18 replies to this topic

[ProzaicMuze]

(NEXT GUIDE: Thunderstrike Barbarian)

I'm back with another guide! If you missed my last guide for a Spirit Barrage Witch doctor, you can find it here:

Thread | Preview | Guide

This build uses Ice Armor's freezing mechanics to facilitate channeling Sleet Storm and tanking without Critical Mass. You can opt for pure damage with Jagged Ice or push the higher MP levels with the triple freeze combo of Ice Reflect, Blizzard with Frozen Solid and Frost Nova with Shatter.

Feedback and/or criticism is welcomed and appreciated as always

GAMEPLAY PREVIEW

SLEET STORM BUILD GUIDE

Build Calculator - http://us.battle.net...gjSf!ZXW!YcZaZb

Gear Set - http://d3up.com/b/1002

You can find my channel at www.youtube.com/ProzaicMuze

[Pietrov]

Pin this!

[Bagstone]

Nice build, interesting synthesis of a lot of cold spell mechanics (and Frostburn Gloves). This sounds nice right now already, and might be awesome with 1.07! And +1 for showing that there *is* build diversity, if you're willing to think out of the box and say no to cookie cutter standard builds.

[ProzaicMuze]

Psh build diversity. . . that's just a story gamers tell to scare young developers at night ;P

[IgnatiusReilly]

Been running a type of Sleet Storm build myself for a while. It's an awesome skill. Cool to see it getting some exposure. I'll have to give this one a try.

Edited by IgnatiusReilly, 29 January 2013 - 12:13 AM.

[maka]

Bagstone, on 28 January 2013 - 12:28 PM, said:

Nice build, interesting synthesis of a lot of cold spell mechanics (and Frostburn Gloves). This sounds nice right now already, and might be awesome with 1.07! And +1 for showing that there *is* build diversity, if you're willing to think out of the box and say no to cookie cutter standard builds.

I think you mean "if you're willing to get the gear on the AH - RM or Gold". There's no way one can use all these non-cookie-cutter builds with self-found/crafted gear - it would take you years to find all the right pieces. Case in point: throw barbs. Another one? 0 CD dogs sacrifice WDs.

Edited by maka, 29 January 2013 - 12:58 AM.

[Moola]

I been using sleet Storm for over 2 months now. Im sitting at 210k dps, 67% crit chance with 600ish res. I tank mp10/ubers pretty well.
So I dont have to repost all that boring information heres a link to what I use and such, also what Im looking for.
http://www.diablofan...ost-tank-build/
Works very well, just not done with all my gear yet.

[Bagstone]

maka, on 29 January 2013 - 12:57 AM, said:

I think you mean "if you're willing to get the gear on the AH - RM or Gold". There's no way one can use all these non-cookie-cutter builds with self-found/crafted gear - it would take you years to find all the right pieces. Case in point: throw barbs. Another one? 0 CD dogs sacrifice WDs.

Hm, in general I wouldn't contradict you with this statement because I know that you're certainly the expert on playing non-AH. But have you had a look at the OP's gear? There's really nothing special about it. The Frostburn Gloves are nice, but not a necessity, and besides that I've found them myself a couple of times so when I tried Blizzard this part of my build was self-found.

Completely agree with throw barbs, 0 CD dogs, or for example Disintegrate (you kind of need SoJ + 4 Tal pieces)... but this particular spec here seems to work with about any gear, because if you don't have the EHP/DPS for it, you can just go back to kiting. Care to elaborate why you think this build is so hard when playing self-found? From my perspective, gearing up CMWW self-found seems to be more difficult (all the necessary APoC, IAS, CC).

[redcinder]

Is this just a fun build or is it actually viable because I cant see any quick clearing in your videos ?

[maka]

Bagstone, on 29 January 2013 - 07:34 AM, said:

maka, on 29 January 2013 - 12:57 AM, said:

I think you mean "if you're willing to get the gear on the AH - RM or Gold". There's no way one can use all these non-cookie-cutter builds with self-found/crafted gear - it would take you years to find all the right pieces. Case in point: throw barbs. Another one? 0 CD dogs sacrifice WDs.

Hm, in general I wouldn't contradict you with this statement because I know that you're certainly the expert on playing non-AH. But have you had a look at the OP's gear? There's really nothing special about it. The Frostburn Gloves are nice, but not a necessity, and besides that I've found them myself a couple of times so when I tried Blizzard this part of my build was self-found.

Completely agree with throw barbs, 0 CD dogs, or for example Disintegrate (you kind of need SoJ + 4 Tal pieces)... but this particular spec here seems to work with about any gear, because if you don't have the EHP/DPS for it, you can just go back to kiting. Care to elaborate why you think this build is so hard when playing self-found? From my perspective, gearing up CMWW self-found seems to be more difficult (all the necessary APoC, IAS, CC).

I agree. However, I can't escape the feeling that, without buying specific gear, most builds just feel like an amalgamation of skills and gear instead of a coherent build. How am I supposed to make a proper build, with synergies between skills and items, if I see skill-related affixes once in a blue moon?
Right now, I'm using a Blizzard/Meteor Shower in anticipation of the changes in 1.0.7, but it feels really clunky because I have nothing in my gear that specifically favours one or another build.

Anyway, grats to the OP for moving away from the 1 or 2 builds everyone is using.

[ProzaicMuze]

Moola, on 29 January 2013 - 02:45 AM, said:

I been using sleet Storm for over 2 months now. Im sitting at 210k dps, 67% crit chance with 600ish res. I tank mp10/ubers pretty well.
So I dont have to repost all that boring information heres a link to what I use and such, also what Im looking for.
http://www.diablofan...ost-tank-build/
Works very well, just not done with all my gear yet.

I'll go drop a few tips in your thread when I finish replying to comments

redcinder, on 29 January 2013 - 10:04 AM, said:

Is this just a fun build or is it actually viable because I cant see any quick clearing in your videos ?

It's certainly viable, but it sounds like you consider being fast a measure of viability. It's slower than standard CM or Archon so you probably wouldn't consider this viable for you. I will say that it can have a slight advantage on lower MP levels where you start doing damage immediately while a CM wizard has a slight windup. Archon wizards win at all MP levels, though.

[Peter8111]

I tried this build yesterday. It works great, but only with melee mobs. How can I deal with casters ?

[Keiser]

Peter8111, on 30 January 2013 - 10:03 AM, said:

I tried this build yesterday. It works great, but only with melee mobs. How can I deal with casters ?

You can't.

It's like Rain of Toads that you can only cast over yourself (slightly larger), and if you move, it stops damaging.  This is the reason it never gained traction when WW's coefficient got nerfed.  Sleet Storm's proc coefficient was FOUR TIMES WW's, but if you can't damage or get procs while repositioning, it's not going to be a very good build.  I have tried it.  Less than 90 seconds into the build preview video the OP gets hit by berserker slams.  Stops damaging them.  Doesn't show what this build is like in areas with many ranged units.  Tracking guys down one by one with sleet storm is pretty annoying, and will turn off most people that try this.  Unusable against single targets unless you have crazy crit/APOC.

At this point in Diablo 3's life EVERY skill is viable if you have 600k EHP (like the OP) or 200k DPS.  I guess some of the posters in this thread believe build diversity is being able to outgear content... and all gear pretty much outgears MP0/MP1 now.  OP doesn't struggle to stay alive > MP1 with that EHP, but boy those elite packs take a while.  Imagine a pack of casters that you can only reach 1 at a time of in late Act 3.

Forked lightning > sleet storm.

[ProzaicMuze]

Keiser, on 31 January 2013 - 09:11 PM, said:

Peter8111, on 30 January 2013 - 10:03 AM, said:

I tried this build yesterday. It works great, but only with melee mobs. How can I deal with casters ?

You can't.

It's like Rain of Toads that you can only cast over yourself (slightly larger), and if you move, it stops damaging.  This is the reason it never gained traction when WW's coefficient got nerfed.  Sleet Storm's proc coefficient was FOUR TIMES WW's, but if you can't damage or get procs while repositioning, it's not going to be a very good build.  I have tried it.  Less than 90 seconds into the build preview video the OP gets hit by berserker slams.  Stops damaging them.  Doesn't show what this build is like in areas with many ranged units.  Tracking guys down one by one with sleet storm is pretty annoying, and will turn off most people that try this.  Unusable against single targets unless you have crazy crit/APOC.

At this point in Diablo 3's life EVERY skill is viable if you have 600k EHP (like the OP) or 200k DPS.  I guess some of the posters in this thread believe build diversity is being able to outgear content... and all gear pretty much outgears MP0/MP1 now.  OP doesn't struggle to stay alive > MP1 with that EHP, but boy those elite packs take a while.  Imagine a pack of casters that you can only reach 1 at a time of in late Act 3.

Forked lightning > sleet storm.

I'm going to assume you didn't watch the entire guide as you're implying that I hid the weaknesses of the build. I always discuss the challenges these builds will face and I am very clear about Sleet Storm's. Also, you're completely mistaken about needing "crazy crit/APoC" to use this build against single targets. My AP is completely stable against groups OR single targets. The only drain on my AP is needing to use Blizzard too often due to repositioning. Per my linked stats, I only have 12.5% Crit Chance and 10 APoC from bracers with 4 crit, a ring with 3.5 crit and Storm Crow. I'd hardly call that "crazy." Even with a 1H and source, my CM Wizard can run Sleet Storm just fine against single targets with 30% Crit and 19 APoC (also not "crazy").

Furthermore, I specifically mention the minimum recommended stats for starting MP 1 (which is much lower than what I have) while showing how far my stats can take me. I'm able to clear MP 5 comfortably (albeit slowly) and can handle the majority of packs in 6 and a few in 7. If what you were saying were true and I am clearing MP 1 due to over-gearing, then I shouldn't be sitting in MP 5 with little trouble. You might argue that being slow is an example of struggling, but that's kinda the point of these guides: finding suboptimal builds and making them work. That said, there are posts in this thread and other threads where players have used Sleet Storm successfully all the way up to MP 10.

To me, it seems like you're using the lower efficiency of this build to exaggerate the weaknesses of Sleet Storm.

Peter8111, on 30 January 2013 - 10:03 AM, said:

I tried this build yesterday. It works great, but only with melee mobs. How can I deal with casters ?

Try using the triple freeze variation using Blizzard with Frozen Solid and Frost Nova with Shatter. If you get on top of ranged elites and land Frost Nova while around trash, you can kill the trash to trigger additional Novas while Blizzard occasionally freezes them. It's usually enough to kill 1-2 (more if horde) of the pack before chasing down the straggler(s). It's even better if melee trash trigger Ice Reflect to continue freezing the running elites.

[ProzaicMuze]

Just posted the next guide for a Thunderstrike Barbarian

[Keiser]

My point was just that using sleet storm as your primary skill results in a HUGE drop in efficiency the more you have to move.  In MP10, you fight fewer monsters, so it works better there.  Yes, you can manage MP5.  With 600k EHP and 45k DPS.  That's how a hardcore character should be built.  My Wiz can key farm on MP5 with 100k EHP.  You're using extreme survivability to make the skill look good.  My argument is that using 600K EHP can make ANY skill build "work" if you have enough time.  I could just as easily make a Storm Armor guide with the same premise that it's a sub-optimal build and will "work" eventually.

Yes, people in MP10 and/or uber runs can use Sleet Storm with great effect because they don't have to move, similar in vein to CMWW builds.  I'm arguing that in MP1-5 Blizzard with Forked Lightning would be faster.

[ProzaicMuze]

Keiser, on 05 February 2013 - 02:04 AM, said:

My point was just that using sleet storm as your primary skill results in a HUGE drop in efficiency the more you have to move.  In MP10, you fight fewer monsters, so it works better there.  Yes, you can manage MP5.  With 600k EHP and 45k DPS.  That's how a hardcore character should be built.  My Wiz can key farm on MP5 with 100k EHP.  You're using extreme survivability to make the skill look good.  My argument is that using 600K EHP can make ANY skill build "work" if you have enough time.  I could just as easily make a Storm Armor guide with the same premise that it's a sub-optimal build and will "work" eventually.

Yes, people in MP10 and/or uber runs can use Sleet Storm with great effect because they don't have to move, similar in vein to CMWW builds.  I'm arguing that in MP1-5 Blizzard with Forked Lightning would be faster.

These are more reasonable assertions than previous.

I agree that Sleet Storm is less efficient, but I'm not using EHP to make the Sleet Storm look good. I'm using EHP because it is the ONLY way to make the skill viable in the presented fashion. Wizards are incredibly squishy as a result of the consistent proc nerfs and lack of reliable damage mitigation outside of CM. By not using CM in this build, I have to get a large enough health pool to actual take the hits that will trigger Ice Armor. I've been using this build for a long time and having started with 30k HP, 400 Res and 3k Armor, I can safely tell you that the build was terrible until I reached higher stats. Meanwhile I can use a CM build with the same stats and enough crit without issue.

There would be no point in using Ice Armor if I couldn't survive the hits required to make it function.

[Bagstone]

One thing I'd like to add to that:

Especially on EU, EHP gear is relatively cheap (i.e., affordable) as compared to DPS gear. Every piece of equipment that has a stupid little DPS affix on it will cost you a fortune. The EU AH is a joke sometimes, that's why I'd prefer any build that needs a bit more EHP over one that requires you to reach a certain DPS.

[ProzaicMuze]

Yeah, I've been hearing about the troubles of EU's AH economy

You'd think they'd combine ALL of the AHs given that currency conversion exists and everyone uses the same gold.