117 replies to this topic

[Maffia]

I have the same amount of proof as those suggesting that duping is rampant.

Also sure others make a profit, but if done deliberately it is those instating that will make the biggest profits by far, and they aren't going to scream and shout about it.

As I said before people as a whole are stupid, and it only takes a little to start a run on things, see real life.

Edited by Maffia, 13 November 2012 - 06:36 PM.

[ruksak]

mannercookie, on 13 November 2012 - 05:59 PM, said:

ruksak, on 13 November 2012 - 05:50 PM, said:

mannercookie, on 13 November 2012 - 05:40 PM, said:

I thought these were very isolated cases? Now your telling me I'm the 50th person to bring up cases of duping in the last 4 months?

Clarify please?

ISOLATED; Having minimal contact or little in common with others.

Though occurring multiple times, these cases do not share a common point of origin, nor are the culprits related in any way.

Okay as much as I enjoy talking to you about this matter, if you routinely searched for 1b+ barb items to upgrade into or resell with groups of people also doing the same thing everyday constantly throughout the day, you would understand what we are seeing.

I have responded to you enough times and it's going nowhere except you citing me definitions of the English language.

good luck to you sir.

edit: there is plenty of evidence out there, it's not hard to see. I'm sure some other ppl who don't want duping to get out of control can help show more evidence for the skeptics.

Your evidence is evidence of something other than what you're implying.

You haven't come out and said it, which I find kinda odd.

You're implying that there is a bonafide method of in-game item duping. I have refuted that innocuous implication quite logically. As in, if this was true, one person could make it quite obvious, let alone the damage several people could do if they knew how to do this.

If this was fact, it would be undeniable.  We would be seeing something far more compelling than a smattering of items here and there, in small numbers.

That is what you're implying, correct? That there is an in-game method of duplication being exercised?

Edited by ruksak, 13 November 2012 - 06:26 PM.

[Gheed2010]

mannercookie, on 13 November 2012 - 05:39 PM, said:

Duped items destroy the game's economy, hence the game.

Not necessarily true - the Federal Reserve creates hundreds of billions out of thin air every year ("quantitative easing") and the idea is to help the economy.

[Xenocow]

ruksak, on 13 November 2012 - 04:32 PM, said:

These are rollbacks. It starts by getting two of one item via roll back. Slide it to a friend....rollback....now there's 4......slide it to a friend....rollback....now there's 8.

Eventually you run out of friends and it stops.

Actually, its a Bug thats being abused.
And only a Handful people know about it... earning shitloads of Gold and RL Cash.
Thats also the reason why there are only 15-20 Weapons, and not thousands.

They sell one for maximum Profit, then they sell the next one... and so on.

The Rollback Dupe is a hoax, until someone posts a Video about it i dont believe in it.
Blizzard aint stupid.

[Bourrelle]

Gheed2010, on 13 November 2012 - 06:33 PM, said:

Not necessarily true - the Federal Reserve creates hundreds of billions out of thin air every year ("quantitative easing") and the idea is to help the economy.

Quantitative easing is MUCH more complicated than duping in diablo3. hahahaha you shoudn't compare those two. Yes, sometimes printing money can help in VERY specific situation but most of the time, IT IS A VERY BAD idea... but i mean. A very very bad idea....

[Kaeron]

Oo im suprised this hasnt been fixed yet

[xrmb]

Someone explain to me how the rollback works. You load your char up with nice items, sell them, give them to friends, call blizzard and say you were hacked and they give you your items back from lets say yesterday?
I understand blizzard doesnt care for things that go through the RMAH since they profit from it... but all this sounds like a conspiracy theory to me.

[mannercookie]

ruksak, on 13 November 2012 - 06:25 PM, said:

mannercookie, on 13 November 2012 - 05:59 PM, said:

ruksak, on 13 November 2012 - 05:50 PM, said:

mannercookie, on 13 November 2012 - 05:40 PM, said:

I thought these were very isolated cases? Now your telling me I'm the 50th person to bring up cases of duping in the last 4 months?

Clarify please?

ISOLATED; Having minimal contact or little in common with others.

Though occurring multiple times, these cases do not share a common point of origin, nor are the culprits related in any way.

Okay as much as I enjoy talking to you about this matter, if you routinely searched for 1b+ barb items to upgrade into or resell with groups of people also doing the same thing everyday constantly throughout the day, you would understand what we are seeing.

I have responded to you enough times and it's going nowhere except you citing me definitions of the English language.

good luck to you sir.

edit: there is plenty of evidence out there, it's not hard to see. I'm sure some other ppl who don't want duping to get out of control can help show more evidence for the skeptics.

Your evidence is evidence of something other than what you're implying.

You haven't come out and said it, which I find kinda odd.

You're implying that there is a bonafide method of in-game item duping. I have refuted that innocuous implication quite logically. As in, if this was true, one person could make it quite obvious, let alone the damage several people could do if they knew how to do this.

If this was fact, it would be undeniable.  We would be seeing something far more compelling than a smattering of items here and there, in small numbers.

That is what you're implying, correct? That there is an in-game method of duplication being exercised?

A month and half ago the first real signs of "duping" that seemed to be much more than just rollbacks popped up, for those of you who don't know, Rollbacks aren't simply dump your items and tell blizzard your hacked lol, Rollbacks are very rarely granted.

The first real mass signs of an item being duped was in 1.04, when an echoing fury with 1179 dps, str, and lifesteal popped up on the AH, RMAH all at the same time. I believe at one point there was 6-8 on the AH/RMAH. Everyone was talking for a while and it just kind of faded out, people naturally assumed this was some kind of creative rollback abuse by a few people.

A lot of people, myself included did not buy these items even though they were at amazing prices since we knew they were duped. There was some forums posts, etc, etc, nothing really ever came of it and it died out.

Slowly since then there has been more and more duped items trickling into the scene and most recently there has been lots of new sightings of multiple kinds of high-end barb gear, Chests/Bracers/Weapons, who knows what else is out there and has been duped.

Whoever is releasing duped items are being smarter and only putting one up at a time, The thing is even when they sell dupes for $250, there are people sniping that item to re-sell for 1b on GAH, so now it's happening again with these lacunis and this mace, the same thing that happened with the echoing a month or so ago.

My assumption is that this time around they've gotten a little smarter at the whole duping process, they aren't just duping a single item and releasing it in masses (Selling it once every 2-3 days will still make it popup on the GAH/RMAH together if the value of the item is over 500m).

They are instead now duping multiple different items and spacing them out more and looking for new items to dupe.

If all these copies of these items were made because Blizzard is just plain retarded and didn't see that the rollbacks were the same items over and over again, that just makes me think there is even higher of a chance that there is not only duping but duping with rollbacks going on as well.

Edited by mannercookie, 13 November 2012 - 07:15 PM.

[brx]

ruksak, on 13 November 2012 - 06:25 PM, said:

mannercookie, on 13 November 2012 - 05:59 PM, said:

ruksak, on 13 November 2012 - 05:50 PM, said:

mannercookie, on 13 November 2012 - 05:40 PM, said:

I thought these were very isolated cases? Now your telling me I'm the 50th person to bring up cases of duping in the last 4 months?

Clarify please?

ISOLATED; Having minimal contact or little in common with others.

Though occurring multiple times, these cases do not share a common point of origin, nor are the culprits related in any way.

Okay as much as I enjoy talking to you about this matter, if you routinely searched for 1b+ barb items to upgrade into or resell with groups of people also doing the same thing everyday constantly throughout the day, you would understand what we are seeing.

I have responded to you enough times and it's going nowhere except you citing me definitions of the English language.

good luck to you sir.

edit: there is plenty of evidence out there, it's not hard to see. I'm sure some other ppl who don't want duping to get out of control can help show more evidence for the skeptics.

Your evidence is evidence of something other than what you're implying.

You haven't come out and said it, which I find kinda odd.

You're implying that there is a bonafide method of in-game item duping. I have refuted that innocuous implication quite logically. As in, if this was true, one person could make it quite obvious, let alone the damage several people could do if they knew how to do this.

If this was fact, it would be undeniable.  We would be seeing something far more compelling than a smattering of items here and there, in small numbers.

That is what you're implying, correct? That there is an in-game method of duplication being exercised?

you realise your only argument of why there is no method to dupe is completely stupid right? Maybe You would be very obvious if you knew the method, but maybe there is people with more than half a brain and a plan out there? Your argument is invalid.

Edited by brx, 13 November 2012 - 07:44 PM.

[brx]

Gheed2010, on 13 November 2012 - 06:33 PM, said:

mannercookie, on 13 November 2012 - 05:39 PM, said:

Duped items destroy the game's economy, hence the game.

Not necessarily true - the Federal Reserve creates hundreds of billions out of thin air every year ("quantitative easing") and the idea is to help the economy.

You don't see it yet but the problem with paper money and creating money out of thin air etc is very well documented. Every time it ended badly to say the least. It will probably be the same for the dollar.

[brx]

double post sry

Edited by brx, 13 November 2012 - 07:43 PM.

[ruksak]

brx, on 13 November 2012 - 07:33 PM, said:

you realise your only argument of why there is no method to dupe is completely stupid right? Maybe You would be very obvious if you knew the method, but maybe there is people with more than half a brain and a plan out there? Your argument is invalid.

Greed knows no bounds. That is my assertion. That if there was a viable method for duping, we would all be curling in horror as the game's economy saw itself wrecked with great speed. People successfully accomplished this with Gems just weeks ago and it took hours before the market collapsed into the dirt. The issue was apparently rectified, at least on the US end.

Also, could we please discuss this without insulting each others intelligence. There are going to be a wide array of varying opinions on this matter and I don't see cause for stooping to "you iz stoopids" verbiage.

[brx]

ruksak, on 13 November 2012 - 07:54 PM, said:

brx, on 13 November 2012 - 07:33 PM, said:

you realise your only argument of why there is no method to dupe is completely stupid right? Maybe You would be very obvious if you knew the method, but maybe there is people with more than half a brain and a plan out there? Your argument is invalid.

Greed knows no bounds. That is my assertion. That if there was a viable method for duping, we would all be curling in horror as the game's economy saw itself wrecked with great speed. People successfully accomplished this with Gems just weeks ago and it took hours before the market collapsed into the dirt. The issue was apparently rectified, at least on the US end.

OR they could want to make a lot of money and not succumb to the urge of screwing it up stupidly. This hypothesis seems way better to me, and at least can't be dismissed that easily either.

[mannercookie]

ruksak, on 13 November 2012 - 07:54 PM, said:

brx, on 13 November 2012 - 07:33 PM, said:

you realise your only argument of why there is no method to dupe is completely stupid right? Maybe You would be very obvious if you knew the method, but maybe there is people with more than half a brain and a plan out there? Your argument is invalid.

Greed knows no bounds. That is my assertion. That if there was a viable method for duping, we would all be curling in horror as the game's economy saw itself wrecked with great speed. People successfully accomplished this with Gems just weeks ago and it took hours before the market collapsed into the dirt. The issue was apparently rectified, at least on the US end.

Also, could we please discuss this without insulting each others intelligence. There are going to be a wide array of varying opinions on this matter and I don't see cause for stooping to "you iz stoopids" verbiage.

Whoever has figured out duping, they are literally sitting on a potentially 1-2k usd per day income, possibly more?

That's a lot of money and incentive to stay quiet and not let items out in a rush like it was done with the echoing furies.

Their only mistake is they don't quiet understand the games economy fully and overplayed it because they should've been duping items that are worth 600m and selling for 500m instead of duping 1b++ items and selling them for 500m.

Otherwise they would've flown under the radar entirely, the problem with the above is that in order to understand the true value of the game's items as it fluctuates is to actually play and understand the game fully, which I assume the dupers are not doing.

Edited by mannercookie, 13 November 2012 - 08:14 PM.

[ruksak]

brx, on 13 November 2012 - 08:03 PM, said:

OR they could want to make a lot of money and not succumb to the urge of screwing it up stupidly. This hypothesis seems way better to me, and at least can't be dismissed that easily either.

you make a good point, and it sounds valid.

However, I would point out that these methods spread like wildfire when discovered, despite the best efforts of some whom proliferate the practice.

So I would think if some exploit was uncovered, it would get around. Stupid and smart, the restrained and the unrestrained alike would be passing the method on, making mistakes, succumbing to greed.

I cite both human nature and the lack of any serious cause upon the item market as reasons for not fearing a rampant outbreak of duping. Eventually something, some viable exploit will leak and we'll know it. Without any argument, we'll all know it.

At this point it seems premature to concern ourselves beyond just chuckling at a few knuckle heads that may likely get their accounts banned for their greed.

[mannercookie]

There is two ways to get godly high-end gear in this game.

You swipe your credit card for thousands of dollars and buy the best gear at face value

or

You play the AH and learn to flip by understanding what the true value of items are worth and what the price currently people are willing to pay.

Because of the latter is why dupes show up and get noticed, dupers are selling items for $250 that are worth billions, and people are buying to flip for a quick 300-500m profit on GAH.

[ruksak]

mannercookie, on 13 November 2012 - 08:13 PM, said:

Whoever has figured out duping, they are literally sitting on a potentially 1-2k usd per day income, possibly more?

That is a frightening prospect.

[Chiron]

xrmb, on 13 November 2012 - 06:54 PM, said:

Someone explain to me how the rollback works. You load your char up with nice items, sell them, give them to friends, call blizzard and say you were hacked and they give you your items back from lets say yesterday?
I understand blizzard doesnt care for things that go through the RMAH since they profit from it... but all this sounds like a conspiracy theory to me.

Here's one description of the rollback-dupe process, no idea if this really works or not:

(removed link due to second thoughs but here's a crude description)

You use a VPN service to "hack" your own account (basically you login from a totally different IP than what you normally use). You transfer your items to another character who then sells them to a third character and maybe even further than that. You then log back in to your character number 1 and file a ticket to Blizzard to do a rollback. Since the items are no longer in the possession of character number 2, they don't remove the items as character number 3 might be a completely legit player who just bought the items in good faith. If Blizzard then does a rollback, you effectively have duplicated your items.

Edited by Chiron, 13 November 2012 - 09:02 PM.

[ruksak]

Chiron, on 13 November 2012 - 08:21 PM, said:

xrmb, on 13 November 2012 - 06:54 PM, said:

Someone explain to me how the rollback works. You load your char up with nice items, sell them, give them to friends, call blizzard and say you were hacked and they give you your items back from lets say yesterday?
I understand blizzard doesnt care for things that go through the RMAH since they profit from it... but all this sounds like a conspiracy theory to me.

Here's one description of the rollback-dupe process, no idea if this really works or not:

aye....I'm not sure linking exploits is the best idea either.

[Chiron]

ruksak, on 13 November 2012 - 08:36 PM, said:

aye....I'm not sure linking exploits is the best idea either.

True, thought about that for a second. But still, anyone can just google it up if they want so it's not like it's very secret anyway and the method described in the link takes a lot of effort so I don't think many random players will even think about attempting to use it.