the build is basically based on running 4 skills 3 of which have high support utility (bbv, mass confusion, woz) with cooldowns and then spamming firebats for big dps for around 8 secs after soul harvesting. if somehow OOM, spiders keep enemies in check with snares and as far as I understand each spider has two bites o the chance to snare is actually 50% for each spider on a hit.
WoZ is kinda there onl to make the cooldown 3x gen faster through vision quest (and pretty much any woz rune works there), but I can see trying to work with spirit walk for defensive purposes instead, although it will be a lot tougher to keep up.
I really like this build, seems pretty good for everything and doing some basic math, regen without gear will be 102 mana/sec at level 60, enabling you basically to spam high dps bats off the SH for at least 8 seconds or so.
the only big problem I see is that its very cooldown-dependent and grave injustice is kinda working against vision quest against weaker mobs that are large in #s. also, to keep cooldowns running to spam bats, we need to soul harvest every 15 seconds basically...which can be a problem on inferno...but then again, we have mass confusion and siphon life, not to mention a good chance to be healed by a monk in a group.
oh, and well, this build is not that great for bosses as well. otherwise, though, it's one of the best I could come up with.
This build lacks AoE damage so this should help a lot in that regard. You won't be able to rely on it too much due to the cooldown but at least grave injustice will help out. I don't think regular WoZ will be very helpful in a group situation... unless you're playing with all ranged.
Why isn't this build good for bosses? It's awesome for single target.
I'd change your primary as well because I hate spiders... but that's just personal preference. I do think the rune you picked won't help out much in groups though just like WoZ wasn't helping.
P.S. Regarding your math. The mana cost in the calc I believe is the mana cost when you unlock it. The mana cost scales with each level (I forget the exact amount) so they will cost more mana at lvl 60 than what is listed.
This build lacks AoE damage so this should help a lot in that regard. You won't be able to rely on it too much due to the cooldown but at least grave injustice will help out. I don't think regular WoZ will be very helpful in a group situation... unless you're playing with all ranged.
aren't bats AOE though ? especially when you channel them its like a cone of fire or something...I agree about WoZ, thats why I said any rune should work as well, pile on or dead rush
Why isn't this build good for bosses? It's awesome for single target.
only one high dps spell. with pile on it's much better though, I agree.
P.S. Regarding your math. The mana cost in the calc I believe is the mana cost when you unlock it. The mana cost scales with each level (I forget the exact amount) so they will cost more mana at lvl 60 than what is listed.
yes, that's a huge miss on my part. Im pretty new to game mechanics, just got into the wait game by looking through videos and reading are there exact numbers as to how much the cost scales with levels ? Ive tried to find the info with no success.
I like vision quest builds. I will probably go for one later.
I do think spiritual attunement seems kind of weak when you already have vision quest. That passive alone should easily give you enough mana to spend.
Im not too sure on that. especially with spell costs being higher on high levels. Ive heard a lot of opinions that with higher cost spells involved like acid cloud or locust swarm you're oom very fast no matter your regen...SA is not the greatest skill, but 20% mana increase seems pretty good to me, and that % regen gets higher the higher your pool goes
Im not sure you need a cheap primary spell (when you got so much mana from vision quest) so I would change spiders for something else. If you are changing to spiders to something that deals poison damage such as locust swarm with pestilence, you could go for changing the spiritual attunement to bad medicine. That means that the monsters affected by the poison will deal 20% less damage to everyone including those in your group while affected.
Ive thought about it, but again I dont want to be caught OOM in situations where all my low mana skills are on cooldowns. I think a primary cheap spell will be essential in inferno, because it wont be as easy keeping the cooldowns running, and as far as panic skills I dont have many in this build. I also dont think bad medicine is that great b/c it only lasts for 3 secs currently and would have to use AOE skills with high mana costs and meh dps to use it well.
Wall of zombies with unrelenting grip seems somewhat weaker than grasp of the dead with unbreakable grasp, since they have longer cd and last for a shorter time. If you find that you got enough mana to spam an extra unbreakable grasp instead of wall of zombies I would do that instead. Having grasp of the dead means that you have to spam it some more than wall of zombies to keep it on cd, but that would perhaps only help in inferno.
Soul harvest might be harder to pull off in inferno, especially when you dont have any pets. However if you are in groups with melee it might be much easier.
yea woz was my biggest question, and spirit walk/grasp were my first two choices of replacement. the problem with grasp is that the cooldown will really be short to invoke VQ well, especially with grave injustice. it's also pretty mana heavy compared to other spells. if like you say the mana wont be a problem, I guess grasp can replace spiders, but I very much doubt that.
I agree about SH in inferno, but in groups, esp with a monk who can heal it might be easier to pull off.
Good build all around for a complete group, with all that slow, the DH must have the passive that increase his damage against slowed enemies, that would be killer
for team play id swap out vision quest and put in Bad Medicine then change the primary + secondary skills to some poison damage. Bad Medicine is probably the best team play ability in the game of any class; if im wrong please correct me but i havent seen anything from other classes that rival it.
im not a fan of vision quest because it forces you to use CDs as soon as possible instead at the exact moment you need to use the ability.
for team play id swap out vision quest and put in Bad Medicine then change the primary + secondary skills to some poison damage. Bad Medicine is probably the best team play ability in the game of any class; if im wrong please correct me but i havent seen anything from other classes that rival it.
im not a fan of vision quest because it forces you to use CDs as soon as possible instead at the exact moment you need to use the ability.
yes, the CD thing is the biggest problem to me.
as far as BM goes, I just wish it lasted longer. also you kinda have to do AOE poison which costs mana, otherwise its fairly useless other than champions/elite who are few in numbers but are very powerful...so poison dart+BM works well there.
I also know monk by himself has resolve (enemy damage -25% for 2.5 secs for any damage he deals) , tempest rush bluster rune(-20% damage over 2 secs on a knockback) and a mantra of conviction intimidation rune (-10% damage over aoe for 3 minutes !)
by the way, another class that has something similar (and IMO better) to bad medicine is demon hunter. numbing traps reduces enemy damage by 25% over 3 seconds...and that can be done with lots of caltrops that are relatively cheap and fan of knives
This build lacks AoE damage so this should help a lot in that regard. You won't be able to rely on it too much due to the cooldown but at least grave injustice will help out. I don't think regular WoZ will be very helpful in a group situation... unless you're playing with all ranged.
aren't bats AOE though ? especially when you channel them its like a cone of fire or something...I agree about WoZ, thats why I said any rune should work as well, pile on or dead rush
Why isn't this build good for bosses? It's awesome for single target.
only one high dps spell. with pile on it's much better though, I agree.
P.S. Regarding your math. The mana cost in the calc I believe is the mana cost when you unlock it. The mana cost scales with each level (I forget the exact amount) so they will cost more mana at lvl 60 than what is listed.
yes, that's a huge miss on my part. Im pretty new to game mechanics, just got into the wait game by looking through videos and reading are there exact numbers as to how much the cost scales with levels ? Ive tried to find the info with no success.
thanks for your reply !
The rune you picked for bats isn't AoE, it's single target. That's why you really need WoZ - Pile On. You don't have a single aoe spell without it.
I believe the mana costs scale evenly with level so you can compare the costs on the skill calc to get an idea of an expensive spell vs cheap spell. I'm unsure exactly how much mana per level each spell scales... it's not a whole lot... a few mana each level it seemed like in the beta.
This build lacks AoE damage so this should help a lot in that regard. You won't be able to rely on it too much due to the cooldown but at least grave injustice will help out. I don't think regular WoZ will be very helpful in a group situation... unless you're playing with all ranged.
aren't bats AOE though ? especially when you channel them its like a cone of fire or something...I agree about WoZ, thats why I said any rune should work as well, pile on or dead rush
Why isn't this build good for bosses? It's awesome for single target.
only one high dps spell. with pile on it's much better though, I agree.
P.S. Regarding your math. The mana cost in the calc I believe is the mana cost when you unlock it. The mana cost scales with each level (I forget the exact amount) so they will cost more mana at lvl 60 than what is listed.
yes, that's a huge miss on my part. Im pretty new to game mechanics, just got into the wait game by looking through videos and reading are there exact numbers as to how much the cost scales with levels ? Ive tried to find the info with no success.
thanks for your reply !
The rune you picked for bats isn't AoE, it's single target. That's why you really need WoZ - Pile On. You don't have a single aoe spell without it.
I believe the mana costs scale evenly with level so you can compare the costs on the skill calc to get an idea of an expensive spell vs cheap spell. I'm unsure exactly how much mana per level each spell scales... it's not a whole lot... a few mana each level it seemed like in the beta.
I thought dire bats and hungry bats are both aoe if channeled...
Yeah, you can't tell anything from that video. From the tooltip and how much damage the ability does, I doubt it is AoE. It wouldn't make much sense if it did 60% more damage and homed and did the same AoE as dire bats. Best case, they explode on impact and damage 2-3 monsters. The graphic is a lot smaller than dire bats so I doubt this is the case.
the bats in general seem the best damage spell of WD you can hypothetically spam (or semi-spam). its fast, effective and relatively cheap compared to other AOE/dmg spells. Im not considering DoT spells like haunt of course.
pile on does very nice damage but its kinda slow and obviously has a cooldown.
imo bats will have to be in almost anyones WD build unless you go for a heavy summon build.
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how does this look for inferno coop (not pvp) ?
the build is basically based on running 4 skills 3 of which have high support utility (bbv, mass confusion, woz) with cooldowns and then spamming firebats for big dps for around 8 secs after soul harvesting. if somehow OOM, spiders keep enemies in check with snares and as far as I understand each spider has two bites o the chance to snare is actually 50% for each spider on a hit.
WoZ is kinda there onl to make the cooldown 3x gen faster through vision quest (and pretty much any woz rune works there), but I can see trying to work with spirit walk for defensive purposes instead, although it will be a lot tougher to keep up.
I really like this build, seems pretty good for everything and doing some basic math, regen without gear will be 102 mana/sec at level 60, enabling you basically to spam high dps bats off the SH for at least 8 seconds or so.
the only big problem I see is that its very cooldown-dependent and grave injustice is kinda working against vision quest against weaker mobs that are large in #s. also, to keep cooldowns running to spam bats, we need to soul harvest every 15 seconds basically...which can be a problem on inferno...but then again, we have mass confusion and siphon life, not to mention a good chance to be healed by a monk in a group.
oh, and well, this build is not that great for bosses as well. otherwise, though, it's one of the best I could come up with.
any thoughts/critique ?
cheers
This build lacks AoE damage so this should help a lot in that regard. You won't be able to rely on it too much due to the cooldown but at least grave injustice will help out. I don't think regular WoZ will be very helpful in a group situation... unless you're playing with all ranged.
Why isn't this build good for bosses? It's awesome for single target.
I'd change your primary as well because I hate spiders... but that's just personal preference. I do think the rune you picked won't help out much in groups though just like WoZ wasn't helping.
P.S. Regarding your math. The mana cost in the calc I believe is the mana cost when you unlock it. The mana cost scales with each level (I forget the exact amount) so they will cost more mana at lvl 60 than what is listed.
only one high dps spell. with pile on it's much better though, I agree.
yes, that's a huge miss on my part. Im pretty new to game mechanics, just got into the wait game by looking through videos and reading are there exact numbers as to how much the cost scales with levels ? Ive tried to find the info with no success.
thanks for your reply !
Ive thought about it, but again I dont want to be caught OOM in situations where all my low mana skills are on cooldowns. I think a primary cheap spell will be essential in inferno, because it wont be as easy keeping the cooldowns running, and as far as panic skills I dont have many in this build. I also dont think bad medicine is that great b/c it only lasts for 3 secs currently and would have to use AOE skills with high mana costs and meh dps to use it well.
yea woz was my biggest question, and spirit walk/grasp were my first two choices of replacement. the problem with grasp is that the cooldown will really be short to invoke VQ well, especially with grave injustice. it's also pretty mana heavy compared to other spells. if like you say the mana wont be a problem, I guess grasp can replace spiders, but I very much doubt that.
I agree about SH in inferno, but in groups, esp with a monk who can heal it might be easier to pull off.
thanks for the reply !
im not a fan of vision quest because it forces you to use CDs as soon as possible instead at the exact moment you need to use the ability.
as far as BM goes, I just wish it lasted longer. also you kinda have to do AOE poison which costs mana, otherwise its fairly useless other than champions/elite who are few in numbers but are very powerful...so poison dart+BM works well there.
I also know monk by himself has resolve (enemy damage -25% for 2.5 secs for any damage he deals) , tempest rush bluster rune(-20% damage over 2 secs on a knockback) and a mantra of conviction intimidation rune (-10% damage over aoe for 3 minutes !)
The rune you picked for bats isn't AoE, it's single target. That's why you really need WoZ - Pile On. You don't have a single aoe spell without it.
I believe the mana costs scale evenly with level so you can compare the costs on the skill calc to get an idea of an expensive spell vs cheap spell. I'm unsure exactly how much mana per level each spell scales... it's not a whole lot... a few mana each level it seemed like in the beta.
I know this might not be 100% right...but animation looks like both of them are aoe
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-I9bG4JDjQI
the bats in general seem the best damage spell of WD you can hypothetically spam (or semi-spam). its fast, effective and relatively cheap compared to other AOE/dmg spells. Im not considering DoT spells like haunt of course.
pile on does very nice damage but its kinda slow and obviously has a cooldown.
imo bats will have to be in almost anyones WD build unless you go for a heavy summon build.