[PiSeas1984]

Didnt come up with this, but just want to make a cool idea more visible to Bashiok & see what everyone thinks, get some fresh input. The original thread is here

http://www.battle.ne...al&T=323693&P=1

Quick rundown: the OP proddeh suggested an infinite series of levels, randomly generated, where you can just let loose on mobs & gain exp+items. The mobs difficulty should scale up by certain percentage every lvl with few boss monsters thrown here and there. And you have to do it in one go, once u TP out u start from lvl 1 again. This would:
1) Provide a more fun alt to doing the 8578th baal run
2) Provide some form of bragging rights (mayb a counter on ur BNet toon showing highest lvl
u made it to)
3) (IMO) Solve once and for all the whine of 'my hammerdin solo'd uber&pandemonium diablos togethr on one testicle..cant u guys dish up some real punishment???

An alt idea (or maybe let's have both!) every1 liked was a survival area where random waves of mobs jus come at u, scaling up as well.

Now my guess is if Bashiok sees this, the argument will be "this wil take focus away from other game content / bots will overrun / wot a load of crap" . However i think something like this will really enhance playability & the challenge factor, without too much extra developing work involved, so why not? Some guys said the exp&item drop can be reduced, so if u wanna MF go do boss runs®ular game content, and come here for some challenge&ownage

[Daemaro]

Eh... I guess it's not too bad of a idea, but I do see a potential problem with bots, and would it really matter if the exp was reduced? They'd just set the bot to farm the first to levels repeatedly for days on end. Go up a few levels as they get higher levels.

Bots are inevitable though I think. Even in regular gameplay.

[akse]

This is fun idea. If anyone played ADOM, there was such place at least I don't know anyone who got out of there :) The dungeon started as a really easy and sometimes I just made a character and went there untill I found it got really hard at the 10th level of the dungeon or something. It was great place to find equipment and get exp. At some point really strong monsters started to come by when it was safer to leave the place and go somewhere else .) THese monsters would be beatable tho when you get higher level I guess.

If anyone have any memories of the cave,, please share :)

[Jack00]

I like the idea, kinda like Challenge of the gods in God of War I/II. Could be fun if you get tired of doing endboss runs.

[Veltras]

Arrrggh! I wanted to make a thread about this for some time now.

My idea was pretty much the same, but instead of being infinite it would just be insanely long and have some sort of reward at the end.

Also I don't think you should able to TP at all just to make it more challenging and if you die you have to restart a new game.

Finally to prevent bots and free access to this dungeon, People should have to do a sidequest a la Uber Tristram to get there first.

I already see the name of this dungeon, The Tower of Terror :cool:

[ZharTheMad]

Cool idea! If you could forgive me, WoW-like instances on D3 might be cool too.

[Ezekel]

ZharTheMad said:

Cool idea! If you could forgive me, WoW-like instances on D3 might be cool too.

If you are talking about a raid, then as the player limit is at most going to be around 8 a 24 person raid would be impossible. That and D3 will be a single player game as well so anything that requires more than one person to achieve is unlikely, not impossible though.

Also any raid, and WoW didnt do them first, relies on a tank+healer+dps. As all classes in Diablo are designed for DPS and there is no real tank or healer it would just be a bunch of people wailing on a boss on screen.

That and the entire game is its own instance.

[Luckmann]

Ezekel said:

If you are talking about a raid, then as the player limit is at most going to be around 8 a 24 person raid would be impossible. That and D3 will be a single player game as well so anything that requires more than one person to achieve is unlikely, not impossible though.

Also any raid, and WoW didnt do them first, relies on a tank+healer+dps. As all classes in Diablo are designed for DPS and there is no real tank or healer it would just be a bunch of people wailing on a boss on screen.

That and the entire game is its own instance.

As a side note to that, Blizzard have mentioned in an article that they are considering lowering the number of players to 4-5, since they are experiencing the best of the game at around 4 people working together.

[carambolage de charogne]

Luckmann said:

As a side note to that, Blizzard have mentioned in an article that they are considering lowering the number of players to 4-5, since they are experiencing the best of the game at around 4 people working together.

4-5...!

that seems really low. i like 8 just fine.

but the idea of this tower is pretty good. let it have an end and a final boss. also make it not just 1 room, but a randomly generated dungeon, with random monsters and resists.

[Guildenstern]

Woah I love this idea, it doesn't even have to be one, it could be one infinite dungeon and one survival arena per act with different settings and monsters so you don't get bored of them. The difficulty level for all of them should be around the same though and like Veltras said you should need some sort of key to enter them like the uber Tristam quest.

I disagree though that exp and MF should be reduced, I think they should be left at the normal rate.

I think the levels shouldn't be too big like jail/catacombs because it would be very annoying looking for the stairs, they should be more compact and action packed like jail/catacombs from the Median 2008 mod (or like forgotten tower if you've never played Median)

About the scaling of difficulty I think the level increase of monsters per floor should be logarithmical rather than linear or exponential so that the difference in difficulty in the higher levels (floor 30 or something) isn't astronomical and it doesn't get to a point where everyone can get to say floor 32 rather easily but is just impossible to get to 33. With logarithmical scaling the increase in difficulty should be way smoother, that way the regular bunch of players could push it to level 40s while a party with really skilled and coordinated players could push it to level 60 and beyond.

PiSeas1984 said:

Now my guess is if Bashiok sees this, the argument will be "this wil take focus away from other game content / bots will overrun / wot a load of crap"

Well that can be easily avoidable if the dungeon(s) is only available after you beat the game in hell difficulty. Also I don't know much about botting but I think the new positional strategy and health orb system will not let players bot effectively.

[PiSeas1984]

The prob is if exp&MF is the same, d3 servers will just be swamped with 'infinite tower' runs , since the much higher kills(drops)/min count will mean higher returns for same time spent than any other area. Think it'll b better if d3 servers will have at least 3 categories of games going on: MF = boss runs, exp = some set scenario runs, 'fun' = infinite/survival runs

Really would prefer this to be infinite rather than just really long dungeon with an end (thats just regular diablo isnt it...), since otherwise its jus a matter of time b4 whole ranks of ppl going 'now what?' after lvl100. I can see this ruining lives tho~there'll def b diehard nuts sitting at 'lvl 23894763' a week down the line! XD

How bout each level being one big arena? Easy2program, and differentiates from regular play (=dungeon crawling).Let the mobs come to me instead of me running around looking for them (similar to mobs swarming over the barbarian in the gameplay vid's opening scenes). Open portal to next level once arena is clear.

If you guys like the idea, spread the seeds! Make posts on the other d3 forums!! Really want to see something come from this, if only just to make blizzard implement ONE community-suggested feature into the game! (anyone heard of that happening in d3 yet??)

[Jack00]

4-5 players in the same game sounds good, if you ask me i think it would force the players for a more cooperative gameplay. I hope the max players doesn't top 6.

[Guildenstern]

PiSeas1984 said:

The prob is if exp&MF is the same, d3 servers will just be swamped with 'infinite tower' runs , since the much higher kills(drops)/min count will mean higher returns for same time spent than any other area. Think it'll b better if d3 servers will have at least 3 categories of games going on: MF = boss runs, exp = some set scenario runs, 'fun' = infinite/survival runs

Actually I don't see how the infinite dungeon can have more drops/min than a boss run since basically every level in the game is filled with monsters, not to mention that the boss drops way better items than normal monsters and you only have to go through 2-3 levels to get to the boss.

Also I don't see the problem in people prefering to do a tower run rather than a boss run, they should be able to do whatever they want in the endgame, not be forced to do boss runs to get the better items. Maybe there could be a number of other uberquests with biased loot so that players can alternate between them rather than just running the same thing over and over.

[InstantLite]

Sounds Like a good gameplay idea, fit it into the story, get it to fend off bots, decide if it should drop or not, what to drop, how much experience, and you're good (maybe it could be the replacement for the cow level, and if you lose, you have to wait 1 hour to play again)

[carambolage de charogne]

it doesnt have to fit with the story. it could just be a bonus level. i vote for full exp and drops, otherwise it wouldnt be worth it. having pre-reqs subdues bots. and make it very hard in the latter stages, you only get 1 life so if you die then you must leave the game, so its a challenge. and have some sort of leaderboard to see which 'team' or solo-er gets to the highest stage.

[solus_fides]

applesoffury said:

it doesnt have to fit with the story. it could just be a bonus level. i vote for full exp and drops, otherwise it wouldnt be worth it. having pre-reqs subdues bots. and make it very hard in the latter stages, you only get 1 life so if you die then you must leave the game, so its a challenge. and have some sort of leaderboard to see which 'team' or solo-er gets to the highest stage.

You know, if you think about it, the cow level doesn't it into the storyline either. But it is an unlock-able level where people can just go in and kill cows. But yeah, they can decide to add it into the storyline if they want, but I see it as completely optional.

[PiSeas1984]

A sadistic idea I havnt seen mentioned yet is: how bout u lose all exp&item gained in the dungeon if u/whole-party die inside? You only get to keep them if u/at-least-one-surviving-party-member opt to tele out AFTER CLEARING A LVL. This would
1) Add excitement&tension. "Weighing my skills, can I try finishing next wave and risk losing all, or should take safe route out by now". If u save&exit mid-level u get nothing

2) Add apprehension of death, which hasnt been a part of diablo really since anytime u feel scared can simply save&exit, no penalty. At least make this ONE area actually feel dangerous to fight in.

3) Reduce bots? i assume bot logic is 'if health < x%, save&exit'. if that happens here the botter gains nothing.

4) Increase the multiplayer incentive which bliz is trying so hard to do. Bigger party = bigger chance of one person surviving to enable party escape with loot. Mite null the #2 point tho, if party of bots r used...

[carambolage de charogne]

PiSeas1984 said:

A sadistic idea I havnt seen mentioned yet is: how bout u lose all exp&item gained in the dungeon if u/whole-party die inside? You only get to keep them if u/at-least-one-surviving-party-member opt to tele out AFTER CLEARING A LVL. This would
1) Add excitement&tension. "Weighing my skills, can I try finishing next wave and risk losing all, or should take safe route out by now". If u save&exit mid-level u get nothing

2) Add apprehension of death, which hasnt been a part of diablo really since anytime u feel scared can simply save&exit, no penalty. At least make this ONE area actually feel dangerous to fight in.

3) Reduce bots? i assume bot logic is 'if health < x%, save&exit'. if that happens here the botter gains nothing.

4) Increase the multiplayer incentive which bliz is trying so hard to do. Bigger party = bigger chance of one person surviving to enable party escape with loot. Mite null the #2 point tho, if party of bots r used...

theres a mode called 'hardcore'

[PhrozenDragon]

Veltras said:

Arrrggh! I wanted to make a thread about this for some time now.

You thinking Bloody Palace too Veltras? ;)

applesoffury said:

it doesnt have to fit with the story. it could just be a bonus level. i vote for full exp and drops, otherwise it wouldnt be worth it. having pre-reqs subdues bots. and make it very hard in the latter stages, you only get 1 life so if you die then you must leave the game, so its a challenge. and have some sort of leaderboard to see which 'team' or solo-er gets to the highest stage.

I think it's a good idea for sure, if it's going to be in then there should be a ranking system for it.

[Guildenstern]

PiSeas1984 said:

A sadistic idea I havnt seen mentioned yet is: how bout u lose all exp&item gained in the dungeon if u/whole-party die inside? You only get to keep them if u/at-least-one-surviving-party-member opt to tele out AFTER CLEARING A LVL. This would
1) Add excitement&tension. "Weighing my skills, can I try finishing next wave and risk losing all, or should take safe route out by now". If u save&exit mid-level u get nothing

2) Add apprehension of death, which hasnt been a part of diablo really since anytime u feel scared can simply save&exit, no penalty. At least make this ONE area actually feel dangerous to fight in.

3) Reduce bots? i assume bot logic is 'if health < x%, save&exit'. if that happens here the botter gains nothing.

4) Increase the multiplayer incentive which bliz is trying so hard to do. Bigger party = bigger chance of one person surviving to enable party escape with loot. Mite null the #2 point tho, if party of bots r used...

You mean a masoquistic idea, and like applesoffury pointed out, only the masoquist hardcore players would like this system. Us softcore sadists would probably never use a feature like this.