Hi everyone, today I want to talk about something I've been thinking over for months - what is the ideal amount of stash space for a game like Diablo 3? What is 'enough'? To that end, I roughly photoshopped what I believe to be sufficient and future expansion proof.
In this video I explain why this general amount of space will always be enough, why you need a tab you can dedicate to a specific class if you choose, and the idea behind a mat-only tab. Hopefully someone at Blizzard will see this. Enjoy and let me know what you guys think!
Haha. Agree with this. It doesn't take a video to say "I want 10 9x19 tabs".
I think stash tabs are fine too. I'm one of those people who would keep 3-4 copies of every single item I find if I could. Having limited space forces me to keep only the stuff that actually really needs keeping. If given the chance, I would blow more time organizing my storage than playing the game. So I'm glad that they don't allow me to do that.
The video is to explain WHY this is enough, is future proof, why we need it, etc. A screenshot with no explanation is the type of 'feedback' that gets thrown in the blizzard trash heap. I'm trying to make a strong case for why we need what we need. Sigh..
If you are one of those guys that level every class and play with all of them often (usually when you get bored), the actual stash space is NOT enough.
If you play with only 2 or 3 classes regularly, but you like to swap builds often (cuz you got bored) you still don't have enough space.
Just to make it short: If you play ALOT and like to use diferent specs with different characters the actual stash space is not enough.
Completely agree man. Its a really unnecessary problem that blizzard forces us to have. I play all 6 classes, so I have 9 mules full of gear (6 main characters, each class). Every 2-3 days I have to go through my mules gain an delete stuff since I have no room. It's not like I keep useless stuff either, for each character I like to keep every set, every gear required for the various builds. I've been meaning to create a seasonal character just for the transmog bonus, but guess what I cant. I have no character slots left.
If you are one of those guys that level every class and play with all of them often (usually when you get bored), the actual stash space is NOT enough.
If you play with only 2 or 3 classes regularly, but you like to swap builds often (cuz you got bored) you still don't have enough space.
Just to make it short: If you play ALOT and like to use diferent specs with different characters the actual stash space is not enough.
I have every class and i consider that precisely why i don't need extra stash space, tons of gear slots and inventory slots, crafting materials will become UI like bloodshar
[quote=Rayden_Weiss;/members/95217-rayden_weiss;/forums/diablo-iii-general-forums/diablo-iii-general-discussion/97330-ideal-stash-space-concept-video?comment=9]I totally agree with the video.
If you are one of those guys that level every class and play with all of them often (usually when you get bored), the actual stash space is NOT enough.
If you play with only 2 or 3 classes regularly, but you like to swap builds often (cuz you got bored) you still don't have enough space.
Just to make it short: If you play ALOT and like to use diferent specs with different characters the actual stash space is not enough.
I have every class and i consider that precisely why i don't need extra stash space, tons of gear slots and inventory slots, crafting materials will become UI like bloodshards eventually.
I'm not talking about having all the classes, but playing regularly with most or even all of them. If you do play alot with every class, I'll just assume you salvage alot of good legendaries and don't like to keep alternative gear sets for build swapping.
Honestly Torchlight 2 solved this issue with ease in the Vanilla game(unmoded) by giving the player 2 stash chest with 6 tabs each. 1 chest was your community stash for all characters, and 1 personal chest for each character. Blizz over the years have taken great ideals, or reworked their own versions of what worked from other MMO's/MODS and patched right into WOW. An example of this would be Rift launching with "loot all" and WOW a year later implementing this function due the forums asking "why can't we have group loot" like in Rift?
Well, "Why can't we have 2 separate chest" Blizzard, like in Torchlight 2? Also since I'm on the subject of what other ARPG's do slightly different, why can't we socket items using the blacksmith, then enchant the item? Like the use of a Ramaladni's gift actually has a damn blacksmithing hammer as its on use click....Rather than having to break damn near perfect rings/necks just to remove it's primary for a socket since anyone who's min/max will always dump the primary for the socket. Which would bring up the issue of why a socket even has to count as an affix, when other games treat them as a secondary or even a purchasable upgrade. When enchanting is used correctly, we can enhance an item or remove the undesired stats vs. the current of removing say LPH only to roll a 50%CHD(facepalm yelling WHY!) then re-roll again for the fucking socket.
Also I only play one class really, dabble a bit in others but mostly play barb only. I have 5 sets of gear, and like 1/2 of the higher end rings/neck/2h/1h/belts/bracers to interchange elemental damage types. This is due to me being paranoid that blizz will retroactive a so/so item into a godly one, or maybe I am a pack rat lol. Either way blizz should start looking at the other big ARPG's no different than how they treat WOW by making quality of life changes almost exclusively due to public outcry when being compared to the MMO that offers the change.
The video is to explain WHY this is enough, is future proof, why we need it, etc.
I normally really like your videos, but this one is kinda a fail for me. You basically just made a 10min long video asking for more stash space. I do not see WHY this would ever be enough. You even said it yourself in the video: the size of a tab SHOULD be enough, and mentioned that might change in a few years. You never know how fast they will be releasing new items, and how much people keep. If the current stash is too small for you, a bigger one will be too small for someone else, no matter how big you make it.
As for your future proof: unless I missed something, that is "just add 3 additional tabs we shouldn't be using now, but is for the future"? In 2.0 they gave an extra tab, and one of the last patches (don't know what exactly) they made it 5. So, they can just add whenever they want. You could as well just ask 7 tabs (1 for each class, and 1 for mats), and have them add 1 for each class they add, just as future proof.
Don't get me wrong, everyone wants more space, including me. But the only useful thing in your video is the small quality of life change that crafting mats will go to the right tab automatically.
I would suggest a stash like this: 2 tabs: -Crafting Mats (everything that is not gear) - Second tab you can see as "drawers". You will have an icon for pants, 1 for rings, 1 for amulet, ... When you click on such an item (for example pants), it will show you all pants in your stash, starting with your class specific sets, then items with your mainstat, items without mainstat, items with other mainstat, other classes sets. If you have multiple pieces of the same item, it will be a stack, if you click on it it will show you all of them on a new tab. (sorting will be done with highest mainstat first). If you add a filter, to search an item by name, you will have a very easy way to store your items.
They stated they are not against keeping the items or more space, they have problems with the fact that it's hard to find your items if you have too many.
So, coming with a solution how to cleanly store/display items so you can find them quick might convince them faster than saying why we would need more space and how much would be enough.
A (very) short term remedy would be just to increase the stack sizes 10 fold. Its kind of ridiculous that trial keys stack at 100, gems and mats stack at 1000. I dont even pick up trial keys anymore because I dont want it taking it up stash space. How is that ideal gameplay?
For your demon hunter:
Are you keeping a nats set, shadow set? A couple of good elemental andariels? A very good rolled set of danettas? Shrine gloves and illusory boots? Gold find set? Harringtons? Maybe a good vigilante? Perhaps a good string of ears? What about elemental options? Cold? Phys? Fire? Lightning? Are you salvaging your dex furnace? Calamity? Do you have two helm maurader pieces for EA and CA? Boots for Ea/CA? Do you have cdr/rcr/sentry/dex and cdr/sentry/vit/dex shoulders? Now about quivers? You got a good set of bombadiers? A meticulous bolts? Bracers...lol lacuni's, slave bonds, warzechian, nememis, of course custerian (gold find). Buriza with 2 pierce? Good rolled Uksang? Good rolled windforce? Helltrapper of course...and of course etrayu...rings...unity - cdr/chc/chd, rrogs, hfa's, elemental immune ammies...
Need I go on?
Now imagine this situation for 6 classes. How on earth is that going to fit in 4 stash tabs?
Yep I do this for all 6 classes. Hence all my 9 mules available are full.
[quote]Question: This could be a controversial question. One problem people have in Diablo is character and stash space. Can we buy more inventory space or character space in Diablo 3? Answer: Will we have a store to sell more stash space? Everyone wants that. Not specifically the store aspect, but we’re always discussing the issue of more space. And if we give you more you want more, and more and more and eventually all the internet is your items.We think about it and we want to address it, but nothing to say now. Travis Day also
[quote]Stash space comes up a lot. I’ve said myself, “I would totally pay to have more stash tabs.” But honestly… that’s when I’m in my player’s shoes. When I’m in my designer’s shoes, we talk about it differently. No matter how many tabs we give players; two more, five more, etc, they’re going to fill those and want more. So what we’ve been trying to figure out recently is how we can help you better manage your stash. How we can help you not need to save so many things. So take something like crafting materials. Maybe we make them easier to store. maybe we find reasons for players to get rid of some extra stuff they’re keeping.
The topic of Stash Space was brought up during the Q&A part of the Diablo Panel at BlizzCon, and I just wanted to relay the developer's feedback on this topic here as well.
[quote]Question: This could be a controversial question. One problem people have in Diablo is character and stash space. Can we buy more inventory space or character space in Diablo 3? Answer: Will we have a store to sell more stash space? Everyone wants that. Not specifically the store aspect, but we’re always discussing the issue of more space. And if we give you more you want more, and more and more and eventually all the internet is your items.
We think about it and we want to address it, but nothing to say now. Travis Day also
[quote]Stash space comes up a lot. I’ve said myself, “I would totally pay to have more stash tabs.” But honestly… that’s when I’m in my player’s shoes. When I’m in my designer’s shoes, we talk about it differently. No matter how many tabs we give players; two more, five more, etc, they’re going to fill those and want more. So what we’ve been trying to figure out recently is how we can help you better manage your stash. How we can help you not need to save so many things.
So take something like crafting materials. Maybe we make them easier to store. maybe we find reasons for players to get rid of some extra stuff they’re keeping.
On top of that there are technical reasons. There are only so many… we call them “actors” but it’s about how many items are in our game and how many it’s storing in memory at any given time. If we do almost any more than we have now, the game can’t physically keep up with it. So to summarise; the developers are very much aware of the concerns you guys have in regards to stash space, and while there are some technical limitations that will have to be considered, the developers are looking into how best to address the stash space situation.
I read through the blue posts, and I'm really hoping they're working on something behind the scenes. It's not true to say that 'no matter how much we give you it'll never be enough'. It will. But if you want replayability (multiple classes and specs), you have to accommodate for that, and it's not the case right now.
The s*** will hit the fan once season 1 is over, bet on it.
I read through the blue posts, and I'm really hoping they're working on something behind the scenes. It's not true to say that 'no matter how much we give you it'll never be enough'. It will. But if you want replayability (multiple classes and specs), you have to accommodate for that, and it's not the case right now.
The s*** will hit the fan once season 1 is over, bet on it.
Watched the video and I liked the automation idea for materials and the like. But I would like to harken back to what others spoke earlier, specifically Jrobb1107, regarding those materials. Insofar that they still intend for materials, gems, organs, keys etc. to be integrated into the UI. That in and of itself would be a great boon to storage capacity. At least from my perspective - that's a whole tab. I commented on another topic regarding storage before and disregarded the cost it would place in terms of data storage. Admittedly it doesn't come to mind that it would be a huge request but I cannot for certain make that declaration.
So thinking on it some more after seeing the video here's a different idea assuming Blizzard still makes the material UI thing a... thing: All items take one square! All items. That's 70 items a tab. Now potentially the idea suffers a few drawbacks that I foresee.
First would be media blitz. Being inundated with so much information at once makes it muddled. Never a good thing. But I believe in practice and user familiarity the benefits outweigh this temporary issue. Secondly, seeking out the item you actually want would be a chore. So I propose more tags on items in storage. You already have the transmog tag so why not include an elemental tag beside it? Outliers would be triumvirate and possibly other items with multiple elemental boosts. There's already tiny 12x12 elemental icons in the game on the shield tab. Why not recycle the assets.
Here's a screen shot of what the new method would look like compared to the current (forgive cheesy photoshop):
It would require a rework of item drawing of course but it would alleviate a lot of hoarding stress on the user.
That all being said. One more tab. There should be one tab devoted to each class. And one tab for all the junk that isn't considered a material. Legendary gems, legendary potions, follower tokens, ramaladni's gifts and the like.
I read through the blue posts, and I'm really hoping they're working on something behind the scenes. It's not true to say that 'no matter how much we give you it'll never be enough'. It will. But if you want replayability (multiple classes and specs), you have to accommodate for that, and it's not the case right now.
The s*** will hit the fan once season 1 is over, bet on it.
Watched the video and I liked the automation idea for materials and the like. But I would like to harken back to what others spoke earlier, specifically Jrobb1107, regarding those materials. Insofar that they still intend for materials, gems, organs, keys etc. to be integrated into the UI. That in and of itself would be a great boon to storage capacity. At least from my perspective - that's a whole tab. I commented on another topic regarding storage before and disregarded the cost it would place in terms of data storage. Admittedly it doesn't come to mind that it would be a huge request but I cannot for certain make that declaration.
So thinking on it some more after seeing the video here's a different idea assuming Blizzard still makes the material UI thing a... thing: All items take one square! All items. That's 70 items a tab. Now potentially the idea suffers a few drawbacks that I foresee.
First would be media blitz. Being inundated with so much information at once makes it muddled. Never a good thing. But I believe in practice and user familiarity the benefits outweigh this temporary issue. Secondly, seeking out the item you actually want would be a chore. So I propose more tags on items in storage. You already have the transmog tag so why not include an elemental tag beside it? Outliers would be triumvirate and possibly other items with multiple elemental boosts. There's already tiny 12x12 elemental icons in the game on the shield tab. Why not recycle the assets.
Here's a screen shot of what the new method would look like compared to the current (forgive cheesy photoshop):
It would require a rework of item drawing of course but it would alleviate a lot of hoarding stress on the user.
That all being said. One more tab. There should be one tab devoted to each class. And one tab for all the junk that isn't considered a material. Legendary gems, legendary potions, follower tokens, ramaladni's gifts and the like.
Sincerely Detruncate,
Some good suggestions and I thought about most of these. Here's the thing though - eventually most players WILL play all classes or quit the game. Even look at Alkaizer, 2 years later finally got bored with barb. MC went to play HS. AOD stopped making DH content. A lot of players in my clan who only played a single class got bored and quit, but I'm sure they'll be back again.
So, with that in mind you have to think about the stash as a whole.
Integrating mats into the UI would be awesome, but as I mentioned it's a major change. Maybe it SHOULD be the first change, just to free up 1 tab and see what happens, but it still won't be enough. With all the new items, it just won't. I have WAY more than 1 extra tab worth of extra gear. I have the equivalent of 10 alts FILLED with various sets and well rolled legendaries. 1 tab won't make a dent. If you saw some of these items, you'd have a hard time throwing them away too. Example: I now have a near perfect Nat's set. One of these days, it's going to be SICK.
Personally I'm ok with 2 squares for larger items, but the squares themselves are too big and the stash UI has a bunch of wasted space.
You will see a MAJOR amount of feedback on stash space as soon as season 1 ends and unless something is done by season 2, it's going to be a disaster. I'll still find a way to fit everything in because I know what has the potential to be good, but a lot of people don't and with more and more new items hitting regularly it's a serious problem.
In this video I explain why this general amount of space will always be enough, why you need a tab you can dedicate to a specific class if you choose, and the idea behind a mat-only tab. Hopefully someone at Blizzard will see this. Enjoy and let me know what you guys think!
http://youtu.be/R5yaDCbZl2c
MeatHeadGaming - YouTube - Twitch - Facebook - Web
I think stash tabs are fine too. I'm one of those people who would keep 3-4 copies of every single item I find if I could. Having limited space forces me to keep only the stuff that actually really needs keeping. If given the chance, I would blow more time organizing my storage than playing the game. So I'm glad that they don't allow me to do that.
TLDR: No change required.
MeatHeadGaming - YouTube - Twitch - Facebook - Web
If you are one of those guys that level every class and play with all of them often (usually when you get bored), the actual stash space is NOT enough.
If you play with only 2 or 3 classes regularly, but you like to swap builds often (cuz you got bored) you still don't have enough space.
Just to make it short: If you play ALOT and like to use diferent specs with different characters the actual stash space is not enough.
"Do you guys not have phones?"
"Do you guys not have phones?"
Well, "Why can't we have 2 separate chest" Blizzard, like in Torchlight 2? Also since I'm on the subject of what other ARPG's do slightly different, why can't we socket items using the blacksmith, then enchant the item? Like the use of a Ramaladni's gift actually has a damn blacksmithing hammer as its on use click....Rather than having to break damn near perfect rings/necks just to remove it's primary for a socket since anyone who's min/max will always dump the primary for the socket. Which would bring up the issue of why a socket even has to count as an affix, when other games treat them as a secondary or even a purchasable upgrade. When enchanting is used correctly, we can enhance an item or remove the undesired stats vs. the current of removing say LPH only to roll a 50%CHD(facepalm yelling WHY!) then re-roll again for the fucking socket.
Also I only play one class really, dabble a bit in others but mostly play barb only. I have 5 sets of gear, and like 1/2 of the higher end rings/neck/2h/1h/belts/bracers to interchange elemental damage types. This is due to me being paranoid that blizz will retroactive a so/so item into a godly one, or maybe I am a pack rat lol. Either way blizz should start looking at the other big ARPG's no different than how they treat WOW by making quality of life changes almost exclusively due to public outcry when being compared to the MMO that offers the change.
I normally really like your videos, but this one is kinda a fail for me. You basically just made a 10min long video asking for more stash space. I do not see WHY this would ever be enough. You even said it yourself in the video: the size of a tab SHOULD be enough, and mentioned that might change in a few years. You never know how fast they will be releasing new items, and how much people keep. If the current stash is too small for you, a bigger one will be too small for someone else, no matter how big you make it.
As for your future proof: unless I missed something, that is "just add 3 additional tabs we shouldn't be using now, but is for the future"? In 2.0 they gave an extra tab, and one of the last patches (don't know what exactly) they made it 5. So, they can just add whenever they want. You could as well just ask 7 tabs (1 for each class, and 1 for mats), and have them add 1 for each class they add, just as future proof.
Don't get me wrong, everyone wants more space, including me. But the only useful thing in your video is the small quality of life change that crafting mats will go to the right tab automatically.
I would suggest a stash like this:
2 tabs:
-Crafting Mats (everything that is not gear)
- Second tab you can see as "drawers". You will have an icon for pants, 1 for rings, 1 for amulet, ... When you click on such an item (for example pants), it will show you all pants in your stash, starting with your class specific sets, then items with your mainstat, items without mainstat, items with other mainstat, other classes sets. If you have multiple pieces of the same item, it will be a stack, if you click on it it will show you all of them on a new tab. (sorting will be done with highest mainstat first).
If you add a filter, to search an item by name, you will have a very easy way to store your items.
They stated they are not against keeping the items or more space, they have problems with the fact that it's hard to find your items if you have too many.
So, coming with a solution how to cleanly store/display items so you can find them quick might convince them faster than saying why we would need more space and how much would be enough.
problem solved!
Yep I do this for all 6 classes. Hence all my 9 mules available are full.
[quote]Question: This could be a controversial question. One problem people have in Diablo is character and stash space. Can we buy more inventory space or character space in Diablo 3?
Answer: Will we have a store to sell more stash space? Everyone wants that. Not specifically the store aspect, but we’re always discussing the issue of more space. And if we give you more you want more, and more and more and eventually all the internet is your items.We think about it and we want to address it, but nothing to say now.
Travis Day also
[quote]Stash space comes up a lot. I’ve said myself, “I would totally pay to have more stash tabs.” But honestly… that’s when I’m in my player’s shoes. When I’m in my designer’s shoes, we talk about it differently. No matter how many tabs we give players; two more, five more, etc, they’re going to fill those and want more. So what we’ve been trying to figure out recently is how we can help you better manage your stash. How we can help you not need to save so many things.
So take something like crafting materials. Maybe we make them easier to store. maybe we find reasons for players to get rid of some extra stuff they’re keeping.
The topic of Stash Space was brought up during the Q&A part of the Diablo Panel at BlizzCon, and I just wanted to relay the developer's feedback on this topic here as well.
[quote]Question: This could be a controversial question. One problem people have in Diablo is character and stash space. Can we buy more inventory space or character space in Diablo 3?
Answer: Will we have a store to sell more stash space? Everyone wants that. Not specifically the store aspect, but we’re always discussing the issue of more space. And if we give you more you want more, and more and more and eventually all the internet is your items.
We think about it and we want to address it, but nothing to say now. Travis Day also
[quote]Stash space comes up a lot. I’ve said myself, “I would totally pay to have more stash tabs.” But honestly… that’s when I’m in my player’s shoes. When I’m in my designer’s shoes, we talk about it differently. No matter how many tabs we give players; two more, five more, etc, they’re going to fill those and want more. So what we’ve been trying to figure out recently is how we can help you better manage your stash. How we can help you not need to save so many things.
So take something like crafting materials. Maybe we make them easier to store. maybe we find reasons for players to get rid of some extra stuff they’re keeping.
On top of that there are technical reasons. There are only so many… we call them “actors” but it’s about how many items are in our game and how many it’s storing in memory at any given time. If we do almost any more than we have now, the game can’t physically keep up with it.
So to summarise; the developers are very much aware of the concerns you guys have in regards to stash space, and while there are some technical limitations that will have to be considered, the developers are looking into how best to address the stash space situation.
WD Season 8 https://www.diabloprogress.com/hero/finiar-1655/Kildare/84509816
Monk season 7 http://www.diabloprogress.com/hero/finiar-1655/MojoJoJo/42225505
DH season 6 http://www.diabloprogress.com/hero/finiar-1655/DeadShot/75655606
Angry Chicken http://www.diabloprogress.com/hero/finiar-1655/WhoDoVooDoo/68187610
What? Me worry?
The s*** will hit the fan once season 1 is over, bet on it.
MeatHeadGaming - YouTube - Twitch - Facebook - Web
Watched the video and I liked the automation idea for materials and the like. But I would like to harken back to what others spoke earlier, specifically Jrobb1107, regarding those materials. Insofar that they still intend for materials, gems, organs, keys etc. to be integrated into the UI. That in and of itself would be a great boon to storage capacity. At least from my perspective - that's a whole tab. I commented on another topic regarding storage before and disregarded the cost it would place in terms of data storage. Admittedly it doesn't come to mind that it would be a huge request but I cannot for certain make that declaration.
So thinking on it some more after seeing the video here's a different idea assuming Blizzard still makes the material UI thing a... thing: All items take one square! All items. That's 70 items a tab. Now potentially the idea suffers a few drawbacks that I foresee.
First would be media blitz. Being inundated with so much information at once makes it muddled. Never a good thing. But I believe in practice and user familiarity the benefits outweigh this temporary issue. Secondly, seeking out the item you actually want would be a chore. So I propose more tags on items in storage. You already have the transmog tag so why not include an elemental tag beside it? Outliers would be triumvirate and possibly other items with multiple elemental boosts. There's already tiny 12x12 elemental icons in the game on the shield tab. Why not recycle the assets.
Here's a screen shot of what the new method would look like compared to the current (forgive cheesy photoshop):
It would require a rework of item drawing of course but it would alleviate a lot of hoarding stress on the user.
That all being said. One more tab. There should be one tab devoted to each class. And one tab for all the junk that isn't considered a material. Legendary gems, legendary potions, follower tokens, ramaladni's gifts and the like.
Sincerely Detruncate,
"We", "Everyone" - Argumentum ad populum. "You people" - Argumentum ad hominem. "Your dumb" - Contractionem absum.
So, with that in mind you have to think about the stash as a whole.
Integrating mats into the UI would be awesome, but as I mentioned it's a major change. Maybe it SHOULD be the first change, just to free up 1 tab and see what happens, but it still won't be enough. With all the new items, it just won't. I have WAY more than 1 extra tab worth of extra gear. I have the equivalent of 10 alts FILLED with various sets and well rolled legendaries. 1 tab won't make a dent. If you saw some of these items, you'd have a hard time throwing them away too. Example: I now have a near perfect Nat's set. One of these days, it's going to be SICK.
Personally I'm ok with 2 squares for larger items, but the squares themselves are too big and the stash UI has a bunch of wasted space.
You will see a MAJOR amount of feedback on stash space as soon as season 1 ends and unless something is done by season 2, it's going to be a disaster. I'll still find a way to fit everything in because I know what has the potential to be good, but a lot of people don't and with more and more new items hitting regularly it's a serious problem.
MeatHeadGaming - YouTube - Twitch - Facebook - Web