This is a very tricky topic to address, because there are quite a few different approaches to multiboxing out there and only some of them goes against our Terms of Use.
It is an issue if and when multiboxing automates gameplay, but as long as the player who is multiboxing is the legitimate account holder on all the involved accounts, and as long as all the characters being played are 100% under the player's control without any kind of automation involved, then we are okay with it.
Edit: Removing the air plane analogy, because looking at it in retrospect, I can see that it wasn't really very accurate. Please look to my next response for further clarification:
so they probably got banned for them being automated alright good to know thanks
FYI. nobody has ever gotten ban for multi boxing. i'm not arguing. these are facts. i do not agree with it as blizz are idiots when it comes to muti boxing.
Uhm guys, please stay on topic ;-) This is not about multi-boxing.
Thanks for the discussion so far.
True, this topic isn't about multi-boxing, but the topic is about the concerns of Seasons. Imo, multi-boxing is one of my/the concerns. I really think multiboxers can ruin the fun for others in Seasons.
You aren't going to win ladder. Don't worry about it. Make ladder be a break from the monotony for you. Use it to farm items for later use in non-lad. No need to sink silly big hours into it unless you wish to.
Well. Think about it as very rare items. There are some legendaries you might never see even after six month of farming. That's what season only legendaries will be for you.
Seriously, this talk of fearing other players will get ahead of you playing seasons is rather inconsiderate and selfish. Xp and items might be rolled into regular accounts right after, but ladder player will obviously pex at a much lower rate than you during the levelling phase. They won't be able to loot end game legendaries during this time. They won't be farming torment legendaries anytime soon after reaching 70.
And it's not because those ladder specific legendaries will be new that they'll be more powerfull. There's no garantee you'll get them even while playing ladder...
Seriously. I can see it from here. I'm gonna play ladder. Some friends won't. They'll cry all the way. Right after the end of the season, they'll drop one of those specific legendaries that I never got the chance to see while playing ladder. A perfectly rolled one to boot. Season two will begin, they'll start crying all over again. I'll tell them " Dude, I levelled a brand new character for a shot at getting this item. I never did. You got a perfect one right after the end of the season while busting my shards all along. So, if you don't shut up about season 2 ladder legendaries I swear I'm gonna f*cking kill you." And nobody will ever talk again about ladder ruining the fun for non ladder players.
So just chill, enjoy the game your way. Think about you can gain, and not about what other could gain by playing a different way that you do not enjoy.
One day you might want to try something different and play ladder. And once you do You'll be glad there's a bit more of an incentive to it.
I think you sufficiently nailed the correct ebb-n-flow of advantage/disadvantage. +1
Well. Think about it as very rare items. There are some legendaries you might never see even after six month of farming. That's what season only legendaries will be for you.
Seriously, this talk of fearing other players will get ahead of you playing seasons is rather inconsiderate and selfish. Xp and items might be rolled into regular accounts right after, but ladder player will obviously pex at a much lower rate than you during the levelling phase. They won't be able to loot end game legendaries during this time. They won't be farming torment legendaries anytime soon after reaching 70.
And it's not because those ladder specific legendaries will be new that they'll be more powerfull. There's no garantee you'll get them even while playing ladder...
Seriously. I can see it from here. I'm gonna play ladder. Some friends won't. They'll cry all the way. Right after the end of the season, they'll drop one of those specific legendaries that I never got the chance to see while playing ladder. A perfectly rolled one to boot. Season two will begin, they'll start crying all over again. I'll tell them " Dude, I levelled a brand new character for a shot at getting this item. I never did. You got a perfect one right after the end of the season while busting my shards all along. So, if you don't shut up about season 2 ladder legendaries I swear I'm gonna f*cking kill you." And nobody will ever talk again about ladder ruining the fun for non ladder players.
So just chill, enjoy the game your way. Think about you can gain, and not about what other could gain by playing a different way that you do not enjoy.
One day you might want to try something different and play ladder. And once you do You'll be glad there's a bit more of an incentive to it.
Awful argument might I say? I mean really yeah we will eventually get them, but you're avoiding our whole point which is, Why do ladder players feel so entitled to special legendaries? Why not just add legendaries and make them universally accessible? I don't play ladder, never have never will. Don't like the idea of restarting my progress. I enjoy my non ladder characters that I've sunk numerous hours into. Why do I have to wait? What makes you so damned special over me? Are ladder players gods? Do I need to sacrifice the Lord of Bells to RNJesus? I mean I don't get what's so complicated here. You're getting an entitlement for playing the game roughly the exact same way as I am; For no reason at all! It's not fair, just like I don't like the MP buff, What makes people who play co-op so special over those who solo? They have a HUGE advantage over SP players for 0 reason. Also the reason I dislike the way rifts got a 100% leg buff, Why did rifts get it but not all of Adventure mode? What made rifts so special versus everything else? You already got shards in rifts and bounties, why do we need a higher drop rate? If the drop rate was bad in rifts doesn't that mean it's bad everywhere? Seriously some stupid design choices by the Blizzard Dev team. I don't understand why they've decided to make a right way to play and a wrong way to play, I thought we were supposed to play how we wanted to...guess that was never an option.
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
Not even Death will save you from Diablo Bunny's Cuteness!
Well. Think about it as very rare items. There are some legendaries you might never see even after six month of farming. That's what season only legendaries will be for you.
Seriously, this talk of fearing other players will get ahead of you playing seasons is rather inconsiderate and selfish. Xp and items might be rolled into regular accounts right after, but ladder player will obviously pex at a much lower rate than you during the levelling phase. They won't be able to loot end game legendaries during this time. They won't be farming torment legendaries anytime soon after reaching 70.
And it's not because those ladder specific legendaries will be new that they'll be more powerfull. There's no garantee you'll get them even while playing ladder...
Seriously. I can see it from here. I'm gonna play ladder. Some friends won't. They'll cry all the way. Right after the end of the season, they'll drop one of those specific legendaries that I never got the chance to see while playing ladder. A perfectly rolled one to boot. Season two will begin, they'll start crying all over again. I'll tell them " Dude, I levelled a brand new character for a shot at getting this item. I never did. You got a perfect one right after the end of the season while busting my shards all along. So, if you don't shut up about season 2 ladder legendaries I swear I'm gonna f*cking kill you." And nobody will ever talk again about ladder ruining the fun for non ladder players.
So just chill, enjoy the game your way. Think about you can gain, and not about what other could gain by playing a different way that you do not enjoy.
One day you might want to try something different and play ladder. And once you do You'll be glad there's a bit more of an incentive to it.
Awful argument might I say? I mean really yeah we will eventually get them, but you're avoiding our whole point which is, Why do ladder players feel so entitled to special legendaries? Why not just add legendaries and make them universally accessible? I don't play ladder, never have never will. Don't like the idea of restarting my progress. I enjoy my non ladder characters that I've sunk numerous hours into. Why do I have to wait? What makes you so damned special over me? Are ladder players gods? Do I need to sacrifice the Lord of Bells to RNJesus? I mean I don't get what's so complicated here. You're getting an entitlement for playing the game roughly the exact same way as I am; For no reason at all! It's not fair, just like I don't like the MP buff, What makes people who play co-op so special over those who solo? They have a HUGE advantage over SP players for 0 reason. Also the reason I dislike the way rifts got a 100% leg buff, Why did rifts get it but not all of Adventure mode? What made rifts so special versus everything else? You already got shards in rifts and bounties, why do we need a higher drop rate? If the drop rate was bad in rifts doesn't that mean it's bad everywhere? Seriously some stupid design choices by the Blizzard Dev team. I don't understand why they've decided to make a right way to play and a wrong way to play, I thought we were supposed to play how we wanted to...guess that was never an option.
"What makes you so damned special over me?"
Because they're doing something about it given the circumstances.
If you want it, work for it. If not, wait for it later on.
Working for it isn't "special".
Wanting something for nothing is "entitilment" mentality.
And I get it, I don't want to do ladders, so youknow what, I'm just gonna wait for it...
Casual players (and I am one of them) would not care "falling behind" because anyway they are playing with other casual players... If anything I personally think it might incentivise myself to try another character beside my wizard but that's it.
Fundamentally, I disagree with your assessment of "casuals."
Casual players are, by definition, "behind" due to their inability to commit more time to the game. Making it such that they're even FURTHER behind because they don't have access to a subset of items for X months only serves to exacerbate that problem while further lumping rewards on the demographic which already has everything they could possibly want.
Instead of being more equitable all they're accomplishing is widening the gap.... which is good for Kripp's ePeen, but tragic for anyone who can't sit around for 14 hours per day drinking organic OJ and watching pornhub.
If seasons are short (I'm thinking like 1.5 - 2.5 months) then ladder-only items probably won't impact "casuals" too much. If seasons are longer than 3 months, though, it becomes a progressively-larger problem as you're asking people who paid the exact same for the game to "just wait" for content.
Never have, never will? Why not try something new instead of getting angry and blaming the devs or players that are into ladders or players that want to play together. Seriously what makes them special over you? They are willing to step outside of themselves. Let us live in a world where there is no reward for anything.
Whats that life isnt fair? I must go qq on the forums..
Never have, never will? Why not try something new instead of getting angry and blaming the devs or players that are into ladders or players that want to play together. Seriously what makes them special over you? They are willing to step outside of themselves. Let us live in a world where there is no reward for anything.
Whats that life isnt fair? I must go qq on the forums..
Well. Think about it as very rare items. There are some legendaries you might never see even after six month of farming. That's what season only legendaries will be for you.
Seriously, this talk of fearing other players will get ahead of you playing seasons is rather inconsiderate and selfish. Xp and items might be rolled into regular accounts right after, but ladder player will obviously pex at a much lower rate than you during the levelling phase. They won't be able to loot end game legendaries during this time. They won't be farming torment legendaries anytime soon after reaching 70.
And it's not because those ladder specific legendaries will be new that they'll be more powerfull. There's no garantee you'll get them even while playing ladder...
Seriously. I can see it from here. I'm gonna play ladder. Some friends won't. They'll cry all the way. Right after the end of the season, they'll drop one of those specific legendaries that I never got the chance to see while playing ladder. A perfectly rolled one to boot. Season two will begin, they'll start crying all over again. I'll tell them " Dude, I levelled a brand new character for a shot at getting this item. I never did. You got a perfect one right after the end of the season while busting my shards all along. So, if you don't shut up about season 2 ladder legendaries I swear I'm gonna f*cking kill you." And nobody will ever talk again about ladder ruining the fun for non ladder players.
So just chill, enjoy the game your way. Think about you can gain, and not about what other could gain by playing a different way that you do not enjoy.
One day you might want to try something different and play ladder. And once you do You'll be glad there's a bit more of an incentive to it.
Awful argument might I say? I mean really yeah we will eventually get them, but you're avoiding our whole point which is, Why do ladder players feel so entitled to special legendaries? Why not just add legendaries and make them universally accessible? I don't play ladder, never have never will. Don't like the idea of restarting my progress. I enjoy my non ladder characters that I've sunk numerous hours into. Why do I have to wait? What makes you so damned special over me? Are ladder players gods? Do I need to sacrifice the Lord of Bells to RNJesus? I mean I don't get what's so complicated here. You're getting an entitlement for playing the game roughly the exact same way as I am; For no reason at all! It's not fair, just like I don't like the MP buff, What makes people who play co-op so special over those who solo? They have a HUGE advantage over SP players for 0 reason. Also the reason I dislike the way rifts got a 100% leg buff, Why did rifts get it but not all of Adventure mode? What made rifts so special versus everything else? You already got shards in rifts and bounties, why do we need a higher drop rate? If the drop rate was bad in rifts doesn't that mean it's bad everywhere? Seriously some stupid design choices by the Blizzard Dev team. I don't understand why they've decided to make a right way to play and a wrong way to play, I thought we were supposed to play how we wanted to...guess that was never an option.
"What makes you so damned special over me?"
Because they're doing something about it given the circumstances.
If you want it, work for it. If not, wait for it later on.
Working for it isn't "special".
Wanting something for nothing is "entitilment" mentality.
And I get it, I don't want to do ladders, so youknow what, I'm just gonna wait for it...
AGAIN WITH THIS MENTALITY THAT YOU'RE DOING SOMETHING SPECIAL. You fail to see that anyone playing ladders does the EXACT SAME THING AS NON LADDERS! The only difference being their shit gets erased from the ladder for COMPETITIVENESS! THAT'S THE ONLY PURPOSE OF LADDERS! TO BE COMPETITIVE! NOT SO YOU CAN GET COOLER ITEMS QUICKER. I don't understand how people are failing to realize this. They aren't working any harder for it than I am. They are playing the game the same as I did. Why do we have to incentivize doing this? Why does it need to have Ladder only Legendaries? You're missing the point that there is 0 reason for it to be incentivized considering I play the game the same way just without a restart.. It'd kind of ridiculous actually to think about. The "Right" way to play is Ladder Rifts, If you don't be prepared to be severely lacking in gear, for quite a few months. Of which I could instead rack up about 100 hours of Non Ladder playtime of equal value.
The problem is that everyone is equating that ladder mean you are doing more you are being competitive, and thus there follows rewards for being competitive. I agree wholeheartedly that they deserve awards. But to put them in the form of gearing faster than those who chose not to play competitively is a bit too much. Cosmetic rewards and I wouldn't care. A cool transmog for getting to P100 in a season, Cool that makes me wanna do it, Making me play so I can understand how to gear with the season only legendaries, just to then use them on a different character, Nah count me out. They've over incentivized this game to the point of it being unfairly imbalanced. You shouldn't be that heavily rewarded for doing nothing more than I'm doing.
Quote fromxduch355x
Never have, never will? Why not try something new instead of getting angry and blaming the devs or players that are into ladders or players that want to play together. Seriously what makes them special over you? They are willing to step outside of themselves. Let us live in a world where there is no reward for anything.
Whats that life isnt fair? I must go qq on the forums..
Dumbest thing I've ever read on a forum. In a game where you can balance everything at your whim, why would you go for something unfair? I understand life isn't fair. But a game, that should be fair. We have no control over some of the things that happen in life. But in a game where it's very easy to control things, I'd assume they'd strive for a balance of all the different people who want to play. I'm not going after people who want to play ladder I'm going after the devs absurd route of thought. Their train of thought boils down to this "They play Seasons, Give them cool new items first; because they are playing the right way and everyone else isn't" This is the wrong mentality. They need to be saying how can we make it as distributed as possible. In the beginning of RoS they had it somewhat decent. You either did bounties for a cache that could give a legendary, Did rifts to get blood shards to possibly get a legendary, or played through the entire campaign for a guaranteed legendary. There were three roads. You could get everything in each of the three roads. You didn't need to do one or the other there was a choice. After they buffed the rifts though, now it's all anyone cares about. Why play anything else if you have an extra 100% legendary drop rate? They're extending that with seasons now. Why play anything else when you get all the cool items first (At least a whole month) in season? It's about trying to create a balance, of which the D3 dev team is starting to stray away from. By yours and everyone else logic, there should be a super set of Hardcore only legendaries because they play in a highly competitive environment, with the risk of losing their character forever. And to take it further Season HC should have even cooler newer legendaries that even SC season players don't get because they have the ultimate competitive environment. But you don't see them doing that do you? Yeah... retarded. All we're asking is the devs to be fair since they have it 100% in their power to do so.
Never have, never will? Why not try something new instead of getting angry and blaming the devs or players that are into ladders or players that want to play together. Seriously what makes them special over you? They are willing to step outside of themselves. Let us live in a world where there is no reward for anything.
What you're trying to argue is akin to arguing that when playing FFVII that people who want to use Tifa instead of Cid shouldn't expect their game to have similar chances of success. They should just "step outside themselves" and use Cid even though they want to use Tifa in their group. Who cares that people enjoy a game? Just go do whatever is best... that's all. Min/max 24/7 at all costs.
This is the mentality of the streaming community. Who cares if CotA runs are actually fun? Just do them because they're the best.
Why shouldn't everyone feel that their way of playing (again, within reason) is at least close to the "best" way to play? Why do there have to be such severe differences? If someone really enjoys bounties but doesn't love rifts so much, so they do 90% bounties and 10% rifts, why should they feel that they're getting fewer items than someone who is leeching T4+ RiF games?
Why shouldn't we want a game where there are more options for everyone so that they feel happy about their experience as opposed to a game where "go play something you don't really enjoy" is the predominant design philosophy?
Not a big fan of seasons unless they are going to last at least a year. I like the tiered rifts.
Heard someone in the clan mention some talk about being able to bring current chars into ladder seasons. Not sure what that was all about.
You're right, however. I mentioned earlier on in this thread that I would like to see ladder chars get wiped at the end of the season and all the loot be adopted over to non-lad. But then we run out of room in regard to stash.
It would seem a bit silly to have to delete chars over time as they are brought from lad to non-lad. Quite a few tough decisions to be made by the devs in this regard.
With the introduction of season only legendaries I wonder how people are going to feel when they don't get them to drop by the end of the season and have nothing to carry over to the normal game. I'm all for tiered rifts but there should be some sort of legendary safety net when it comes to competing in regards to the RNG of gear.
Safety nets are so not Diablo. I don't like hearing such things.
Anyway, on topic. I agree with you on that statement:
casual = behind
But I think you are to failing to realised mine was:
casual = don't care about being behind
I agree that casuals tend not to care so much about "being behind" but just like everything that doesn't exist in a vacuum.
Let's use Heroic vs Normal raiding in WoW as an example. Heroic loot is 13 item levels better than Normal loot, typically. This has been established as an acceptable difference both to support the additional effort it takes to clear heroic content without making the people who aren't clearing it feel like they're an afterthought. Imagine if Blizzard scaled up that difference to 26 or 39 or 52 item levels. Do you think the casuals, who generally don't care about the fact that they don't have heroic loot, are going to accept that?
What I'm saying is that I don't care about "being behind" although I do take issue with some of the social-based farming methods that Blizzard seems not to care about making solo play feel punitive. But there's a level of "being behind" which most of us are willing to tolerate and past that line it does become something we're acutely aware of and dissatisfied with.
Makes sense, right?
Taking a scenario where casuals are ALREADY behind and throwing in another game mode which puts them further behind is toeing a line, as seen by the opinions in this topic. Clearly there are people who are OK with the level of "behindness" that exists in the current game. But clearly there are people who feel that ladder-only loot (even if it's rolled back into the non-ladder drop tables after the season ends) creates a level of "behindness" that's simply unjustified.
I can't believe how many people are against Season only items. Did any of D3's community play D2 LoD? Suck it up, seriously.
Diablo 3 cannot be competitive without Seasons. There needs to be a reset to bring everybody back to the starting line. At the end of the Season, all your newly found items and Paragon is added to your normal characters, so it is not lost.
So why Season only gear? Incentive. If there was no new loot, or if the loot was added to non-Season drops, nobody would play it.
So why can't you play Seasons? Because you don't want to start anew? Then don't. Otherwise, stop being a princess and jump on board. I cannot wait until Seasons is the 'real game' and what we have now is just an accumulation of Paragon/gold/items from everything we have done in our D3 career.
people still arguing with this shaggy ? don't feed the troll, or the naive
You're basically saying don't add any depth or complexity for the simple reason that us player's who can't play the game as much as others (bordering on majority) will not be able to keep up or enjoy the experience, or feel forced to make time to play it. In other words, (Blizzard forget about them, develop this game for ME), yet you try to say others are "Selfish/Ignorant"
And your argument seems to be founded on Heroic/Casual gamer in WoW being separated by ilvl is "13" then you I guess some how translate that into Blackthorn = 1 ilvl, Shard of Hate = 13 ilvl (even though both items are completely RNG and can be found by both types of players, you can farm torment 1 naked) -- Not the case in WoW and then you further go on to claim that Ladders/seasons will make this so called pseudo separation go from "13" to "60+" (even though the game is still based on RNG with easy access to said RNG Pool, and even though we don't even know how the loot will work, all based on your assumptions) either way the whole argument doesn't correlate from WoW to diablo, and just stems down to you either wanting people who can play 3-4+ a day to be handicapped, or you want loot to be easier for people with limited amount of time (Aka, the casual movement of Wotlk) ---
A CASUAL GAMER IN WOW GENERALLY SPEAKING BACK IN THE DAY ONLY CONSIDERED HAVING ACCESS TO "END-GAME" LOOT 1-4 MONTHS DOWN THE TRACK OF CONTENT RELEASE, DEPENDING ON LEVEL OF CASUAL/ RNG / OTHER WAITING FACTORS (WHICH YOU SEEM TO ACCEPT AS A 1:13 SEPARATION)
A CASUAL GAMER IN DIABLO IS EXPECTED (DEPENDING ON DURATION OF SEASONS) WE WOULD LIKE TO ASSUME 1-4 MONTHS IS ACTUALLY COINCIDENTALLY A FAIRLY GOOD SEASON DURATION (AT WHICH THE END OF SAID SEASON YOU WILL HAVE ACCESS TO THESE ITEMS WITHOUT TOUCHING SEASONS)
Your whole argument of saying ladders/seasons will make it too separated is false and misinformed #RNG
that's also assuming even at 2.1 you're still labouring under the delusion that in order to participate in season/ladders you must have no-life (could you be any more ignorant? lmao)
It seems like you're unwilling to compromise on any ground that may affect your mindset (because that's all it is) you could easily keep playing the game as you have been if you don't want to commit to seasons and accept that you only can commit certain amount of hours and you expect blizzard to progress their game to "YOUR" standards and demands/capabilties
It's very easy for you to sit there playing the victim, like people in your position have done for years, especially on WoW, but try thinking about players who want to see the Diablo franchise keep growing and exceed it's current lackluster mold, like iv'e said before, any addition to the game should be welcomed by all player's it might not immediately benefit you if you don't want to play in seasons or competitively, but it will inherently flow into all game modes and benefit all types of players in time, but you'd rather sit there naively sitting there with your head in the sand and cry about how bad it will affect you.... oh please.... harden the F up.
Shaggy ""The question they should be asking themselves is "how does this change make the game better for everyone?" Clearly it doesn't because, obviously, not everyone wants to be involved with ladders. I get that Blizzard wants to throw a bone to the 10hr/day no-lifers, but I think they can do that in a way that's less-detrimental to the rest of us who aren't "professional gamers." As been said a thousand times before: cosmetic rewards.""
You can easily participate in Seasons/Ladders without 10 hours a day to sink into Diablo 3 -- It's not about getting first. Someone will always be better than you. You can have a life, play a decent amount of time, and enjoy ladders/seasons (You can also not play them at all, and continue to play other area's of Diablo 3, or other games)
How does not adding any depth/complexity to the game benefit every one????? the crux of your arguments seems to be how 'detrimental' this will be to the game, when in truth, keeping the game in it's current state is what will be detrimental. There is only positives to take from all Ladder/seasons idea's flowing around Blizzard (from what we know)
Cosmetic rewards don't belong in Diablo, you trying to handi-cap rational and efficient gamers and the growth of Diablo 3 because you're too lazy to utilize your time ( Yes, that's right, you don't need a lot, not as much as you make out to be, typicalhypochondriac)
You say it's ignorant to insinuate that you can keep playing the game normally, yet, it's completely rational and considerate, what your view points and opinions are right?? classic case of don't want to put X effort to gain Y, but don't want Z to get Y.
your argument on this is also founded on a very naive assumption of how the legendary distribution system will work, already debunked your fear that it will be locked into season mode, as i predicted they plan to release them into the overall loot table, and seasons shouldn't be that long, so if you can't play that much the time should go relatively fast, and should keep that '1:13' separation ratio you like to use
Either way your pretty much just a guy sitting there saying, anything that doesn't agree with me is Ignorant, and everything I say is golden and should be listened to. /yawn
Dang I fed him, ohwell.... needed to be said
TL:DR Any addition to Diablo is much needed and should be welcomed by all players to embrace in a positive mindset, find the positive in the "personal drawback", stop being a whining blizzard pitchfork QQer, it's getting old
Community
This is a very tricky topic to address, because there are quite a few different approaches to multiboxing out there and only some of them goes against our Terms of Use.
It is an issue if and when multiboxing automates gameplay, but as long as the player who is multiboxing is the legitimate account holder on all the involved accounts, and as long as all the characters being played are 100% under the player's control without any kind of automation involved, then we are okay with it.
Edit: Removing the air plane analogy, because looking at it in retrospect, I can see that it wasn't really very accurate. Please look to my next response for further clarification:
http://eu.battle.net/d3/en/forum/topic/5825582768#15
http://eu.battle.net/d3/en/profile/Time2Kill-1230/hero/23330792
http://eu.battle.net/d3/en/profile/Time2Kill-1230/hero/23330792
BurningRope#1322 (US~HC) Request an invite to the official (NA) <dfans> Clan
BurningRope#1322 (US~HC) Request an invite to the official (NA) <dfans> Clan
Because they're doing something about it given the circumstances.
If you want it, work for it. If not, wait for it later on.
Working for it isn't "special".
Wanting something for nothing is "entitilment" mentality.
And I get it, I don't want to do ladders, so youknow what, I'm just gonna wait for it...
WD Season 8 https://www.diabloprogress.com/hero/finiar-1655/Kildare/84509816
Monk season 7 http://www.diabloprogress.com/hero/finiar-1655/MojoJoJo/42225505
DH season 6 http://www.diabloprogress.com/hero/finiar-1655/DeadShot/75655606
Angry Chicken http://www.diabloprogress.com/hero/finiar-1655/WhoDoVooDoo/68187610
What? Me worry?
Casual players are, by definition, "behind" due to their inability to commit more time to the game. Making it such that they're even FURTHER behind because they don't have access to a subset of items for X months only serves to exacerbate that problem while further lumping rewards on the demographic which already has everything they could possibly want.
Instead of being more equitable all they're accomplishing is widening the gap.... which is good for Kripp's ePeen, but tragic for anyone who can't sit around for 14 hours per day drinking organic OJ and watching pornhub.
If seasons are short (I'm thinking like 1.5 - 2.5 months) then ladder-only items probably won't impact "casuals" too much. If seasons are longer than 3 months, though, it becomes a progressively-larger problem as you're asking people who paid the exact same for the game to "just wait" for content.
And I don't agree that it makes anything worse for the casual player. If they are truly casual, it's all good.
WD Season 8 https://www.diabloprogress.com/hero/finiar-1655/Kildare/84509816
Monk season 7 http://www.diabloprogress.com/hero/finiar-1655/MojoJoJo/42225505
DH season 6 http://www.diabloprogress.com/hero/finiar-1655/DeadShot/75655606
Angry Chicken http://www.diabloprogress.com/hero/finiar-1655/WhoDoVooDoo/68187610
What? Me worry?
Whats that life isnt fair? I must go qq on the forums..
WD Season 8 https://www.diabloprogress.com/hero/finiar-1655/Kildare/84509816
Monk season 7 http://www.diabloprogress.com/hero/finiar-1655/MojoJoJo/42225505
DH season 6 http://www.diabloprogress.com/hero/finiar-1655/DeadShot/75655606
Angry Chicken http://www.diabloprogress.com/hero/finiar-1655/WhoDoVooDoo/68187610
What? Me worry?
The problem is that everyone is equating that ladder mean you are doing more you are being competitive, and thus there follows rewards for being competitive. I agree wholeheartedly that they deserve awards. But to put them in the form of gearing faster than those who chose not to play competitively is a bit too much. Cosmetic rewards and I wouldn't care. A cool transmog for getting to P100 in a season, Cool that makes me wanna do it, Making me play so I can understand how to gear with the season only legendaries, just to then use them on a different character, Nah count me out. They've over incentivized this game to the point of it being unfairly imbalanced. You shouldn't be that heavily rewarded for doing nothing more than I'm doing.
Dumbest thing I've ever read on a forum. In a game where you can balance everything at your whim, why would you go for something unfair? I understand life isn't fair. But a game, that should be fair. We have no control over some of the things that happen in life. But in a game where it's very easy to control things, I'd assume they'd strive for a balance of all the different people who want to play. I'm not going after people who want to play ladder I'm going after the devs absurd route of thought. Their train of thought boils down to this "They play Seasons, Give them cool new items first; because they are playing the right way and everyone else isn't" This is the wrong mentality. They need to be saying how can we make it as distributed as possible. In the beginning of RoS they had it somewhat decent. You either did bounties for a cache that could give a legendary, Did rifts to get blood shards to possibly get a legendary, or played through the entire campaign for a guaranteed legendary. There were three roads. You could get everything in each of the three roads. You didn't need to do one or the other there was a choice. After they buffed the rifts though, now it's all anyone cares about. Why play anything else if you have an extra 100% legendary drop rate? They're extending that with seasons now. Why play anything else when you get all the cool items first (At least a whole month) in season? It's about trying to create a balance, of which the D3 dev team is starting to stray away from. By yours and everyone else logic, there should be a super set of Hardcore only legendaries because they play in a highly competitive environment, with the risk of losing their character forever. And to take it further Season HC should have even cooler newer legendaries that even SC season players don't get because they have the ultimate competitive environment. But you don't see them doing that do you? Yeah... retarded. All we're asking is the devs to be fair since they have it 100% in their power to do so.
This is the mentality of the streaming community. Who cares if CotA runs are actually fun? Just do them because they're the best.
Why shouldn't everyone feel that their way of playing (again, within reason) is at least close to the "best" way to play? Why do there have to be such severe differences? If someone really enjoys bounties but doesn't love rifts so much, so they do 90% bounties and 10% rifts, why should they feel that they're getting fewer items than someone who is leeching T4+ RiF games?
Why shouldn't we want a game where there are more options for everyone so that they feel happy about their experience as opposed to a game where "go play something you don't really enjoy" is the predominant design philosophy?
Not a big fan of seasons unless they are going to last at least a year. I like the tiered rifts.
You're right, however. I mentioned earlier on in this thread that I would like to see ladder chars get wiped at the end of the season and all the loot be adopted over to non-lad. But then we run out of room in regard to stash.
It would seem a bit silly to have to delete chars over time as they are brought from lad to non-lad. Quite a few tough decisions to be made by the devs in this regard.
BurningRope#1322 (US~HC) Request an invite to the official (NA) <dfans> Clan
BurningRope#1322 (US~HC) Request an invite to the official (NA) <dfans> Clan
Let's use Heroic vs Normal raiding in WoW as an example. Heroic loot is 13 item levels better than Normal loot, typically. This has been established as an acceptable difference both to support the additional effort it takes to clear heroic content without making the people who aren't clearing it feel like they're an afterthought. Imagine if Blizzard scaled up that difference to 26 or 39 or 52 item levels. Do you think the casuals, who generally don't care about the fact that they don't have heroic loot, are going to accept that?
What I'm saying is that I don't care about "being behind" although I do take issue with some of the social-based farming methods that Blizzard seems not to care about making solo play feel punitive. But there's a level of "being behind" which most of us are willing to tolerate and past that line it does become something we're acutely aware of and dissatisfied with.
Makes sense, right?
Taking a scenario where casuals are ALREADY behind and throwing in another game mode which puts them further behind is toeing a line, as seen by the opinions in this topic. Clearly there are people who are OK with the level of "behindness" that exists in the current game. But clearly there are people who feel that ladder-only loot (even if it's rolled back into the non-ladder drop tables after the season ends) creates a level of "behindness" that's simply unjustified.
Diablo 3 cannot be competitive without Seasons. There needs to be a reset to bring everybody back to the starting line. At the end of the Season, all your newly found items and Paragon is added to your normal characters, so it is not lost.
So why Season only gear? Incentive. If there was no new loot, or if the loot was added to non-Season drops, nobody would play it.
So why can't you play Seasons? Because you don't want to start anew? Then don't. Otherwise, stop being a princess and jump on board. I cannot wait until Seasons is the 'real game' and what we have now is just an accumulation of Paragon/gold/items from everything we have done in our D3 career.
You're basically saying don't add any depth or complexity for the simple reason that us player's who can't play the game as much as others (bordering on majority) will not be able to keep up or enjoy the experience, or feel forced to make time to play it. In other words, (Blizzard forget about them, develop this game for ME), yet you try to say others are "Selfish/Ignorant"
And your argument seems to be founded on Heroic/Casual gamer in WoW being separated by ilvl is "13" then you I guess some how translate that into Blackthorn = 1 ilvl, Shard of Hate = 13 ilvl (even though both items are completely RNG and can be found by both types of players, you can farm torment 1 naked) -- Not the case in WoW and then you further go on to claim that Ladders/seasons will make this so called pseudo separation go from "13" to "60+" (even though the game is still based on RNG with easy access to said RNG Pool, and even though we don't even know how the loot will work, all based on your assumptions) either way the whole argument doesn't correlate from WoW to diablo, and just stems down to you either wanting people who can play 3-4+ a day to be handicapped, or you want loot to be easier for people with limited amount of time (Aka, the casual movement of Wotlk) ---
A CASUAL GAMER IN WOW GENERALLY SPEAKING BACK IN THE DAY ONLY CONSIDERED HAVING ACCESS TO "END-GAME" LOOT 1-4 MONTHS DOWN THE TRACK OF CONTENT RELEASE, DEPENDING ON LEVEL OF CASUAL/ RNG / OTHER WAITING FACTORS (WHICH YOU SEEM TO ACCEPT AS A 1:13 SEPARATION)
A CASUAL GAMER IN DIABLO IS EXPECTED (DEPENDING ON DURATION OF SEASONS) WE WOULD LIKE TO ASSUME 1-4 MONTHS IS ACTUALLY COINCIDENTALLY A FAIRLY GOOD SEASON DURATION (AT WHICH THE END OF SAID SEASON YOU WILL HAVE ACCESS TO THESE ITEMS WITHOUT TOUCHING SEASONS)
Your whole argument of saying ladders/seasons will make it too separated is false and misinformed #RNG
that's also assuming even at 2.1 you're still labouring under the delusion that in order to participate in season/ladders you must have no-life (could you be any more ignorant? lmao)
It seems like you're unwilling to compromise on any ground that may affect your mindset (because that's all it is) you could easily keep playing the game as you have been if you don't want to commit to seasons and accept that you only can commit certain amount of hours and you expect blizzard to progress their game to "YOUR" standards and demands/capabilties
It's very easy for you to sit there playing the victim, like people in your position have done for years, especially on WoW, but try thinking about players who want to see the Diablo franchise keep growing and exceed it's current lackluster mold, like iv'e said before, any addition to the game should be welcomed by all player's it might not immediately benefit you if you don't want to play in seasons or competitively, but it will inherently flow into all game modes and benefit all types of players in time, but you'd rather sit there naively sitting there with your head in the sand and cry about how bad it will affect you.... oh please.... harden the F up.
Shaggy ""The question they should be asking themselves is "how does this change make the game better for everyone?" Clearly it doesn't because, obviously, not everyone wants to be involved with ladders. I get that Blizzard wants to throw a bone to the 10hr/day no-lifers, but I think they can do that in a way that's less-detrimental to the rest of us who aren't "professional gamers." As been said a thousand times before: cosmetic rewards.""
You can easily participate in Seasons/Ladders without 10 hours a day to sink into Diablo 3 -- It's not about getting first. Someone will always be better than you. You can have a life, play a decent amount of time, and enjoy ladders/seasons (You can also not play them at all, and continue to play other area's of Diablo 3, or other games)
How does not adding any depth/complexity to the game benefit every one????? the crux of your arguments seems to be how 'detrimental' this will be to the game, when in truth, keeping the game in it's current state is what will be detrimental. There is only positives to take from all Ladder/seasons idea's flowing around Blizzard (from what we know)
Cosmetic rewards don't belong in Diablo, you trying to handi-cap rational and efficient gamers and the growth of Diablo 3 because you're too lazy to utilize your time ( Yes, that's right, you don't need a lot, not as much as you make out to be, typicalhypochondriac)
You say it's ignorant to insinuate that you can keep playing the game normally, yet, it's completely rational and considerate, what your view points and opinions are right?? classic case of don't want to put X effort to gain Y, but don't want Z to get Y.
your argument on this is also founded on a very naive assumption of how the legendary distribution system will work, already debunked your fear that it will be locked into season mode, as i predicted they plan to release them into the overall loot table, and seasons shouldn't be that long, so if you can't play that much the time should go relatively fast, and should keep that '1:13' separation ratio you like to use
Either way your pretty much just a guy sitting there saying, anything that doesn't agree with me is Ignorant, and everything I say is golden and should be listened to. /yawn
Dang I fed him, ohwell.... needed to be said
TL:DR Any addition to Diablo is much needed and should be welcomed by all players to embrace in a positive mindset, find the positive in the "personal drawback", stop being a whining blizzard pitchfork QQer, it's getting old