Title:[Bug][Legendary Affix] The bracers that spawn a group on every shrine activation are not limited to one spawnReproducible: Always
Severity: Critical
Steps to reproduce:
1. Nemesis Bracers
2. Get a mouse macro software and record anything from 5-200 LMB mouse clicks on a single button.
3. Click on shrine with the macro button
Expected result: Only one elite group is spawned
Actual result: Anything from 5 to about 100 groups spawn all together, possibly lagging and crashing the server.
Notes: The shrine will keep spawning as long as no enemy is spawned under your mouse and replaces the mouse cursor with a sword cursor. Some places, like the Highlands Crossing in act 1 have a shrine that can potentially be used to spawn insane amounts that will lagg the game and possibly crash the server. Other shrines like this one exist throughout the acts. I have already reported this bug to Blizzard. If you don't spawn too many mobs, then this method is farmable.Farmed with this method on normal for about 10 hours yesterday. Aside from me, at least 5-10 other people from our clan know about this. I'm not sure if other people already know about this (haven't seen anyone streaming it. I'm pretty sure this will get hotfixed very soon.Confirmation: The drop rates in this current version are too low. After killing thousands of elites yesterday with 260-290 MF, i got about 7-15 legendary items and about 25 legendary crafting mats. It should be a lot higher considering that you clear like 50 packs at once and no legendary drops most of the times.
Clarification: This is on PTR. This is probably not as effecient on BETA.
INVIS and his friend(s) took the exploit to a whole new level lol...
Apparently you can refresh the shrine that is right before Izual, so they keep refreshing it that way and farming it. Also, they are doing it on T6 and i think exploding palm just wrecks everything. Since the monk has serenity, he's pretty much the best character for this exploit. Anyway, hotfix incoming
Remember they are trying new difficulty system which increases drop rates of legendaries at certain level , also with removal of MF , they have to test it out , not only what they think is the right drop chance , but also what the community thinks and how it works with the new density(they probably were testing this too). Also the new changes to weapon damage and stats and removal of crushing blow , too many changes from last patch to put it simply as drop chance numbers.
Raw numbers don't usually work out perfectly in reality as they did in theory.
Edit : After watching Kingkongor with Invis and exploiting the shrine at T3 and 6 , and everybody seems to be having fun , why not fix it so that it is no longer a bug and make something similar but intended. Remove the possibility to enter Izzual's level a million times or remove the shrine there , but allow the shrines to spawn 3-4 packs with the legendary , or since they want the Cursed Chests to be the new thing , then maybe they should consider adding this intense champion pack density to them after certain wave.(Many things can be done to cursed chests to make them fun).
I'm not buying that difficulty system change as a reason for the abysmally low drop rate, for one reason only. From normal through master mode, there is absolutely zero change in legendary drop rates; that doesn't happen until torment. In that case, there was no reason to drop the legendary drop rate far below that of live on the PTR. I can understand tweaking the drop rates for torment difficulties, where the difficulty level does actually matter, but having actually participated in this thread's exploit, I have seen just how bad the drop rates really are.
We would go anywhere from 200 to 300 (occasionally more) champ packs without seeing a legendary drop, and often, the only drop would be a legendary crafting material. Think about the time that you would spend without the exploit to farm the same number of champ packs, and then compare that to live. A very significant difference when the motto of RoS seems to be more, improved legendaries.
Everyone, including Blizz, knows that the legendary drop rate is terrible on the PTR, and it will be buffed; that's not the issue. It does, however, have many of us wondering, just wtf were they thinking, lol? Barring any tinfoil hat theories, I'm leaning toward the idea that somebody just flat out forgot that MF was being nerfed with regards to legendaries, and so we have what we now have. It's beta, things happen, no biggie; kinda comical, imo. Trying to somehow rationalize it as it being what Blizz intended, well, to each their own opinion.
Edit: Over the course of about 3 hours, give or take a little bit for breaks, and constantly using this exploit, I came out of it with 14 legendary crafting materials and 9 actual legendary items. MF of 260%. Just numbers for those who care. And yeah, ematanis, there is a lot of room to play with, I think, especially with cursed chests; it'll be interesting to see if they capitalize on things like that or not.
I'm not buying that difficulty system change as a reason for the abysmally low drop rate, for one reason only. From normal through master mode, there is absolutely zero change in legendary drop rates; that doesn't happen until torment. In that case, there was no reason to drop the legendary drop rate far below that of live on the PTR. I can understand tweaking the drop rates for torment difficulties, where the difficulty level does actually matter, but having actually participated in this thread's exploit, I have seen just how bad the drop rates really are.
We would go anywhere from 200 to 300 (occasionally more) champ packs without seeing a legendary drop, and often, the only drop would be a legendary crafting material. Think about the time that you would spend without the exploit to farm the same number of champ packs, and then compare that to live. A very significant difference when the motto of RoS seems to be more, improved legendaries.
Everyone, including Blizz, knows that the legendary drop rate is terrible on the PTR, and it will be buffed; that's not the issue. It does, however, have many of us wondering, just wtf were they thinking, lol? Barring any tinfoil hat theories, I'm leaning toward the idea that somebody just flat out forgot that MF was being nerfed with regards to legendaries, and so we have what we now have. It's beta, things happen, no biggie; kinda comical, imo. Trying to somehow rationalize it as it being what Blizz intended, well, to each their own opinion.
Edit: Over the course of about 3 hours, give or take a little bit for breaks, and constantly using this exploit, I came out of it with 14 legendary crafting materials and 9 actual legendary items. MF of 260%. Just numbers for those who care. And yeah, ematanis, there is a lot of room to play with, I think, especially with cursed chests; it'll be interesting to see if they capitalize on things like that or not.
By NO means are the drop rates worse than production.... I'm an average player that plays on mp4 with around 250% total mf after calcs. I find the drop rates on the ptr extremely higher... and in fact probably perfect.
It's only you "gosu" 500+% mf players that are whining. And really stfu.... blizzard is doing the less is more method... and they removed the horribly broken mf system that only allowed mp10/pl100 to see drops...
sabvre no need to tell others to stfu. also many people feel drop rate is low and they are going to buff it slightly. and who is gosu. i imagine someone many don't know about or care about.
sabvre no need to tell others to stfu. also many people feel drop rate is low and they are going to buff it slightly. and who is gosu. i imagine someone many don't know about or care about.
I apologize for my approach... but seriously I'm sick of the 2000+ crowd feeling entitled to the game being tailored to them. I'm also sick of the people that speed rush the game, and expecting blizzard to tailor to them as well.
Diablo is not a subscription game, and as such should neither receive the content, nor be played as such. 300 hours into any non MMO over a two year span should be considered plenty....
He's entirely entitled to his opinion, though the vitriol dripping from it is a bit excessive. Humorous, but excessive . Some people may be perfectly satisfied playing at lower difficulties, or haven't had the time or money to break into the higher MPs. For those people, the PTR probably does feel like more of the same, or better. To each their own.
He's entirely entitled to his opinion, though the vitriol dripping from it is a bit excessive. Humorous, but excessive . Some people may be perfectly satisfied playing at lower difficulties, or haven't had the time or money to break into the higher MPs. For those people, the PTR probably does feel like more of the same, or better. To each their own.
Its mostly that I'm sick of the negativity towards Diablo 3 (mostly on the official forums) and I'm probably venting. Take for example the ample butt hurt over boredom and calling the game shit when they had 1000 hours at its first anniversary.
I just don't think drops should be tailored to the hardcore crowd. Time spent should not become an exponential curve in that you get both better (mf) and more (kill speed) drops. This tailors the game only to the hardcore and also causes the butt hurt about worthless drops.
Anyways, the drops aren't exactly worse than prod. They are simply less frequent (for you high MF)... and inline with their "less is more" philosophy.
Honestly no , it doesn't feel the same and not in a good way. I used to farm on my monk in mp0-2 with Tempest Rush and the drop rates were significantly higher than what is found on the PTR , I did many many runs on normal with my Tempest Rush monk clearing the whole act in around 20 minutes(act3) and no drops whatsoever , I don't want a drop every run and I don't want a drop every hour , but playing for hours and not finding anything with my Paragon level(142) not the highest but still good enough , it feels like I am wasting time , the only thing making me feel better is that it is a PTR and it is all going for the bigger goal which is to better the game.
Also the game shouldn't feel less rewarding for us players that did break the higher mps and have higher paragon characters , I put good hours in the PTR and I found only 4 legendaries at 60 , 3 were total garbage and 1 good.
Loot 2.0 is supposed to give us less items but better , but when the better part doesn't work then the less part stings harder.Finding Tyrael's Might chest with no main stats only Resistance and 2 secondary stats isn't worth the 6-10 hours farming not to forget that in Vanilla we can't use the mystic to optimize the item for our build , so it either drops with exactly what you want or it is bad and good luck with finding what you want.
I'm not buying that difficulty system change as a reason for the abysmally low drop rate, for one reason only. From normal through master mode, there is absolutely zero change in legendary drop rates; that doesn't happen until torment. In that case, there was no reason to drop the legendary drop rate far below that of live on the PTR. I can understand tweaking the drop rates for torment difficulties, where the difficulty level does actually matter, but having actually participated in this thread's exploit, I have seen just how bad the drop rates really are.
We would go anywhere from 200 to 300 (occasionally more) champ packs without seeing a legendary drop, and often, the only drop would be a legendary crafting material. Think about the time that you would spend without the exploit to farm the same number of champ packs, and then compare that to live. A very significant difference when the motto of RoS seems to be more, improved legendaries.
Everyone, including Blizz, knows that the legendary drop rate is terrible on the PTR, and it will be buffed; that's not the issue. It does, however, have many of us wondering, just wtf were they thinking, lol? Barring any tinfoil hat theories, I'm leaning toward the idea that somebody just flat out forgot that MF was being nerfed with regards to legendaries, and so we have what we now have. It's beta, things happen, no biggie; kinda comical, imo. Trying to somehow rationalize it as it being what Blizz intended, well, to each their own opinion.
Edit: Over the course of about 3 hours, give or take a little bit for breaks, and constantly using this exploit, I came out of it with 14 legendary crafting materials and 9 actual legendary items. MF of 260%. Just numbers for those who care. And yeah, ematanis, there is a lot of room to play with, I think, especially with cursed chests; it'll be interesting to see if they capitalize on things like that or not.
By NO means are the drop rates worse than production.... I'm an average player that plays on mp4 with around 250% total mf after calcs. I find the drop rates on the ptr extremely higher... and in fact probably perfect.
It's only you "gosu" 500+% mf players that are whining. And really stfu.... blizzard is doing the less is more method... and they removed the horribly broken mf system that only allowed mp10/pl100 to see drops...
In order to have around 250% mf on mp4 after stacks + calcs you would need to only be paragon 21, that in and of itself is pretty low. I dont play that much and I play on MP8 on my barb and I am up to P63. My wizard is P37 and I only played on MP1 for her.
My barb that is P63 on MP8 sees on average 1-2 legendary per run. With a run consisting of festering woods -> fields of misery -> weeping hollow (and that spawned location in fields if it is there). I use no actual MF gear.
Now these guys are running with high MF farming ONLY elites for hours and seeing only 9 legendary items? That is far too low.
As both Jamoose and Krystal have pointed out, the bigger issue is drop rates. We have two theories 1) they forgot to take into account MF when adjusting for drop rates which is simple human error, no big deal; or 2) We are seeing how loot 2.0 is going to play out long term and this is in fact Blizz's endstate.
If the latter then it serves to highlight the debate over BoA. There are arguments on both sides. On the anti-BoA side there's the idea that you have two possible ways to go 1) drop rates have to be low, so low that over the course of a year you won't have seen a significant % of possible legendaries and thus your character will find it difficult to progress or 2) The drop rates have to be so high that over a years course you will have seen every legendary multiple times. In both cases, it sucks to be you. In#1 you will become so frustrated at your lack of progress you will quit playing. In #2 you quickly become bored, and quit playing.
The exploit illustrates #1 above and if that's the way it's going to work at release, the game will suck. There have been some great ideas out there on how to improve it that DON'T involve third party trading sights or keeping MF in the game, both of which I am against. I've always hated MF and never used it except what came naturally through paragon levels.
But to say the answer is simply trading within a game/group is also bad if #1 is left in place. It would lead to groups being formed among players with the same primary stat i.e. Wiz/WD, Monk/DH, Barb/Crusader because at least that way if a legendary dropped for the Wiz say and they already had it or it wasn't an upgrade, it could be traded to the WD possibly.
TLDR; something needs to be done about drop rates and BoA before launch.
Low is a subjective term. I played a lot before paragon was added... I have a wife, a house, 2 kids, and a salaried job. When your have responsibilities spending 400 hours on a game (10 fte work weeks) is a lot.
Maybe, your "not playing much" is in comparison to the fact you may not have responsibilities? Or compared to spending all available free time on other games?
Low is a subjective term. I played a lot before paragon was added... I have a wife, a house, 2 kids, and a salaried job. When your have responsibilities spending 400 hours on a game (10 fte work weeks) is a lot.
Maybe, your "not playing much" is in comparison to the fact you may not have responsibilities? Or compared to spending all available free time on other games?
I don't think hours invested has anything to do with it, actually.
Everyone who is saying drops feel low is comparing what they're doing on the PTR to what they're doing on live, and it's unlikely that they've suddenly found tons more hours per week to play the PTR.
I have a pLvl 100 who could handle MP6. I put that toon into Master (60) and I'm seeing probably 25% of the legendaries that I was seeing on live. It MAY even be less than that. Considering we can't trade the logical thing is to INCREASE drop rates, not to drastically slash them. This is not rocket science and should be patently obvious to everyone at Blizzard too. The problem is that they absolutely have NOT taken into account that most of us are down a pretty significant amount of magic find from live - that explains MOST of the "low drop rate" problems. Yet they have not fixed that, which is kinda a head-scratcher.
1) They know we can't trade which means we need better odds to find items 2) They know we all have less MF than we do on live 3) They still drastically slashed drop rates, instead of trying something more moderate
In light of #1 and #2, #3 is completely nonsensical and the combination of all of it is why people are thoroughly frustrated. I know that I do not find the PTR terribly fun. It's tedious. It's a chore. In a BoA world I shouldn't be bent over backwards by RNG.
Low is a subjective term. I played a lot before paragon was added... I have a wife, a house, 2 kids, and a salaried job. When your have responsibilities spending 400 hours on a game (10 fte work weeks) is a lot.
Maybe, your "not playing much" is in comparison to the fact you may not have responsibilities? Or compared to spending all available free time on other games?
I love this argument, I really do. I have all the same responsibilities as you do, well, only 1 kid here, but still about the same. It's a juggling act, I play when I can. Some days, it's maybe an hour. Other days, I can get away with more. Such is life and entertainment . And just as low is a subjective term, so is the mentality subjective that the current drop rates on the PTR are fine. What do you consider fine? How many legendaries per hour are you finding, for example? Or how many hours does it take to find just one? It's why I provided the exact numbers on what happened when we farmed only elites for those 3 hours, to give some sort of reference. And not just any elites; a LOT of elites.
I'll admit that when I said drop rates were fine imo, I miss spoke. Compared to before.. it feels like an improvement to players like me.
I am okay with rates being upped, as long as people don't expect a legendary piñata. People need to remember that blizzard is trying to enforce a "less is more" philosophy.
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Good on you for reporting it. How did you get such high mf in ros?
Bought items from AH, waited for the profile to update and then copied.
According to MannerCookie, this exploit is like two weeks old. I'm not sure if that's true or not though.
I hanged around at MistFire's stream and linked him this thread so he was testing it out on his barb / wd with some pretty good results.
INVIS and his friend(s) took the exploit to a whole new level lol...
Apparently you can refresh the shrine that is right before Izual, so they keep refreshing it that way and farming it. Also, they are doing it on T6 and i think exploding palm just wrecks everything. Since the monk has serenity, he's pretty much the best character for this exploit. Anyway, hotfix incoming
Remember they are trying new difficulty system which increases drop rates of legendaries at certain level , also with removal of MF , they have to test it out , not only what they think is the right drop chance , but also what the community thinks and how it works with the new density(they probably were testing this too).
Also the new changes to weapon damage and stats and removal of crushing blow , too many changes from last patch to put it simply as drop chance numbers.
Raw numbers don't usually work out perfectly in reality as they did in theory.
Edit : After watching Kingkongor with Invis and exploiting the shrine at T3 and 6 , and everybody seems to be having fun , why not fix it so that it is no longer a bug and make something similar but intended.
Remove the possibility to enter Izzual's level a million times or remove the shrine there , but allow the shrines to spawn 3-4 packs with the legendary , or since they want the Cursed Chests to be the new thing , then maybe they should consider adding this intense champion pack density to them after certain wave.(Many things can be done to cursed chests to make them fun).
I'm not buying that difficulty system change as a reason for the abysmally low drop rate, for one reason only. From normal through master mode, there is absolutely zero change in legendary drop rates; that doesn't happen until torment. In that case, there was no reason to drop the legendary drop rate far below that of live on the PTR. I can understand tweaking the drop rates for torment difficulties, where the difficulty level does actually matter, but having actually participated in this thread's exploit, I have seen just how bad the drop rates really are.
We would go anywhere from 200 to 300 (occasionally more) champ packs without seeing a legendary drop, and often, the only drop would be a legendary crafting material. Think about the time that you would spend without the exploit to farm the same number of champ packs, and then compare that to live. A very significant difference when the motto of RoS seems to be more, improved legendaries.
Everyone, including Blizz, knows that the legendary drop rate is terrible on the PTR, and it will be buffed; that's not the issue. It does, however, have many of us wondering, just wtf were they thinking, lol? Barring any tinfoil hat theories, I'm leaning toward the idea that somebody just flat out forgot that MF was being nerfed with regards to legendaries, and so we have what we now have. It's beta, things happen, no biggie; kinda comical, imo. Trying to somehow rationalize it as it being what Blizz intended, well, to each their own opinion.
Edit: Over the course of about 3 hours, give or take a little bit for breaks, and constantly using this exploit, I came out of it with 14 legendary crafting materials and 9 actual legendary items. MF of 260%. Just numbers for those who care. And yeah, ematanis, there is a lot of room to play with, I think, especially with cursed chests; it'll be interesting to see if they capitalize on things like that or not.
sabvre no need to tell others to stfu. also many people feel drop rate is low and they are going to buff it slightly. and who is gosu. i imagine someone many don't know about or care about.
He's entirely entitled to his opinion, though the vitriol dripping from it is a bit excessive. Humorous, but excessive . Some people may be perfectly satisfied playing at lower difficulties, or haven't had the time or money to break into the higher MPs. For those people, the PTR probably does feel like more of the same, or better. To each their own.
I used to farm on my monk in mp0-2 with Tempest Rush and the drop rates were significantly higher than what is found on the PTR , I did many many runs on normal with my Tempest Rush monk clearing the whole act in around 20 minutes(act3) and no drops whatsoever , I don't want a drop every run and I don't want a drop every hour , but playing for hours and not finding anything with my Paragon level(142) not the highest but still good enough , it feels like I am wasting time , the only thing making me feel better is that it is a PTR and it is all going for the bigger goal which is to better the game. Also the game shouldn't feel less rewarding for us players that did break the higher mps and have higher paragon characters , I put good hours in the PTR and I found only 4 legendaries at 60 , 3 were total garbage and 1 good.
Loot 2.0 is supposed to give us less items but better , but when the better part doesn't work then the less part stings harder.Finding Tyrael's Might chest with no main stats only Resistance and 2 secondary stats isn't worth the 6-10 hours farming not to forget that in Vanilla we can't use the mystic to optimize the item for our build , so it either drops with exactly what you want or it is bad and good luck with finding what you want.
Low is a subjective term. I played a lot before paragon was added... I have a wife, a house, 2 kids, and a salaried job. When your have responsibilities spending 400 hours on a game (10 fte work weeks) is a lot.
Maybe, your "not playing much" is in comparison to the fact you may not have responsibilities? Or compared to spending all available free time on other games?
I don't think hours invested has anything to do with it, actually.
Everyone who is saying drops feel low is comparing what they're doing on the PTR to what they're doing on live, and it's unlikely that they've suddenly found tons more hours per week to play the PTR.
I have a pLvl 100 who could handle MP6. I put that toon into Master (60) and I'm seeing probably 25% of the legendaries that I was seeing on live. It MAY even be less than that. Considering we can't trade the logical thing is to INCREASE drop rates, not to drastically slash them. This is not rocket science and should be patently obvious to everyone at Blizzard too. The problem is that they absolutely have NOT taken into account that most of us are down a pretty significant amount of magic find from live - that explains MOST of the "low drop rate" problems. Yet they have not fixed that, which is kinda a head-scratcher.
1) They know we can't trade which means we need better odds to find items
2) They know we all have less MF than we do on live
3) They still drastically slashed drop rates, instead of trying something more moderate
In light of #1 and #2, #3 is completely nonsensical and the combination of all of it is why people are thoroughly frustrated. I know that I do not find the PTR terribly fun. It's tedious. It's a chore. In a BoA world I shouldn't be bent over backwards by RNG.
I'll admit that when I said drop rates were fine imo, I miss spoke. Compared to before.. it feels like an improvement to players like me.
I am okay with rates being upped, as long as people don't expect a legendary piñata. People need to remember that blizzard is trying to enforce a "less is more" philosophy.