15 replies to this topic

[superp123]

Below is a video of the most redicilious snapshot i have ever done, i used a gimped weapon and my dps is 120k and i go to 679k dps.  that is insane and the reason as well as others that this nerf is going through.

Edited by superp123, 05 February 2013 - 11:34 PM.

[superp123]

https://www.youtube....h?v=KyK9EY4JU8A

[superp123]

GOD LIKE!! broke 1 million dps snapshot with a 5 million weapon!!!!

https://www.youtube....h?v=ixQ8q4aABi4

Edited by superp123, 05 February 2013 - 11:31 PM.

[maka]

That's pretty crazy.

[Mordewraith]

im afraid snap-shotting doesnt work like that, uve got it the wrong way round, snapshotting doesnt take into account attack speed im afraid, so all that massive 1mil dps is wasted in the snapshot, all that is included in a snapshot is

weapon average damage,
any ave dam boosts on rings/amulets,
elemental % boosts,
crit dam,
monster specific boost, like demon % increases,
%dam increases to elites,
dex,
Sweeping winds dam increases,
and life steal,

then add all your skills that boost ur DPS, like blazing wrath, faith in the light etc

add all gear with that combination of stats and snapshotting is at its max, ur char sheet DPS means nothing.
IAS and crit chance are not included in the snapshot,
BUT
IAS boosts are included in boosting how much blinding flash's 30% dam increase is worked out, so that weapons massvive IAS boost will boost blinding flash's effectiveness.

Edited by Mordewraith, 06 February 2013 - 12:25 AM.

[Crensh]

Everyone knows how this works. The reason snapshot is being changed is because some greedy fucks had to run around on mp10 doing the gear swaps.

[Diavolo222]

^ This. Snapshot was never a problem and it was a good mechanic, that sadly got abused by people whom I dont want to even insult as they insult themselves by just existing.

[SolusCoda]

Diavolo222, on 11 February 2013 - 09:20 PM, said:

^ This. Snapshot was never a problem and it was a good mechanic, that sadly got abused by people whom I dont want to even insult as they insult themselves by just existing.

It's a shame you insist on blaming the players instead of the developer for the game's poor mechanics. Players who used this method were cleverly making use of known properties of snapshot, which was a decision made by Blizzard. Snapshot was *always* a problem, until now.

Full disclosure: I used the gear-swapping method for a long time. In fact, I initially discovered it on my own without seeing it on the forums and thought I was brilliant for a while.

I will be happy to see these changes though, as it will improve build diversity, and gear swapping isn't exactly the most fun mechanic.

Edited by SolusCoda, 12 February 2013 - 05:38 PM.

[stromchin]

The problem with snapshot was that monks needed it to not be behind the other characters. Now we will be behind other characters no matter what.

And I'm not talking about gear swapping with snapshot, I'm talking about buff then snapshot.
The exploit being abused was the gear swapping, and that's how you could get incredible edps, but they simply nerfed 95% of the monks who didn't gear swap.

Unfortunately other class don't even understand this.

[maka]

SolusCoda, on 12 February 2013 - 05:22 PM, said:

Diavolo222, on 11 February 2013 - 09:20 PM, said:

^ This. Snapshot was never a problem and it was a good mechanic, that sadly got abused by people whom I dont want to even insult as they insult themselves by just existing.

It's a shame you insist on blaming the players instead of the developer for the game's poor mechanics. Players who used this method were cleverly making use of known properties of snapshot, which was a decision made by Blizzard. Snapshot was *always* a problem, until now.

Full disclosure: I used the gear-swapping method for a long time. In fact, I initially discovered it on my own without seeing it on the forums and thought I was brilliant for a while.

I will be happy to see these changes though, as it will improve build diversity, and gear swapping isn't exactly the most fun mechanic.

By your reasoning, you can't blame players for using any exploits found in any game, because the developers put it there.
The way I see it, snapshotting was an exploit, and I'm glad to see it gone. If you feel the Monk will be gimped by this, then Blizzard needs to buff him. Simple as that.

[stromchin]

maka, on 12 February 2013 - 06:19 PM, said:

SolusCoda, on 12 February 2013 - 05:22 PM, said:

Diavolo222, on 11 February 2013 - 09:20 PM, said:

^ This. Snapshot was never a problem and it was a good mechanic, that sadly got abused by people whom I dont want to even insult as they insult themselves by just existing.

It's a shame you insist on blaming the players instead of the developer for the game's poor mechanics. Players who used this method were cleverly making use of known properties of snapshot, which was a decision made by Blizzard. Snapshot was *always* a problem, until now.

Full disclosure: I used the gear-swapping method for a long time. In fact, I initially discovered it on my own without seeing it on the forums and thought I was brilliant for a while.

I will be happy to see these changes though, as it will improve build diversity, and gear swapping isn't exactly the most fun mechanic.

By your reasoning, you can't blame players for using any exploits found in any game, because the developers put it there.
The way I see it, snapshotting was an exploit, and I'm glad to see it gone. If you feel the Monk will be gimped by this, then Blizzard needs to buff him. Simple as that.

yes, simple as that
except that one day someone found a video of a monk exploiting it and killing azmodan in nothing, so there was uproar, and blizzard saw that and nerfed it.
Guess where is the uproar now?
Only monks are complaining because the other classes don't care. And monks are always ignored by blizzard.

All other classes (I'm not sure about WD) can kill azmodan in a record time, like 15 seconds or something
Monks needed an exploit to do it, and now that exploit is gone. They didn't need to remove snapshotting, only remove sweeping wind if someone changed gears, which wasn't so hard, and it would only have destroyed the exploit.

But no, every histerical poster on the forums was complaining about how IT'S A BUG YOU CAN'T COMPLAIN IF IT GETS REMOVED
sorry, but yes, I'm pissed off, my monk has lost between 5% to 10% edps because of this, and that takes away survivability and I won't be able to do as high mp levels as before.

[ErlendOlsen]

Quote

All other classes (I'm not sure about WD) can kill azmodan in a record time, like 15 seconds or something
Monks needed an exploit to do it, and now that exploit is gone. They didn't need to remove snapshotting, only remove sweeping wind if someone changed gears, which wasn't so hard, and it would only have destroyed the exploit.

There is only one class thats able to kill azmodan @ mp 10 in under 16 sec, and that class is a barbarian.. But to be able to reach that dps output he need to use 2x spells with 120sec cooldown.

I gonna quote a post i did before the sw exploiting nerf.  

Quote

The only time a barb (with BIS items) can compete with the damage output of a "min maxing" exploiting monk is when the fight/measurement last under 15 sec (Azmodan)

To be able to compete in those 15s the barb need to use WOTB Insanity + Earthquake (120sec cooldown on both). While the monk can sustain that damage output.

And this is without even taking into consideration the difference in EHP/substain vs a glass cannon 15sec barb and a min maxing sw gearswapping monk. (the monk cant be killed in hes post snapshot gear)

http://www.diablofan...k-sweeping-wind (pre 1.07)

*edit*

Iam pretty sure a top geared monk can match or get very close (or even beat) a top geared barb in sustained dps output in 1.07.

I personally believe many monks that was using the sw gearsweap exploit got spoiled by the "way to high" damage output, and now when they are put on equal footing as the rest of the classes, they dont like it, as they were so used to be "imba".. (hate to use that word)

[Guide] The New Cookie Cutter! (1.0.7) @ http://us.battle.net...08630872?page=1

Iam pretty sure you top geared monks can beat my azmodan killtime if i dont use WOTB Insanity + Earthquake... (~11-12sec killtime with those skills)

Edited by ErlendOlsen, 12 February 2013 - 07:37 PM.

[maka]

One thing doesn't validate the other. As I said, if you feel Monk's DPS will be lacking with the demise of snapshotting, then by all means complain about it. I encourage you to do it. But that doesn't justify maintaining a mechanic that, in my view, was broken. Yes, not only the gear-swap snapshotting, but also the buff snapshotting. To me, it was a very awkward way of doing things.

On a related sidenote, they should change Inna's final set bonus. Without snapshotting, keeping SW going just to maintain 3 stacks isn't really worth it.

[Crensh]

Not a monk player maka? Inna's final set bonus makes TR build possible. And this build is pretty much the only way for monks to farm fast enough.

[maka]

Crensh, on 13 February 2013 - 12:37 PM, said:

Not a monk player maka? Inna's final set bonus makes TR build possible. And this build is pretty much the only way for monks to farm fast enough.

I have all classes at 60, but the Monk is definitely one of the least played ones. Still:

• (4) Set:
  
• Gain 10.0 Life per Spirit Spent (Monk Only)
  
• Reduces resource cost of Sweeping Wind by 70 Spirit. (Monk Only)

I don't see why this is so vital for TR monks.
I'd be very interested to know, though.

[MONK_101]

Snapshot on gear definitely has to go, snapshot on buff is debatable and Blizzard chose to do it away altogether for simplicity.

To make up for it, in 1.0.7. monk got a long list of buff in passive and active skills, noticeably, WoL, SW/cyclone, EP, etc.

With all these buffs, monk is not inferior to any class in terms of sustained DPS output. (SSS=1777 weapon damage, WoL>1000 weapon damage aoe, SW gets about 20% buff, single target and aoe).

[heavymetalmak]

maka, on 15 February 2013 - 02:16 AM, said:

Crensh, on 13 February 2013 - 12:37 PM, said:

Not a monk player maka? Inna's final set bonus makes TR build possible. And this build is pretty much the only way for monks to farm fast enough.

I have all classes at 60, but the Monk is definitely one of the least played ones. Still:

• (4) Set:
  
• Gain 10.0 Life per Spirit Spent (Monk Only)
  
• Reduces resource cost of Sweeping Wind by 70 Spirit. (Monk Only)

I don't see why this is so vital for TR monks.
I'd be very interested to know, though.

its necessary for a lot of different reasons.  one is gear diversity.  some people like to use SW - Inner Storm, which at a 3 stack provides 3 spirit regen/sec.  This allows you to drop one piece of spirit gear for a dps piece.  One of the more common problems with TR is that you lose a lot of dps is you try to get all or most of your regen from your gear.

Another use i see, and i personally use, is SW - Blade Storm.  It provides 78% wpn damage, but only at a 3 stack.  So, i prefer to use this rune when doing TR for the extra dmg.  Its nice to be able to spam SW.  

I do agree with you that it is not mandatory to spam SW anymore, but for a lot of the lesser geared monks, or monks just trying TR for the first time, it is usually the only option.  As you get more dps, you might switch out some of the Inna's gear for better dps stuff.  But most of us dont worry about it.