18 replies to this topic

[Sealteam]

Here's how it works.

Monks deal damage from two abilities, Fists of Thunder, and Sweeping Winds - Cyclone. Fists of Thunder deals Lightning damage. Cyclones from Sweeping Winds are the (vast) majority of the skill's damage, which are Lightning damage. The base Sweeping Winds damage remains Physical.

So, almost all of your damage is dealt as Lightning damage.


Therefore:
If your paper dps is less than your new damage, after you multiply your new damage by the 'Lightning skills deal x% more damage' on your shiny new WKL, then WKL is better than your old weapon.

That is:
If New Dps * 1.(Lightning Skill Damage%) > Old Dps then you are dealing more damage.


E.g, my monk's DPS with a 960 dps, 21% Lightning Skill Damage, socketed WKL is 101k. I purchased this WKL for 7mil (with a nice chunk of spirit regen to boot). A 1112 dps sword is 150dex, 58% crit damage and a socket (worth approx. 150mil) nets me 119k damage.

101*1.21 = 122.21 > 119

So the 7mil weapon beats the 150mil weapon.

Ergo, go buy a Won Khim Lau before prices skyrocket.

[pr3ach3r]

I'm really curious about this as I also have a WKL which deals 4k dmg less than my current axe.

DPS with axe 50k, DPS with WKL (25% lightning dmg) 46k.

So if I multiply 46k*1.25=57.5k dmg, is this correct? pretty insane...

And what about the 6% straight lightning damage from WKL? how does that factor?

[RenescoD3]

Orly?

Yeah i scrapped 3 of those int brimstones.. that would been nice to know a few weeks back...

[Sealteam]

pr3ach3r, on 29 October 2012 - 12:44 PM, said:

I'm really curious about this as I also have a WKL which deals 4k dmg less than my current axe.

DPS with axe 50k, DPS with WKL (25% lightning dmg) 46k.

So if I multiply 46k*1.25=57.5k dmg, is this correct? pretty insane...

And what about the 6% straight lightning damage from WKL? how does that factor?

If what I've read is true, the latest patch fixed % Elemental Damage affixes to work on weapons which already deal elemental damage, and is correctly displayed on your paper dps. So, basically it's just a 6% weapon damage buff.

[m4st0d0n]

Sealteam, on 29 October 2012 - 12:58 PM, said:

If what I've read is true, the latest patch fixed % Elemental Damage affixes to work on weapons which already deal elemental damage, and is correctly displayed on your paper dps. So, basically it's just a 6% weapon damage buff.

I'd rather hear official confirmation on that. No such thing in patch notes, just checked.

RenescoD3, on 29 October 2012 - 12:45 PM, said:

Yeah i scrapped 3 of those int brimstones.. that would been nice to know a few weeks back...

No worries, w/o socket and/or high dps WKL prices won't get much higher. And good monks knew this always, I've sold a few nicely rolled, socketed WKLs on rmah right after 1.04.

Edited by m4st0d0n, 29 October 2012 - 01:18 PM.

[Morphos]

It's actually slightly better than this, because the +5-6% lightning damage on it converts your physical damage attacks to lightning damage. Any barb who uses a cold damage SOJ can tell you this, since that item makes all your attacks chill enemies. That means that the base damage of sweeping winds is also doing lightning damage and getting multiplied as well.

As for what the +5-6% lightning damage does, it adds that % of your physical damage. So it works on the base damage of the won khim lau, but not the lightning damage, the physical damage of your other weapon (either just the base damage on an elemental weapon or all of it on a black weapon) and any bonus damage you might have on jewelry.

[KdLoL]

WKL has always been expensive if its good roll, up to like few hundred mil, I was able to get my hands on one that is like, 860 dps, 100 crit, 2.7 ls for 70m a few weeks ago, definitely seeing bigger numbers, like 200k-300k fot crit

[thundersteele]

Morphos, on 29 October 2012 - 01:29 PM, said:

It's actually slightly better than this, because the +5-6% lightning damage on it converts your physical damage attacks to lightning damage. Any barb who uses a cold damage SOJ can tell you this, since that item makes all your attacks chill enemies. That means that the base damage of sweeping winds is also doing lightning damage and getting multiplied as well.

Afaik this is not true. The cold damage might add a chill effect to all attacks, but it doesn't convert them to cold attacks.


@OP
It's good to remind people of some things, but this is certainly not new and WKL prices are not suddenly going to skyrocket.

[lou_bot]

I usually use a Skorn with 1163,7 damage, my WKL has 942,5 and adds a 24% bonus to spell that do lighting damage. The other weapon is a Echoing Fury with 1060,9 dps ... final dps with Skorn is 43491,39 and with EF + WKL  I reach only 30579,48 ... can't understand what's the best choice with this gear ...

[ballon]

@lou_bot
Stop putting gold into legendary and start working on your other gear. Skip the twohander idea, if you played with it versus dual wield you should already see the problems with it.

KdLoL, on 29 October 2012 - 02:45 PM, said:

WKL has always been expensive if its good roll [...]

That's the problem. To outpass other stuff avaible for a reasonable price you'd need a socket and crit damage on that weapon. With this combination you can't get either lifesteal or life on hit. If you want on of those you'll have to pass on lots of potential damage.

So unless you can get your life recovery elsewhere you're better off using a rare crit damage + socketed + life recovery weapon with an equal amount dex to WKL.

Sealteam, on 29 October 2012 - 12:28 PM, said:

The base Sweeping Winds damage remains Physical.

Don't underestimate that part, while the cyclones deal a decent amount of damage (20% weapon damage) it also ticks for 45% all the time. And the bonus damage during Blinding Flash is holy (beacon of ytar passive ftw!). Actually i'd use only half or three quarter of the bonus for your overall damage calculation -> 20% lightning skill damage ~= 10% or 15% overall damage increase.

[Valt3r7]

I am up with Ballon on this one. I've guestimated that not more than 70-80% top of your dmg is lightning. No hard date about that ofc, but that's what I've come up with from my own experience.

With that being said, WKL is still the absolute best offhand possible. I have an ok roll one (860dps, 20light dmg, 90cd and socket, for near perfect rolls prices are way out of my range) and I love it. Nothing like seeing your FoT crits for 500-600 even 700k . Life recovery starts being a problem with only one slot for ll, but I intend to get a decent amulet with atleast 600-700 LoH and I hope that will do it for now.

But I don't see prices going higher than that. Really good rolled ones are already going for billions.

[IcyInsanity]

i wish the dmg calculator in D3 was correct. But since the start i havent followed the numbers on my dmg calculator..
there is a program called d3 dmg meter. i used it once to see what my dmg is in real, and i might use it to increase my dps more.

Edited by IcyInsanity, 30 October 2012 - 08:54 AM.

[KdLoL]

i don't understand why we don't have built in damage meter, will make the game so much more fun

i heard they ban ppl who use addons...

[Grimy_Bunyip]

Ywanna clarify two points here.

first is that cold SoJs do not chill or slow while using thunderclap or cyclone.
both are lightning skills, and as such override all elemental damage into lightning.

this is easy to test, get a cold soj or even a cheapo frostburn.
punch some mobs with cyclone thunderclap, there will be no chill or slow effect.

try again with a skill that has no element such as deadly reach and you will see the cold debuff

this data may the wind stack on cyclone is indeed lightning and thus does not apply effects from cold damage.
the other explanation is that cold damage is applied on proc, in which csse the wind stack may be physical.

either way, cold soj are not useful with elemental skills such as thunderclap and cyclone

Edited by Grimy_Bunyip, 30 October 2012 - 03:39 PM.

[Xandor]

Hey guys,

currently this is my gear: http://eu.battle.net...967/hero/554773

Would it make sense if I changed my main hand weapon to a WKL with 6%lighting damage, 21% more lighting damage 155dex, 44chd, and a socket, as I am currently bidding for one and is at 30mill. Considering it may go up to 50mill, would it be an upgrade, or a downgrade compared to the one I'm running now?

Edit: Okay, the one I was bidding for was sold for a higher price than I bid for, now I see ones with same stats as above one without the chd. Would my damage drop, or would stay the same, or would it be still more if I bought one?

Thanks

Edited by Xandor, 31 October 2012 - 05:12 AM.

[Coho]

What main-hand weapon damage type would one use if running won khim lau? Physical damage, lightning damage, doesn't matter?

-found old thread with some maths, http://www.diablofan...im-lau-testing/

Edited by Coho, 31 October 2012 - 06:58 AM.

[Diavolo222]

I dont get the point of this thread.Everybody knows its a good weapon, possibly the best off-hand coupled with a good echoing fury.And prices wont skyrocket since any legendary in the game is cheap as hell now, especially decent ones, and the good ones which are rare, are the ones that are worth hundreds of millions, and they will always be worth that.

Edited by Diavolo222, 31 October 2012 - 02:47 PM.

[MxoxoSSG]

^

lolwat

[Lastzoul]

wkl is the best offhand atm