that there is water underneath the surface moving around creating these cracks... before we try to find lifeforms in other parts of the universe we, as humans, need to do our selves a huge favor and first make a macine that can bore/melt its way thru the ice on europa and into the seas below to see if there is any... and i mean ANY... living organisms... from single celled creatures to complex life such as exists here on earth... and to quote the movie contact... "if there was nothing else out there... id be an awful waste of space" i know contact isnt real but its a good line and im posative that there are other life forms in outerspace... i mean cmon... were one fuckin solarsystem out of TRILLIONS OR MORE... and the heaven and hell thing... how can u believe in an imaginary place for "good" and "bad" people but cant fathom there being other life outside of our puny fuckin planet?
ima go out ona limb and say that some of these crop circles are too elaborate and absolutely perfect for human construction... and explain how inside some of the circles there are burns on the corn stalks?
gamma11 > east