Quote from GladHeHasBeta
1. a sense of progression from forcing to re-lvl? you mean a sense of redundancy?
It would only be redundant if you level with the exact same build/skills as you had done so previously which is not at all what I was referring to. If they want to make the claim that new skill builds are like new play experiences, then I would say being consistent with that then NO, it would not have a sense of redundancy. And in that there would still be progression inherently from re-leveling. No one says you HAVE to re-level a new build (after having a max level class of one type of build), but it adds depth and replay-ability long term.
Quote from GladHeHasBeta
2. you obviously have not spent much time on the skill calc. i have spent hundreds of hours with it and i can say without a doubt there are at least hundreds of possible builds that are a lot different for each class. 100x more then D2 had. considering how much fun and time ive spent just on the skill calc alone, actually using these builds will make it last infinitely longer.
While I can see your point here, and it is a good one, its still speculation. You don't know how well any of those builds will really transfer over into the game at release. In relation to a point I was making before, there may be some more diverse and interesting ways to play, but that may give the player an inherent disadvantage or "not full maximization" depending on your point of view. They may also just not really be as much fun in practice as they are on paper. And again this point was in relation to hardcore and avid players, people who will be concerned with something like this. However again, I can see where you are coming from as I have done something similar (albeit to a much lesser extent) it's just still to be foreseen how it will actually translate.
Quote from GladHeHasBeta
3. his response doesnt side step anything. he gives the exact response he should because its the truth.
This is again where we disagree. He does sidestep the issue because he does not address the concerns the OP brings up, rather he offers his opinion on the consequences. He does not directly address or give a response to the OP and therefore nothing was really answered. I am still left wondering "how does this new system function long term?" If I am still left wondering anything, than to be fair, the blue post has not answered constructively enough.
Quote from GladHeHasBeta
4. gear has always been the main point of longevity in diablo, and then ppl complain when its the same thing in the sequal? lol?
The one thing I would appreciate is to not put words in my mouth. I never said that at all, the reason I've played D2 since release is I enjoy the item hunt. However its the variety of ways in which you approach it that makes D2 great. If it was really all about the item hunt can you say you'd have fun with only 1 class and many more items? No of course not, because some diversity will always be better and give you an opportunity to, as I said, do the same thing but differently. I know that they have some ways to do this with the current system, but I feel as though they could have (and almost did) go a much better route in doing it. Even without the locked in skill builds I thought it was ok because of the skill rune hunt, but that is removed too which re-raises some concerns for me.
Quote from GladHeHasBeta
5. there is absolutely nothing stopping you from replaying or recreating a character. D2 FORCED you to do this which was bogus and they finally added respecs a little bit ago which made it way better. people are brain washed into thinking the permanancy of D2 was a good thing when it added nothing but an inconvenience. why? because it took a whole 3 hours to get a new char from 1-80 to test out your new build n equip all the gear you farmed from your other guy. so again i say, it added nothing. all thats changed is now people have a choice to re-level a new char to test new builds or use the same one.
people complain hard about how D3 took away choices, took away the choice of skill points and the choice of attributes. then they rage hardcore about given a choice to re-lvl or not? lol....
Finally, I do agree with you somewhat there. Again I'll ask not to put words in my mouth because I was fine with the removal of attributes, granted I still would like to have seen skill points in because even incremental increases give a sense of progression and accomplishment. I've toyed with that notion many times, there is nothing stopping you from making a new character so why not just add self imposed restrictions, stick with a build and if you want another one then make a new character? But obviously I won't do that because I'll just respec. I'm not detracting at all from the convenience or positives it brings, but I think in the long term it harms the replay-ability and integrity of the game. There really isn't a reason to re-level a character of the same class anymore and because of that I doubt I will do so. I know I will be able to but I have no incentive to do so because I can change builds on a whim, and that saddens me. Again as a hardcore player myself most of this is catered to my opinion and needs, but as I've said before; "Inevitably all new players will become experienced players, experienced players will not revert back to being new players." With this mindset blizzard should be catering the majority of the game to experienced players (in my opinion). Experienced players will do some research on a build before committing to it fully, and probably wouldn't level all the way up to 80 if they don't anticipate liking the build. That was also all after many years of the game being out and no longer supported avidly, I suspect it will be a long time before having to deal with issues like that in D3.
I look forward to seeing your responses to the questions I have brought forth.
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I was considering this, however I saw very mixed results. Some people said upgrading improved gameplay, but most others said it did not fix anything. Considering how I just spent $60 on a game I can't play, I'm a bit hesitant to drop another $30 on a POSSIBLE solution. Can anyone confirm that this will help? Honestly if I can get the game to just run consistently at 20 fps I'd be happy, but it is impossible and not even worth it to play at 9-13 fps.
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In particular "The frozen addict" is awesome, and "brain transplant."
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What if they've been waiting just as long? Does that make us more entitled, all things equal, solely on the principle that we are American? Sounds like some straight Nazi logic to me.
On topic; sucks that midnight release doesn't actually mean midnight for anyone except those in pst.
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Well if you didn't watch talking dead, you'll be happy to know that Kirkman said the pace for season 3 is going to be more akin to the last few episodes of season 2.
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So hard that they couldn't find one for this. I'm sorry man but the kid who plays Carl is not such a great actor. He constantly breaks the immersion for me with his lackluster performances. Aside from that, fantastic end to a great season. Only bad part is having to wait until fall for more, while ignoring spoilers all the while.
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I was thinking about that very fact actually. But why would they wait to tell us this instead of mentioning it when they announced that they were removing droppable runes? And even after the uproar that followed. Seeing as how it still has only been released on a foreign website and not even confirmed in English?
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It would only be redundant if you level with the exact same build/skills as you had done so previously which is not at all what I was referring to. If they want to make the claim that new skill builds are like new play experiences, then I would say being consistent with that then NO, it would not have a sense of redundancy. And in that there would still be progression inherently from re-leveling. No one says you HAVE to re-level a new build (after having a max level class of one type of build), but it adds depth and replay-ability long term.
While I can see your point here, and it is a good one, its still speculation. You don't know how well any of those builds will really transfer over into the game at release. In relation to a point I was making before, there may be some more diverse and interesting ways to play, but that may give the player an inherent disadvantage or "not full maximization" depending on your point of view. They may also just not really be as much fun in practice as they are on paper. And again this point was in relation to hardcore and avid players, people who will be concerned with something like this. However again, I can see where you are coming from as I have done something similar (albeit to a much lesser extent) it's just still to be foreseen how it will actually translate.
This is again where we disagree. He does sidestep the issue because he does not address the concerns the OP brings up, rather he offers his opinion on the consequences. He does not directly address or give a response to the OP and therefore nothing was really answered. I am still left wondering "how does this new system function long term?" If I am still left wondering anything, than to be fair, the blue post has not answered constructively enough.
The one thing I would appreciate is to not put words in my mouth. I never said that at all, the reason I've played D2 since release is I enjoy the item hunt. However its the variety of ways in which you approach it that makes D2 great. If it was really all about the item hunt can you say you'd have fun with only 1 class and many more items? No of course not, because some diversity will always be better and give you an opportunity to, as I said, do the same thing but differently. I know that they have some ways to do this with the current system, but I feel as though they could have (and almost did) go a much better route in doing it. Even without the locked in skill builds I thought it was ok because of the skill rune hunt, but that is removed too which re-raises some concerns for me.
Finally, I do agree with you somewhat there. Again I'll ask not to put words in my mouth because I was fine with the removal of attributes, granted I still would like to have seen skill points in because even incremental increases give a sense of progression and accomplishment. I've toyed with that notion many times, there is nothing stopping you from making a new character so why not just add self imposed restrictions, stick with a build and if you want another one then make a new character? But obviously I won't do that because I'll just respec. I'm not detracting at all from the convenience or positives it brings, but I think in the long term it harms the replay-ability and integrity of the game. There really isn't a reason to re-level a character of the same class anymore and because of that I doubt I will do so. I know I will be able to but I have no incentive to do so because I can change builds on a whim, and that saddens me. Again as a hardcore player myself most of this is catered to my opinion and needs, but as I've said before; "Inevitably all new players will become experienced players, experienced players will not revert back to being new players." With this mindset blizzard should be catering the majority of the game to experienced players (in my opinion). Experienced players will do some research on a build before committing to it fully, and probably wouldn't level all the way up to 80 if they don't anticipate liking the build. That was also all after many years of the game being out and no longer supported avidly, I suspect it will be a long time before having to deal with issues like that in D3.
I look forward to seeing your responses to the questions I have brought forth.
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Right, but it's a CONTEST, not a given. Odds are not supposed to be in your favor. I don't get why people continue to think they are so special an deserving. It's about luck, and if you are lucky enough to get a key then congratulations and enjoy. If not, deal with like everyone else and just keep trying or wait for the game to be released.