Twisters (excluding those created with the Wicked Wind rune) will now despawn if they stop moving
This applies only to the PC/Mac version
No other changes really, but it'll be interesting to see what becomes the top DPS group now. I personally think it's gonna be an interesting battle between HT Garg WD, generator monk, and Archon wizard. Maybe those three +x?
A big change is Fist of Fury on Way of a Hundred Fists got the Flying Dragon Snapshot removed it no longer cares about attack speed and buff stacks 15 times max. This hurts Gen Monk a lot which was the highest solo build on PTR currently.
This means only one thing for me,i gonna play s7 only for stash tab.Another thing is that im pretty sure that all rec. in group play gonna be lower.This patch "2.4.1" is last chance for all NS players to lev. up gems and get some good amount of para.
Sorry Jelloslock and Angry_Roleplayer, of course there are other changes. But let's be honest here, everything pales in comparison to that one. And I'm not sure why that crusader change was necessary. I wonder what all of us overlook when it comes to Crusader - the measly buffs leave him so useless, they must know something internally that would make it too powerful if they provide further buffs, but the entire playerbase is missing it. And about the monk, I think it's a fair change, the monk is pretty strong on PTR already and I think it's still among the top 3 in S7.
it is funny how apparently they weren't able to fix it, so they just applied a workaround ^^
I think this is no workaround, this is exactly the fix that is needed. Only the Wicked Wind rune should allow twisters to stay in place, otherwise Twisters travel, as the tooltip says. It was always more like an "unintended mechanic" that certain corners were keeping the Twisters in place, and using that in combination with Energy Twister made it so powerful.
I can think of many workarounds (nerfing the damage, removing the rune, messing with collision boxes) but this is exactly the fix.
so there are literally no coders or techincal workers who can solve a basic item bug..
I don't think I will invest any more time into this game at its current state... Legion is coming, hearthstone is looming and those 2 are enough for my gaming time.
Sorry Jelloslock and Angry_Roleplayer, of course there are other changes. But let's be honest here, everything pales in comparison to that one. And I'm not sure why that crusader change was necessary. I wonder what all of us overlook when it comes to Crusader - the measly buffs leave him so useless, they must know something internally that would make it too powerful if they provide further buffs, but the entire playerbase is missing it. And about the monk, I think it's a fair change, the monk is pretty strong on PTR already and I think it's still among the top 3 in S7.
Because stacking cons = 2.5m hps Now that it doesn't stack its 48k hps.
And also, complaininh about the team not having enough manpower is annoying. We know it. They know it. What would you expect when you had 2 major people leaving the company and another one working on another game. Maybe season 8 will see better days than season 7 but for the love of whatever deity you believe in - take everything in proportion...
I do not understand their inability and non existing motivation to bring Crusader up to speed and make Akkhan more interesting... It just baffles me.
Excuse me? Sader LoN-Thorns is one of the top 3 solo builds since LoN came out. Sure it would be nice to see one of the others get higher than GR80-85 but still, they have one of the best solo builds.
Good news, finally we will not see 30gem lv difference on group players and solo players. And Grift lv will be lower as well which means lower paragon and give more even field for solo leaderboards.
Sorry to break it to ya, but there is still likely going to be a 30 gem level difference. Most solo players stick around GR85, and I expect groups to still be in the 110-115 range in the end.
Good news, finally we will not see 30gem lv difference on group players and solo players. And Grift lv will be lower as well which means lower paragon and give more even field for solo leaderboards.
Sorry to break it to ya, but there is still likely going to be a 30 gem level difference. Most solo players stick around GR85, and I expect groups to still be in the 110-115 range in the end.
That's comparing semi-casual solo players to high-end groups.
Top solo players will beat GR100 or a bit higher, top groups probably GR110, maybe GR115. The difference will not be 30 levels, more like 10-15, and due to the group "nerf" it might even be less than ten for most people. For casuals, the difference between grouping with similarly geared+skilled people and playing solo will be very very small. Of course they're going to have gems about 20-30 levels lower than the top players... which has nothing to do with "group play vs solo play" but simply with the fact that high end players play more, play more efficient, and are better at what they're doing.
How do you define a high end player? My clans has multiple players with 100+ level gems and top 200 solo and group records. I don't follow clan rankings so is my clan high end? Most of my clannies play consistently, but are far from the lifers everyone talks about as throwing the curve off.
What I do know is that zdps play has allowed many players to make gains far past the abilities of someone like me who has refused to play any form of Z toon. Even if 2.4.2 nerfs z play the damage has been done and has gone on too long. I've been playing since vanilla, but just by refusing to play z I will never get to anything equivalent to where z players are standing at now. I made a stance and no matter what I will never make up for not joining the heard and suckling the teat of z whore that the devs allowed to happen.
I await to see what will happen in season 7 with the new patch, but the game is forever cancered by the past 2 seasons of z mania.
There's no definition for "high end player". I just use this to highlight the gap between GR levels, as it often has other reasons than what people claim. Look at the NA monk leaderboard: MIchael is probably gonna finish top 5 in the end, but he has only played solo after the first few days (so literally not a single high GR run with a group, it's why his gems are 90 and his augments 75) and he stopped after one month. Similarly, Wudijo cleared a GR88 at around paragon 1100 and relatively low gems and augments (he was pushed by a group in 5 days, but the same can be achieved in a few weeks of solo play). A GR84 would probably doable for someone like him at half that paragon and much lower gems - and that would be top 100! Yet, it would be more than 15 tiers below the top tier.
That's what I mean: experience, knowledge, efficiency, and most importantly skill are just as important (if not more important) to success in D3 than other factors. So when I see people compare a casual solo player at GR85 with the top groups on the 4 player leaderboards, it's comparing apples and oranges. If they're 30 tiers higher it's *not* just the game's fault, half of that (or more) is due to other factors that are often neglected with arguments like "D3 requires no skill", "I don't have the time to get 3000 paragon", "yeah but I don't have rank 120 gems". The last two points might be true, but occasionally we get to see how "high end players" would still be 5-10 tiers better than most other players given the same starting point.
Well, I digress, let's not derail this too much. To put things into perspective, on PTR it seems like on season some Chinese players pushed group play quite a bit and GR99 was the highest, at the paragon ~800 range, but that was with the old healing Crusader. Support monk/barb and 2 HT WDs as DPS. However, there's a paragon 1500 WD on NS who cleared GR95 with not too crazy gear, so that already highlights that the gap might be something in the range of 8-10. Maybe less, maybe more, we'll see, but I really don't think it'll be 20+ tiers again unless something crazy is discovered. On live, GR129 is down (WQW on NS-EU yesterday), so we'll probably see 130+ by the end of the season. Solo, the wizard can probably go much higher than people think: Blatty cleared GR109, Loulou GR111, but they seem to be the only solo wizards to push with the non-Firebug (and have gear+skill to pull it off). So there's a 20 tier gap between group and solo. The non-wizard classes follow 10 tiers behind. So of the 30 tier gap, 10 is probably due to Twister madness, and 10 due to overpowered group buffs.
So, if i followed right, twister is gone for good, which is nice, and HT garg WD would be a good contender for the dps spot alongside another dps dedicated to bosskilling right ? With this set up, does wd will still be support ? Because i'mplanning on playing wd next season and i'd prefer to play support in group
I've said this about a million times, but once again:
We absolutely don't know. Since Twister was still on until yesterday, no one tested anything beyond Twister. There's still no more than 30 groups that ran anything on PTR, and only one group has even done a GR100+ post-patch. One group, and millions of players on live. We have absolutely no clue.
Currently PTR would tell us that double HT WD as DPS would be top, with likely monk+barb as support. However, I could easily see monk go DPS/Hybrid. I don't think pure WD support will be a thing at all, no. Maybe an Archon wizard will be squeezed in as well. My "guess", but honestly, it's really just a guess: barb stays in as support, WD, monk, wiz battle for DPS spots, with potentially going for hybrid (WD/monk) or full support (monk). Could be a 2+2 or 3+1 (3 DPS here) meta. As of now, my guess is that DH/Crusader will likely underperform in any role in 4 player. However, that is for the top groups. If you're not battling for rank 1, you can probably play just about anything, since the crazy group buffs have been nerfed. Just make sure you have some kind of synergy (a LoN DH or thorns Crusader just don't really work in group) and are able to pull your own weight at the GR level (a HT WD will be able to compete at 100+, a Roland/Akkhan Crusader probably not).
But again: it's just guessing. The lightning ball DH was discovered weeks after the PTR in S1. The Hydra wizard was discovered just at the end of S3. The static charge monk came up 4 weeks into S4. The sticky Twister became public a few weeks into S5. The Archon/Twister was discovered towards the end of S6. Almost never has any meta-relevant stuff been discovered on PTR - and never before was PTR such a barren wasteland as it is now. NO. ONE. KNOWS. WHAT'S GONNA BE THE META :-)
DPS would be either raiment monks, HT WD or Tal Rasha/Archon Wizards. Archon will still be there as it absolutely performs better than any non-archon builds as of now.
As for support. Crusader is absolutely dead. Barb is still decent with damage reduction buffs, WD is decent (-60% damage from mobs with paranoia and cloud of insects, and some buffs as well via piranhas, slam dance and hex), Monk still has superior pulling with Implosion. Nothing can beat that. For DH i don't know for sure. Monk will surely be there, as AREA DAMAGe/density is still strong, does not matter the class, so pulls are still necessary.
AT LAST!
They finally fixed it. No more sticky Twisters. Rejoice everyone!
Full patch notes for current PTR patch: http://www.diablofans.com/blizz-tracker/topic/62657-patch-2-4-2-ptr-patch-notes
And the exact quote that matters:
Energy Twister
No other changes really, but it'll be interesting to see what becomes the top DPS group now. I personally think it's gonna be an interesting battle between HT Garg WD, generator monk, and Archon wizard. Maybe those three +x?
A big change is Fist of Fury on Way of a Hundred Fists got the Flying Dragon Snapshot removed it no longer cares about attack speed and buff stacks 15 times max. This hurts Gen Monk a lot which was the highest solo build on PTR currently.
No other changes???
Heal Sader instantly killed! :((
RIP.. and i wanted to play sader in S7 lol
http://www.angryroleplayer.com/
http://www.youtube.com/c/angryroleplayer
https://www.diablofans.com/builds/105329-2-6-7-rend-bleed-whirlwind-gr130
https://www.diablofans.com/builds/105301-2-6-7-fist-of-the-heavens-aegis-of-valor-gr110
This means only one thing for me,i gonna play s7 only for stash tab.Another thing is that im pretty sure that all rec. in group play gonna be lower.This patch "2.4.1" is last chance for all NS players to lev. up gems and get some good amount of para.
maybe 2/2? like HT+Archon with 2 Zdps? or would it go 2x Archon+2 zdps? pets with 4 players just seems like a terrible thing if its 3z+1dps haha.
Sorry Jelloslock and Angry_Roleplayer, of course there are other changes. But let's be honest here, everything pales in comparison to that one. And I'm not sure why that crusader change was necessary. I wonder what all of us overlook when it comes to Crusader - the measly buffs leave him so useless, they must know something internally that would make it too powerful if they provide further buffs, but the entire playerbase is missing it. And about the monk, I think it's a fair change, the monk is pretty strong on PTR already and I think it's still among the top 3 in S7.
I can think of many workarounds (nerfing the damage, removing the rune, messing with collision boxes) but this is exactly the fix.
so there are literally no coders or techincal workers who can solve a basic item bug..
I don't think I will invest any more time into this game at its current state... Legion is coming, hearthstone is looming and those 2 are enough for my gaming time.
And also, complaininh about the team not having enough manpower is annoying. We know it. They know it. What would you expect when you had 2 major people leaving the company and another one working on another game. Maybe season 8 will see better days than season 7 but for the love of whatever deity you believe in - take everything in proportion...
Finally
2 dps + 2 support max btw, no need to blame all supports for one.. such as dh lol.
#12 solo monk - era 5 ns
#9 solo wizard - era 4 ns
#9 2 player - era 4 ns
I wonder if it will just be 4x HT WD? or if its 2dps/2zpds what would the Z be?
Top solo players will beat GR100 or a bit higher, top groups probably GR110, maybe GR115. The difference will not be 30 levels, more like 10-15, and due to the group "nerf" it might even be less than ten for most people. For casuals, the difference between grouping with similarly geared+skilled people and playing solo will be very very small. Of course they're going to have gems about 20-30 levels lower than the top players... which has nothing to do with "group play vs solo play" but simply with the fact that high end players play more, play more efficient, and are better at what they're doing.
How do you define a high end player? My clans has multiple players with 100+ level gems and top 200 solo and group records. I don't follow clan rankings so is my clan high end? Most of my clannies play consistently, but are far from the lifers everyone talks about as throwing the curve off.
What I do know is that zdps play has allowed many players to make gains far past the abilities of someone like me who has refused to play any form of Z toon. Even if 2.4.2 nerfs z play the damage has been done and has gone on too long. I've been playing since vanilla, but just by refusing to play z I will never get to anything equivalent to where z players are standing at now. I made a stance and no matter what I will never make up for not joining the heard and suckling the teat of z whore that the devs allowed to happen.
I await to see what will happen in season 7 with the new patch, but the game is forever cancered by the past 2 seasons of z mania.
100 level gems are not nigh end. 200 top is not high end. This is "casual", like me.
115+ gems are high end. top10 is high end.
http://www.angryroleplayer.com/
http://www.youtube.com/c/angryroleplayer
https://www.diablofans.com/builds/105329-2-6-7-rend-bleed-whirlwind-gr130
https://www.diablofans.com/builds/105301-2-6-7-fist-of-the-heavens-aegis-of-valor-gr110
There's no definition for "high end player". I just use this to highlight the gap between GR levels, as it often has other reasons than what people claim. Look at the NA monk leaderboard: MIchael is probably gonna finish top 5 in the end, but he has only played solo after the first few days (so literally not a single high GR run with a group, it's why his gems are 90 and his augments 75) and he stopped after one month. Similarly, Wudijo cleared a GR88 at around paragon 1100 and relatively low gems and augments (he was pushed by a group in 5 days, but the same can be achieved in a few weeks of solo play). A GR84 would probably doable for someone like him at half that paragon and much lower gems - and that would be top 100! Yet, it would be more than 15 tiers below the top tier.
That's what I mean: experience, knowledge, efficiency, and most importantly skill are just as important (if not more important) to success in D3 than other factors. So when I see people compare a casual solo player at GR85 with the top groups on the 4 player leaderboards, it's comparing apples and oranges. If they're 30 tiers higher it's *not* just the game's fault, half of that (or more) is due to other factors that are often neglected with arguments like "D3 requires no skill", "I don't have the time to get 3000 paragon", "yeah but I don't have rank 120 gems". The last two points might be true, but occasionally we get to see how "high end players" would still be 5-10 tiers better than most other players given the same starting point.
Well, I digress, let's not derail this too much. To put things into perspective, on PTR it seems like on season some Chinese players pushed group play quite a bit and GR99 was the highest, at the paragon ~800 range, but that was with the old healing Crusader. Support monk/barb and 2 HT WDs as DPS. However, there's a paragon 1500 WD on NS who cleared GR95 with not too crazy gear, so that already highlights that the gap might be something in the range of 8-10. Maybe less, maybe more, we'll see, but I really don't think it'll be 20+ tiers again unless something crazy is discovered. On live, GR129 is down (WQW on NS-EU yesterday), so we'll probably see 130+ by the end of the season. Solo, the wizard can probably go much higher than people think: Blatty cleared GR109, Loulou GR111, but they seem to be the only solo wizards to push with the non-Firebug (and have gear+skill to pull it off). So there's a 20 tier gap between group and solo. The non-wizard classes follow 10 tiers behind. So of the 30 tier gap, 10 is probably due to Twister madness, and 10 due to overpowered group buffs.
I've said this about a million times, but once again:
We absolutely don't know. Since Twister was still on until yesterday, no one tested anything beyond Twister. There's still no more than 30 groups that ran anything on PTR, and only one group has even done a GR100+ post-patch. One group, and millions of players on live. We have absolutely no clue.
Currently PTR would tell us that double HT WD as DPS would be top, with likely monk+barb as support. However, I could easily see monk go DPS/Hybrid. I don't think pure WD support will be a thing at all, no. Maybe an Archon wizard will be squeezed in as well. My "guess", but honestly, it's really just a guess: barb stays in as support, WD, monk, wiz battle for DPS spots, with potentially going for hybrid (WD/monk) or full support (monk). Could be a 2+2 or 3+1 (3 DPS here) meta. As of now, my guess is that DH/Crusader will likely underperform in any role in 4 player. However, that is for the top groups. If you're not battling for rank 1, you can probably play just about anything, since the crazy group buffs have been nerfed. Just make sure you have some kind of synergy (a LoN DH or thorns Crusader just don't really work in group) and are able to pull your own weight at the GR level (a HT WD will be able to compete at 100+, a Roland/Akkhan Crusader probably not).
But again: it's just guessing. The lightning ball DH was discovered weeks after the PTR in S1. The Hydra wizard was discovered just at the end of S3. The static charge monk came up 4 weeks into S4. The sticky Twister became public a few weeks into S5. The Archon/Twister was discovered towards the end of S6. Almost never has any meta-relevant stuff been discovered on PTR - and never before was PTR such a barren wasteland as it is now. NO. ONE. KNOWS. WHAT'S GONNA BE THE META :-)
I think top GR will be about 108-110 this season.
DPS would be either raiment monks, HT WD or Tal Rasha/Archon Wizards. Archon will still be there as it absolutely performs better than any non-archon builds as of now.
As for support. Crusader is absolutely dead. Barb is still decent with damage reduction buffs, WD is decent (-60% damage from mobs with paranoia and cloud of insects, and some buffs as well via piranhas, slam dance and hex), Monk still has superior pulling with Implosion. Nothing can beat that. For DH i don't know for sure. Monk will surely be there, as AREA DAMAGe/density is still strong, does not matter the class, so pulls are still necessary.
http://www.angryroleplayer.com/
http://www.youtube.com/c/angryroleplayer
https://www.diablofans.com/builds/105329-2-6-7-rend-bleed-whirlwind-gr130
https://www.diablofans.com/builds/105301-2-6-7-fist-of-the-heavens-aegis-of-valor-gr110