Looking at it from an objective based standpoint, I tend to also agree that its hard to find a practical use for the skill. Other skills just do things better:
Elemental Arrow's Frost Arrow effect theoretically is AOE as well, but also adds a chilling effect
Rapid Fire does better single target damage
Chakram also offers a cheaper aoe alternative
This means the ONE and ONLY thing Strafe has which none of the other comparable skills have is: mobility. Whether that is beneficial enough to make the skill viable won't be determined until release, but at this point I'm leaning towards no.
edit: if that is your YT account...god man...its time to upgrade your monitor...wtf resolution is that...1024x728? @_@
@Glitterpony: my view is that your opinion will change when you play in harder areas (beta = a retard could complete it). Strafe is allright in the Beta because you're so much better than the mobs.
Yeah there's no doubt that it won't be as effective later in the game but then again the same could be argued for any skill. Until we see how it scales and really get to test the full functionality of all the runes it's really anybody's guess. As of patch 13, if you were level 9 and had level-appropriate weapons, then it seemed to be tuned pretty well. Of course once you're level 13 with a bunch of crafted gear and weapons it was clearly too powerful. I mean, if we had watched that same video from the OP and strafe DID clear the room (or came close) then everyone would be complaining in the opposite direction.
I'm just trying to convey the point that while it clearly isn't intended to be a "street sweeper" in the Diablo universe, it's more useful than everyone is giving it credit for. If it was as powerful as everyone seems to want it to be, then what you're effectively requesting is a long-ranged whirlwind that is self targeting and highly mobile (movement speed while strafing IS affected by speed modifying spells/effects). Anyone who wants that doesn't really want to play this game anyways unless they enjoy farming Normal mode over and over again.
Let's not even consider how an OP'd Strafe would feel in PvP combat...
TLDR;
In a room full of monsters (in the dozens) - strafe SHOULDN'T kill anything. It's swapping to too many targets.
In a room with 5-6 mobs of average health - strafe should probably be able to kill most (if not all) of them.
In a room with 1 mob - You're an idiot for strafing for any reason other than barrel-destroying fun.
It's clearly a very situational ability - but one that's a lot of fun to use.
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I think (at the very worst) it'll turn into a really useful skill IF you're not resource hungry. That being said, I think it's mobility paired with it's range (which is huge) paired again with it's auto-targeting will make it a bit better in practice than it seems on paper...
If you have a resource hungry build, it'll definetely be a no no.
In either case, it doesn't really matter to me, I had a lot of fun rolling out of a strafe straight into a rapid-fire. It definetely makes you feel very "action-hero" when you transition from room to room with guns blazin'.
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I've been watching a lot of players streaming their Beta play on-line, and it is seldom I see people use Strafe that much.
Maybe because at a low level, the damage it causes isn't really that significant yet. Still, with 1, 2, 3, 5 or a mob of enemies, the arrows should auto-target each and every one of them, which it does not.
The main difference I think between Strafe in D2 and that of Diablo III is that, on D2, your attack is mainly focused on the direction that your character is facing, while the Strafe on that of Diablo III has a 360 degrees angle of cover. Meaning, you still fire arrows from the direction which you've come from, which is a big waste of Hatred.
Since the arrows are fired off a 360 degree angle, there is no guarantee that all of these arrows will hit a target, which is why like Glitterpony had said: it's only fun for barrel-destroying.
Strafe on Diablo III is not, and I repeat, IS NOT as effective as it was in D2.
Maybe in higher levels, it would step-up and be a very effective AoE skill or a useful crowd control. We cant prove this for only Blizzard employees playing internal Alpha has used the skill in higher levels, but this may be the case since Blizzard made sure that the skill has a high pre-requisite level requirement.
The thing I've seen is that using Rapid Fire is turning out to be players' better skill choice for killing Diablo's minions faster.
Whatever their reason is for doing what Blizzard did, of however effective the skill would really turn out to be, I do wish they would fix this issue with Strafe and make it less Hatred consuming.
Maybe they could attach some kind of limiter, wherein the skill wont fire any arrows if there are no monsters within a 35 or 40 yards radius.
This way the skill will not use up Hatred unnecessarily if there are no jars, barrels or monsters nearby, simply because it will not fire any arrows at all.
Just because you spin around doesn't mean you waste shots behind you....
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"Is God willing to prevent evil, but not able? Then he is not omnipotent. Is he able, but not willing? Then he is malevolent. Is he both able and willing? Then whence cometh evil? Is he neither able nor willing? Then why call him God?"
I've been watching a lot of players streaming their Beta play on-line, and it is seldom I see people use Strafe that much.
Maybe because at a low level, the damage it causes isn't really that significant yet. Still, with 1, 2, 3, 5 or a mob of enemies, the arrows should auto-target each and every one of them, which it does not.
The main difference I think between Strafe in D2 and that of Diablo III is that, on D2, your attack is mainly focused on the direction that your character is facing, while the Strafe on that of Diablo III has a 360 degrees angle of cover. Meaning, you still fire arrows from the direction which you've come from, which is a big waste of Hatred.
Since the arrows are fired off a 360 degree angle, there is no guarantee that all of these arrows will hit a target, which is why like Glitterpony had said: it's only fun for barrel-destroying.
Strafe on Diablo III is not, and I repeat, IS NOT as effective as it was in D2.
Maybe in higher levels, it would step-up and be a very effective AoE skill or a useful crowd control. We cant prove this for only Blizzard employees playing internal Alpha has used the skill in higher levels, but this may be the case since Blizzard made sure that the skill has a high pre-requisite level requirement.
The thing I've seen is that using Rapid Fire is turning out to be players' better skill choice for killing Diablo's minions faster.
Whatever their reason is for doing what Blizzard did, of however effective the skill would really turn out to be, I do wish they would fix this issue with Strafe and make it less Hatred consuming.
Maybe they could attach some kind of limiter, wherein the skill wont fire any arrows if there are no monsters within a 35 or 40 yards radius.
This way the skill will not use up Hatred unnecessarily if there are no jars, barrels or monsters nearby, simply because it will not fire any arrows at all.
I'm not trying to troll or pick a fight here but I think you might have taken what I said a little out of context - yes there are times when it's only good for barrel-destroying fun (like if there's very very few mobs in a room) but it does have it's niche.
Also, I thought it was important to mention that it DOES auto-target. Strafe shots (even though the animation shows them in all directions) choose a target and hit that target regardless of which way it shows the shot being fired. I am not certain however that it prioritizes mobs over destructable targets (like barrels and vases). If it does not, then that is certainly a draw-back for use.
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If you hover over a particular enemy with strafe it targets that Enemy more than the others. Atleast when I did it it did its sweet cause you can mow through small groups of enemies while continuing in your Initial direction without having to stop and shoot
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Additionally if you read my posts if your building a grenade or rocket build it could be interesting. The main issue is it costs so much hatred that’s my beef with it. A runed caltrops is far more effective for getting away from something. I like comment of wiping out a large group of weakend mobs but there are other AoE' that should cover this scenario.
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Playing Diablo since 97. I know nothing and having nothing good to say, I be a troll.
"AOE spell doesn't kill single targets very efficiently and therefore sucks."
Well played world. Well played.
Why are you posting in what you consider a troll thread? That doesn't make sense.
And Strafe isn't an AoE.............................................
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"Is God willing to prevent evil, but not able? Then he is not omnipotent. Is he able, but not willing? Then he is malevolent. Is he both able and willing? Then whence cometh evil? Is he neither able nor willing? Then why call him God?"
It shoots bolts in every direction very quickly. Would you prefer the term "multi-target?" it amounts to the same thing. It has an Effect (E) an Area(A) and murders everyone in it. Bolts shoot in random directions because it shoots like 6 per second. It's meant for crowd damage.
Complaining about it not being able to kill single targets quickly is ridiculous. That's not what it's FOR. It's like complaining about Ancient Spear not knocking targets back. You're doing it wrong.
It shoots bolts in every direction very quickly. Would you prefer the term "multi-target?" it amounts to the same thing. It has an Effect (E) an Area(A) and murders everyone in it. Bolts shoot in random directions because it shoots like 6 per second. It's meant for crowd damage.
Complaining about it not being able to kill single targets quickly is ridiculous. That's not what it's FOR. It's like complaining about Ancient Spear not knocking targets back. You're doing it wrong.
AoE = Area of Effect.
For example, Bola Shot is an AoE
Area of effect (or AoE) is a term used in many role playing and strategy games to describe attacks or spells that affect multiple targets within a specified area.
Strafe is a single target spell that switches targets automatically. If we use your absurd definition, then everything is an AoE. For example, hungering arrow.
Its not even remotely the same thing.
There are lots of AoE's that work well at killing single enemies. Heck look at the wizard, almost everything she has is an AoE.
Who even mentioned using it for killing single targets?!?
Edit:
I can see why you don't like theory crafting now.
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"Is God willing to prevent evil, but not able? Then he is not omnipotent. Is he able, but not willing? Then he is malevolent. Is he both able and willing? Then whence cometh evil? Is he neither able nor willing? Then why call him God?"
It shoots bolts in every direction very quickly. Would you prefer the term "multi-target?" it amounts to the same thing. It has an Effect (E) an Area(A) and murders everyone in it. Bolts shoot in random directions because it shoots like 6 per second. It's meant for crowd damage.
Complaining about it not being able to kill single targets quickly is ridiculous. That's not what it's FOR. It's like complaining about Ancient Spear not knocking targets back. You're doing it wrong.
AoE = Area of Effect.
For example, Bola Shot is an AoE
Area of effect (or AoE) is a term used in many role playing and strategy games to describe attacks or spells that affect multiple targets within a specified area.
Strafe is a single target spell that switches targets automatically. If we use your absurd definition, then everything is an AoE. For example, hungering arrow.
Its not even remotely the same thing.
There are lots of AoE's that work well at killing single enemies. Heck look at the wizard, almost everything she has is an AoE.
Who even mentioned using it for killing single targets?!?
Edit:
I can see why you don't like theory crafting now.
It doesn't matter what the term is used in other places. AoE is used in D3 for ANY ability that hits multiple targets. Thats how people use the term AoE here. It's not like the term "AoE' has an worldwide definition that everyone follows. This do not happen even in serious stuff like science and business, imagine in games...
Just accept the fact that abilities that hits only one target are what people call single target and abilities that hits more then one target people call AoE. AoE it's just a very convinient way to say "ability designed to kill many targets at once". Cleave is AoE, Bash and Frenzy is not. Elemental Arrow is, Impale is not.
Strife is pretty good when you have multiple targets to hit and need to keep moving. The hatred cost is a downside, but noone said you should spend all your hatred using it. Unlike Rapid Fire, you don't have activation cost, which means it's completly viable to hold strife for a few seconds until you make some distance and then use other abilities.
It shoots bolts in every direction very quickly. Would you prefer the term "multi-target?" it amounts to the same thing. It has an Effect (E) an Area(A) and murders everyone in it. Bolts shoot in random directions because it shoots like 6 per second. It's meant for crowd damage.
Complaining about it not being able to kill single targets quickly is ridiculous. That's not what it's FOR. It's like complaining about Ancient Spear not knocking targets back. You're doing it wrong.
AoE = Area of Effect.
For example, Bola Shot is an AoE
Area of effect (or AoE) is a term used in many role playing and strategy games to describe attacks or spells that affect multiple targets within a specified area.
Strafe is a single target spell that switches targets automatically. If we use your absurd definition, then everything is an AoE. For example, hungering arrow.
Its not even remotely the same thing.
There are lots of AoE's that work well at killing single enemies. Heck look at the wizard, almost everything she has is an AoE.
Who even mentioned using it for killing single targets?!?
Edit:
I can see why you don't like theory crafting now.
It doesn't matter what the term is used in other places. AoE is used in D3 for ANY ability that hits multiple targets. Thats how people use the term AoE here. It's not like the term "AoE' has an worldwide definition that everyone follows. This do not happen even in serious stuff like science and business, imagine in games...
Just accept the fact that abilities that hits only one target are what people call single target and abilities that hits more then one target people call AoE. AoE it's just a very convinient way to say "ability designed to kill many targets at once". Cleave is AoE, Bash and Frenzy is not. Elemental Arrow is, Impale is not.
Strife is pretty good when you have multiple targets to hit and need to keep moving. The hatred cost is a downside, but noone said you should spend all your hatred using it. Unlike Rapid Fire, you don't have activation cost, which means it's completly viable to hold strife for a few seconds until you make some distance and then use other abilities.
I got that definition from wiki. I don't think its debated anywhere near as much as you think.
By that definition hungering arrow is an AoE 50% of the time....
Why would I accept a bad definition? When its far more likely he just posted some BS, because he doesn't like the subject matter.
Strafe isn't a terrible ability, its just a very situational ability and is in no way designed to be a primary attack.
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"Is God willing to prevent evil, but not able? Then he is not omnipotent. Is he able, but not willing? Then he is malevolent. Is he both able and willing? Then whence cometh evil? Is he neither able nor willing? Then why call him God?"
It shoots bolts in every direction very quickly. Would you prefer the term "multi-target?" it amounts to the same thing. It has an Effect (E) an Area(A) and murders everyone in it. Bolts shoot in random directions because it shoots like 6 per second. It's meant for crowd damage.
Complaining about it not being able to kill single targets quickly is ridiculous. That's not what it's FOR. It's like complaining about Ancient Spear not knocking targets back. You're doing it wrong.
AoE = Area of Effect.
For example, Bola Shot is an AoE
Area of effect (or AoE) is a term used in many role playing and strategy games to describe attacks or spells that affect multiple targets within a specified area.
Strafe is a single target spell that switches targets automatically. If we use your absurd definition, then everything is an AoE. For example, hungering arrow.
Its not even remotely the same thing.
There are lots of AoE's that work well at killing single enemies. Heck look at the wizard, almost everything she has is an AoE.
Who even mentioned using it for killing single targets?!?
Edit:
I can see why you don't like theory crafting now.
It doesn't matter what the term is used in other places. AoE is used in D3 for ANY ability that hits multiple targets. Thats how people use the term AoE here. It's not like the term "AoE' has an worldwide definition that everyone follows. This do not happen even in serious stuff like science and business, imagine in games...
Just accept the fact that abilities that hits only one target are what people call single target and abilities that hits more then one target people call AoE. AoE it's just a very convinient way to say "ability designed to kill many targets at once". Cleave is AoE, Bash and Frenzy is not. Elemental Arrow is, Impale is not.
Strife is pretty good when you have multiple targets to hit and need to keep moving. The hatred cost is a downside, but noone said you should spend all your hatred using it. Unlike Rapid Fire, you don't have activation cost, which means it's completly viable to hold strife for a few seconds until you make some distance and then use other abilities.
I got that definition from wiki. I don't think its debated anywhere near as much as you think.
By that definition hungering arrow is an AoE 50% of the time....
Why would I accept a bad definition? When its far more likely he just posted some BS, because he doesn't like the subject matter.
Hungering Arrow has potential to kill multiple enemies, but this potential is so small people consider it a single target. Imagine a Skill that deals 200% weapon damage in an single target and 1% weapon damage to all enemies around the first target (withint 12 yards). In your definition it would be an AoE but majority of people will simply consider it an singletarget.
Definitions are not based on what the skill do and how it behaves. It's based on how people tend to use it.
Hungering Arrow has potential to kill multiple enemies, but this potential is so small people consider it a single target. Imagine a Skill that deals 200% weapon damage in an single target and 1% weapon damage to all enemies around the first target (withint 12 yards). In your definition it would be an AoE but majority of people will simply consider it an singletarget.
Definitions are not based on what the skill do and how it behaves. It's based on how people tend to use it.
Hungering arrow has a 50% chance to piece runed. Heck one of the runes increases the dmg by 70% after it pierces. So yes, hungering arrow can easily kill 1-2 maybe more weak enemies.
Definition >>> BS examples
Strafe is a collection of dots = 0 area.
Frost Arrow is a frontal cone, aka triangle = area.
Ohh and guess what, yes your example is still an aoe spell. A terrible one that would never exist, but yes an AoE. I don't get why you are arguing something so simple....this is not a subject of debate.
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"Is God willing to prevent evil, but not able? Then he is not omnipotent. Is he able, but not willing? Then he is malevolent. Is he both able and willing? Then whence cometh evil? Is he neither able nor willing? Then why call him God?"
1- italofoca, I think you're on the wrong side of this 'definition' exchange. There aren't just 'single target' and 'aoe' attacks, 'multitarget' is its own category.
Your 1% splash example is definitely an AOE ability. It's a bad ability as far as area damage is concerned, but it is area damage.
2- Strafe's power is largely item dependent, and I would say more so than other abilities. If there are properties such as peirce, explosion-on-hit, debuff on hit (like Amp. Damage from D2 or something), chance to cast spell, constant additional damage on hit (i.e. 100-200 additional cold damage vs 10-15% additional cold damage), and so on I think Strafe would benefit from those characteristics more than other abilities.
I hope there are such item properties as I really enjoy my Strafer in D2, but could never get that Brand I wanted.
For those who have used Strafe...I didn't see if this was answered earlier in the thread, though I checked most of the posts so sorry if someone said it already. If there is only viable target on the screen and you use Strafe, will all shots be directed at that target?
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edit: if that is your YT account...god man...its time to upgrade your monitor...wtf resolution is that...1024x728? @_@
Yeah there's no doubt that it won't be as effective later in the game but then again the same could be argued for any skill. Until we see how it scales and really get to test the full functionality of all the runes it's really anybody's guess. As of patch 13, if you were level 9 and had level-appropriate weapons, then it seemed to be tuned pretty well. Of course once you're level 13 with a bunch of crafted gear and weapons it was clearly too powerful. I mean, if we had watched that same video from the OP and strafe DID clear the room (or came close) then everyone would be complaining in the opposite direction.
I'm just trying to convey the point that while it clearly isn't intended to be a "street sweeper" in the Diablo universe, it's more useful than everyone is giving it credit for. If it was as powerful as everyone seems to want it to be, then what you're effectively requesting is a long-ranged whirlwind that is self targeting and highly mobile (movement speed while strafing IS affected by speed modifying spells/effects). Anyone who wants that doesn't really want to play this game anyways unless they enjoy farming Normal mode over and over again.
Let's not even consider how an OP'd Strafe would feel in PvP combat...
TLDR;
In a room full of monsters (in the dozens) - strafe SHOULDN'T kill anything. It's swapping to too many targets.
In a room with 5-6 mobs of average health - strafe should probably be able to kill most (if not all) of them.
In a room with 1 mob - You're an idiot for strafing for any reason other than barrel-destroying fun.
It's clearly a very situational ability - but one that's a lot of fun to use.
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If you have a resource hungry build, it'll definetely be a no no.
In either case, it doesn't really matter to me, I had a lot of fun rolling out of a strafe straight into a rapid-fire. It definetely makes you feel very "action-hero" when you transition from room to room with guns blazin'.
16GB G Skill Ram ~ 2x Mushkin 120GB SSD's ~ MSI GTX 570 Twin Frozer ~ Asus P8P67 Deluxe
Maybe because at a low level, the damage it causes isn't really that significant yet. Still, with 1, 2, 3, 5 or a mob of enemies, the arrows should auto-target each and every one of them, which it does not.
The main difference I think between Strafe in D2 and that of Diablo III is that, on D2, your attack is mainly focused on the direction that your character is facing, while the Strafe on that of Diablo III has a 360 degrees angle of cover. Meaning, you still fire arrows from the direction which you've come from, which is a big waste of Hatred.
Since the arrows are fired off a 360 degree angle, there is no guarantee that all of these arrows will hit a target, which is why like Glitterpony had said: it's only fun for barrel-destroying.
Strafe on Diablo III is not, and I repeat, IS NOT as effective as it was in D2.
Maybe in higher levels, it would step-up and be a very effective AoE skill or a useful crowd control. We cant prove this for only Blizzard employees playing internal Alpha has used the skill in higher levels, but this may be the case since Blizzard made sure that the skill has a high pre-requisite level requirement.
The thing I've seen is that using Rapid Fire is turning out to be players' better skill choice for killing Diablo's minions faster.
Whatever their reason is for doing what Blizzard did, of however effective the skill would really turn out to be, I do wish they would fix this issue with Strafe and make it less Hatred consuming.
Maybe they could attach some kind of limiter, wherein the skill wont fire any arrows if there are no monsters within a 35 or 40 yards radius.
This way the skill will not use up Hatred unnecessarily if there are no jars, barrels or monsters nearby, simply because it will not fire any arrows at all.
.
My PvP build would be different from these 13.
Check out the leaked Demon Hunter skill list here from Blizzard China: http://translate.google.com/translate?hl=en&sl=auto&tl=en&u=http://tiny.cc/10p16
Diablo III is $50; MSI GT683DXR-423US Gaming Laptop is $1,599; Playing Diablo III w/ my wife & 2 brothers is PRICELESS
Epicurus
I'm not trying to troll or pick a fight here but I think you might have taken what I said a little out of context - yes there are times when it's only good for barrel-destroying fun (like if there's very very few mobs in a room) but it does have it's niche.
Also, I thought it was important to mention that it DOES auto-target. Strafe shots (even though the animation shows them in all directions) choose a target and hit that target regardless of which way it shows the shot being fired. I am not certain however that it prioritizes mobs over destructable targets (like barrels and vases). If it does not, then that is certainly a draw-back for use.
16GB G Skill Ram ~ 2x Mushkin 120GB SSD's ~ MSI GTX 570 Twin Frozer ~ Asus P8P67 Deluxe
Well played world. Well played.
And Strafe isn't an AoE.............................................
Epicurus
Complaining about it not being able to kill single targets quickly is ridiculous. That's not what it's FOR. It's like complaining about Ancient Spear not knocking targets back. You're doing it wrong.
For example, Bola Shot is an AoE
Area of effect (or AoE) is a term used in many role playing and strategy games to describe attacks or spells that affect multiple targets within a specified area.
Strafe is a single target spell that switches targets automatically. If we use your absurd definition, then everything is an AoE. For example, hungering arrow.
Its not even remotely the same thing.
There are lots of AoE's that work well at killing single enemies. Heck look at the wizard, almost everything she has is an AoE.
Who even mentioned using it for killing single targets?!?
Edit:
I can see why you don't like theory crafting now.
Epicurus
It doesn't matter what the term is used in other places. AoE is used in D3 for ANY ability that hits multiple targets. Thats how people use the term AoE here. It's not like the term "AoE' has an worldwide definition that everyone follows. This do not happen even in serious stuff like science and business, imagine in games...
Just accept the fact that abilities that hits only one target are what people call single target and abilities that hits more then one target people call AoE. AoE it's just a very convinient way to say "ability designed to kill many targets at once". Cleave is AoE, Bash and Frenzy is not. Elemental Arrow is, Impale is not.
Strife is pretty good when you have multiple targets to hit and need to keep moving. The hatred cost is a downside, but noone said you should spend all your hatred using it. Unlike Rapid Fire, you don't have activation cost, which means it's completly viable to hold strife for a few seconds until you make some distance and then use other abilities.
I got that definition from wiki. I don't think its debated anywhere near as much as you think.
By that definition hungering arrow is an AoE 50% of the time....
Why would I accept a bad definition? When its far more likely he just posted some BS, because he doesn't like the subject matter.
Strafe isn't a terrible ability, its just a very situational ability and is in no way designed to be a primary attack.
Epicurus
Definitions are not based on what the skill do and how it behaves. It's based on how people tend to use it.
Definition >>> BS examples
Strafe is a collection of dots = 0 area.
Frost Arrow is a frontal cone, aka triangle = area.
Ohh and guess what, yes your example is still an aoe spell. A terrible one that would never exist, but yes an AoE. I don't get why you are arguing something so simple....this is not a subject of debate.
Epicurus
Your 1% splash example is definitely an AOE ability. It's a bad ability as far as area damage is concerned, but it is area damage.
2- Strafe's power is largely item dependent, and I would say more so than other abilities. If there are properties such as peirce, explosion-on-hit, debuff on hit (like Amp. Damage from D2 or something), chance to cast spell, constant additional damage on hit (i.e. 100-200 additional cold damage vs 10-15% additional cold damage), and so on I think Strafe would benefit from those characteristics more than other abilities.
I hope there are such item properties as I really enjoy my Strafer in D2, but could never get that Brand I wanted.