1: rushing is lame BUT
2: people rush for a reason
What is the xp rate we are looking at in D3 ? there are less levels now, will it take the same amount of time to get to level 60 as it did to get to level 99 in D2?
I am a bit concerned now, I don't want to have to take an hour to level up, not until past level.... 44?
xp rate should be FAST.
especially at low levels, you should go from level 1-10 in a flash.
I used to think d2 exp was ok, but only when rushing, when you go to an area your ''supposed to be in'' the xp is painfully slow, starting at about level 16
if normal xp rate was higher I think less people would rush, I wouldn't spend 15 minutes trying to get into a cow run, if the xp from where I am supposed to be didnt take me an hour to level up.
then you have the other extreme, level 90s rushing you baal runs, and getting 2 levels in about 1 minute, that's just insane.
but like Jay said, thats friends helping friends, and thats a good thing,
but you shouldn't be boned if your NOT rushing, remember people this is a hack and slash rpg, not an MMO
as a noob I should level up and get new skill points before I even know wtf im doing with my current skills ( remember, your only going to have that problem once, at least per character)
we need to think of how we want the game to move in the long run, don't let your nub brain kick in and go, ACHK! the xp speed is too fast! I dont know what skills to get! slow down! etc etc
So lets hope they know what they are doing with that
You'll be at level 60 around the time that you beat the game on Hell difficulty, so there won't be the endgame grinding that you saw in D2. That being said, the D3 team has hinted at new plans for the endgame multiple times, so you won't be done when you hit 60, as there will still be ways to make your character better that just don't involve grinding for xp.
"So just to reiterate some things and maybe draw it back to more specific bullet points of why a lower level cap is (we believe) better for the game:
We want each level to feel like a significant boost in power. You can think of the amount of power a character gains through leveling as a bucket of orange soda, and each level as a glass. We have to have an end-point and so we can only scale player power to that point. By having fewer glasses they can be filled more, and each one has more delicious thirst-quenching orange soda. Spread that same bucket out over 99 or 200 glasses, and each level is less satisfying (if not downright unnoticeable).
We want level benefits to be as clear as possible. Some people have suggested "Well, let us hit level 60, but then keep giving us points after that." which isn't a solution, it's the same problem except worse because there's no actual tracking mechanism built in (ie levels). We also want to avoid providing level benefits at irregular intervals (although this may be unavoidable for trait points), as some people suggest "Let us level to 99 and just give us the rewards every few levels". This goes back to the first point: We want each level to feel like a significant boost in power. Trait points may not come every level, but the sum of the other increases from leveling, we feel, are still very significant and maintain our intent.
Because of the extreme leveling curve in Diablo II, balance really couldn't be adjusted around level 99 characters. This meant that the last 15 or so levels were not just minimal increases in power, but in most cases provided absolutely nothing to a characters ability to effectively complete Hell difficulty and get items, which did significantly improve their character. Instead, leveling to 99 became a status symbol more than anything.
We can have long term status symbols people can go for that are extremely visual, show to others the effort you've put in, but not attach that to something like a character level. Along with artisans, achievements, gems, runestones, and all the other various character customization progressions, we still have some surprises left in store on this front.
Balance isn't a main point for a tighter level system, but it is one side benefit. With the sum changes and improvements to all of the core designs, we believe that we can have a more reasonably challenging game throughout (as we can fairly clearly know how strong someone should be at any point in time) without attempting to create "challenge" through cheesy tactics.
The game paces out progression very well through all of the various customization systems, which are far more interesting and important to an end-game character, as opposed to chasing a number.
I'm sure I'm leaving out a good point or two. The real bottom line is that we understand people like having those long term goals, and those feel good to chase and eventually achieve, but we do not feel one needs to be character level, and in fact making character levels a long term goal brings a great many negative effects with them (keeping in mind our goals for how important each level should feel). We do not doubt that people will feel good about chasing the long term goals of building the perfect character, getting a playtime intensive achievement, leveling up an artisan to max, or any of the other many individual long term progression systems the game offers."
Is that a fact? Can you provide evidence? I can't seem to find any info on D3's ladder, or if there will even be one. I know how it is pre-launch.. you hear things in videos or read an article claiming something, then can't remember where you got the information, so I don't blame you if that's the case. Appreciate any help.
Is that a fact? Can you provide evidence? I can't seem to find any info on D3's ladder, or if there will even be one. I know how it is pre-launch.. you hear things in videos or read an article claiming something, then can't remember where you got the information, so I don't blame you if that's the case. Appreciate any help.
I'm pretty sure that's what they said during Blizzcon '09. I know for sure it's been said though. They may not have mentioned the word ladder specifically (so there may not even be one), but the point was that they were working on not having to reset the economy. So I guess I should've mentioned that I was speaking from the economical POV. They hadn't mentioned the arena at that point in time though so there may very well be a ladder (resetting or not) PvP-wise.
Anyhow, I'll do some google magic once I get off work. "Speaking" about this kinda made me want to see/hear what was said once again.
I don't recall exactly what was said, but I do know that they didn't deny the possibility for ladder/economy resets. They are indeed working on item/gold sinks to make the economy more balanced. If the economy ends up being broken after all they might have to resort to resets, even though they don't like it.
Thats why I was under the impression xp would be slow, 'because more increase in power per level'.
But this is very very good news!
As for the respecs, I thought I heard some where you will not get a full respec like in diablo 2, all stats/ skill points reset, But just some of the recent skills?
or is that old news?
either way I don't care, id love to start over and try different build of same character from scratch, the only reason to respec is if the skills arent balanced, which isnt going to be a problem in D3 ( * crosses fingers*)
Well they at least said that they would never delete your character for any reason, so that kinda goes against ladder resets. Although they could just make them non-ladder after a season. Either way, ladder resets are mainly to keep the economy in check, but if they can make an effective gold based economy that won't really be a problem.
I think D2 xp is fine except for the last 10 levels or so.
Imo the last levels should be alot harder to get... 2:00h to get a level is a good number when we are talking about the last 5 levels.
Imo the greatest advantage of this level cap is the possibility of increasing it on a expansion. Extra levels is a great way to refresh all characters you have build.
D3 1-60 is equal to D2 1-85. Less overall time is needed.
Players can respec a skill or two easily for a fee, much easier than rolling a new character from scratch. (also auto-added attributes means no mistakes there either)
No town portals for high levels to speed low levels through content. Low levels have to follow the high level and actually survive for it to work. So far it sounds like monsters will target the low level. It will probably be very tedious to get rushed.
I hope that there will be some serious challenges in the end game such as uber diablo. I'm still not sure what's going to keep things interesting in the late game, especially if there is no magic find.
Yea, the last time they addressed rushing they basically said they were fine with it as long as it didn't involve skipping content. So you'll still be able to make new characters quickly, but it won't involve just not playing huge sections of the game.
Playing D2 again recently I realized two things
1: rushing is lame BUT
2: people rush for a reason
What is the xp rate we are looking at in D3 ? there are less levels now, will it take the same amount of time to get to level 60 as it did to get to level 99 in D2?
I am a bit concerned now, I don't want to have to take an hour to level up, not until past level.... 44?
xp rate should be FAST.
especially at low levels, you should go from level 1-10 in a flash.
I used to think d2 exp was ok, but only when rushing, when you go to an area your ''supposed to be in'' the xp is painfully slow, starting at about level 16
if normal xp rate was higher I think less people would rush, I wouldn't spend 15 minutes trying to get into a cow run, if the xp from where I am supposed to be didnt take me an hour to level up.
then you have the other extreme, level 90s rushing you baal runs, and getting 2 levels in about 1 minute, that's just insane.
but like Jay said, thats friends helping friends, and thats a good thing,
but you shouldn't be boned if your NOT rushing, remember people this is a hack and slash rpg, not an MMO
as a noob I should level up and get new skill points before I even know wtf im doing with my current skills ( remember, your only going to have that problem once, at least per character)
we need to think of how we want the game to move in the long run, don't let your nub brain kick in and go, ACHK! the xp speed is too fast! I dont know what skills to get! slow down! etc etc
So lets hope they know what they are doing with that
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"So just to reiterate some things and maybe draw it back to more specific bullet points of why a lower level cap is (we believe) better for the game:
We want each level to feel like a significant boost in power. You can think of the amount of power a character gains through leveling as a bucket of orange soda, and each level as a glass. We have to have an end-point and so we can only scale player power to that point. By having fewer glasses they can be filled more, and each one has more delicious thirst-quenching orange soda. Spread that same bucket out over 99 or 200 glasses, and each level is less satisfying (if not downright unnoticeable).
We want level benefits to be as clear as possible. Some people have suggested "Well, let us hit level 60, but then keep giving us points after that." which isn't a solution, it's the same problem except worse because there's no actual tracking mechanism built in (ie levels). We also want to avoid providing level benefits at irregular intervals (although this may be unavoidable for trait points), as some people suggest "Let us level to 99 and just give us the rewards every few levels". This goes back to the first point: We want each level to feel like a significant boost in power. Trait points may not come every level, but the sum of the other increases from leveling, we feel, are still very significant and maintain our intent.
Because of the extreme leveling curve in Diablo II, balance really couldn't be adjusted around level 99 characters. This meant that the last 15 or so levels were not just minimal increases in power, but in most cases provided absolutely nothing to a characters ability to effectively complete Hell difficulty and get items, which did significantly improve their character. Instead, leveling to 99 became a status symbol more than anything.
We can have long term status symbols people can go for that are extremely visual, show to others the effort you've put in, but not attach that to something like a character level. Along with artisans, achievements, gems, runestones, and all the other various character customization progressions, we still have some surprises left in store on this front.
Balance isn't a main point for a tighter level system, but it is one side benefit. With the sum changes and improvements to all of the core designs, we believe that we can have a more reasonably challenging game throughout (as we can fairly clearly know how strong someone should be at any point in time) without attempting to create "challenge" through cheesy tactics.
The game paces out progression very well through all of the various customization systems, which are far more interesting and important to an end-game character, as opposed to chasing a number.
I'm sure I'm leaving out a good point or two. The real bottom line is that we understand people like having those long term goals, and those feel good to chase and eventually achieve, but we do not feel one needs to be character level, and in fact making character levels a long term goal brings a great many negative effects with them (keeping in mind our goals for how important each level should feel). We do not doubt that people will feel good about chasing the long term goals of building the perfect character, getting a playtime intensive achievement, leveling up an artisan to max, or any of the other many individual long term progression systems the game offers."
Is that a fact? Can you provide evidence? I can't seem to find any info on D3's ladder, or if there will even be one. I know how it is pre-launch.. you hear things in videos or read an article claiming something, then can't remember where you got the information, so I don't blame you if that's the case. Appreciate any help.
I don't recall exactly what was said, but I do know that they didn't deny the possibility for ladder/economy resets. They are indeed working on item/gold sinks to make the economy more balanced. If the economy ends up being broken after all they might have to resort to resets, even though they don't like it.
Join the chat!
But this is very very good news!
As for the respecs, I thought I heard some where you will not get a full respec like in diablo 2, all stats/ skill points reset, But just some of the recent skills?
or is that old news?
either way I don't care, id love to start over and try different build of same character from scratch, the only reason to respec is if the skills arent balanced, which isnt going to be a problem in D3 ( * crosses fingers*)
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Imo the last levels should be alot harder to get... 2:00h to get a level is a good number when we are talking about the last 5 levels.
Imo the greatest advantage of this level cap is the possibility of increasing it on a expansion. Extra levels is a great way to refresh all characters you have build.
Find any Diablo news? Contact me or anyone else on the news team.
DiabloFans: Facebook, Twitter, YouTube, Live Chat