- A patch that changes an ability, no matter how small, should reset a characters abilities. They do that in WoW (atleast on big changes) and that's really good.
If they did that, and removed a meaningful respec mechanic, people would do the following:
- Fuck up their character
- Give up playing for until they release a big patch (which may not even happen)
If there wasn't for rushing in D2, people would have just given up on the whole game a long time ago... It's either rushing or limited respecs. I vote respecs.
Respecs should be in the game, as long as there is a good balance. WoW respecs was nice because if you respeced too often then the price got really high. I think a cool idea would be if respecs were based on the skill Tiers.
For example if you have a character that is just getting into Tier 3 skills and you mess up a skill point you should be able to just reset that entire tiers worth of skill points used. If you want to go back and respec Tier 2 as well it will cost you extra gold than at Tier 3 and even more gold at Tier 1. This basically makes it so that if you have a full level character you can respec your late tier talents rather cheaply but if you want to reset all of your talents it is going to cost you big time.
This also allows you to repsec while you level and allows you to try new spells/talents out without a full respec.
The problem with the WoW way was the price of respec didn't KEEP going higher. So people would just gladly pay 40g each time they wanted to PvP or raid.
The problem with the WoW way was the price of respec didn't KEEP going higher. So people would just gladly pay 40g each time they wanted to PvP or raid.
Well the thing about WoW is that you had two completely different game styles, PVP and Raiding, in which your specs drastically changed how well you performed in each. I dont see this as being much of the case in Diablo 3. Your build is going to be pretty much the same for PVP and for PVE. The 40g( or whatever the number is now) is/was a good stopping point because certain classes really needed to respec in order to pvp well, and then they needed to respec in order to PVE/raid well.
If you think about it, during WoW's first year out that was a really tough price to meet. Most gold came from raiding/selling stuff on auction house. Not like it is today with all the daily quests. If you respec 2 times a week thats 80g a week, not only that but repairs/pots/and anything else you might need to spend gold on for raiding/pvp.
If the gold economy is balanced just right then you wont have people respecing like crazy. You are right in the fact that today the WoW respec price needs to go up. Especially since there are easier ways to get gold. But if you look back on WoW it was a perfect idea and balance. It is just out-dated.
I realize it was needed but I know people who would respec up to 3-4 times a day between raiding and PvPing. Which is just silly. It kind of defeats the purpose of having skill trees.
I think in D3 respec should be limited to once every 3 days or something and have a increasing fee like WoW so that low levels can do it for semi cheap but the more people use and abuse it it will go up.
I'm usually humble about my personal contributions, but I believe my respec idea is pure genius. The idea could be tweaked to perfection in beta. It's a simple and easy way to limit respecs to 1 per 10 levels so that instace based respecs could not be used effectively. Remember, "Occam's razor makes the cutting clean".
I'm usually humble about my personal contributions, but I believe my respec idea is pure genius. The idea could be tweaked to perfection in beta. It's a simple and easy way to limit respecs to 1 per 10 levels so that instace based respecs could not be used effectively. Remember, "Occam's razor makes the cutting clean".
Unfortunately, I disagree with a limit on the number of respecs. I've said this before, and it bears repeating. I'm the kind of person (and I know a number of people like me) who enjoy these games for the build creation process. Testing new builds, creating something entirely new, something entirely bass ackwards from the norm to create an interesting character to see if it's viable. We did this in Guild Wars, we did this in Diablo 2, and we did this in WoW.
But to get to the point, herein lies the problem: When a character gets to maximum level, based on the idea of "1 respec in 10 levels", they can respec 9 or 10 times (depending on max level). That limit on respecs will force players to, after exhausting their respecs to create new characters... the same exact character, and start again. On the same token, say a player makes it to 42 and exhausts their respecs... and horribly messes up again. These create problems with people who don't want to have to level yet another character every time they exhaust their respecs. Now, I'm not advocating free respecs, or cheap respecs.... I vote an increase in price per level and per respec... and limiting the respecs in a single room to once per. Respecs should have a price... but limiting the amount of respecs on a character basis I feel will just turn people away from the game the same way no respecs did. People just don't want to level a character every time.
That's my 2gp anyway
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Unfortunately, I disagree with a limit on the number of respecs. I've said this before, and it bears repeating. I'm the kind of person (and I know a number of people like me) who enjoy these games for the build creation process. Testing new builds, creating something entirely new, something entirely bass ackwards from the norm to create an interesting character to see if it's viable. We did this in Guild Wars, we did this in Diablo 2, and we did this in WoW.
But to get to the point, herein lies the problem: When a character gets to maximum level, based on the idea of "1 respec in 10 levels", they can respec 9 or 10 times (depending on max level). That limit on respecs will force players to, after exhausting their respecs to create new characters... the same exact character, and start again. On the same token, say a player makes it to 42 and exhausts their respecs... and horribly messes up again. These create problems with people who don't want to have to level yet another character every time they exhaust their respecs. Now, I'm not advocating free respecs, or cheap respecs.... I vote an increase in price per level and per respec... and limiting the respecs in a single room to once per. Respecs should have a price... but limiting the amount of respecs on a character basis I feel will just turn people away from the game the same way no respecs did. People just don't want to level a character every time.
That's my 2gp anyway
The only limitation would be the amount of gold you have. You couldn't run out of respecs. Also it encourages people to make it to level 90 so that they can have more respecs on their next character by simply transfering the gold. Some people won't care about respecs and just spend their money on other gold sinks. Some people will sacrifice good items for gold find items so that they can respec more.
I thought of a flaw in my design, if you have a character that is level 99 killing monsters in act 1 normal, then they could gold farm much faster. A simple way to fix this would be to implement a system that resets the gold drop rate for an act to an apropriate level after it is completed.
The only limitation would be the amount of gold you have. You couldn't run out of respecs. Also it encourages people to make it to level 90 so that they can have more respecs on their next character by simply transfering the gold. Some people won't care about respecs and just spend their money on other gold sinks. Some people will sacrifice good items for gold find items so that they can respec more.
That is if Gold Find is applicable in D3. I don't think they'll make it as prominent if bring it back at all for the pure sake of making Gold the standard for trading.
I thought of a flaw in my design, if you have a character that is level 99 killing monsters in act 1 normal, then they could gold farm much faster. A simple way to fix this would be to implement a system that resets the gold drop rate for an act to an apropriate level after it is completed.
That's an all around good idea. I think the same should go with Magic Find, to a certain degree. Not bringing back Magic Find would cripple what Diablo 3 brings to the table (I'm very accepting of these new mechanics... but Magic Find as a stat is a must due to the basic item priority brought about by the game itself).
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@Daemaro; @Lachdonan:
Its 50g not 40g per respec. Always been like that. Going back and forth before and after the raid costs 100g. You could afford that if you played 18 hours a day.
@Daemaro; @Lachdonan:
Its 50g not 40g per respec. Always been like that. Going back and forth before and after the raid costs 100g. You could afford that if you played 18 hours a day.
Well, now-a-days you could do that in a few hours of just doing Sunwell dailies.... but this is where Blizzard should change their economics to meet with the inflation of the value of Gold.
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------------------------------------------- Those who stand for nothing will fall for anything.
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Well respecs are most likely going to be in the game anyway. I don't really feel like I NEED them though it'd be nice on some occasions.
I just hope they do put some sort of limitation on it, I don't want it to end up like WoW where you can just respec 10 times in one day if you have the money, just to suit whatever personal needs you want. It makes characters that should excel in certain places, excel in all places.
Like with a druid on WoW you can be DPS, Healer, or Tank, all you need is a little gear and some gold to respec. It makes things a lot less unique. Like I said, I know people that respec 2-3 times a day to PvP/Raid.
In D3 we don't have these Tank/Healer/DPS classes and builds but I'm sure we will have certain builds that are better for PvP and some better for solo and some better for party PvM, and if people can just switch between any of those on a whim, it's going to make things kind of boring to me.
I like the idea of Respecs, believe it or not. Mainly, i like to try new builds, a lot. Those who are familiar with my HC uswest clan (CgB) know we like to use creative and different builds. What i don't like is wasting time and space building a character to a certain level just to test a build. Also, the process of leveling has degenerated a lot online.
Allowing Respec would drastically reduce: muling, rushing, grushing, 'baalbots', as well as encouraging diversity and less 'wasted items'. What i mean is this; i have many mules with items like two Jade Talon (2/2/230+/45+) collecting dust because i just don't want to go through the effort of leveling an assassin to 66 to use the damn things. We know the respec won't be without a hefty penalty, but it would save me a SHITLOAD of time doing things i'd rather not.
Also, it allows me the ability to test new things, and experiment with builds legally (i don't use 3rd party programs) which is great. I don't want to risk downloading a virus, causing a computer crash, wasting time leveling, all for the effort of testing a new build. I can go "hey, i got this great idea for a build. Grab your Wizard!"
You can use an editor (singleplayer) to "test things". Hell, half of the "testing" can be done on paper just by making some easy calculations. Its a lame excuse in favor of making the game essentially boring and partly pointless via allowing respecs.
If that's the case, then just give unlimited respecs in single player. There is no need to bring 3rd party hacking programs into a great game. I don't think just having a talent calculator is good enough... because numbers really don't mean anything. I could sit around on WoWhead making specs all day, but without actually testing them in real-time in an actual environment, the spec could be just as easily moot.
I know I bring up Guild Wars a lot, but for good reason. Go to the GW build wikis. There are, at any given time, over 500 builds... each equally as viable as the next. That's what I'd like to see in the Diablo universe. I would love to see more builds that are equally as powerful and useful as the rest. I won't want to have to resort to one or two specs that hands down make the game easy-mode like it currently is (Same problem WoW has as far as talents).
Being a different build that I can make work is far more valuable to me than just having the gear and talents that everyone else has. I've contributed 50+ builds to PvXwiki, each of them unique builds that I've made work due to my play-style and synergy between skills. Albeit strange in first look... but that's what I'm talking about.
On the same token, though, I don't want Diablo 3 to copy Guild Wars' skill system. If I wanted that, I'd just go play Guild Wars and watch trailers of Diablo 3. I just would like to see more variety in viable builds, and the ability to test these builds out to see what's right for me without having to painstakenly grind every time I want to test a new one out, without having to resort to 3rd party methods.
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I think they should remove the respec system. Sure it may sound like a cool feature but in my opinion a lot of the fun of d2 was coming up with new build theorys and trying them out. Sometimes you have success and other times complete failure... it's a learning process. Also there will be no pointing in having multiple characters of the same class with different builds. With the respec system all you will have to do is get different gears sets and respec when you want to try a new playstyle. lame :mad:
Pros
Saves you time
Keeps your from screwing up a char
Cons
Reduces replay value
Cookie cutter builds
I guess I understand where you're coming from, but, for starters, your point about some of the fun being in coming up with new build theories and trying them out... to me, this likely half the reason respecs are being implemented!
If you have an idea about a build, but you're already done leveling and have a different build, respec to the build you're thinking about and boom you can try it out without having to level all over again.
Also, in regards to your point about the respec system making it so that all you have to do is get new gear and change your playstyle via respec - I don't see how this is any different from current D2.
Are you trying to say that making a new character and then getting it rushed through the game adds a level of excitement? I can change a few words in your last sentence and it will still make complete sense.
With current diablo 2 all you have to do is get different gears sets and beg for a grush when you want to try a new playstyle. lame :mad:
- Fuck up their character
- Give up playing for until they release a big patch (which may not even happen)
If there wasn't for rushing in D2, people would have just given up on the whole game a long time ago... It's either rushing or limited respecs. I vote respecs.
For example if you have a character that is just getting into Tier 3 skills and you mess up a skill point you should be able to just reset that entire tiers worth of skill points used. If you want to go back and respec Tier 2 as well it will cost you extra gold than at Tier 3 and even more gold at Tier 1. This basically makes it so that if you have a full level character you can respec your late tier talents rather cheaply but if you want to reset all of your talents it is going to cost you big time.
This also allows you to repsec while you level and allows you to try new spells/talents out without a full respec.
Well the thing about WoW is that you had two completely different game styles, PVP and Raiding, in which your specs drastically changed how well you performed in each. I dont see this as being much of the case in Diablo 3. Your build is going to be pretty much the same for PVP and for PVE. The 40g( or whatever the number is now) is/was a good stopping point because certain classes really needed to respec in order to pvp well, and then they needed to respec in order to PVE/raid well.
If you think about it, during WoW's first year out that was a really tough price to meet. Most gold came from raiding/selling stuff on auction house. Not like it is today with all the daily quests. If you respec 2 times a week thats 80g a week, not only that but repairs/pots/and anything else you might need to spend gold on for raiding/pvp.
If the gold economy is balanced just right then you wont have people respecing like crazy. You are right in the fact that today the WoW respec price needs to go up. Especially since there are easier ways to get gold. But if you look back on WoW it was a perfect idea and balance. It is just out-dated.
I think in D3 respec should be limited to once every 3 days or something and have a increasing fee like WoW so that low levels can do it for semi cheap but the more people use and abuse it it will go up.
Fuck you, I'm a dragon.
Unfortunately, I disagree with a limit on the number of respecs. I've said this before, and it bears repeating. I'm the kind of person (and I know a number of people like me) who enjoy these games for the build creation process. Testing new builds, creating something entirely new, something entirely bass ackwards from the norm to create an interesting character to see if it's viable. We did this in Guild Wars, we did this in Diablo 2, and we did this in WoW.
But to get to the point, herein lies the problem: When a character gets to maximum level, based on the idea of "1 respec in 10 levels", they can respec 9 or 10 times (depending on max level). That limit on respecs will force players to, after exhausting their respecs to create new characters... the same exact character, and start again. On the same token, say a player makes it to 42 and exhausts their respecs... and horribly messes up again. These create problems with people who don't want to have to level yet another character every time they exhaust their respecs. Now, I'm not advocating free respecs, or cheap respecs.... I vote an increase in price per level and per respec... and limiting the respecs in a single room to once per. Respecs should have a price... but limiting the amount of respecs on a character basis I feel will just turn people away from the game the same way no respecs did. People just don't want to level a character every time.
That's my 2gp anyway
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Those who stand for nothing will fall for anything.
-------------------------------------------
I thought of a flaw in my design, if you have a character that is level 99 killing monsters in act 1 normal, then they could gold farm much faster. A simple way to fix this would be to implement a system that resets the gold drop rate for an act to an apropriate level after it is completed.
Fuck you, I'm a dragon.
That is if Gold Find is applicable in D3. I don't think they'll make it as prominent if bring it back at all for the pure sake of making Gold the standard for trading.
That's an all around good idea. I think the same should go with Magic Find, to a certain degree. Not bringing back Magic Find would cripple what Diablo 3 brings to the table (I'm very accepting of these new mechanics... but Magic Find as a stat is a must due to the basic item priority brought about by the game itself).
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Those who stand for nothing will fall for anything.
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Its 50g not 40g per respec. Always been like that. Going back and forth before and after the raid costs 100g. You could afford that if you played 18 hours a day.
Well, now-a-days you could do that in a few hours of just doing Sunwell dailies.... but this is where Blizzard should change their economics to meet with the inflation of the value of Gold.
-------------------------------------------
Those who stand for nothing will fall for anything.
-------------------------------------------
I just hope they do put some sort of limitation on it, I don't want it to end up like WoW where you can just respec 10 times in one day if you have the money, just to suit whatever personal needs you want. It makes characters that should excel in certain places, excel in all places.
Like with a druid on WoW you can be DPS, Healer, or Tank, all you need is a little gear and some gold to respec. It makes things a lot less unique. Like I said, I know people that respec 2-3 times a day to PvP/Raid.
In D3 we don't have these Tank/Healer/DPS classes and builds but I'm sure we will have certain builds that are better for PvP and some better for solo and some better for party PvM, and if people can just switch between any of those on a whim, it's going to make things kind of boring to me.
Remove Teky.
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Allowing Respec would drastically reduce: muling, rushing, grushing, 'baalbots', as well as encouraging diversity and less 'wasted items'. What i mean is this; i have many mules with items like two Jade Talon (2/2/230+/45+) collecting dust because i just don't want to go through the effort of leveling an assassin to 66 to use the damn things. We know the respec won't be without a hefty penalty, but it would save me a SHITLOAD of time doing things i'd rather not.
Also, it allows me the ability to test new things, and experiment with builds legally (i don't use 3rd party programs) which is great. I don't want to risk downloading a virus, causing a computer crash, wasting time leveling, all for the effort of testing a new build. I can go "hey, i got this great idea for a build. Grab your Wizard!"
If that's the case, then just give unlimited respecs in single player. There is no need to bring 3rd party hacking programs into a great game. I don't think just having a talent calculator is good enough... because numbers really don't mean anything. I could sit around on WoWhead making specs all day, but without actually testing them in real-time in an actual environment, the spec could be just as easily moot.
I know I bring up Guild Wars a lot, but for good reason. Go to the GW build wikis. There are, at any given time, over 500 builds... each equally as viable as the next. That's what I'd like to see in the Diablo universe. I would love to see more builds that are equally as powerful and useful as the rest. I won't want to have to resort to one or two specs that hands down make the game easy-mode like it currently is (Same problem WoW has as far as talents).
Being a different build that I can make work is far more valuable to me than just having the gear and talents that everyone else has. I've contributed 50+ builds to PvXwiki, each of them unique builds that I've made work due to my play-style and synergy between skills. Albeit strange in first look... but that's what I'm talking about.
On the same token, though, I don't want Diablo 3 to copy Guild Wars' skill system. If I wanted that, I'd just go play Guild Wars and watch trailers of Diablo 3. I just would like to see more variety in viable builds, and the ability to test these builds out to see what's right for me without having to painstakenly grind every time I want to test a new one out, without having to resort to 3rd party methods.
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Those who stand for nothing will fall for anything.
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I guess I understand where you're coming from, but, for starters, your point about some of the fun being in coming up with new build theories and trying them out... to me, this likely half the reason respecs are being implemented!
If you have an idea about a build, but you're already done leveling and have a different build, respec to the build you're thinking about and boom you can try it out without having to level all over again.
Also, in regards to your point about the respec system making it so that all you have to do is get new gear and change your playstyle via respec - I don't see how this is any different from current D2.
Are you trying to say that making a new character and then getting it rushed through the game adds a level of excitement? I can change a few words in your last sentence and it will still make complete sense.
With current diablo 2 all you have to do is get different gears sets and beg for a grush when you want to try a new playstyle. lame :mad:
Blizzard - No!
Me - Hahaha