Difficulty Discussion, Transmogrification and Legendaries (Part 2), RoS Skill Limit Will Remain at 6, Tyrael Fan Art

  • #1
    Blizzard Wants to Give 'More Control Over the Difficulty Settings'
    The 'Torment Difficulty' strings we datamined along with the RoS achievements raised some pretty serious discussions and today Grimiku made an appearance in one of the threads over at the Official Forums.

    Originally Posted by Blizzard (Blue Tracker / Official Forums)

    Torment Difficulty: 3 playthroughs or 4 or 5?
    We'd like to give players more control over the difficulty settings, and we're looking at ways to accomplish that. It's a little early to share any details, but there was an interview prior to gamescom where Josh Mosqueira shares some of his thoughts about it. He mentions (at 7:30) that Diablo III has a great engine, but we constrain some of it's awesome potential by forcing players to replay the same Acts, quest, and levels over and over.




    Clarifications on Transmogrification and Legendaries

    Originally Posted by Blizzard (Blue Tracker / Official Forums)

    Any changes to dye mechanics? Are they just simply bought from vendors or are changes being made to them?
    Transmogrified items can currently be dyed in the same manner regular items are (the dye is applied to the item).

    What is the reason behind this? If you don't want the transmog look to carry to another player why not just have it removed once it is traded?
    It's a matter of whether or not you wish to utilize the item. If you think something would best benefit you by trading it, it should not be enchanted or transmogrified. If it's instead something you see yourself wearing for a while, you should feel good about customizing it to fit your needs (visually or mechanically via Enchanting). Doing either is meant to be a player decision that carries weight.

    TR:DL Will transmog allow to double equip same appearance items as weapons if the legendaries that they were made of are Unique Equipped?
    Yes! You can visually be wielding two Skycutters, so long as you have unlocked its appearance.

    Why not? Why is "similar animations" the limit? Why can't you 'mog an item's appearance and it's animation?
    It would open up a lot of unintended options, such as swinging a bow like a sword. While we could ensure these oddities generally don't occur, we'd prefer a system that's always working.

    will this count items id'ed prior to 2.0 or only post 2.0?
    We're still working on some of the finer details, so I don't have an answer to this just yet.




    RoS Skill Limit Will Remain at 6

    Originally Posted by Blizzard (Blue Tracker / Official Forums)

    Will ROS have increased skill limit?

    No current plans to increase the 6-skill limit. We still feel that 6 is a good number, enough to give you flexibility in your build choices, but not too much to where you don't have to make thoughtful decisions about what you put on your bar. (We actually had 7 skills available for a pretty substantial period of time before Diablo III shipped; however, after lots of testing and feedback rounds, we reduced the number to 6. So, this is definitely something we've not only considered, but also evaluated heavily in the actual game environment.)

    Now, we know that some players may disagree with that approach. Totally cool, but let me turn the question back on you (and then add a few more), because learning why you prefer one gameplay feature over another is super meaningful. Also, sometimes it can be pretty fun, too.
    • How is having only six skill lots negatively impacting your gameplay experience right now? If you can cite specific examples, even better!
    • On the flip side, how would having an extra skill slot improve your game experience?
    • If you had a 7th skill slot, what additional spells or abilities would you add to your bar (on top of the builds you use currently)?



    Tyrael Fan Art
    DeviantArt member LoweringSky has created an amazing Tyrael Fan Art placing the Archangel of Justice (currently - Archangel of Wisdom) on a soothing forest background. The best part is LoweringSky has posted a step-by-step collage showing the creation of the piece.

  • #2
    If I can track down this interview where "torment" is hinted at, I'll post it! Hot on it's trail.

    EDIT: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HKS4g48F4hw
  • #3
    6 skills is great IMO.. But we also know there will be the 4th passive , which i am excited about :)
  • #4
    6 skills means I can use one hand to play my character, since I have the Diablo 3 mouse. It has 2 buttons on each side, so I never have to use the keyboard if I don't want to. If they added another skill slot, I'd be forced to use the keyboard. I'm not saying that is a bad thing necessarily, but it is something to consider.
  • #5
    Really cryptic comment about the difficulty, I don't know what that means. My best guess:

    - New difficulty progression is Normal -> Torment -> Inferno
    - Difficulties are now locked only by level, not campaign progress (see the removal of that string)
    - Adventure mode is playable after you beat Normal(maybe even account-wide) and it scales to whatever your level is

    This way if you don't like replaying the campaign multiple times you can just start farming Adventure mode, and never touch the campaign again after the first time if that's what you want.
  • #6
    Quote from Ryude

    6 skills means I can use one hand to play my character, since I have the Diablo 3 mouse. It has 2 buttons on each side, so I never have to use the keyboard if I don't want to. If they added another skill slot, I'd be forced to use the keyboard. I'm not saying that is a bad thing necessarily, but it is something to consider.


    6 Skills means = Keep synergy for console play, they won't go over 6 now
  • #7
    I think a 7th skill slot would be awesome - As a coodown only skill. Aka you can only place say Archon, WoTB or say Seven sided strike in the 7th slot because i know 1 Ive never used any type of long CD skill because it just does not feel worth it. 15 sec of glory or 1 powerful attack then i am useless for 2 mins? No thanks.

    Ive talked to a ton of players 20+ about this idea and they all love it. 6 normal skills you can set your build to then pick 1 uber cooldown skill based on what you like. for EXP i would totaly pick WoTB for the + Dodge chance as mine for an amaizng def cooldown. No way in hell i'd use it any other time with just 6 skills tho.
  • #8
    At least we now know Torment is a thing even if purely for testing/temporary.
  • #9
    Quote from reclaimer3235

    I think a 7th skill slot would be awesome - As a coodown only skill. Aka you can only place say Archon, WoTB or say Seven sided strike in the 7th slot because i know 1 Ive never used any type of long CD skill because it just does not feel worth it. 15 sec of glory or 1 powerful attack then i am useless for 2 mins? No thanks.

    Ive talked to a ton of players 20+ about this idea and they all love it. 6 normal skills you can set your build to then pick 1 uber cooldown skill based on what you like. for EXP i would totaly pick WoTB for the + Dodge chance as mine for an amaizng def cooldown. No way in hell i'd use it any other time with just 6 skills tho.

    That's a very interesting idea.

    It would be like a "ultimate" skill slot (similar to what mobas have). But that would require those skills to be removed from the Normal Skill pool then. But I kinda like the core concept of giving these "ultimate" abilities a separate system.
  • #10
    Quote from Zero(pS)

    Quote from reclaimer3235

    I think a 7th skill slot would be awesome - As a coodown only skill. Aka you can only place say Archon, WoTB or say Seven sided strike in the 7th slot because i know 1 Ive never used any type of long CD skill because it just does not feel worth it. 15 sec of glory or 1 powerful attack then i am useless for 2 mins? No thanks.

    Ive talked to a ton of players 20+ about this idea and they all love it. 6 normal skills you can set your build to then pick 1 uber cooldown skill based on what you like. for EXP i would totaly pick WoTB for the + Dodge chance as mine for an amaizng def cooldown. No way in hell i'd use it any other time with just 6 skills tho.

    That's a very interesting idea.

    It would be like a "ultimate" skill slot (similar to what mobas have). But that would require those skills to be removed from the Normal Skill pool then. But I kinda like the core concept of giving these "ultimate" abilities a separate system.


    Me too. WoW ran into a similar problem (as do a hell of a lot of class-based action games... hell, it also pops up with super-weapons that have very limited ammo) where too long on the cooldown means players always hold it in reserve, but too short and it has to be nerfed to remain balanced, but loses a lot of appeal in the process.

    I'd really like to see an uber-ability slot that charges up with each elite kill, and costs multiple charges to actually use. Build its use into D3's famous combat cadence... ok Blizzard? Please?
  • #11
    okay, im not the one to reinvent the wheel, but why doesnt Blizz give us "full control" of game difficulty by implementing a switch using a variable built on a few exponential (or heavens forbid linear) functions like the /players X switch was in D2 (which was of course more linear than exponential)?
    simply type: /mp X and the formula will dynamically adjust the monsterhp/monsterdmg/loot/xp and whatnot ratio using those functions
    i have always wondered with regards to monster power why we were bound by static, preprogrammed difficulties in the first place
  • #12
    Quote from yourgrandma

    okay, im not the one to reinvent the wheel, but why doesnt Blizz give us "full control" of game difficulty by implementing a switch using a variable built on a few exponential (or heavens forbid linear) functions like the /players X switch was in D2 (which was of course more linear than exponential)?
    simply type: /mp X and the formula will dynamically adjust the monsterhp/monsterdmg/loot/xp and whatnot ratio using those functions
    i have always wondered with regards to monster power why we were bound by static, preprogrammed difficulties in the first place


    I agree that it would be nice, but I wonder why you mention D2 as example. In D2 you had /players 1 to 8, in D3 you have MP0 to 10. 8 vs 11 difficulty settings.

    But maybe the answer lies in D2 1.09b: for a short period, /players would go up to 64, but was removed shortly after (at least on official servers, not talking about mods here). It seems that it's not that easy to let it scale up infinitely. As for the steps between different monster powers now, I don't feel like MP1-10 needs more granularity. Is anyone playing on MP9 anyways? I usually play 1, 5, 7, 10. If the reason to not have this "full control" is a month or two development time that could be spend on different things, I'd say there are more important things...
  • #13
    I agree that it would be nice, but I wonder why you mention D2 as example. In D2 you had /players 1 to 8, in D3 you have MP0 to 10. 8 vs 11 difficulty settings.

    But maybe the answer lies in D2 1.09b: for a short period, /players would go up to 64, but was removed shortly after (at least on official servers, not talking about mods here). It seems that it's not that easy to let it scale up infinitely. As for the steps between different monster powers now, I don't feel like MP1-10 needs more granularity. Is anyone playing on MP9 anyways? I usually play 1, 5, 7, 10. If the reason to not have this "full control" is a month or two development time that could be spend on different things, I'd say there are more important things...


    it was just to present an example how people were able to manually adjust difficulty. and yes, in my oppinion it does seem easy to scale up infinitely. and it is definitely top 3 issue imho what is called replayability. you need to assure replayability somehow. now how you gonna do that? sure as hell blizz wont be introducing new content every quarter, the AH tycoons who were actually playing the game for financial gains will be leaving the game with the removal of the AH and loot 2.0, so the remaining people will either 1. want to climb the new paragon ladder fast 2. seek new challenges. now in the latter case even random dungeons and the still very limited adventuring missions will get old very quick, and that kinda leaves you with trying to "beat" the game on as hard a level as you can. and the infinite paragon system perfectly facilitates just that, because after a while you will be able to advance difficulty level even if you only put your points in base stats.
    anyone else have any better ideas?
  • #14
    If monster hp is stored in a 32bit number and you go over that, you'll have created the ingame version of the AH gold dupe bug from a while ago, just to name one situation where infinite scaling is technically problematic. Code optimization is a thing, infinite whatever is a huge roadblock to that thing.

    I'd like them to bring curses back to the game, if we're talking more skill slots. They could even not bind a particular curse to a particular class and just have the 7th slot be a pool from which all classes can draw. A skill slot reserved for long cooldowns sounds ok too but I'd rather they did away with long cd's entirely instead and rebalance those skills for either short or permanent use (short for WotB, Archon, Earthquake and such, permanent for Fetish Army and the like).

    edit: I have to add this though: A 7th skill slot is just 'more' power. It's a design issue of not having a skill tree, ie being forced to choose one thing but not another. With a skill tree, there may be builds where choosing extra abilities is suboptimal because you're not maximizing your core stuff. With the way Diablo's skill system works, an extra skill is just an added bonus, it's never right to not pick one. So... meh to the whole idea I guess, they'd have to rebalance everything so player power doesn't grow out of hand.
  • #15
    Quote from yourgrandma

    okay, im not the one to reinvent the wheel, but why doesnt Blizz give us "full control" of game difficulty by implementing a switch using a variable built on a few exponential (or heavens forbid linear) functions like the /players X switch was in D2 (which was of course more linear than exponential)?
    simply type: /mp X and the formula will dynamically adjust the monsterhp/monsterdmg/loot/xp and whatnot ratio using those functions
    i have always wondered with regards to monster power why we were bound by static, preprogrammed difficulties in the first place


    Probably because of the always online requirement, there are tons more data that has to be synced than there was in D2.
  • #16
    i just want more control over my char...WASD
  • To post a comment, please or register a new account.
Posts Quoted:
Reply
Clear All Quotes