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  • posted a message on A Few Ideas: Item Decay, Gear, and Weapon Tuning. Yay or Nay?
    Well yes, every solution to something always has at least one con. In case of the Fast trade idea, the con is that you can no longer instantly buyout entire gear. But I'd say there's at least as much people that consider this a pro as there are who think it's a con. People have been whining all the time how it sux that you can instantly buy 100% of your gear through AH. Well, this is actually a solution to that problem. But I agree that to many players this sounds like a bad thing.

    The question is if the pro's outweight the cons. I think they definitely do.

    But I have no illusions. This idea of mine is never gonna get implemented in D3. But I'm currently working for a indie company who's heavily in debate if they want to include an AH in their whole game design or not. The AH could be a really good thing in ARPG's. Blizzard was just the first to do it, and it failed because it was a leap in the unknown. Other companies now have the opportunity to identify the problems with it and design a better system from scratch. But it is not an easy task.

    As for achie points being spendable it is something that I've been thinking about a while ago as well. And I think it's not a good idea to make them spendable on something that makes your character more powerful or to unlock more content.

    That way you make the achievement system a must, and there's too many players who don't like achievement style content. Achievements are in all games meant as something optional. Not as one of the main content types.

    If they would wanna make achie point spendable the rewards should be cosmetic/collector based. Not power.

    The idea is already there, you get banner patterns etc for completing achies. Now they should just add more that you can buy with achie points, so you actually have the choice what you want to unlock first, and more people might be motivated to hunt for achies.

    I'm thinking:

    - dye unlocks
    - titles
    - transmog'ish stuff
    - token to change your characters gender
    etc


    They could however introduce repeatable achies that are in line with the main goal in D3 --> killing hordes of monsters.

    - Every 10 unique rare spawn mobs killed = 10 achie points
    - Every 10 events completed = 10 achie points
    - 5 Boss kills = 10 achie points
    - 500 mob massacre = 10 achie points

    Things like that. Then you also get achie points by just playing the game like everyone does. But you just get the rewards at a slower pace than people who are actively hunting special achievements. This way achiements still remain somewhat optional and they could add a few minor power rewards to it.
    Posted in: Diablo III General Discussion
  • posted a message on A Few Ideas: Item Decay, Gear, and Weapon Tuning. Yay or Nay?
    Quote from HeyseusKristos

    People really only have jumped on the item decay idea of the 3 ideas I mentioned. Some liked it, many didn't. Let me share some of my original motivation behind the idea. Like someone else mentioned, BoA is coming to D3, what the developers and CM's have been saying along with the fansites, its not hard to see the big neon lights spelling out "Bound to Account" invading our eyes, gears, and Diablo series. I'm not a fan of BoA. Its a lazy mechanic. Not looking back, looking forward: My idea is not based on the current loot system. Its based on what I believe the new system will look like and I would want it introduced in the new system when the new items come out in the expansion. Its not meant to effect the current gear because when the new gear comes out, everything currently will be made worthless anyway. Every online economy goes through this when an xpac is released. This was for a fresh start in the xpac. I suppose I should have clarified this so we didn't have to keep looking in the past. Item decay is meant as a counter to BoA which I don't like but I know its coming. I don't mind crafted BoA, but I don't want to farm and loot BoA.

    I have only seen a few people mention other ideas, would like to hear more opinions on them.

    As for that fast trade idea. God please don't let them do that mess. The first time I have a hardcore death because I am getting AH spam, I'm rage quitting. I really don't want to have to be prohibited from farming because I just posted an item on the AH. I put it on the AH so I didn't have to be hasselled and do the dance. If I wanted to do the dance I would be in trade chat or posting gear in the trade forums. It would be nice if they would have "trade" as game type instead of just brawling, monster slaying, and key warden. Even nicer is if they had a dedicated area for up to 10 people to hang out with their chars where trading, dueling,and chatting was done. Add a pvp gear vendor and boom, a sense of community is born.


    What's the difference with the current pop-ups "item x got sold". It also distracts you from playing and might get you killed in hardcore.

    There's also an easy fix for that problem: just a simple popup saying "Received new fast trade offer" without any details so you don't have to further read anything. The moment you received a FT offer there could be a 15-20min delay in the timer to increase the AH cut %. So you have plenty of time to finish your current game and go check the offers before you start new run. Or drop the idea of increasing AH cut altogether and just make a FT offer expire after 30 min. So you don't have to worry about the increasing AH cut at all.

    The current way the AH works is terrible, and for that reason I havent used it in 6 months or so apart from buying gems.

    I hate that for every item I want to put up for sale I have to waste a shitload of time filling in the affixes and numbers, scanning for similar items, seeing what's the lowest price. Then changing the numbers to 85% because else you don't find any similar items. It's like a job man. Seriously, it's not fun at all. And I'm not even talking about flipping yet, i'm just talking about putting your drops up for sale.

    WTS shift + click takes me 1 second instead of 3 minutes to put a item up for sale. A mediocre item in the AH is lost in thousands of similar items from the whole continent while with WTS x you got the attention of 100+ people in trade/general chat right away. You don't have to check any prices, losing time filling in affixes. The buyers will do it for you, come up with an offer and you can continue playing :D

    People think AH is easy mode but it's not. Not at all. It just takes away the need of social interaction when trading, what many people actually consider a bad thing as well.

    With the Fast Trade system it becomes much easier. Finish up your game. Check offer. "Does the price sound fair to me?". Accept/Decline. Done. Took you 10sec max to decide before you're in a new game again.

    Same with putting item for sale. Don't have to put in the affixes etc, because there is no buyout price you can check. All you have to do is decide "What's a fair starting bid?" put in the numbers click ok and done. No more 3+ min to check out what is the lowest buyout price on similar items...

    To comment on your idea#3:

    It requires the skill system to be balanced better in the first place. Then they also need to balance the new legendary items that affect skills with them, and then after that they have to balance it even further with your skill enhancement ideas.

    It would get too complex and impossible to balance is what I'm thinking. Don't really have anything else to say about it :D

    I'm sure there's a good idea in it, but I just really don't see it happening

    I agree though that different characters should feel special and have some different purpose. To motivate people making multiple characters. This has a really good effect on the trading economy as well cause it keeps a lot more items out of economy.

    And the freedom of the skill system kind of takes away the purpose of making alts. While in D2 for example, when I was locked in a skilltree, yea it sucked in some cases, but it also kept economy stable. Because in D3 many people have only a main character and don't play alts so they need only 1 set of gear that stays out of economy. But in D2 I had probably more than 30 characters, who all had a different purpose and a different spec. Requiring different gear with different stats.

    Not only did my 30+ chars in d2 keep 6x more items out of economy than my 5 chars in d3. They also kept a broader type of items out of economy, because different classes used different item affixes etc. There were no useless items in D2 and useless items didn't clutter up the trading interface. Think about it, there's billions of items on the AH that nobody wants. They only make it harder to find what you actually want. Requiring you to fill in all 6 affixes in the AH to find what you're looking for, and taking up a lot of your time in the process... :/

    We need more incentive to play more than 5 characters. Hell, a lot of people already need more incentive to play even more than 1 character. And for that reason account shared paragon system is actually a good idea, add stat allocation to that and there's even more difference between characters. That's really going in the right direction.
    Posted in: Diablo III General Discussion
  • posted a message on A Few Ideas: Item Decay, Gear, and Weapon Tuning. Yay or Nay?
    Quote from Bagstone

    Quote from Stellar

    A second thing that could be done is my idea of fixing the AH:

    - Remove Buyout so you can no longer be undercut by your entire continent.
    - Add a option to buyers to send a "Fast Trade", When accepted by the seller, the seller will have only 5% AH cut instead of 15% and the trade is completed right away.

    This has a few positive effects:

    - The seller doesn't have to wait 12 hours to get his gold if he gets a fast trade he is happy with.
    - The buyer can still have a nearly instant buy, if his FT offer is a fair deal.
    - Instead of competing with the entire continent when trying to sell something, the competition is now between the buyers who need to come up with a fair deal asap. This keeps prices more stable and fair.
    - AH bots are less effective, because they can no longer get items very cheap by bidding in the last second... Because the deal is in the sellers hands, the seller needs to accept if the price is fair or not. If it's not a top-end item, bots won't bid. And if it's a good wanted item, then there will be FT offers before auction ends, so players can actually compete with bots to get good/fair deals.
    - People can no longer buy entire gear from AH instantly by using buyout buttons, so some people might actually try finding some gear themself first and then go to the AH for the last few pieces.

    Instead of trying to be the lowest seller, and fucking up the economy as a result, the trade system and economy is now in the hands of the buyers, while the final decision about a trade is still in the hands of the sellers. The trade system changes from "Whatever is the lowest price..." to "what do I think is a fair price?"


    This actually sounds like an awesome idea. At first I was like "nah, it doesn't work because the next bid has to be 5% higher anyways" and whatever, but if you think about it, the entire AH interaction would change. There's no point in waiting for the last second to bid on an item, it might be gone by then. I think the incentive needs to be higher, and there needs to be a decaying effect (otherwise the seller will just wait for 1 minute before the auction ends to save the 10% increased AH fee). Like, the earlier you accept a bid, the less AH fees you pay, and the max AH fee should be raised to something like 30% or so.

    It could work and could potentially solve a lot of problems.


    That is indeed a nice addition to my idea :D From buyer perspective I think the incentive is there because you always have the feeling that someone might bid and that the seller might accept the deal. So you try to come up with a offer that sounds fair to you rather than trying to get the item for as cheap as possible :D Because you really want the seller to accept.

    But indeed there needs to be more incentive for the seller to accept. Else the incentive for buyer to come up with good offer is also diminished if they know they will wait for last minute anyway. Then the bots are back in the game as well.

    Really nice idea to make AH cut bigger the longer you wait. I think it's a pretty solid system that way :D However there are also changes needed to the over-supply thingy to make the game better. More things to make gear go out of the trade economy.

    I'm thinking:

    1) more incentive to play alt characters (also multiple of the same class). The more alt characters people have, the more mediocre gear goes out of trade economy.
    2) Reintroduce armor slots on followers. Again making mediocre gear have another use, taking a lot of items out of the economy.
    3) Upgrading gear at the cost of making it BoA, also takes items out of trade economy.
    Posted in: Diablo III General Discussion
  • posted a message on A Few Ideas: Item Decay, Gear, and Weapon Tuning. Yay or Nay?
    Quote from safka

    A first step would be equipment upgrading at the cost of making it BoA. Blizz is already working on this.

    Interesting, can you post a link to confirm this?


    I believe it was in the interview with Archon. Lemme see if I can find it.

    edit: Couldn't find where I originally read it, but it just got confirmed in the full transcript of diablofans interview that they're working on item upgrading and reintroducing the mystic.

    It could ofcourse be implemented in many different ways. for example the mystic enchanting your gear is also a form of "upgrading your gear".

    I guess if they're gonna implement upgrading it's gonna be the mystic. Cause they also already said that the mystic is coming back in the future. They said it again in the diablofans interview aparently cause it's stated in the highlights post.
    Posted in: Diablo III General Discussion
  • posted a message on A Few Ideas: Item Decay, Gear, and Weapon Tuning. Yay or Nay?
    The reason why economy is fucked up is because the AH makes trading too easy. When everyone throws his stuff on the AH and you can undercut each other then items with high drop rate will become worthless pretty fast. While really good/rare items keep increasing in value. This creates a wall where a normal player can never ever get any good items by just playing the game. And on the other hand they can instantly buy full mediocre gear which is already better than anything they can get from drops. So every normal player is stuck with an unrewarding game and only the elitists and AH flippers or botters can enjoy going for gear upgrades regularly.

    With the AH, your items are competing with your entire continent server (americas, europe, asia) so prices drop too fast. While only items that are impossible to get from drops yourself have value and keep increasing in value because of botters. They are being controlled by botters and flippers because no regular player can ever get his hands on something valued unless they won the lottery.

    In D2 economy was fine because:

    - No undercutting. Prices remained stable based upon rarity/drop rate of the item. Trading was based on offers you get rather than prices you set.
    - Compete only with a few other sellers in tradegames. Not the entire fucking continent. Again keeping prices stable.
    - Because trading required you to actually do something and have some social interaction, many people just kept items for alts. Again making prices remain more stable because there was less over-supply. (The same way the HC AH on D3 is more stable because gear goes out of the economy because of deaths --> less supply = less undercutting = more stable prices)
    - Items had less RNG. (uniques didn't have random stats. A shako was always a good drop and had always around the same value)
    - There was no wall between cheap mediocre gear and items you can never afford. There were ways to slowly build up to rare items like high runes. (my tactic was just to farm mephi for shako's/gazes etc. Trade a couple of those for a stormshield or likely valued items. Then trade those for ist runes and eventually building up towards high runes and runewords, just by farming mephi for items that had a decent droprate and thus I wasn't bound to winning the lottery.) Trading that way was actually fun, and part of playing the game. Scanning through some text based AH all day and trying to flip items is boring and feels like a job. So it's not part of playing the game.

    In MMO's an AH works because:

    - continents are divided in different servers so your items are only competing with a small part of your continent. Keeping prices more stable.
    - Items obtained in MMO's come from different places and from different mobs. Also from different content types. Not every player is farming the same type of loot, again reducing the amount of people you are competing with when putting up your farmed items for sale. While in Diablo everyone is farming the same things. So a lot more people are undercutting each other and bringing more and more items in supply.
    - Items don't have that much RNG. Buyers don't need access to items from the entire continent to find what they are looking for. There is enough supply in items just by having 3000-5000 people servers.
    - Because there is no RNG on items, you know what you are looking for and you don't have to specify a bunch of text affixes and numbers. This is less boring and doesn't feel like a job. In MMO's an AH is actually part of the fun the game has to offer.



    The real problem with balancing the AH in D3 is that items have too much RNG. So in order to find any good item through trade, having the AH shared in the entire continent server is somewhat required to ever have BiS items available for trade.

    On the other hand, if those top end items never show up on the AH because there is not enough supply, then people will be happy much faster with the gear they CAN get. Because there are no pages full of insane gear that you can never afford.

    I personally am happy with my 180k dps barb's gear. I can do MP10 without dying too much. I can find plenty legendaries so I don't need better gear. The problem is that the AH has pages full of upgrades that I can never in my entire life afford. And that my friends, becomes a shitty feeling. A feeling that wouldn't have been there if there was no AH there.

    A solution needs to be found to the undercutting problem, and to the fact that there is oversupply.

    A first step would be equipment upgrading at the cost of making it BoA. Blizz is already working on this. Pulls some items out of the economy, which is what we need. But it's not enough.
    A second thing that could be done is my idea of fixing the AH:

    - Remove Buyout so you can no longer be undercut by your entire continent.
    - Add a option to buyers to send a "Fast Trade", When accepted by the seller, the seller will have only 5% AH cut instead of 15% and the trade is completed right away.

    This has a few positive effects:

    - The seller doesn't have to wait 12 hours to get his gold if he gets a fast trade he is happy with.
    - The buyer can still have a nearly instant buy, if his FT offer is a fair deal.
    - Instead of competing with the entire continent when trying to sell something, the competition is now between the buyers who need to come up with a fair deal asap. This keeps prices more stable and fair.
    - AH bots are less effective, because they can no longer get items very cheap by bidding in the last second... Because the deal is in the sellers hands, the seller needs to accept if the price is fair or not. If it's not a top-end item, bots won't bid. And if it's a good wanted item, then there will be FT offers before auction ends, so players can actually compete with bots to get good/fair deals.
    - People can no longer buy entire gear from AH instantly by using buyout buttons, so some people might actually try finding some gear themself first and then go to the AH for the last few pieces.

    Instead of trying to be the lowest seller, and fucking up the economy as a result, the trade system and economy is now in the hands of the buyers, while the final decision about a trade is still in the hands of the sellers. The trade system changes from "Whatever is the lowest price..." to "what do I think is a fair price?"

    What could be considered a con is that the buyers can no longer buy their gear instantly all the time. But that also has positive sides and the other pros definitely outweight the cons imo...

    No-AH mode, preferable in the form of ladders is the best solution I've been able to think of to work alongside these changes to AH's on the other modes.

    Other solutions/suggestions I've heard here and on the official forums all have more cons than pros or only tackle a side effect of the AH and not the root of the problem. Or are just a temporary fix or delay to the economy problem before undercutting catches up again and makes the game feel unrewarding again....


    As for elitist gear suggestion. I don't like it to be tied to the paragon system. I don't want to have to level another character just to have fun with it. Not having my 300% MF/GF and 300main stat / 200 vit is already a big slap in the face...

    I'd rather have item upgrades like they are working on. So you have to spend for example demonic essences to get your gear upgraded. It's the same as grinding for paragon levels. It requires some work to get good gear and you can't instantly buy stuff from the AH. The difference is that now you can do it with your main character and have fun and then equip good gear the moment you ding 60 on an alt. Or you can paragon level your alt, get DE's that way and do the upgrading that way. But the choice is yours. We need MORE motivation to play alt characters. Not less.

    With your suggestion you are forcing people to play a boring alt without paragon stats. You are taking away the ability to equip alt gear that you found with your main char right when you ding 60, just for the sake of removing the ability to buy stuff instantly from AH. That's not good... You are also taking away the joy of finding good item on your main char. Because when found something good you also realize you have to grind another 200 hours to get plevel 70 on that alt as well. That would be a huge slap in the face. We need the game to be more rewarding, not less :)

    /sigh I'm litteraly incapable of making short posts lol
    Posted in: Diablo III General Discussion
  • posted a message on DiabloFans Interview With the Devs: Highlights
    That's some interesting points! Looking forward to full interview!

    Finally some info we didn't know yet
    Posted in: News & Announcements
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