I use a darklight/firestarter build, and I've been using a terribly rolled lidless wall for the +fire damage because I've never found anything that compares wit it.. until now.
I've found a very well rolled defender of westmarch, and while I'm pretty sure it's the better choice, I'm curious if I will lose some effective damage due to the loss of fire damage, and the vast majority of my damage being firestarter ticks.
The strange part about this, is that the new mouse over fire damage calculation added in 2.0.6 actually shows a higher value even though I have lost 20% + fire. I guess this is because it's calculating strength into account. The strength and crit is obviously what makes defender such a high sheet DPS upgrade, but is firestarter tick affected by str or crit at all?
I feel like I need to use defender anyway for the toughness to progress to t6, but I'm just mainly curious if lidless would still technically be worth more real damage because of the mechanics of firestarter,
Also, should I roll that block chance to -10% elite damage perhaps? I use punish/roar, so that synergizes with extra block chance, but my lack of a unity is causing spike damage problems in t5/6 for me, so I think I'll need to.
I personnaly use Defender of Westmarch but I mostly play in 4 players games. The reasons why I use Defender os Wesmarch are because I like to be close to monsters, the proc of darklight is usefull if you're close to monsters and in 4 players games you won't be as effective at killing speed. That's why being close is good! It's also why I changed some skill and passive skills to reflect my playstyle while being quite effective. By the way I solo T6.
You also want to have a lot of health globe bonuses because it synergize well with the passive Wrathfull. You also gonna have to change your amulet, even a well rolled yellow one would be better! Btw if you have any question, let me know! GL!
It's a hard one to answer, but what I can say is that the block chance of my shield synergize with the passive skill Divine fortress. Because of that I would tend to say that I prefer to keep the block chance!
If you would have to chose between AR or - elite damage on your shield, take - elite damage. It's much more effective for damage mitigation considering that most dangerous elemental damage comes from elites packs.
I see you didn't re-roll the block from your defender. Do you think block is better than res all or - elite damage?
You should definitely reroll the vit over the block chance. Unfortunate that the base block chance rolled so low (10%, lowest possible), but that +% block chance will definitely give you more in the long run (Divine Fortress, block mitigation, and the Defender's proc).
The Defender of Westmarch is definitely the better shield here.
I see you didn't re-roll the block from your defender. Do you think block is better than res all or - elite damage?
You should definitely reroll the vit over the block chance. Unfortunate that the base block chance rolled so low (10%, lowest possible), but that +% block chance will definitely give you more in the long run (Divine Fortress, block mitigation, and the Defender's proc).
The Defender of Westmarch is definitely the better shield here.
Really re roll the vit? I'm at 400k hp now, if I roll the vit to elite or AR, It will leave me at 320k hp, isn't that a little low for T5/6? I feel like leaving the block and rolling the vit is going to cause spikier health fluctuation than I already have.
How much HP/Mitigation should I be aiming for? Im at 400k/850AR/17k armor now.
I see you didn't re-roll the block from your defender. Do you think block is better than res all or - elite damage?
You should definitely reroll the vit over the block chance. Unfortunate that the base block chance rolled so low (10%, lowest possible), but that +% block chance will definitely give you more in the long run (Divine Fortress, block mitigation, and the Defender's proc).
The Defender of Westmarch is definitely the better shield here.
Really re roll the vit? I'm at 400k hp now, if I roll the vit to elite or AR, It will leave me at 320k hp, isn't that a little low for T5/6? I feel like leaving the block and rolling the vit is going to cause spikier health fluctuation than I already have.
How much HP/Mitigation should I be aiming for? Im at 400k/850AR/17k armor now.
It's up to you - the only thing to note is that vitality provides an inflated toughness stat, it doesn't actually increase your overall mitigation. Every point of mitigation (block, all res, elite damage reduction, armor, etc) increases the effectiveness of all healing you receive, vitality doesn't provide the same effect. After you have enough health to survive a damage spike, you should be focusing on raising mitigation, not health.
It just comes down to how much health you're comfortable having, really.
I'm pretty sure vitality usually gives more life than % life which means if you are rerolling out of health then % life would be the better option. The defender of westmarch is the better shield here especially when you aren't stuck with what you can reroll.
I have a question for you, are you playing alone or in group? I have more life and armor and sometimes some nasty elites pack can be challenging. So if you enchant vit and ends up with 320k life, I will say good luck in T6. It wont necessary be impossible, but you're just gonna die a couple of time per rift. And if you're in a group and you can't tank much, you won't be as usefull and effective considering you're using darklight (can't tank = not close to monster which doesn't use the full potential of the second FOH done with the proc of the weapon).
And if you end up being much more far away, then use Lidless instead.
My personal goal, or something I would like to test, is having reduce elites damage affix on my armor and my shield. Thats would be 20-22% reduced elites damage.Concerning end-game stats :Around 500k life and 800AR... I would say at least 20k armor (more if paragon lvl 600 and using Divine Fortress--- around 25k if so)... at least 100k health globe bonuses or more.
I'm pretty sure vitality usually gives more life than % life which means if you are rerolling out of health then % life would be the better option. The defender of westmarch is the better shield here especially when you aren't stuck with what you can reroll.
718 Vitality provides 57,440 life, meaning if he has 382,933 or more HP (after removing the vit/life % in question) and doesn't have any other life % buffs, the life % is more valuable. So, in this case, you might be right, the vitality may be worth more, since it's unlikely he doesn't have other sources of life % gain.
I'm pretty sure vitality usually gives more life than % life which means if you are rerolling out of health then % life would be the better option. The defender of westmarch is the better shield here especially when you aren't stuck with what you can reroll.
718 Vitality provides 57,440 life, meaning if he has 382,933 or more HP (after removing the vit/life % in question) and doesn't have any other life % buffs, the life % is more valuable. So, in this case, you might be right, the vitality may be worth more, since it's unlikely he doesn't have other sources of life % gain.
It appears that they have % life on their belt. That should give the vitality more value in this case.
Thanks for doing the math though. It never came to mind. I was just stating from personal experience as I've always found vitality to add more toughness than % life.
I don't use holy cause, I use fervor, wrathful, divine fortress and finery
Holy cause would be completely pointless in my build.
Maybe I mis clicked one of my passives before logging out and it updated the profile like that.
I should try hold your ground, I will try switching out finery for it and see how that goes.
But this brings me back to my original question, if I re-roll my VIT on my shield to something else, I'll end up with only 320k hp. I feel like that's just not enough for t5/6, even when playing in a group. The question is more whether or not I should be rolling the block chance off of the shield for res all or -elite damage, but that seems like it would be a bad idea based on the opinions of those in this thread.
The problem here is that the default block chance of your shield is low. Lower is the block chance, less is the stat usefull. If your shield had 30% block chance, I would had say don't touch the block chance bonus on the shield. There is no clear answer to your question, simply because a good defensive shield for T6 has around 30% block chance. At least for a firebuild playing in group. Also if you choose to enchant the stat (block chance), divine fortress will be useless. Now what I say? Well, if you want to play T6, you might have survability issue. You have 25k healh globe bonuses... at 50k it start to get better to replinishing life with Wrathfull. For the shield you got the same stats as mine except that the default block chance is lower... keep it like it is or trade % life for - elite damage. If you can, do reapears wrap with those stats : fire, str, vit, CC.
For end game stats, I posted them in my third post on this topic!
I'm using these passive skills: Divine fortress, Vigilant, Wrathful and fervor. Wrathfull and fervor are mandotory for this builld... divine fortress give me 30% more armor (block chance of my shield) and vigilant reduce non physical damage by 20% (elemental damage from elites hurts).
And no, I would not trade any of these passive for Hold your ground. That's from a player (me) playing T6 in group that want to stay alive. If you decide to choose Hold your ground, trade Divine fortress for it.
I've found a very well rolled defender of westmarch, and while I'm pretty sure it's the better choice, I'm curious if I will lose some effective damage due to the loss of fire damage, and the vast majority of my damage being firestarter ticks.
Here's my profile:
http://us.battle.net/d3/en/profile/Grep-1483/hero/43931675
Here's the two shields:
http://imgur.com/U4904Do
With lidless, my stats are
360k hp
558k dps
7.5m tough
56% fire (871,072)
with the defender, they are:
404k hp
667k dps
8.5m tough
36% fire (907,788)
The strange part about this, is that the new mouse over fire damage calculation added in 2.0.6 actually shows a higher value even though I have lost 20% + fire. I guess this is because it's calculating strength into account. The strength and crit is obviously what makes defender such a high sheet DPS upgrade, but is firestarter tick affected by str or crit at all?
I feel like I need to use defender anyway for the toughness to progress to t6, but I'm just mainly curious if lidless would still technically be worth more real damage because of the mechanics of firestarter,
Also, should I roll that block chance to -10% elite damage perhaps? I use punish/roar, so that synergizes with extra block chance, but my lack of a unity is causing spike damage problems in t5/6 for me, so I think I'll need to.
thoughts? opinions?
Here's my build :http://us.battle.net/d3/en/profile/MrTeK-1365/hero/43679695
I personnaly use Defender of Westmarch but I mostly play in 4 players games. The reasons why I use Defender os Wesmarch are because I like to be close to monsters, the proc of darklight is usefull if you're close to monsters and in 4 players games you won't be as effective at killing speed. That's why being close is good! It's also why I changed some skill and passive skills to reflect my playstyle while being quite effective. By the way I solo T6.
You also want to have a lot of health globe bonuses because it synergize well with the passive Wrathfull. You also gonna have to change your amulet, even a well rolled yellow one would be better! Btw if you have any question, let me know! GL!
If you would have to chose between AR or - elite damage on your shield, take - elite damage. It's much more effective for damage mitigation considering that most dangerous elemental damage comes from elites packs.
The Defender of Westmarch is definitely the better shield here.
How much HP/Mitigation should I be aiming for? Im at 400k/850AR/17k armor now.
It just comes down to how much health you're comfortable having, really.
And if you end up being much more far away, then use Lidless instead.
My personal goal, or something I would like to test, is having reduce elites damage affix on my armor and my shield. Thats would be 20-22% reduced elites damage.Concerning end-game stats :Around 500k life and 800AR... I would say at least 20k armor (more if paragon lvl 600 and using Divine Fortress--- around 25k if so)... at least 100k health globe bonuses or more.
Thanks for doing the math though. It never came to mind. I was just stating from personal experience as I've always found vitality to add more toughness than % life.
I'm more concerned with the relative value of the block chance VS the VIT/Life%
Holy cause would be completely pointless in my build.
Maybe I mis clicked one of my passives before logging out and it updated the profile like that.
I should try hold your ground, I will try switching out finery for it and see how that goes.
But this brings me back to my original question, if I re-roll my VIT on my shield to something else, I'll end up with only 320k hp. I feel like that's just not enough for t5/6, even when playing in a group. The question is more whether or not I should be rolling the block chance off of the shield for res all or -elite damage, but that seems like it would be a bad idea based on the opinions of those in this thread.
For end game stats, I posted them in my third post on this topic!
I'm using these passive skills: Divine fortress, Vigilant, Wrathful and fervor. Wrathfull and fervor are mandotory for this builld... divine fortress give me 30% more armor (block chance of my shield) and vigilant reduce non physical damage by 20% (elemental damage from elites hurts).
And no, I would not trade any of these passive for Hold your ground. That's from a player (me) playing T6 in group that want to stay alive. If you decide to choose Hold your ground, trade Divine fortress for it.
Hope it helps!
Thanks all.