No, i dont. Many of the changes are very welcome, especially those concerning PvP. When i was playing Diablo online (especially on Hardcore) i wanted to focus on the demons, not some random f*cker who'd simply hostile and hit me while i'm low on life. Where's the glory in that? If you want to consider yourself good in PvP, try to fight someone fair. One on One. Thats how the big boys know they're big in PvP.
The other stuff you mention (excluding graphics) are mostly to make it harder. Players in Diablo 2 were impossible to kill by monsters with all the life leech and potions.
Having to get your corpse wasnt as good either, running around naked because your equipment was in the middle of the monsters that killed you... nah, not that good.
One solution to the problem is by adding monster health regen.
Monster health regeneration might not work if there are other players within the same dungeon who haven't yet died. This could become an exploitable element of the game, whereby one player stays alive and hides in a corner while the other player lowers their health little by little.
Then again, it all depends on how the health regen mechanic works. If it works like it did in Diablo II, in that monsters a certain distance away from the character regen their health, then it'll solve the issue.
Another way would be to add a temporary experience and loot penalty that lasts for a period of time or for a certain amount of experience. That is to say, the next ten monsters that the player kills will provide reduced experience (due to the exp penalty) and have a lower chance to drop good loot.
this diablo is just much of an other Diablo than the D2 I know.
and to to tell u the truth for me its no more fun to read the news.
at the beginning I felt like: " ohh, okay some new features, yeah okay, no potions, okay come on I´ll be able to live without that, new graphics, yeah hate them but gameplay > graphics"
but now it´s more like: "come on, stop changing things, fu*king STOP!"
where will be the 'pk time' I loved so much? where is the fear of losing in pvp duell?
(u wont to have pick up your body, so it´s more like: "ahh, no problem, I´ll just fight him again", what I want is more like: if u lose, then U LOSE! u have to get past the enemy to get your body back, struggling through your way)
come on blizzard to tell u the truth, for someone like me who played 5years diablo in a extreme way (to bad I didn´t count my playtime) pvp,pvm, hc,ladder....ALLL!
I tell u one thing, your Diablo 3 at it´s current state: isn´t fun!
last chance blizzard: make a proper PVP system
do u guys fell the same?
Ive been playing Diablo for eight years. The game sounds fun to me. You have to let go of the old style and adapt to this new one. Like goin from D1 to D2. there was alot of change now were going from d2 to d3 theres going to be change. Live with it. (I dont get your PvP method did you nk after you killed them are what. When dueling you should let them get there body back.) And you havent even played Diablo3 so dont lie to yourself saying it isn't fun! Play it and you will realize that IT IS FUN!!!
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I don't think that by ultra-speed-hack'n'slash they necessarily mean to go through the game in an hour and being constantly killing monsters. It just means that we'll be spending more time out of town crawling dungeons, and that the time spent in town will simply be of better quality (as I assume NPCs will be more interesting this time around).
I agree with you phex about the pvp thing and having to run to your body after you lose. But I feel the lack of tps will aid pvp in every way possible. If you like pvp as much as you claim and want to kill people then you will see this as a sign that kids will no longer be able to run to town and hide in there for 10 minutes to avoid you killing them. This just leaves them out in the wilderness to be dismantled however you please. Prob one of the first good ideas I have seen come out of the people from WoW.
I just finished the non-expansion portion of TQ and would tend to agree with the you. I enjoyed the checkpoints, but sometimes I missed parts of the game barreling past scores of enemies just to find the next one. I admit D2s system was flawed in that every so often the player builds up a sense of indestructability and forgets to put a portal down just in case he does fall, potentially leaving him stranded in town. It will be interesting to see where this goes though.
This sounds great! It will help cure some of [what I consider] the games problems. This kindly reduces rushing and "Sorc you go tele to Baal and open a tp!" slacking. It will get people playing more together and develop a real sense of earnest amongst players.
Just try to think about the only times you ever really "partied up", Act 2 & Act 3 (before we found out about killing the Council and tp'ing to Meph), because in those acts you had to collect stuff in order to advance, even a lvl 99 still had to collect the pieces.
I still think that a death (especially on a higher difficulty) deserves a loss of experience. But this depends on how far the checkpoints are going to be placed under the new system, because if it takes you a couple of minutes to get back to the action, then you have (in a sense) lost experience. I hope that the body system is still in effect, when you die you drop your corpse, but I don't know how that will work with the new system, because it may be tough to get back to your body if the checkpoints are widely spread.
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_______________________________________________________________________ ____________If the best things in life are free... then Diablo 3 will be free!____________
Well honestly I doubt Blizz is going "ok look this is how they do it in TQ so lets go for that". But if you use logic you'll probably realize that the folks at blizz making games are also gamers themselves first and foremost so yeah once again it's very probable that they will be thinking " oh yeah I tried that once in this game and I thought it was a successful feature in comparison to this and that" . And TQ being a product of years of game development themselves. So I think it's pointless to be saying "well your starting to look more and more like this game" just because some of the underlying features have the same system type. Then you might as well be pointing the finger at every RTS/FPS/RPG games ever developed that feel like one another with similar features.
Honestly I really don't agree with most of you guys on the "no bodies no pk fun" train of thoughts.
It's rediculous to think that having to run for your body would have anything to do with the PK part of the game. Unless your the type of guy that got a thrill from getting your ass handed to you and having to run like a moron to get your body back while dodging guided arrows. If you are then go play D2 cuz there's plenty of that still going on. However for more strategical type people and especially competitive players, I strongly believe that a reward/betting system for duel matches is a good idea that was pointed out many times before and would surely add to the PK interest factor, along with a good ranking system on Bnet.
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[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]Diablo 3, Hottest shit to happen to 21st Century Entertainment since Georges "Rush" St-Pierre.______________ --------~~Mattheo's Quote of the day~~---------
----------Brought to you by Diablofans.com Forums -------- Originally Posted by mattheo_majik
I LOVE being a SEX TON!!!
I like the idea of having to fight through a wall of monsters to make you way to the next checkpoint and return to town. This system will also force you to pretty much clear the areas as you go through them. Otherwise, the monsters you leave behind will kill you after you respawn with low health.
Being out of town for longer periods will also increase the value of identify scrolls, which became near useless after rescuing Cain in Diablo 2.
The Titan Quest rebirth fountain system is very similar to the checkpoint system found in old games from before computers had enough memory to store autosaves, quicksaves, or waypoints like we know them today.
I bought Abe's Oddysee on steam a while ago, and that game implements a "diamond," or checkpoint, system in which your progress is saved every few screens or so. Depending on the frequency of the checkpoints, this can be similar to autosave. It appears that is what Blizzard is going for, probably in addition to some variation of the traditional waypoints and town portals.
I like this mechanic because, IMO, all games should have quicksave or at the very least, autosave. It's just annoying having to re-walk areas you completed before, especially since the monsters will remain dead.
Keeping track of how many times you have died can kind of be an incentive to not want to die, if only for bragging rights. Adding some form of "fatigue" or exp and loot penalty for a few minutes after death is another option. And the incentive for not dying in HC is obvious.
Well that was a rather long first post. I've been reading the forum since the announcement, but felt like posting on this topic since it's an aspect of game design I think about a lot.
I like the idea of not spawning in town. there has been no mention of the town portals thus far so it feels like a lot of people are reading more into what he has said than is necessary. They are trying to get people more involved into the game, and less into the tedious running back from town if you die. The town portals will be announced later on in development, but as i see it, i like them with no restrictions, but if they put restrictions on them it may make the game worth playing longer.
Simply put I think TP's are just like any other part of this game, they just need to be controlled and made so as to prevent abuse. I think this time around Blizz really got down to game mechanics that should be tweaked in order to greatly improve gameplay instead of trying to just blowout on graphics and new stuff.
I mean they already had an amazing game with D1 and D2, with incredible concepts that were either underdeveloped or out of control and abused. Going back to rethink these features and improving them, will go a great way into making us feel like this is a Diablo game instead of only changing everything or replacing it, definately is the smart way to go.
The TP has always been a great concept that endless games copied but haven't really perfected yet so I believe that if they find a way to limit the time/areas that the player is able to use it in than it could be a good factor into spycing up D3. Just as simple as that.
The rushing of D2 and D1 wasn't due to the fact that they could TP from everywhere, but rather the lack of restrictions on Quest/Area in accordance to Char LvL. If you think about it, not being able to TP wouldnt of stopped people from Rushing since they would of simply had to clear a trail to the end boss for the low lvls. Yeah it would of been longer but that's not a big deal. TP isnt at all the root of the Rushing problem.
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[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]Diablo 3, Hottest shit to happen to 21st Century Entertainment since Georges "Rush" St-Pierre.______________ --------~~Mattheo's Quote of the day~~---------
----------Brought to you by Diablofans.com Forums -------- Originally Posted by mattheo_majik
I LOVE being a SEX TON!!!
IMO the game should have autosave (checkpoints), waypoints, and TP scrolls! Anything that allows people to get back to the portion of the game they still haven't completed before as quickly and easily as possible. Death penalties and other mechanics should take care of the avoidance of death and increase the difficulty. Forcing people to redo parts of the game they're done with does not increase the "difficulty," only frustration.
TP scrolls should be on a cooldown like some people said, but they shouldn't be the only way to get back to an area, otherwise players will end up sitting around waiting for the cooldown to finish before attempting a difficult boss fight. Having them be non-combat is probably the best solution.
Contrary to my last reply in favour of the new death [checkpoint-based] mechanic. I wanted to reply with the negatives that I can think about it.
1) I can see alot of the Diablo bullies trapping checkpoints with enemies as a new pastime
2) If your fighting tough enemies you can wear them down by attacking in between deaths (respawn, attack, respawn, rinse, repeat) until you kill them.
The could easily remedy this by creating checkpoint zones, so that you don't always re-spawn in the exact same spot.
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_______________________________________________________________________ ____________If the best things in life are free... then Diablo 3 will be free!____________
Being out of town for longer periods will also increase the value of identify scrolls, which became near useless after rescuing Cain in Diablo 2.
The Titan Quest rebirth fountain system is very similar to the checkpoint system found in old games from before computers had enough memory to store autosaves, quicksaves, or waypoints like we know them today.
I bought Abe's Oddysee on steam a while ago, and that game implements a "diamond," or checkpoint, system in which your progress is saved every few screens or so. Depending on the frequency of the checkpoints, this can be similar to autosave. It appears that is what Blizzard is going for, probably in addition to some variation of the traditional waypoints and town portals.
I like this mechanic because, IMO, all games should have quicksave or at the very least, autosave. It's just annoying having to re-walk areas you completed before, especially since the monsters will remain dead.
Keeping track of how many times you have died can kind of be an incentive to not want to die, if only for bragging rights. Adding some form of "fatigue" or exp and loot penalty for a few minutes after death is another option. And the incentive for not dying in HC is obvious.
Well that was a rather long first post. I've been reading the forum since the announcement, but felt like posting on this topic since it's an aspect of game design I think about a lot.
As opposed to a full-blown auto-save, I think a checkpoint system should only be in effect during the active game, checkpoints should be temporary, with waypoints permanent
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_______________________________________________________________________ ____________If the best things in life are free... then Diablo 3 will be free!____________
As opposed to a full-blown auto-save, I think a checkpoint system should only be in effect during the active game, checkpoints should be temporary, with waypoints permanent
I second that.
Cain uses a TP in gameplay vid.
C'mon ppl, if they don't mention the tp in an interview it means nothing.
TP's will probably now just have a cool-off attribute, is all.
The other stuff you mention (excluding graphics) are mostly to make it harder. Players in Diablo 2 were impossible to kill by monsters with all the life leech and potions.
Having to get your corpse wasnt as good either, running around naked because your equipment was in the middle of the monsters that killed you... nah, not that good.
Monster health regeneration might not work if there are other players within the same dungeon who haven't yet died. This could become an exploitable element of the game, whereby one player stays alive and hides in a corner while the other player lowers their health little by little.
Then again, it all depends on how the health regen mechanic works. If it works like it did in Diablo II, in that monsters a certain distance away from the character regen their health, then it'll solve the issue.
Another way would be to add a temporary experience and loot penalty that lasts for a period of time or for a certain amount of experience. That is to say, the next ten monsters that the player kills will provide reduced experience (due to the exp penalty) and have a lower chance to drop good loot.
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Ive been playing Diablo for eight years. The game sounds fun to me. You have to let go of the old style and adapt to this new one. Like goin from D1 to D2. there was alot of change now were going from d2 to d3 theres going to be change. Live with it. (I dont get your PvP method did you nk after you killed them are what. When dueling you should let them get there body back.) And you havent even played Diablo3 so dont lie to yourself saying it isn't fun! Play it and you will realize that IT IS FUN!!!
If you want to arrange it
This world you can change it
If we could somehow make this
Christmas thing last
By helping a neighbor
Or even a stranger
And to know who needs help
You need only just ask
Just try to think about the only times you ever really "partied up", Act 2 & Act 3 (before we found out about killing the Council and tp'ing to Meph), because in those acts you had to collect stuff in order to advance, even a lvl 99 still had to collect the pieces.
I still think that a death (especially on a higher difficulty) deserves a loss of experience. But this depends on how far the checkpoints are going to be placed under the new system, because if it takes you a couple of minutes to get back to the action, then you have (in a sense) lost experience. I hope that the body system is still in effect, when you die you drop your corpse, but I don't know how that will work with the new system, because it may be tough to get back to your body if the checkpoints are widely spread.
____________If the best things in life are free... then Diablo 3 will be free!____________
[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
Honestly I really don't agree with most of you guys on the "no bodies no pk fun" train of thoughts.
It's rediculous to think that having to run for your body would have anything to do with the PK part of the game. Unless your the type of guy that got a thrill from getting your ass handed to you and having to run like a moron to get your body back while dodging guided arrows. If you are then go play D2 cuz there's plenty of that still going on. However for more strategical type people and especially competitive players, I strongly believe that a reward/betting system for duel matches is a good idea that was pointed out many times before and would surely add to the PK interest factor, along with a good ranking system on Bnet.
--------~~Mattheo's Quote of the day~~---------
----------Brought to you by Diablofans.com Forums --------
Originally Posted by mattheo_majik
I LOVE being a SEX TON!!!
The Titan Quest rebirth fountain system is very similar to the checkpoint system found in old games from before computers had enough memory to store autosaves, quicksaves, or waypoints like we know them today.
I bought Abe's Oddysee on steam a while ago, and that game implements a "diamond," or checkpoint, system in which your progress is saved every few screens or so. Depending on the frequency of the checkpoints, this can be similar to autosave. It appears that is what Blizzard is going for, probably in addition to some variation of the traditional waypoints and town portals.
I like this mechanic because, IMO, all games should have quicksave or at the very least, autosave. It's just annoying having to re-walk areas you completed before, especially since the monsters will remain dead.
Keeping track of how many times you have died can kind of be an incentive to not want to die, if only for bragging rights. Adding some form of "fatigue" or exp and loot penalty for a few minutes after death is another option. And the incentive for not dying in HC is obvious.
Well that was a rather long first post. I've been reading the forum since the announcement, but felt like posting on this topic since it's an aspect of game design I think about a lot.
That was a cinematic portal for Cain to walk into. There is no indication of a player being able to use one.
http://www.petitiononline.com/LANSC2/petition.html
I mean they already had an amazing game with D1 and D2, with incredible concepts that were either underdeveloped or out of control and abused. Going back to rethink these features and improving them, will go a great way into making us feel like this is a Diablo game instead of only changing everything or replacing it, definately is the smart way to go.
The TP has always been a great concept that endless games copied but haven't really perfected yet so I believe that if they find a way to limit the time/areas that the player is able to use it in than it could be a good factor into spycing up D3. Just as simple as that.
The rushing of D2 and D1 wasn't due to the fact that they could TP from everywhere, but rather the lack of restrictions on Quest/Area in accordance to Char LvL. If you think about it, not being able to TP wouldnt of stopped people from Rushing since they would of simply had to clear a trail to the end boss for the low lvls. Yeah it would of been longer but that's not a big deal. TP isnt at all the root of the Rushing problem.
--------~~Mattheo's Quote of the day~~---------
----------Brought to you by Diablofans.com Forums --------
Originally Posted by mattheo_majik
I LOVE being a SEX TON!!!
TP scrolls should be on a cooldown like some people said, but they shouldn't be the only way to get back to an area, otherwise players will end up sitting around waiting for the cooldown to finish before attempting a difficult boss fight. Having them be non-combat is probably the best solution.
1) I can see alot of the Diablo bullies trapping checkpoints with enemies as a new pastime
2) If your fighting tough enemies you can wear them down by attacking in between deaths (respawn, attack, respawn, rinse, repeat) until you kill them.
The could easily remedy this by creating checkpoint zones, so that you don't always re-spawn in the exact same spot.
____________If the best things in life are free... then Diablo 3 will be free!____________
[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
As opposed to a full-blown auto-save, I think a checkpoint system should only be in effect during the active game, checkpoints should be temporary, with waypoints permanent
____________If the best things in life are free... then Diablo 3 will be free!____________
[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
I second that.
Cain uses a TP in gameplay vid.
C'mon ppl, if they don't mention the tp in an interview it means nothing.
TP's will probably now just have a cool-off attribute, is all.