Pretty to the point. I figured Blizzard would be more customer savy. "We're not changing it" is a little..arrogant?
Isnt it arrogant to demand that Blizzard change THEIR game because a bunch of goth kids dont like colour or, you know, nature?
There is colour in nature, it happens.
Also, if Blizzard wanted to make Caves and Tombs (i'm an Archaologist, so i've been in caves and tombs alot) really how they should be then you will basically start with black, have the main character with a lantern and show shit all.
Seriously, the amount of times you collide with something which just out, simply because light doesnt do much in such conditions.
Pretty to the point. I figured Blizzard would be more customer savy. "We're not changing it" is a little..arrogant?
No, YOU are for implying that 1% of the fan base should get whatever they demand... In fact I wouldn't say arrogant, I would say immature or even ignorant.... Grow up?
Everyone seems to be under the false impression that Blizzard owes you something, when in fact, you owe them, they made all these amazing games so far they haven't screwed up. Let them do whatever they want, offer suggestions, they might ignore them.... Get over it.
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
"If we're actually making the game worse with no other reason than to be different from WoW, then it's a bad choice." - Jay Wilson (D3 lead designer)
This just all seems like a big excuse. Why the big, gaudy, exaggerated armors? What about the cartoony statues, railings, textures? There's also a difference between varied color usage and misplaced colors - where's all this blue/green coming from? If you want green make a marshland or forest. If you want blue make an ice area. Why use such colors in a dungeon? Why not reds, oranges, yellows like you'd get from torches and candles that would overpower the soft blues you'd get from fog and mist (but still have this minorly present as was shown in Corwyn's screenshot). Let's just face the music, they wanted to make a game that took a lot from WoW - they weren't *forced* into these decisions at all.
There is plenty of room to make good use of color without having to resort to color choices that absolutely make no sense and give the game a cartoony feel. You can still make assets pop out to the player and be highly visible without making them highly exaggerated and comical.
I actually agree with this 100%. Think of how many WoW players pay blizz every month, and now think of the small community that still plays d2. Who do you think they are gonna target their marketing towards?
I actually agree with this 100%. Think of how many WoW players pay blizz every month, and now think of the small community that still plays d2. Who do you think they are gonna target their marketing towards?
Oh ya, it totally makes sense. if I want to make money I'm going to go towards my target market. Which right now, lol, WoW is it.
Oh ya, it totally makes sense. if I want to make money I'm going to go towards my target market. Which right now, lol, WoW is it.
Well actually, the marketing is probably not the reason. But if marketing is the reason, well WoW is dying. So Blizz has to do something.
But I think the style of graphics that they use requires relatively low end systems. And the photoshoped versions of the gameplay seemed more like a step backwards in terms of graphical technology. So I guess blizz wants as many people playing this game as possible? With minimal lag?
If Blizzard says FU fan for not liking our colurs, then i say FU Blizzard for crapping on Blizzard North's art design.
I am quite sure, behind their servants, European cars, mansions and mounds of cash... that you are hurting their feelings.
In other news, wtb another major update... maybe some new information about a new TYPE of item, or about how exactly runes will be represented, will their be "extra damage vs demons/undead" again (personally I always felt a underwhelming stat)... Of course the obvious new class or confirmed and previously unseen new skills for the current classes... I just want everyone to drop this rediculous art debate and start talking about the IMPORTANT THINGS about the game.
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
"If we're actually making the game worse with no other reason than to be different from WoW, then it's a bad choice." - Jay Wilson (D3 lead designer)
I actually agree with this 100%. Think of how many WoW players pay blizz every month, and now think of the small community that still plays d2. Who do you think they are gonna target their marketing towards?
That makes complete sense. Instead of fixing WoW so that people pay 15 a month and ultimately 180 a year, make D3 like WoW so people only pay 50 dollers once. Complete marketing sense. :thumbsup:
(Gods I feel fucking gay using a forum emoticon...)
I am quite sure, behind their servants, European cars, mansions and mounds of cash... that you are hurting their feelings.
In other news, wtb another major update... maybe some new information about a new TYPE of item, or about how exactly runes will be represented, will their be "extra damage vs demons/undead" again (personally I always felt a underwhelming stat)... Of course the obvious new class or confirmed and previously unseen new skills for the current classes... I just want everyone to drop this rediculous art debate and start talking about the IMPORTANT THINGS about the game.
The art is just as important as the gameplay.
Games with good art and style actually stick easier in the minds of the players than just a game with amazing gameplay. A good example is an indy-game called Yume Nikki, the gameplay is actually really simplistic and rather stupid and easy to get lost in as it has no real sense of direction. But the way everything is presented to you visually and audibly really helps to drag you into the messed up dreams of a schizophrenic.
I'd actually say it's one of the best games I've ever spent two hours completing, and that's comparing it to Portal.
That's just an example of how art and style can make a subpar game into an awesome one.
The art helps create the mood, and in the past two games that mood was gothic horror. It's now moved from gothic horror to high fantasy.
Games with good art and style actually stick easier in the minds of the players than just a game with amazing gameplay. A good example is an indy-game called Yume Nikki, the gameplay is actually really simplistic and rather stupid and easy to get lost in as it has no real sense of direction. But the way everything is presented to you visually and audibly really helps to drag you into the messed up dreams of a schizophrenic.
I'd actually say it's one of the best games I've ever spent two hours completing, and that's comparing it to Portal.
That's just an example of how art and style can make a subpar game into an awesome one.
The art helps create the mood, and in the past two games that mood was gothic horror. It's now moved from gothic horror to high fantasy.
Art, cinematics..that's what drew me to Blizzard. Art style is extremely important.
Games with good art and style actually stick easier in the minds of the players than just a game with amazing gameplay. A good example is an indy-game called Yume Nikki, the gameplay is actually really simplistic and rather stupid and easy to get lost in as it has no real sense of direction. But the way everything is presented to you visually and audibly really helps to drag you into the messed up dreams of a schizophrenic.
I'd actually say it's one of the best games I've ever spent two hours completing, and that's comparing it to Portal.
That's just an example of how art and style can make a subpar game into an awesome one.
The art helps create the mood, and in the past two games that mood was gothic horror. It's now moved from gothic horror to high fantasy.
I have to disagree with that. Although Graphics is definately the most important part of drawing fans, it doesn't mean it will play the part of keeping fans. There have been many games with great graphics, but horrible gameplay. Gothic III, Hellgate, Two worlds etc. are all examples of bad gameplay, good graphics.
Starcraft was pretty behind in graphics when it was first released, but that was not even half enough to stop it from dominating the RTS genre. Even till now, Warcraft III is played more than the latest Command and Conquer, a game with much better graphics.
I have to disagree with that. Although Graphics is definately the most important part of drawing fans, it doesn't mean it will play the part of keeping fans. There have been many games with great graphics, but horrible gameplay. Gothic III, Hellgate, Two worlds etc. are all examples of bad gameplay, good graphics.
Starcraft was pretty behind in graphics when it was first released, but that was not even half enough to stop it from dominating the RTS genre.
I think you misinterpreted what I said.
I meant art style and direction, not graphical quality. Look at Crysis, it's got AMAZING real graphics but is a piece of shit.
Second off, the alpha-stage graphics we're looking at right now look nothing like a Frazetta painting. It's like a cheap imitation, not real quality.
I just told you what High Fantasy is. You don't know what it is as you are applying the term to Diablo, which is more of a Dark Gothic Fantasy. Even BLIZZARD themselves claim that Diablo isn't High Fantasy and they like the dark edge the game brings to the table.
And you know jack and shit about game making if you think the outdoor level they showed us was imitation and poor quality. I've heard others use the term "cheap imitation" when they don't know how to properly critique something, and I believe you're doing the same. Sorry, it's true. The level looks like a Frazetta painting in that it has an Autumny palette and soft edges and when the Siege Beast comes out in the video I instantly thought about Frazetta's dark armored up world.
I meant art style and direction, not graphical quality. Look at Crysis, it's got AMAZING real graphics but is a piece of shit.
If that is what you meant, agreed. Crysis trailer blew me out, the game however.....bored me out. Jumping over a car is BS, your enemies don't attempt to run over you, they get out their cars to shoot at you........
Anyways back to topic. You have to remember that D3 has been in productions for a very very long time, and that was also when WoW was hot as hell. WoW had great graphics back then, and obviously Blizzard would use the same style of Graphics. Since they cannot continue on with gameplay and character design before they have chosen their art style.
@ Flamingdts: Yea, and tetris had no graphics at all, your argument is flawed, gameplay isn't a leverage for bad graphics or something.
I don't understand what you mean. Tetris is a great game in 2D. But still one of the most popular games in the world. So my arguement is flawed because??
I just told you what High Fantasy is. You don't know what it is as you are applying the term to Diablo, which is more of a Dark Gothic Fantasy. Even BLIZZARD themselves claim that Diablo isn't High Fantasy and they like the dark edge the game brings to the table.
And you know jack and shit about game making if you think the outdoor level they showed us was imitation and poor quality. I've heard others use the term "cheap imitation" when they don't know how to properly critique something, and I believe you're doing the same. Sorry, it's true. The level looks like a Frazetta painting in that it has an Autumny palette and soft edges and when the Siege Beast comes out in the video I instantly thought about Frazetta's dark armored up world.
Tell me, what is high fantasy, and try not to loosely quote a Wikipedia entry this time.
You can't, because you don't know what high fantasy is, and you don't know what gothic horror is.
And there was nothing in that video that used colour realistically, or in the darkened style of Frazetta.
Tell me, what is high fantasy, and try not to loosely quote a Wikipedia entry this time.
You can't, because you don't know what high fantasy is, and you don't know what gothic horror is.
And there was nothing in that video that used colour realistically, or in the darkened style of Frazetta.
I already told you. I want to hear you define it since me telling you what it is doesn't count. Sounds to me like you went to Wiki and found out what I said was true and you don't know how to counter it. Good for you. Way to go look up how fucking wrong you are.
I'm not talking art with you if you don't know what you're talking about. Unrealistic use of color? What does that even mean? If you're another person complaining about the green light I suggest you play more games and see it used in many of them to create mood and a creep atmosphere.
I already told you. I want to hear you define it since me telling you what it is doesn't count. Sounds to me like you went to Wiki and found out what I said was true and you don't know how to counter it. Good for you. Way to go look up how fucking wrong you are.
I'm not talking art with you if you don't know what you're talking about. Unrealistic use of color? What does that even mean? If you're another person complaining about the green light I suggest you play more games and see it used in many of them to create mood and a creep atmosphere.
You think high fantasy means dwarves and elves, and that's how I know you're wrong. While those two things are often found in high fantasy works, due to Tolkien's Lord of the Rings being the most famous, they can also be found in sword and sorcery novellas/short stories printed in a magazine.
High fantasy is meant to not just take you into a fantastic world, but make you learn and feel the world. A very scholarly look into what's going on instead of a general focus on the action to captivate readers. High fantasy makes you think about what's going on in the story.
And according to Blizzard's statement about wanting to draw us into the World of Sanctuary, I'd say I'm very right about it becoming high fantasy.
Unrealistic colour, in that dungeon where does the blue ambient light come from in a candle lit "Forgotten Tomb". If the candles were blue, I'd expect it, but those candles obviously burn orange.
Unrealistic colour, in that dungeon where does the blue ambient light come from in a candle lit "Forgotten Tomb". If the candles were blue, I'd expect it, but those candles obviously burn orange.
Depends what colour the surface they are emitting light onto.
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Isnt it arrogant to demand that Blizzard change THEIR game because a bunch of goth kids dont like colour or, you know, nature?
There is colour in nature, it happens.
Also, if Blizzard wanted to make Caves and Tombs (i'm an Archaologist, so i've been in caves and tombs alot) really how they should be then you will basically start with black, have the main character with a lantern and show shit all.
Seriously, the amount of times you collide with something which just out, simply because light doesnt do much in such conditions.
Everyone seems to be under the false impression that Blizzard owes you something, when in fact, you owe them, they made all these amazing games so far they haven't screwed up. Let them do whatever they want, offer suggestions, they might ignore them.... Get over it.
Oh ya, it totally makes sense. if I want to make money I'm going to go towards my target market. Which right now, lol, WoW is it.
~Thanks to AlaskanFireDragon for the signature
Well actually, the marketing is probably not the reason. But if marketing is the reason, well WoW is dying. So Blizz has to do something.
But I think the style of graphics that they use requires relatively low end systems. And the photoshoped versions of the gameplay seemed more like a step backwards in terms of graphical technology. So I guess blizz wants as many people playing this game as possible? With minimal lag?
Blizzard
Valve
:thumbsup:
In other news, wtb another major update... maybe some new information about a new TYPE of item, or about how exactly runes will be represented, will their be "extra damage vs demons/undead" again (personally I always felt a underwhelming stat)... Of course the obvious new class or confirmed and previously unseen new skills for the current classes... I just want everyone to drop this rediculous art debate and start talking about the IMPORTANT THINGS about the game.
That makes complete sense. Instead of fixing WoW so that people pay 15 a month and ultimately 180 a year, make D3 like WoW so people only pay 50 dollers once. Complete marketing sense. :thumbsup:
(Gods I feel fucking gay using a forum emoticon...)
The art is just as important as the gameplay.
Games with good art and style actually stick easier in the minds of the players than just a game with amazing gameplay. A good example is an indy-game called Yume Nikki, the gameplay is actually really simplistic and rather stupid and easy to get lost in as it has no real sense of direction. But the way everything is presented to you visually and audibly really helps to drag you into the messed up dreams of a schizophrenic.
I'd actually say it's one of the best games I've ever spent two hours completing, and that's comparing it to Portal.
That's just an example of how art and style can make a subpar game into an awesome one.
The art helps create the mood, and in the past two games that mood was gothic horror. It's now moved from gothic horror to high fantasy.
Words I hate in Gaming Culture:
Epic
Hardcore
E-Sports
Art, cinematics..that's what drew me to Blizzard. Art style is extremely important.
~Thanks to AlaskanFireDragon for the signature
I have to disagree with that. Although Graphics is definately the most important part of drawing fans, it doesn't mean it will play the part of keeping fans. There have been many games with great graphics, but horrible gameplay. Gothic III, Hellgate, Two worlds etc. are all examples of bad gameplay, good graphics.
Starcraft was pretty behind in graphics when it was first released, but that was not even half enough to stop it from dominating the RTS genre. Even till now, Warcraft III is played more than the latest Command and Conquer, a game with much better graphics.
Blizzard
Valve
:thumbsup:
I think you misinterpreted what I said.
I meant art style and direction, not graphical quality. Look at Crysis, it's got AMAZING real graphics but is a piece of shit.
Words I hate in Gaming Culture:
Epic
Hardcore
E-Sports
I just told you what High Fantasy is. You don't know what it is as you are applying the term to Diablo, which is more of a Dark Gothic Fantasy. Even BLIZZARD themselves claim that Diablo isn't High Fantasy and they like the dark edge the game brings to the table.
And you know jack and shit about game making if you think the outdoor level they showed us was imitation and poor quality. I've heard others use the term "cheap imitation" when they don't know how to properly critique something, and I believe you're doing the same. Sorry, it's true. The level looks like a Frazetta painting in that it has an Autumny palette and soft edges and when the Siege Beast comes out in the video I instantly thought about Frazetta's dark armored up world.
If that is what you meant, agreed. Crysis trailer blew me out, the game however.....bored me out. Jumping over a car is BS, your enemies don't attempt to run over you, they get out their cars to shoot at you........
Anyways back to topic. You have to remember that D3 has been in productions for a very very long time, and that was also when WoW was hot as hell. WoW had great graphics back then, and obviously Blizzard would use the same style of Graphics. Since they cannot continue on with gameplay and character design before they have chosen their art style.
I don't understand what you mean. Tetris is a great game in 2D. But still one of the most popular games in the world. So my arguement is flawed because??
Blizzard
Valve
:thumbsup:
Tell me, what is high fantasy, and try not to loosely quote a Wikipedia entry this time.
You can't, because you don't know what high fantasy is, and you don't know what gothic horror is.
And there was nothing in that video that used colour realistically, or in the darkened style of Frazetta.
Words I hate in Gaming Culture:
Epic
Hardcore
E-Sports
Then again, I work outside... So I kinda see trees and stuff first hand...
Psst, a tree is this:
I know alot of you kiddies don't get outside, just figured I'd help you out...
Not the best picture though, but it's not Fall so I can't take pictures of where I live...
I already told you. I want to hear you define it since me telling you what it is doesn't count. Sounds to me like you went to Wiki and found out what I said was true and you don't know how to counter it. Good for you. Way to go look up how fucking wrong you are.
I'm not talking art with you if you don't know what you're talking about. Unrealistic use of color? What does that even mean? If you're another person complaining about the green light I suggest you play more games and see it used in many of them to create mood and a creep atmosphere.
You think high fantasy means dwarves and elves, and that's how I know you're wrong. While those two things are often found in high fantasy works, due to Tolkien's Lord of the Rings being the most famous, they can also be found in sword and sorcery novellas/short stories printed in a magazine.
High fantasy is meant to not just take you into a fantastic world, but make you learn and feel the world. A very scholarly look into what's going on instead of a general focus on the action to captivate readers. High fantasy makes you think about what's going on in the story.
And according to Blizzard's statement about wanting to draw us into the World of Sanctuary, I'd say I'm very right about it becoming high fantasy.
Unrealistic colour, in that dungeon where does the blue ambient light come from in a candle lit "Forgotten Tomb". If the candles were blue, I'd expect it, but those candles obviously burn orange.
Words I hate in Gaming Culture:
Epic
Hardcore
E-Sports
Depends what colour the surface they are emitting light onto.