So many people arguing that THUD should be a part of this Open Letter. To me it is like one group saying the window is a square, while the OP was arguing that the door is a rectangle. A meaningless, pointless strawman debate because neither side is wrong.
Botting *is* an issue. The fact that THUD is also an issue is not at debate, of course it is. Pointing that out does not invalidate the case for arguing against Botting. People complaining so much about why THUD is not a part of this particular campaign (regardless of how right or wrong they are about which issue is bigger) should divert the energy they are putting into this thread into creating their own open letter about THUD, if they feel that strongly about it. no one is stopping you. Heck, probably some of the people involved in the Botting Open Letter would be happy to be apart of that protest too.
ps. for what it is worth, I dislike the idea of botting worse than THUD simply because I find something perverse about the idea of buying a computer game then getting a computer program to play it for you. That seems really whack to me and at that point I think it ceases to be a game.
its just weird that THUD wasnt included and that bagstone and other mods are actively discouraging it from being discussed. i agree that botting is the greater evil when compared to THUD, but THUD is still pretty major. cheating in its entirety is the greatest evil, so why make a letter complaining only about botting?
the signees of this open letter put the effort into it because they see themselves as having greater influence in the diablo community than the average joe. that much is true. mods of reddit have a louder voice than other redditors. streamers and people who make videos have a louder voice too (at least videos with more than a handful of views).
i disagree with the LEADER stuff, but thats irrelevant. because they have more influence, it would mean a lot more for them to campaign against THUD than the average joe. it would make the MOST sense to include THUD into the botting letter to have it encompass both, but it would likely be hypocritical for some of the signees. therefore, the best course of action would be for the few TRULY legit influential and public players to campaign against THUD, botters, and cheaters in general.
please explain why the letter isnt about cheating.
Because then Blizzard's reply would be to simply list the recent actions they have taken against cheaters (eg., blood shard exploit and Hellfire exploit). Thread closed, our letter would be meaningless. They DO ACT against cheaters. What they do not act against are
1) Botters
2) THUD.
Again, I listed often enough in this thread why THUD was not part of the letter, I'm not going to repeat it, read the previous posts in this thread. That leaves us with what? Yeah, exactly. Botting. The last known banwave against botters was very early on this year, which was actually even when botting didn't have that large impact on gameplay yet. Since then, the number of botters is constantly increasing, up to a point where botters publicly admit that they bot and even say it's because Blizzard doesn't act.
Making a generic letter about "please address cheating" would be absolutely pointless. Note, however, that we point Blizzard to their EULA and by enforcing that it would also mean action against all the other cheats you rightfully mention.
I mean, the very fact that there have been known ban waves against botters means that they do in fact act against botters (just not as regularly as we would all like). By your logic, since no known action has been taken against THUD, the letter should focus SOLELY on that instead.
I'm just going to quickly address two points that come up quite a lot:
1) "What about TurboHUD".
TurboHUD and bots are two different issues, and they're treated differently by Blizzard. This includes about how they respond to those issues on the forums, and the history of account actions taken. Our letter and this thread is about botting. I don't think there are two different opinions about bots (unless you're a botter), something you cannot say about other issues. Therefore, please keep TurboHUD and other things out of this message, as it makes the issue more blurry and might result in a vague response. If we put the spotlight on one very specific issue and the community speaks as a whole, chances are significantly higher to get a strong response (i.e., hopefully *action* and not just *words*).
2) "Some people on the list have done X and shouldn't be allowed to sign it".
I guess those people on the list are the streamers. They're often being called out for exploiting, botting, or other violations of the ToS (I am not including TurboHUD here and refer to point 1) - keep it out of this thread). However, when they use exploits they usually do this to force Blizzard to act against it (example: blood shard exploit). On the other hand, all people on this list, especially the streamers, have a history of speaking up publicly against botting. Look at it this way: with this letter we are urging Blizzard to act. We are reminding them of their EULA and asking them to take action against those who violate the rules of the game. Why should anyone who is playing this game competitively violate those rules and then join an open letter which will eventually jeopardize their progress?
It's okay to have your own opinion and you're free to express it in this thread. But please do refrain from accusations for which you have no proof, and keep this thread on topic (the botting issue). Those are my only two requests, thanks.
please explain why the letter isnt about cheating. everything about the letter applies to cheating, yet you guys purposefully limit it to botting. even in this forum/thread, you moderators keep trying to exclude other types of cheating. if you want to limit something for clarity, then why stop at botting in general? why not cherrypick the most popular botting software and offer specific ways and methods for blizzard to detect that one program? then rinse and repeat for the other popular programs. No, you guys kept it broad with botting in general. logically, you should widen it to cheating in general.
i don't make any accusations against specific players, but it definitely feels like this letter does not include other cheats (like turbohd) to protect signees who use them.
Seriously? Where is that vocal minority that disagrees about botting being negative? I only see a vocal majority wondering how you strive to prosecute one "crime", yet turn a blind eye on another, which equally destroys that what you claim to seek.
Why don't you openly discuss THUD and your position about it instead of hushing that up and calling people trolls?
This is SO cute. Why call an end to botting and only botting? Why not call an end to CHEATING? Cheating includes TurboHD and all add-ons that Blizzard does not officially sanction. It also includes sharing accounts (which can account for people with 18+ hours played per day. It's not LIKELY but it's POSSIBLE). Freaking Bagstone. Why would you purposefully try to exclude mention of other cheats in this thread? The letter claims botting gives an unfair advantage, but CHEATING is what gives an unfair advantage. Botting is one aspect of that. The amount of people sitting around using cheats that give a HUGE advantage over legit players while trying to get botters banned is ridiculous. Do you guys not recognize the hypocrisy?? Saying TurboHD provides quality of life improvements that SHOULD be included in the game is like botters saying botting SHOULD be included in the game because they shouldn't have to waste down time on their PC's not collecting mats and keys and gear.
Play the game legit like the rest of us, and be anti-CHEATING in its entirety, or don't complain at all. Almost every single streamer I see uses TurboHD.
A few here missed my point. If normal rift layouts cant spawn in greater rifts, then greater rift layouts shouldnt spawn in normal rifts.
no you missed my point. go quit. get on out of here. git. take your bellyaching and moaning and bitching and whining and complaining with you.
I find it hard to believe anyone can be this stupid, you didnt make it past the title did you? Go protest in ferguson or some other ghetto with the rest of your trash.
LOL like i would ever care about protesting trash. theyre like you. whiners. please tell me what SUBSTANCE you bring to the table worth discussion? something thats not your worthless bitching and moaning. you cant rift or gr worth a damn? tough cookies. get better gear or stop pushing higher than your trash gear is worth.
HAPPY?
Its amazing you know how to write yet cant read...
Im referring to normal t10 rifts, not grifts, you know the easy ones?
its amazing you know how to write and read but simply cant comprehend. you have nothing substantial to say. you have only pathetic whining and complaints. no one cares what you refuse to do. no one cares if you give up. TRUST. you wont be missed.
A few here missed my point. If normal rift layouts cant spawn in greater rifts, then greater rift layouts shouldnt spawn in normal rifts.
no you missed my point. go quit. get on out of here. git. take your bellyaching and moaning and bitching and whining and complaining with you.
I find it hard to believe anyone can be this stupid, you didnt make it past the title did you? Go protest in ferguson or some other ghetto with the rest of your trash.
LOL like i would ever care about protesting trash. theyre like you. whiners. please tell me what SUBSTANCE you bring to the table worth discussion? something thats not your worthless bitching and moaning. you cant rift or gr worth a damn? tough cookies. get better gear or stop pushing higher than your trash gear is worth.
Correct me if I'm wrong but didn't the devs already say that Akkhan's is getting a rework in the next major patch? They're also making invokers a sader set so I imagine that will get a pretty big rework as well. If i had to guess I'd say they'll make one of those a 7-pc set post rework.
i believe only the original 6 piece sets are 7 piece sets because they each got an item added. all other sets will be 6 max. i think a blue said this but im not sure
Would love to see crusaders get some sets with belt / amulet / /shield (tal rasha, inna's, IK, etc) pieces to mix and match like all other classes at the moment. Right now all the crusadergear take the same 6 slots. Would also like to see a set weapon set (green sword / shield like shenlongs, BK swords, chantodo, manajuma). These are all the things other classes have. Sounds so fun to have these kind of things for crusader
im honestly not excited for their revamped invoker set for sader..but i hope they prove me wrong. the idea of a thorns set doesnt sound appealing to me at all
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the signees of this open letter put the effort into it because they see themselves as having greater influence in the diablo community than the average joe. that much is true. mods of reddit have a louder voice than other redditors. streamers and people who make videos have a louder voice too (at least videos with more than a handful of views).
i disagree with the LEADER stuff, but thats irrelevant. because they have more influence, it would mean a lot more for them to campaign against THUD than the average joe. it would make the MOST sense to include THUD into the botting letter to have it encompass both, but it would likely be hypocritical for some of the signees. therefore, the best course of action would be for the few TRULY legit influential and public players to campaign against THUD, botters, and cheaters in general.
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i don't make any accusations against specific players, but it definitely feels like this letter does not include other cheats (like turbohd) to protect signees who use them.
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This is SO cute. Why call an end to botting and only botting? Why not call an end to CHEATING? Cheating includes TurboHD and all add-ons that Blizzard does not officially sanction. It also includes sharing accounts (which can account for people with 18+ hours played per day. It's not LIKELY but it's POSSIBLE). Freaking Bagstone. Why would you purposefully try to exclude mention of other cheats in this thread? The letter claims botting gives an unfair advantage, but CHEATING is what gives an unfair advantage. Botting is one aspect of that. The amount of people sitting around using cheats that give a HUGE advantage over legit players while trying to get botters banned is ridiculous. Do you guys not recognize the hypocrisy?? Saying TurboHD provides quality of life improvements that SHOULD be included in the game is like botters saying botting SHOULD be included in the game because they shouldn't have to waste down time on their PC's not collecting mats and keys and gear.
Play the game legit like the rest of us, and be anti-CHEATING in its entirety, or don't complain at all. Almost every single streamer I see uses TurboHD.
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HAPPY?
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am i missing something? why would the element of the damage matter? only the min/max numbers matter dont they?
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then give up.
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crusaders are definitely the worst class THIS PATCH. but this is the first time theyve been the worst class imo
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