it affects everyone who is competing, of course it doesnt affect anyone who had no chance of being on the leaderbaords and those are the pople who are saying its okay because they didnt put in the time and effort to level up super high and compete. and if 50% cit damage 10 % cooldown 10% crit chance, lots of life per hit, lots of strength int or dex, recourse reduction, and so on doesn't matter then you must be retarded. most rings only have 30% - 50% crit damege so thats like a whole piece a gear probably more because of the other stats. any paragon levels below 800 are huge for progression on most classes.
This detached behavior translates to online gaming. When a major exploit comes along, people say "OMG FKING BLIZZ SUCKS". Instead of the more reasonable approach of calling out those who are purposely ripping the game.
It's basically a case of among teenagers being a troll is cool.
I remember playing WoW and people would sit around with their guildmates, people who were trying to come together to do something more than they could as individuals, and goad them into arguments, spam the table flip ASCII thing, respond to everything with "umadbro?" etc.
You could clearly tell the teenagers from EVERYONE ELSE. It's really a lack of parenting more than anything else. Anyone who believes that exploits are Blizzard's fault probably needed their dad to come home from work and beat the shit out of them with his belt because the kid got mouthy with his mother. But that probably wouldn't happen because the kid has six siblings, each one from a different father.
When I was a child no one gave two fucks if I thought Hasbro made an inferior cement truck toy. Kids today are raised to believe their opinion matters. Just look at Facebook. You have grown adults who communicate on the level of amoeba. And they're everywhere. Why? Because instead of holding their children responsible for being a party to their own education, parents nowadays just go to schools and blame the teachers for failing their children. MOTHERFUCKERS.... YOUR CHILDREN ARE FAILING BECAUSE YOU ARE BLAMING EVERYONE EXCEPT THEM. YOU ARE GIVING THEM A FREE PASS.
And then they grow up into mouthbreathing neckbeards who think that they are God's gift to everything they touch. D3 isn't perfect? RIOT! XP bug? NOT MY FAULT.
Bitch. If a shopowner leaves his front door unlocked that doesn't give you the right to go in and steal all the items from the shelves. Just because there is a bug in a piece of software that doesn't mean you have an open invitation to use it.
Your anology is inaccurate. It should be "if the shop keeper removes all his stock from his shelves, piles them into a wheel barrow, then moves the wheel barrow two blocks down the road and leaves it there unattended with no notice or warning message about who's property it is. He then repeats this again and again. Are the homeless people who converge on the wheel barrows to take the food criminals ?. In the eyes of the law, they are not. Is the homeless person who takes 3 cans of beans any more criminal than the one who takes only 1 can ? That would be a question about greed and not criminality.
Entering an event such as jar of souls or any other exploit is not the same as walking into a shop. The event was put there for us to enter. If the player decompiled the code, hacked it, recomplied and gave himself access, then that is a different.
Don't get me wrong, I do not like exploitation either and I too think cheats should have their accounts stripped but in this case, this is another symptom of Blizzards poor software development cycle, specifically, the test phase. Anyone with any insight into SDLC will immediately see Blizzard's recent patch list has poor QA written all over it.
I too agree there are many immature people around but hey, it's D3, what do you expect ?. It's not a forum on the New Testament or Confuscianism...
I remember a time in gaming where exploiters and cheaters hid in the shadows.
Now they are proud of what they do and THEY feel insulted and attack those who call them on their actions.
WTF happened?
I dunno, man. I remember more than a decade ago, being mocked, insulted, and called a noob in Diablo 2 multiplayer games.. because I was the only one there not running Maphack..
I mean seriously, it's pointed out repeatedly how these thing affect everyone besides just the leaderboards and people keep saying "it doesn't affect you".
This was an attempt to restate what you said, aimed at Belloc. Apologies if you think it was aimed at you, more like it was agreeing with you.
This detached behavior translates to online gaming. When a major exploit comes along, people say "OMG FKING BLIZZ SUCKS". Instead of the more reasonable approach of calling out those who are purposely ripping the game.
It's basically a case of among teenagers being a troll is cool.
I remember playing WoW and people would sit around with their guildmates, people who were trying to come together to do something more than they could as individuals, and goad them into arguments, spam the table flip ASCII thing, respond to everything with "umadbro?" etc.
You could clearly tell the teenagers from EVERYONE ELSE. It's really a lack of parenting more than anything else. Anyone who believes that exploits are Blizzard's fault probably needed their dad to come home from work and beat the shit out of them with his belt because the kid got mouthy with his mother. But that probably wouldn't happen because the kid has six siblings, each one from a different father.
When I was a child no one gave two fucks if I thought Hasbro made an inferior cement truck toy. Kids today are raised to believe their opinion matters. Just look at Facebook. You have grown adults who communicate on the level of amoeba. And they're everywhere. Why? Because instead of holding their children responsible for being a party to their own education, parents nowadays just go to schools and blame the teachers for failing their children. MOTHERFUCKERS.... YOUR CHILDREN ARE FAILING BECAUSE YOU ARE BLAMING EVERYONE EXCEPT THEM. YOU ARE GIVING THEM A FREE PASS.
And then they grow up into mouthbreathing neckbeards who think that they are God's gift to everything they touch. D3 isn't perfect? RIOT! XP bug? NOT MY FAULT.
Bitch. If a shopowner leaves his front door unlocked that doesn't give you the right to go in and steal all the items from the shelves. Just because there is a bug in a piece of software that doesn't mean you have an open invitation to use it.
Reminds me of a young engineer I work with. He's a very smart engineer, but is virtually incable of getting along with anyone outside of his immediate age group. He thinks he knows more about the work environment and how things work than people who have been there 10, 20, 40x longer than he has. And of course, if anyone calls him on it, he views it as age discrimination or racism (he's neon white, but we work in Hawaii). It never even enters his mind that he's a disrespectful assclown to those who have been around longer than him.
Don't get me wrong, I do not like exploitation either and I too think cheats should have their accounts stripped but in this case, this is another symptom of Blizzards poor software development cycle, specifically, the test phase. Anyone with any insight into SDLC will immediately see Blizzard's recent patch list has poor QA written all over it.
I'm not even going to touch on your analogy other than to say you need to understand that a BUG, by definition, is accidental and unintended. Therefore, comparing a bug in a piece of software to someone knowingly, and willingly, putting all their wares in a wheelbarrow and leaving it unattended in the middle of the street is not remotely accurate.
2.1 was rushed. It is a hot mess of lack of balance and badly-implemented ideas. From the constant frustrations with various monsters in GRifts to the fact that they left pet survivability take a massive hit in the nuts even though they knew, and acknowledged, it was a problem, to the brain fart that trials are, to the fact that the community has begged up and down for Blizzard to make difficulty amount to something more than just scaling damage, it seems more that they were interested in getting a patch live by a certain date than making sure the patch was actually complete. This isn't really a QA issue, it's an issue of straying from the "it's ready when it's ready" mentality to the "must get it done for <date>" mentality.
The bounties that could be used for fast T6 XP were reported during the beta. Pet survivability was reported during the beta. Both issues were ignored and allowed to go live. The Blizzard I remember would have fixed them because they were significant issues. For some reason, this time around, they chose to let major issues go live to bend to a deadline. That's the problem. Not QA.
2.1 doesn't have "poor QA" written all over it. It has "we completely skipped the QA process and also ignored a significant amount of beta feedback so that we could push this patch live ASAP" written all over it. And *that* is a much deeper, systemic and cultural, issue that scares me.
Do you really want to know what happened? What changed? You're probably not going to like it. Still want to know? Okay, here goes:
Cheating in Diablo 3 doesn't affect you. D3 is a coop game and cheating is only frowned upon in competitive games. Yes, I realize that some elements of Seasons are "competitive," but not in such a way that exploiting some XP gain by sitting in town is going to give you an unfair advantage.
Look at any online competitive game and you'll see that cheating is frowned upon and actioned whenever possible. Look at games like Counter-Strike or CoD and you'll see communities that are completely against cheating because it actually has a negative impact on their personal enjoyment of the game. Now let's compare that to Diablo 3.
In Diablo 3, you wouldn't even know that someone is cheating unless you were watching their stream. Wow, that really screws up the game for YOU, doesn't it? ... No, it doesn't.
That's what happened. I said you wouldn't like it.
TL;DR: Nothing has changed. Cheating is still frowned upon and cheaters still hide in the shadows... except on Diablo 3... because it doesn't affect anyone aside from themselves.
I really like this post and everything in it. Bans or resets in diablo type game are just silly to me. I bought the game, I should be able to play it in any way I want and so should everybody else.
As was stated above, since D3 was made by MMO devs with MMO features...what others do absolutely does affect everyone, even if they never join a game with another player.
Yeaaaah, no. Your whole "nerfs" post? Yeah, no. Anything that gets nerfed like that would've gotten nerfed at some point, anyway. Exploiters just point out the flaws in the game faster.
If those nerfs are affecting you, it means that you were using the "exploits," as well. "WTF? I can't do chest runs now because those EXPLOITERS were doing chest runs and got it nerfed!" You do realize that Diablo 3 is a farming game, right? So, why would you expect people to behave otherwise? So, it's not an exploit when you open a surface Resplendent chest, but it's an exploit when people go out specifically looking for and farming them? Even when farming is the entire point of Diablo 3? Do you see how silly that sounds? It really sounds like you're just mad because they got to do something and now you can't do it.
Tell me, how exactly did those using the recent Torment-6-Greater-Rift-XP exploit affect you? Were you sitting in town leaching xp? No? Then it doesn't affect you, does it? Those botters, botting chests and bosses and bounties... how do they affect you? The people who were farming the bugged Malthael XP, how did they affect you?
TL;DR: "I should be able to play any way I want to... but those 'EXPLOITERS' shouldn't be able to."
It's not the exploiters that make Blizzard nerf these things... it's the streamers. You want to be mad at someone for ruining the game for you? Blame the streamers. Blizzard wouldn't change things if streamers weren't advertising these problems to the world.
Do you really want to know what happened? What changed? You're probably not going to like it. Still want to know? Okay, here goes:
Cheating in Diablo 3 doesn't affect you. D3 is a coop game and cheating is only frowned upon in competitive games. Yes, I realize that some elements of Seasons are "competitive," but not in such a way that exploiting some XP gain by sitting in town is going to give you an unfair advantage.
Look at any online competitive game and you'll see that cheating is frowned upon and actioned whenever possible. Look at games like Counter-Strike or CoD and you'll see communities that are completely against cheating because it actually has a negative impact on their personal enjoyment of the game. Now let's compare that to Diablo 3.
In Diablo 3, you wouldn't even know that someone is cheating unless you were watching their stream. Wow, that really screws up the game for YOU, doesn't it? ... No, it doesn't.
That's what happened. I said you wouldn't like it.
TL;DR: Nothing has changed. Cheating is still frowned upon and cheaters still hide in the shadows... except on Diablo 3... because it doesn't affect anyone aside from themselves.
I really like this post and everything in it. Bans or resets in diablo type game are just silly to me. I bought the game, I should be able to play it in any way I want and so should everybody else.
As was stated above, since D3 was made by MMO devs with MMO features...what others do absolutely does affect everyone, even if they never join a game with another player.
Yeaaaah, no. Your whole "nerfs" post? Yeah, no. Anything that gets nerfed like that would've gotten nerfed at some point, anyway. Exploiters just point out the flaws in the game faster.
If those nerfs are affecting you, it means that you were using the "exploits," as well. "WTF? I can't do chest runs now because those EXPLOITERS were doing chest runs and got it nerfed!" You do realize that Diablo 3 is a farming game, right? So, why would you expect people to behave otherwise? So, it's not an exploit when you open a surface Resplendent chest, but it's an exploit when people go out specifically looking for and farming them? Even when farming is the entire point of Diablo 3? Do you see how silly that sounds? It really sounds like you're just mad because they got to do something and now you can't do it.
Tell me, how exactly did those using the recent Torment-6-Greater-Rift-XP exploit affect you? Were you sitting in town leaching xp? No? Then it doesn't affect you, does it? Those botters, botting chests and bosses and bounties... how do they affect you? The people who were farming the bugged Malthael XP, how did they affect you?
TL;DR: "I should be able to play any way I want to... but those 'EXPLOITERS' shouldn't be able to."
What a load of nonsense.
1) Shoving your fingers in your ears and yelling "NUH UH!!!!" doesn't change reality, none of these things were nerfed until they were exploited. The streamers are exploiters too, they are not a seperate group you can shift blame too. Also, how long have you worked at Blizzard...oh wait, you don't...so shut up about what would have happened anyway, you have no clue.
2) Your statement saying anyone complaining must be an exploiter too is probably the stupidest thing I've ever read here, congrats, that is no small accomplishment. One does not have to be exploiting something to miss it when it's gone from the game, Missing surface resplendent chests or loot from vases doesn't mean someone was farming or botting them.
P.S. Stop trying to make exploiters sound like some kind of heroes for "pointing out flaws in the game". They are pond scum who know they can't compete on a level playing field.
P.PS. Your TL.DR attempt at trying to equate cheating as a valid playstyle compared to not cheating....makes me wonder how you are able to remember to breath.
Isn't laughing at people getting hurt on TV the fundamental premise of AFV? ... or NFL, if I wanted to get snarkier.
All that's changed is that YouTube and Twitch provide a much bigger platform for douchebags to be the douchebags they've always been. This isn't a fundamental change in human nature, just a fundamental change in the visibility of human nature.
I disagree. It's something in the language, the apathy toward others.
It's got less to do with "visibility" and more to do with "invisibility", as far as internet communique goes. Of course we've always uncomfortably chuckled at the misfortunes of others, but the way we communicate now shows a disconnect with the suffering the person we're watching get hurt has endured.
I cannot help but to wonder what the fuck is wrong with young people these days, as they cannot even put their goddamn phones down to save the life of a friend.
I cannot fathom one of my friends standing there laughing while holding a "phone" (if we can even call them that anymore) and doing nothing to help get his friend out of danger.
I remember playing WoW and people would sit around with their guildmates, people who were trying to come together to do something more than they could as individuals, and goad them into arguments, spam the table flip ASCII thing, respond to everything with "umadbro?" etc.
You could clearly tell the teenagers from EVERYONE ELSE. It's really a lack of parenting more than anything else. Anyone who believes that exploits are Blizzard's fault probably needed their dad to come home from work and beat the shit out of them with his belt because the kid got mouthy with his mother. But that probably wouldn't happen because the kid has six siblings, each one from a different father.
When I was a child no one gave two fucks if I thought Hasbro made an inferior cement truck toy. Kids today are raised to believe their opinion matters. Just look at Facebook. You have grown adults who communicate on the level of amoeba. And they're everywhere. Why? Because instead of holding their children responsible for being a party to their own education, parents nowadays just go to schools and blame the teachers for failing their children. MOTHERFUCKERS.... YOUR CHILDREN ARE FAILING BECAUSE YOU ARE BLAMING EVERYONE EXCEPT THEM. YOU ARE GIVING THEM A FREE PASS.
And then they grow up into mouthbreathing neckbeards who think that they are God's gift to everything they touch. D3 isn't perfect? RIOT! XP bug? NOT MY FAULT.
Bitch. If a shopowner leaves his front door unlocked that doesn't give you the right to go in and steal all the items from the shelves. Just because there is a bug in a piece of software that doesn't mean you have an open invitation to use it.
Entering an event such as jar of souls or any other exploit is not the same as walking into a shop. The event was put there for us to enter. If the player decompiled the code, hacked it, recomplied and gave himself access, then that is a different.
Don't get me wrong, I do not like exploitation either and I too think cheats should have their accounts stripped but in this case, this is another symptom of Blizzards poor software development cycle, specifically, the test phase. Anyone with any insight into SDLC will immediately see Blizzard's recent patch list has poor QA written all over it.
I too agree there are many immature people around but hey, it's D3, what do you expect ?. It's not a forum on the New Testament or Confuscianism...
WD Season 8 https://www.diabloprogress.com/hero/finiar-1655/Kildare/84509816
Monk season 7 http://www.diabloprogress.com/hero/finiar-1655/MojoJoJo/42225505
DH season 6 http://www.diabloprogress.com/hero/finiar-1655/DeadShot/75655606
Angry Chicken http://www.diabloprogress.com/hero/finiar-1655/WhoDoVooDoo/68187610
What? Me worry?
2.1 was rushed. It is a hot mess of lack of balance and badly-implemented ideas. From the constant frustrations with various monsters in GRifts to the fact that they left pet survivability take a massive hit in the nuts even though they knew, and acknowledged, it was a problem, to the brain fart that trials are, to the fact that the community has begged up and down for Blizzard to make difficulty amount to something more than just scaling damage, it seems more that they were interested in getting a patch live by a certain date than making sure the patch was actually complete. This isn't really a QA issue, it's an issue of straying from the "it's ready when it's ready" mentality to the "must get it done for <date>" mentality.
The bounties that could be used for fast T6 XP were reported during the beta. Pet survivability was reported during the beta. Both issues were ignored and allowed to go live. The Blizzard I remember would have fixed them because they were significant issues. For some reason, this time around, they chose to let major issues go live to bend to a deadline. That's the problem. Not QA.
2.1 doesn't have "poor QA" written all over it. It has "we completely skipped the QA process and also ignored a significant amount of beta feedback so that we could push this patch live ASAP" written all over it. And *that* is a much deeper, systemic and cultural, issue that scares me.
If those nerfs are affecting you, it means that you were using the "exploits," as well. "WTF? I can't do chest runs now because those EXPLOITERS were doing chest runs and got it nerfed!" You do realize that Diablo 3 is a farming game, right? So, why would you expect people to behave otherwise? So, it's not an exploit when you open a surface Resplendent chest, but it's an exploit when people go out specifically looking for and farming them? Even when farming is the entire point of Diablo 3? Do you see how silly that sounds? It really sounds like you're just mad because they got to do something and now you can't do it.
Tell me, how exactly did those using the recent Torment-6-Greater-Rift-XP exploit affect you? Were you sitting in town leaching xp? No? Then it doesn't affect you, does it? Those botters, botting chests and bosses and bounties... how do they affect you? The people who were farming the bugged Malthael XP, how did they affect you?
TL;DR: "I should be able to play any way I want to... but those 'EXPLOITERS' shouldn't be able to."
It's not the exploiters that make Blizzard nerf these things... it's the streamers. You want to be mad at someone for ruining the game for you? Blame the streamers. Blizzard wouldn't change things if streamers weren't advertising these problems to the world.
1) Shoving your fingers in your ears and yelling "NUH UH!!!!" doesn't change reality, none of these things were nerfed until they were exploited. The streamers are exploiters too, they are not a seperate group you can shift blame too. Also, how long have you worked at Blizzard...oh wait, you don't...so shut up about what would have happened anyway, you have no clue.
2) Your statement saying anyone complaining must be an exploiter too is probably the stupidest thing I've ever read here, congrats, that is no small accomplishment. One does not have to be exploiting something to miss it when it's gone from the game, Missing surface resplendent chests or loot from vases doesn't mean someone was farming or botting them.
P.S. Stop trying to make exploiters sound like some kind of heroes for "pointing out flaws in the game". They are pond scum who know they can't compete on a level playing field.
P.PS. Your TL.DR attempt at trying to equate cheating as a valid playstyle compared to not cheating....makes me wonder how you are able to remember to breath.
It's got less to do with "visibility" and more to do with "invisibility", as far as internet communique goes. Of course we've always uncomfortably chuckled at the misfortunes of others, but the way we communicate now shows a disconnect with the suffering the person we're watching get hurt has endured.
I cannot help but to wonder what the fuck is wrong with young people these days, as they cannot even put their goddamn phones down to save the life of a friend.
A good example of this disconnect with reality;
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wX3thdYWUbs
I cannot fathom one of my friends standing there laughing while holding a "phone" (if we can even call them that anymore) and doing nothing to help get his friend out of danger.
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