I think for both the GAH and the RMAH, the cost/benefit curve trundles along until it reaches a certain point where suddenly you're paying 10 times more money for a 20% more powerful item. That's the point where there still aren't that many people finding those items, so demand greately outstrips supply. Forunately, that point is slowly creeping upwards to its natural resting place, which is somewhere between 'can farm ActIII fairly comfortably' and 'Best in slot'.
Well that's sort of the issue a lot of demand for these "mediocre" items has slowed because people are getting passed that point or will just try to farm them on their own, and the better items are for the most part still too high so everyone is sort of stuck in this middle ground of not wanting to spend that much on a upgrade and the sellers are thinking "well this was worth 20million when I bought it, surely it will still sell for 8 million." and that's just not the case on a games launch when the economy is trying to settle. Until prices are gradually lowered to a point where the consumers are comfortable spending that amount of money again things aren't going to be that great.
In my experience prices aren't lower - item quality is higher. There's a difference. Reading through these pages, it seems that a (albeit brief) nostalgia for what things were worth have clouded people's judgement of their current value.
I have no problems whatsoever selling items in the 6-digit, 7-digit and 8-digit ranges. So long as you're competent and understand how to correctly price 4-6 affix items despite the 3-filter limit, you shouldn't have to relist often. I've only had to repost maybe 10% of my listings. The rest sells.
In the last few days I've sold two 30m items, four items in the teens and at least eight 6-8m items. The rest of my 10-slot listings are generally in the 100-500k range and turnover a couple times a day. I only mention this to illustrate things are selling at every player's economic level.
I save up an entire inventory (2.5 tabs plus my characters inventory = ~110 items) of 62 and 63 items before identifying them. This will generally result in 15 to 20 items that I think will sell. This causes a backup for my AH slots of a day at most. The throughput has remained steady in my experience.
I'd be more than happy to help people price their items if they're looking for some guidance. I've done some youtube videos this week and will continue to do more. I understand it's a little daunting at first, but the 'know how' will pay for itself if you dedicate a little time to learn the ins and outs of D3's economy. (GamingandTheory on youtube)
Well that's sort of the issue a lot of demand for these "mediocre" items has slowed because people are getting passed that point or will just try to farm them on their own, and the better items are for the most part still too high so everyone is sort of stuck in this middle ground of not wanting to spend that much on a upgrade and the sellers are thinking "well this was worth 20million when I bought it, surely it will still sell for 8 million." and that's just not the case on a games launch when the economy is trying to settle. Until prices are gradually lowered to a point where the consumers are comfortable spending that amount of money again things aren't going to be that great.
Frankly, I wouldn't go waiting on a "settled," economy to start spending gold or selling items you think might hold some value. Although I'm not sure if that's what you're suggesting, apologies if it isn't. The fact people can't update their sell orders or place buy orders as well as the 10 slot limit generates a fairly high degree of volatility to begin with. That on top of the fact we're awaiting a content patch means the likelyhood of more predictable values in the near future is slim.
As Aaron said above, average item quality on the AH is notably higher than it was. People are less likely to list things which are completely bereft of useful stats because a much larger portion of the player base is now smart enough not to buy them up; however, that doesn't mean the market for mid-range items is dead or dying. There are plenty of players out there gearing alts for act1/2 on a budget and the quality of items they are buying isn't terribly uncommon.
I usually do 1 full act2 run each time I log in and that nets me anywhere from 3 to 5 things I know will sell for the 10-100k range and another 1-3 that will probably sell for more. Every few days I'll find something worth more than that. When in doubt I will hold onto the item and check the AH for similar. I nearly scrapped a pair of nice cold-resist monk boots the other weekend because their AR roll was very low. They ended up selling for almost a mil.
Also keep in mind that crafting materials sell like hot-cakes. One full act2 clear can pull in almost half a million worth of that stuff if you're willing to pick up the ilvl 61+ blues and drop them in town. This makes full clears take longer, but it guarantees you a higher baseline profit without the occurrence of a lucky drop.
In my experience prices aren't lower - item quality is higher. There's a difference. Reading through these pages, it seems that a (albeit brief) nostalgia for what things were worth have clouded people's judgement of their current value.
I have no problems whatsoever selling items in the 6-digit, 7-digit and 8-digit ranges. So long as you're competent and understand how to correctly price 4-6 affix items despite the 3-filter limit, you shouldn't have to relist often. I've only had to repost maybe 10% of my listings. The rest sells.
In the last few days I've sold two 30m items, four items in the teens and at least eight 6-8m items. The rest of my 10-slot listings are generally in the 100-500k range and turnover a couple times a day. I only mention this to illustrate things are selling at every player's economic level.
I save up an entire inventory (2.5 tabs plus my characters inventory = ~110 items) of 62 and 63 items before identifying them. This will generally result in 15 to 20 items that I think will sell. This causes a backup for my AH slots of a day at most. The throughput has remained steady in my experience.
I'd be more than happy to help people price their items if they're looking for some guidance. I've done some youtube videos this week and will continue to do more. I understand it's a little daunting at first, but the 'know how' will pay for itself if you dedicate a little time to learn the ins and outs of D3's economy. (GamingandTheory on youtube)
Ding, bolded the truth. This is why the softcore market fluctuates so badly after release, or new content updates: the initial demand is far higher than supply, but as more and more items are introduced to the market, eventually the "average" item creeps higher and higher in quality. Remember, items never leave the pool in softcore. When someone is done using a quality item, they don't salvage it, they re-sell it. Comtrast this to hardcore where items are constantly being removed from the pool by player deaths.
Remember, items never leave the pool in softcore. When someone is done using a quality item, they don't salvage it, they re-sell it. Comtrast this to hardcore where items are constantly being removed from the pool by player deaths.
Or they stop playing altogether and leave the items on their characters? I have quite a few friends who did that..
Remember, items never leave the pool in softcore. When someone is done using a quality item, they don't salvage it, they re-sell it. Comtrast this to hardcore where items are constantly being removed from the pool by player deaths.
Or they stop playing altogether and leave the items on their characters? I have quite a few friends who did that..
Touche, although I think the number of items that effectively eliminates from the economy is fairly miniscule by comparison
I dont think that its dead I just think that its hard to sell the not so great items for 5-10mil like you used to be able to. Now the "decent" pieces are like 1-2mil most you can get but then its not very balanced because the "nice" pieces are like 50-100mil. Theres like next to no middle ground. get an ok piece, your lucky to sell it, want to really nice piece, well good luck unless you farm ALOT.
I dont think that its dead I just think that its hard to sell the not so great items for 5-10mil like you used to be able to. Now the "decent" pieces are like 1-2mil most you can get but then its not very balanced because the "nice" pieces are like 50-100mil. Theres like next to no middle ground. get an ok piece, your lucky to sell it, want to really nice piece, well good luck unless you farm ALOT.
It is only a matter of time until the gap closes though. There are no item sinks aside from player attrition, and with the option to liquidate, there's little reason to leave a significant portion of assets en situ. What is "really good," also shifts a bit based on flavor of the month. A few weeks ago I made 10mil on a really nice bow. Yesterday I found a bow with almost identical stats which sold for only 3mil, mostly because the bandwagon is now firmly hitched to the barb/ww train.
As with any marketplace, if you want to get the most for your currency, you have to either get ahead of demand or follow far enough behind it that you reap the benefit of re-sale. Too expensive to get tornado barb gear? Invest in another class. Chances are good their gear is experiencing a price drop since demand has shifted. If you miss the barb in a few weeks, chances are the herd will have moved on and you can pick up those nice barb upgrades for half what they are selling for today.
The few exceptions to the rule now are weapons and to a lesser extent amulets/rings (since crit dmg and LoH are hard to get anywhere else and they are very desirable stats); however, even those markets will hit saturation sooner or later.
it seems like stuff only sell if you undercut like 30% from the lowest price on a similar item. otherwise only the really good ones will sell and those are also really rare
Well the fact you have to undercut doesn't say much, aside from the fact the equilibrium value of that item is not being reflected by most auctions. You can still make quite a lot of gold consistently selling things for 700k rather than failing to sell them for 1m. Exceptionally good items are obviously going to have more arbitrary values, since they are much harder to come by, but as more of them become available they too will be picked over more carefully.
If you consider it from the point of view of the player: You are more likely to buy an upgrade if it is a BIG upgrade or the last upgrade you will want to make for a while in that slot. If you know you will need to make another purchase in the same slot before you start farming act3, then there is less incentive to drop a lot of gold there. Still, we know that many people are in the act1-3 area of development with their characters, so there will be a market for those mid-range items.
The early marketplace was more like a lottery than a true market. Supply was tiny, information about the goods was scarce, and demand was almost exponential. It was quite easy to pimp every decent-looking item as a boutique would an exclusive ware. Now players who want consistent business need to think less like a boutique and more like a wholesaler. The public is more educated, the supply is more in tune with demand, and now simply making a sale is a more important thing than getting perceived gold value for each and every item.
I'm still selling stuff...Actually I earn even more now than before.... I really try to put the prices down, let say 30-50% lower than the nearest stats found on AH. Day to day I still get around 1m-2m income from a combination of 100k to 800k items... and I only play act 1 with 331 mf, thats better than nothing, or just selling 5m stuff that don't sell.... But items which I think are really good, I put it in RMAH, sometimes they sell, sometimes they don't. But in the end, I guess it really depends on how you price it.....
I have no problems whatsoever selling items in the 6-digit, 7-digit and 8-digit ranges. So long as you're competent and understand how to correctly price 4-6 affix items despite the 3-filter limit, you shouldn't have to relist often. I've only had to repost maybe 10% of my listings. The rest sells.
In the last few days I've sold two 30m items, four items in the teens and at least eight 6-8m items. The rest of my 10-slot listings are generally in the 100-500k range and turnover a couple times a day. I only mention this to illustrate things are selling at every player's economic level.
I save up an entire inventory (2.5 tabs plus my characters inventory = ~110 items) of 62 and 63 items before identifying them. This will generally result in 15 to 20 items that I think will sell. This causes a backup for my AH slots of a day at most. The throughput has remained steady in my experience.
I'd be more than happy to help people price their items if they're looking for some guidance. I've done some youtube videos this week and will continue to do more. I understand it's a little daunting at first, but the 'know how' will pay for itself if you dedicate a little time to learn the ins and outs of D3's economy. (GamingandTheory on youtube)
Frankly, I wouldn't go waiting on a "settled," economy to start spending gold or selling items you think might hold some value. Although I'm not sure if that's what you're suggesting, apologies if it isn't. The fact people can't update their sell orders or place buy orders as well as the 10 slot limit generates a fairly high degree of volatility to begin with. That on top of the fact we're awaiting a content patch means the likelyhood of more predictable values in the near future is slim.
As Aaron said above, average item quality on the AH is notably higher than it was. People are less likely to list things which are completely bereft of useful stats because a much larger portion of the player base is now smart enough not to buy them up; however, that doesn't mean the market for mid-range items is dead or dying. There are plenty of players out there gearing alts for act1/2 on a budget and the quality of items they are buying isn't terribly uncommon.
I usually do 1 full act2 run each time I log in and that nets me anywhere from 3 to 5 things I know will sell for the 10-100k range and another 1-3 that will probably sell for more. Every few days I'll find something worth more than that. When in doubt I will hold onto the item and check the AH for similar. I nearly scrapped a pair of nice cold-resist monk boots the other weekend because their AR roll was very low. They ended up selling for almost a mil.
Also keep in mind that crafting materials sell like hot-cakes. One full act2 clear can pull in almost half a million worth of that stuff if you're willing to pick up the ilvl 61+ blues and drop them in town. This makes full clears take longer, but it guarantees you a higher baseline profit without the occurrence of a lucky drop.
http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/593/gahstillalive.jpg/
Just from today, and still more hours to go
Why did you cross out your purchased items?
Battle.net Profile / Diablo Progress Profile
Ding, bolded the truth. This is why the softcore market fluctuates so badly after release, or new content updates: the initial demand is far higher than supply, but as more and more items are introduced to the market, eventually the "average" item creeps higher and higher in quality. Remember, items never leave the pool in softcore. When someone is done using a quality item, they don't salvage it, they re-sell it. Comtrast this to hardcore where items are constantly being removed from the pool by player deaths.
The sales are more relevant
Touche, although I think the number of items that effectively eliminates from the economy is fairly miniscule by comparison
It is only a matter of time until the gap closes though. There are no item sinks aside from player attrition, and with the option to liquidate, there's little reason to leave a significant portion of assets en situ. What is "really good," also shifts a bit based on flavor of the month. A few weeks ago I made 10mil on a really nice bow. Yesterday I found a bow with almost identical stats which sold for only 3mil, mostly because the bandwagon is now firmly hitched to the barb/ww train.
As with any marketplace, if you want to get the most for your currency, you have to either get ahead of demand or follow far enough behind it that you reap the benefit of re-sale. Too expensive to get tornado barb gear? Invest in another class. Chances are good their gear is experiencing a price drop since demand has shifted. If you miss the barb in a few weeks, chances are the herd will have moved on and you can pick up those nice barb upgrades for half what they are selling for today.
The few exceptions to the rule now are weapons and to a lesser extent amulets/rings (since crit dmg and LoH are hard to get anywhere else and they are very desirable stats); however, even those markets will hit saturation sooner or later.
Well the fact you have to undercut doesn't say much, aside from the fact the equilibrium value of that item is not being reflected by most auctions. You can still make quite a lot of gold consistently selling things for 700k rather than failing to sell them for 1m. Exceptionally good items are obviously going to have more arbitrary values, since they are much harder to come by, but as more of them become available they too will be picked over more carefully.
If you consider it from the point of view of the player: You are more likely to buy an upgrade if it is a BIG upgrade or the last upgrade you will want to make for a while in that slot. If you know you will need to make another purchase in the same slot before you start farming act3, then there is less incentive to drop a lot of gold there. Still, we know that many people are in the act1-3 area of development with their characters, so there will be a market for those mid-range items.
The early marketplace was more like a lottery than a true market. Supply was tiny, information about the goods was scarce, and demand was almost exponential. It was quite easy to pimp every decent-looking item as a boutique would an exclusive ware. Now players who want consistent business need to think less like a boutique and more like a wholesaler. The public is more educated, the supply is more in tune with demand, and now simply making a sale is a more important thing than getting perceived gold value for each and every item.