Posted 02 December 2012 - 10:53 PM
But still, I see people all around here saying "WW build is best" and such, but when I try my WW build/gear in MP5, mobs take forever to kill and elites kick my ass. Whereas with the 2H build, I just blow through everything, including elite packs, with no problems.
us . battle . net/d3/en/profile/Joey-1757/hero/22034567
I only have 3 million gold after spending ~6mil on the gear you see here. And like I said, I plow through MP5/MP6 with no problems; smashing through everything with 600k+ HotA crits and using Rend to make myself almost invincible from all the life return. And really, that's all I want to do: Farm MP5/MP6 for items, I'm not too concerned about paragon leveling as fast as possible.
Which brings me to another question: Where exactly should I farm? I've been doing Act 1 because the mobs are generally a lot easier than the other acts; most of them just being plain melee mobs with no annoying abilities or mob traits.
Posted 03 December 2012 - 05:27 AM
-- Albert Einstein
Posted 03 December 2012 - 09:25 AM
the thing abt farming is u go for low mps for speed and I can see that with your gear and skill choice that running lower mp would not be much faster. a full clear run act 3 farm should not be more than an hour. go for higher mp just for keys and organs. my barb has the same dps as you of 85k, over 100k after shout (without wotb) and I farm mp2 or 3 and I bet I can clear much faster than you, I dont even need wotb to be up anymore, i just use it on extra health packs or one with jailer, frozen affix. I have more or less same gear level and budget as you do as well. I started with 2m total then just recently made some bigger purchases like 4m IK helm but for low mp2 run, a 50k andariel visage is much better than any helm (except maybe for crit mempo but u know how ridiculously expensive this helm is).....
u cant do much with 3 mil for your current gear except for 1 thing, get a better IK belt. you can get 170-190 str belt for 300k-400k. You cannot get a vit 170+str IK belt for that price but I take 80str more str over 27vit anytime especially for only for 300k!!! choose the one with higher str, lifesteal and rend or cleave bonus since you use those 2 skill, for random roll go for fire resist or physical resist since you have both on a number of your items already.
you have to make upgrade plan, i am not sure about hota farming build but as efficient 100k+dps ww barb you want 500ish AR so if I wanna achieve that I would change your helm for 190str IK helm (around 4m buy out). now you gain so much str you can afford losing some, then replace shoulder, bracer, pants with same stat but with AR in them. it would be expensive, buy piece by piece, a good one with stat like you have now with 60-80AR, instead of buying cheaper ones with less stat then u have to upgrade it again. You can of course go for these items right away but your helm needs to be replaced anyway that much we are sure and its so much easier to start there. glove would be tricky to replace because of the good amount of vit there but if u dont need vit and the bonus set you can find many good gloves for low price, even a trifecta with low str is a few hundred Ks max. you have a good idea of what item stat is good for you except its missing AR in most of them and getting them with the same stat will be really expensive like 1-3m a piece for just a decent one (with less main stat of what you have now). a good high STR roll IK glove is very expensive too (with ias/CD you will be looking at 10m+)
Edited by orangedrop, 03 December 2012 - 09:42 AM.
Posted 03 December 2012 - 06:20 PM
I don't see how WW is "better" without spending 100m+ on gear. I tried WW in MP5 and got my ass handed to me while also doing significantly less DPS. Whereas with HotA build I just smash through everything with no problem.
go for higher mp just for keys and organs.
But in higher MP you get much more magic find...in MP6 I'm at like 260% magic find with 5 NV stacks. Unless it's REALLY better to farm lower MP with higher speed...?
Posted 03 December 2012 - 08:18 PM
But I have to agree with the other guy. If you enjoy your current build and it's keeping you alive then, by all means, stick with it. This is a game after all. But if you are really looking to get serious then yes, WW low MP is best for farming XP/Gear. HotA for single target DPS is better for Key/Ubers and I say those things ASSUMING you have the proper gear for both. Getting cheap WW gear will be worse for you than better as you'll just be having fury generation problems which will kill your build.
For farming routes, everyone seems to like Alkaizers as it's tried and true. If you want my opinion, doing the whole act won't hurt you. I figure, the longer I have 5 stacks, the more XP/Gear I'm getting. The only problems I see doing this is that you have a few extra minutes of running around which doesn't bother me too much so I don't worry about it.
The difference between acts though for farming, on MP, I'm not too sure of so maybe someone else could tell you. If I took a guess I'd say it's because you get HUGE mobs in A3. The fallen on the bridge, the Skeletons in the keep depths, the weird mobs in the killing fields and the scorpions in the Crater. I can't remember many close knit mobs like those in any other act besides maybe the cultists.
Posted 03 December 2012 - 11:15 PM
you ask people for advice and then you retaliate with 'WOW wall of text". fine don't read my post but read the others they all said the same thing. I just try to be nice to explain it more for you. and as i said too don't change it if you like it. no it doesnt take 100m gear. as i said my budget barb is only 2m and he can farm mp2 quite easily. i farm mp3 now and I can do mp4 too but the elites takes 30-60 seconds each pack and thats too long for my taste. On mp3 it dies in 15-20 seconds for me. no my gear is not 100m worth, go have a look.
main hand, bracer, chest, boots are self found. old main hand 850 dps axe 120str crit damage socket for 800k. old chest is similar with no armor bonus less resistance but 20ish more VIT and STR each (300k). bracer and boots was found by my monk before I bought any gear to re gear my barb to ww, he was old sword and board revenge build. (I got a IK boots now, if it gets updated my old boots are 140str 50 str 60AR and 12movespeed)
glove is changed i use a 70str trifecta 100k
belt is 1m but you can get one with fire res or physical resist as i explained for 200-400k and it works as well
rings is either 300k or self found I can't remember, I have many rings but I never spend more than 300k on them i just pick and choose which one i need, more dps or more defensive stats
helm is 3.5m but I was using 50k andariel visage before
IK boots is 2.5m but I still have the old boots because it has more str
even when you total all the expensive gear my gear cost 9.9 million without the gems. who said it needs to be 100m+??all my gems are from self found except for the flawless star recipe I bought it of AH for 25k. I can do mp4 with no problem I would probably be able to do mp5 with kiting and a little more care. with a new main hand (10-20m) and a better glove (10m) I will break 100k dps unbuffed and mp5 should be easy. again you don't need 100m you just need to be wise with your purchases instead of buying low level legendaries.
again i am not saying oh WW is the best. its not, if you like your current gameplay stick with it. You ask for upgrade advise I already gave it to you. Get a better IK belt for 300k. after that helm and glove is obviously bad low level legendaries get a higher grade one, glove will be very expensive though while helm is still reasonable. after that I am not sure with HOTA build bu I am guessing you want more all resist. Now you need to think as well how are you going to do ubers, hard to get life back with rend when there is only 1-2 mob at all time, yes some of them can summon mobs but thats still not reliable enough I think. how are you handling bosses? or you just skip them when farming?
Posted 04 December 2012 - 02:29 AM
Because your posts are giant walls of text with little spacing. Very hard to read.
Where exactly did I say that I didn't read it?
Is it 2 mil or "9.9" mil ?
...I'm not wearing any "low level legendaries".
Then why does everyone else say it is?
Posted 04 December 2012 - 04:32 AM
I prefer to item hunt and levelling is just a neat bonus. Right now I am WW playing at MP5-7, and my runs usually are about 20-30 minutes long. I also like to switch it up between running act 3 (keep 1-3, rakkis bridge, field of slaughter, arreat 1 till right before azmodan, keywarden) and act 2 (vault of the assassin and keywarden only) to keep monogamy from setting in. Depending on how aggressive you are with your whirlwind dps (not the tornadoes), it can go pretty fast. I also dont have any IAS on my gear right now, and focused mainly on crit and crit damage. I will be adding IAS as I can, but I really like the way I farm right now.
If you have the gear for it, HOTA spec is technically as fast as WW for most players, but the best geared WW barb will always lose to the HOTA barb in terms of single target dps. Where WW shines is against large amounts of enemies.
WW is the "best" spec for levelling paragon hands down. For farming items, what spec is best for you is actually dependent on your gear setup, and how much you are willing to spend on improving the gear enough to get the spec up and working. In terms of legendaries per run (or hour), I found that farming on MP7 as an aggressively specced WW barb is best personally. Since I dont have the IAS, I cant go the endless HOTA spec, but I tried a fusion spec tonight, and it was pretty fun. It was basically WW, but instead of having the actual WW skill, I had HOTA, and used furious charge(merciless assault) in place of OP-CA so I can still clip through enemies. It was a really fun spec to run as I got basically enough rage from the sprint tornadoes to spam HOTA decently often. Im going to stick to aggressive WW, but it was a nice change of pace.
In all honesty, the best build for item farming is whatever build you are most comfortable running a higher MP with. It isnt worth it to run MP10 (due to the insanely high health), or really to farm much past MP8, but I find that mp7 is a nice middle ground in terms of health to MP ratio.
Posted 04 December 2012 - 11:13 AM
Then why does everyone else say it is?
Because it is not the best all around end-all build. But it is the best farming build, BY FAR. And that includes Magic Finding. Magic Find or XP runs are better done at MP 0-1, unless you are so overgeared that you kill MP 2-3 monsters in exactly one single hit and thus there's no difference at all. In any other case, stick with MP 0-1.
I use both WWnado and HotA builds. I use WW to farm in mp 0-1, and HotA to farm keys/organs in MP 7. There is what I found:
In a regular run, even in a high density mob run such as Alkaizer's run, you spend more than half the time running around. The WW build, with Run like the Wind, and WW, never stop moving. Not only has increased speed from mob to mob, but also never stops to attack the big groups of mobs or get stuck in a door. You just WW through them, leaving tornados behind, and they instantly die (in low MP). Also, the increased MF does not make up for the guaranteed rares of the 5x NV.
So let's assume you are hunting for legendaries and lvl 63 chests, pants, 1h weapons and jewelry. In a given run, you roll, on average, 1 of those, hypothetically, with no MF at all, in MP0.
If you spend 5 minutes on average just to run the whole map (not fighting anyone) in your run of choice, with your regular build, you find that RltW builds (which other non-WW builds can use too, true, but it's not that common) you are saving a whole minute with your extra speed.
Now, if you spend 5 minutes on average killing mobs in, say, MP 5, you'll get 125%magic find on top of your MF, and you'll get 36% extra items, but the monsters will have 600% health. Let's say your MF from Paragon Level and Regular Magic find is 125%, and you get 5 NV (also, remember, it's easy to swap gear pieces for MF in low MP, it's not that easy in MP 0), that gives you 200% mf, plus the MP bonus. So, if you normally roll 1 (arbitrary number) items worth identifying in your run, multiplied by 4.25 (from 325% mf) and 1.36 (from the bonus items from MP). So you get 5,78, That's However, the monsters have 600% extra health. That means you'll need to hit them 3 times, instead of instantly kill them in one single hit. So you spend 3 times more minutes killing them. Your hipothetical regular 5 minutes run, is now 10 to 15 minutes. Add the running time, and you have 5,7 items worth identify, in 20 minutes. That's 0,29 items worth identify, per minute.
Let's compare that to MP0 (or 1, if you can kill all monsters in a single hit in MP1 too). You have the same 125% MF from paragon and items (you could maybe swap a piece or two for more MF, but let's leave that aside for now). You also have your NV stacked. So you have 200% MF. You kill everything in a single pass. And also, you do so in AOE, with RltW and WW. So you spend 5 minutes killing those monsters, instead of 10 to 15, and probably you can also reduce 1 minute in the whole run, from the fact all your attacks are AOE and you never get stuck on doors, but let's let that aside for a moment too. You are doing 9 minutes runs, and you get 1 (Base item) multiplied by 3 (200% mf), so you are getting 0,33% extra MF per minute. And we aren't even factoring that your AOE is better than most builds (so you kill big groups faster), that you can swap more MF gear, that 5 NV stacks give you guaranteed rares no matter how much MF you have (which favor killing speed over MF)
High MP gives you a higher chance of magic items *per mob*, but gives you a lower chance of magic items *per minute*. If we both spend 1 hour farming, and you do 2-3 runs in MP 5 in a route with 20 elite packs (killing 40 to 60 champion packs), while I do 6-7 runs in MP0 (killing 120 to 140 champion packs), I'll have way much more rares founds than you. By far. You get 40-60 guaranteed rares, plus X rares (regular drop) multiplied by 4.25 (regular 200% mf and 125% from MP), multiplied by the 40 to 60 packs you kill. While I get 120 to 140 guaranteed rares, plus X rares (regular drop) multiplied by 3 (regular 200% mf) and multiplied by 120 to 140, which is the number of packs I kill.
Posted 04 December 2012 - 04:14 PM
regardless 2m or 9.9m it is still far off from your claim of 100m to make it work for mp5. Few pieces I bought could be cheaper or I didn't even need them, like the IK boots its a downgrade for me in terms of dps, like int on my IK boots or cc reduction on my helm if I choose whatever random roll it could be cheaper, like melee attacker takes 1234 damage..... I ran mp5 succesfully last night, died once because in keep depth level 3 on that "i trap a huge monster on the next room" thing because I looked away and those nasty ogres hammers came down on me all at once. It just take too long to clear mp5, for 1 mp5 run I can do 3 mp2 run which means more loot!
dude you are using low level legendaries, you are blind as a bat and stubborn as a rock. Look at the STR roll on your IK pieces 95 92 95. It's all low level rolls.
errr 27 lightning resist on your helm? seriously? if thats a 190str IK helm I can understand.
a 300k skorn? At least get bigger crit damage or higher dps.
I'll let u get away with the glove because there is no way you can afford 190str IK glove, no offense but that goes to me too, I rather spend 20m on a new main weapon rather than a mediocre IK glove and your glove has decent VIT as I mention which is good for you.
27vit on your belt?? I hope you didn't spend more than a 100k on this belt because for 300k you can get 80 more STR instead of 27vit. Oculus ring? hardly the choice if you want to run efficient farming, at least it has armor and nice resistances there. 20 AR 28 vitality on the other ring? either choose one with bigger defensive bonus or forgo them all together for average damage 25-40, you can find some decent ones for 200k or less
your shoulder bracer pants would not even cost 100k each since they don't have all resist
so where did your 6m went? tyriel's might is 1-2mil maybe, bracer shoulder pants skorn would not cost more than 500k together. 200-300k on amulet? 100k on the yellow ring? so you spent half of your budget on low grade legendaries.
here watch this
this will help you understand how to buy items
or check kripparian channel, he has lots of good info on barb, he played both rend and ww
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