Jay Wilson: Auction Houses 'really hurt' game

  • #23
    How about a new feature that would let the player soulbind items to their toon. The process would make the item bound to the character or account. Once bound, the item could begin acquire exp, like the materia system in FFVII. Each item could have a single unique bonus affix that would level up like paragon levels as you gain xp with the item equipped. These item affixes would only show up as part of the soulbound thing. There would be an npc (mystic) that would assist with soulbinding/unbinding items. They would also allow you to change what affix your soulbound item currently has. Changing the affix could be done for free, but would reset the item back to 0 xp.

    Once you put up a soulbound item on the AH, a warning is shown and the item is displayed with it's base stats and if it sells it's stripped of its stats and no longer bound. The new buyer has to soulbind it to his own toon in order to start earning xp.
  • #25
    Quote from nadenitza

    They know they f'd up big time, doubt that a closure will occur tho. More like balancing the game around loot hunt but with all the repetitive and linear level design even that will die a swift death IF they don't make some adjustments to "actual random map generation and content". The AH is a good trade platform but itemization just bitch-slapped the crap out of it.


    what? lol i didn't understand a word you just said. just glued some words together to sound smart.....
    you cant even support ur argument sadly.
    The game is THAT horrible that your still supporting it! GJ!
  • #26
    Ohrly?

    Quoting Herbert Garrison: "Well, I don't want to sound like a dickhole, but I told you so."
  • #27
    i have hundreds of millions in gold and can not sell any of it due to this .025 floor why don't they take the floor away so i can cash out. !!!!!!
  • #28
    AH/RMAH for sure adds to the game but ... please correct me if im wrong but as i remember it the AH/RMAH was one of the cornerstones of D3 and integral to the always online 'experience'? which in turn was not DRM? and also drop rates (whether JW says or not) should be a function of that need to be combined with the AH? and how is it possible that a company that has had experience of all these factors, both 'chinese' farmers & understanding of auction house mechanics, to be 'overwhelmed'?

    Also having seen always online + AH/RMAH vs. offline mode -proper hardcore mode, it'd go with the latter.

    So many failures/lies on so many lvls r hard for me to grasp... the game is good but not what it could have been.
  • #29
    Quote from Laevus

    I'm actually considering buying a second copy of D3 just so that I can have an account of characters that never uses the AH. However, I'm not sure I'd trust my own discipline with it since it's just so damned convenient, but I would really love a game mode that removes AH access, that's for sure.


    So it seems the answer to your wishes is buying it on the Playstation console, since that is exactly what they will be doing
  • #30
    t 1 million per day,


    If that's true its probably mostly players from Asia.
  • #31
    You see...the AH made it easy to buy/sell/trade etc. The thing is, it made it too easy. So easy in fact that it cut right through the very lifeblood of the game...the item hunt.
    sto lavorando
  • #32
    I agree with St0rmie that at 1st I thought it would be a good thing, now I just don't use it anymore, and to help Laevus up there, just do like me, create a new char on another continent and never ever use the AH button... turns out my drops have been great on my new char, better dps and hp than my AH pimped chars. It just takes patience and luck. Something the AH removes and that is a core component of playing Diablo...
  • #33
    So, Jay Wilson has confirmed what many players have criticized the past months?

    Bandyto#2350
    EU
  • #34
    If they took out the AH, I'd quit. I'm sorry, but I HATED Diablo 2's system. It was all either people begging for frees, dupe trading, scamming, or trade channels, and it was a MESS. D3 was the only Diablo game where gold mattered, that had a genuine system where you could actually get something for your hard work, and you weren't just "farming Meph/Pindleskin" all frelling day. I'm under the assumption anyone that's for the old system also used bots, as well. I know folks that used them, that and map hack, because it WAS the only way to get drops in the game. D3 is a massive improvement on the system, and the hardcore babies whining about the AH are likely the unpleasable mass that could never be pleased no matter what.

    I do however see inherent problems with the system. The game is balanced around you always having Yellows in your possession, rather than blues. D2 did this much later than D3 did, probably figuring you'd have better gear earlier. Also, it felt like drops were tweaked to be very low during that time, you couldn't gear up without the AH, and the massive increase to repair costs made it impossible to get repaired without spending money to get more gold (protip: I quit after I couldn't repair my gear. Returned half a year later.). It did, however, stop real gold traders, and I see a LOT less spam in that game than any other game. Why? Because they can't beat the current system. There are no customers that would risk it since it was part of the game, and funding the devs.

    You can scream, and whine, and cry about the AH. But I think the AH made the game better. It made the game a hell of a lot less of a mess, it made it so people could get money for their hard work, and it made it so Blizz also got a cut of what was sold, funding game development. I'm also someone that said that Torchlight 2, Path of Exile, etc... would blow this game out of the water. They sucked something violent, either because you could never GET gear/trade (PoE), or because the game was so broken with useless skills and hackers/cheaters (Torchlight 2). All I want from Blizz is an offline mode, so I can mess around should I ever lose my net. That's all. I want to be able to boot this game up years after the servers are gone and have fun, like I do with D1 and D2 (which technically aren't dead, but you get the point). Let's hope they listen.
  • #35
    What a lot of people managed to forget was that Diablo III was suppose to be an ARPG that focused on the most important thing, the loot drops. I'd rather not post this argument all over again, so I will just quote myself from this thread.

    Quote from Ghost_Sanguis

    ...

    Diablo III became a game that focused entirely on the gear of your character and their skill/passive build. The issue with that however is that good gear is far harder to farm in this game, and most people end up finding a lot of trash even after MP10 Inferno Act 3 runs, even with a decent amount of MF from paragon levels. Since trying to farm on large difficulties is hard enough as it is, it encouraged everyone to run the AH to the bones, having characters completely forged out of gear purchased at the AH. This caused us to have no reason to even farm items, but instead farm areas that gave us the most gold.

    ...


    There was actually a heck of a lot more to that post, but I left out those points. The problem is that the core game-play mechanic of Diablo III, which is loot drops that you worked hard to obtain, is completely overshadowed by the shortcut that is the AH. The AH is actually part of a whole array of problems that exist in the design of Diablo III, but it is one of the more significant ones.

    Now, I admit that I am no game designer and I am certainly no business expert either, but from a gaming stand point, I think that there is some sort of potential in a Diablo 3.5, so to speak. Make the game over again, without all the mistakes, take away the AH, give us ladders, offline play, better loot tables, all that good stuff, and put it into a brand new game that won't affect the current one in any way and make people start over again. It can easily be made into a digital download that is free to anyone who has purchased Diablo III. Allow people to have access to the map making tools, allow us to make custom maps, events, and allow the game to be compatible with mods made by the community.

    Call me psycho, but I think it could work if done right.
    Jellyfish are the one and only true Wizards
  • #36
    only thing that could fix D3 is D4. So, in 10-15 years maybe?
  • #37
    Quote from overneathe

    Quote from LeChokeJames
    What really doesn't make sense is how Wilson openly said on more than one occasion that drops were balanced around the existence of the AH, yet now says that they didn't expect the majority of players to use it?


    Do you happen to have a source on that?


    Not from Jay Wilson but from Bashiok :

    http://us.battle.net/d3/en/forum/topic/5150764997?page=3#49

    I spent over 20 minutes in order to find that quote (I didn't think it was that old) ! As a News Manager, maybe you could have found it faster than me !
  • #38
    Quote from overneathe

    Quote from LeChokeJames
    What really doesn't make sense is how Wilson openly said on more than one occasion that drops were balanced around the existence of the AH, yet now says that they didn't expect the majority of players to use it?


    Do you happen to have a source on that?


    It was actually bashiok that said this, not jay

    Originally Posted by Blizzard (Blue Tracker / Official Forums)

    The auction house obviously provides an incredible service to allow for very easy trades between characters, and essentially blows out the wide range of items you could have available to you at any one time. So, in fact, the AH has to be a factor in how we drop items. On one hand you have a huge benefit because you can buy and sell items very easily, as opposed to having to post up WTS threads in the old USEast trading forums, but on the other end it does impact the item pool economy with the inherent ease at which you can trade items. If the AH existed but wasn't a factor at all into how items dropped/rolled, the economy would be completely tanked within a matter of weeks.


    However, Jay later (much later) said this was not true
    http://www.diablofans.com/news/1236-diablo-iii-developer-amaa-update-on-auction-house-commodity-sales-working-on-us-servers-account-security-alert-linkedin/

    Originally Posted by Blizzard (Blue Tracker / Official Forums)

    You've been quoted as saying that Diablo III loot is balanced around the existence of the Auction House. Could you clarify what you mean by that?
    I'm sorry, I don't remember saying that and if I did then I was drunk and/or wrong. We tuned and balanced the game without the auction house, as there weren't enough people internally using it to test it against gameplay, so we didn't design anything for it.
  • #40
    Jay Wilson strikes back from the grave. Man, this guy really never played D2, did he? "D2 never had an AH." Yes, that's right, all of those spam-bots were made and sent by commune hippies who hate the idea of currency. That Enigma Hammerdin was actually a real person, no really.

    The issue isn't the AH, it's the complete and utter lack of item sinks. He (okay they, but I'm pinning this on him solely based on his PvP "blog") Early on in the closed beta, your average crafting recipe had one or two fixed range stats, then a couple of random rolls. Not ALL random rolls. You know, useful crafting. Somehow, that changed. During one Blizzcon, they mentioned that soulbound gear would only be a few items at level 60. It shipped w/ ZERO bound gear whatsoever.

    Everything this guy says is utter crap. He's completely short-sighted and confused as to what problems the AH caused and what was caused by his own incompetence. Yeah, look at your average public game in D2. Seems like a well run, stable economy, right? Seriously? PLAY YOUR OWN GAMES AND LOOK AT THE RESULTS. Idiot.
  • #41
    I never really understood why people feel the loot drops are that bad. I mean it's clear that there are superior items on the AH, but it's not like the stuff you find isn't viable to use for beating the game either. People have beaten the earlier version of inferno on self found gear, and there are players doing high MPs fine on all self found gear now. The AH is simply a shortcut to make it easier, or to use less skill (more face tanking). I can't speak for other servers, but on Americas the AH was down more often than not for the first couple weeks of release, yet many players still did fine even on mostly self found gear.

    Ever since D3 came out, while farming Inferno Act 3, I would regularly sell direct upgrades for my character since I prioritized keeping the money rather then trying to deck out my character. I was definitely getting good drops back then. Based on my PayPal I believe it's somewhere along the lines of $3500 from May through July of mostly self found gear. I did began flipping items pretty regularly sometime after 1.0.4 hit though, as somewhere in the process of altering loot the drop chance went up too much, while quality went down quite a bit. In terms of the "drop quality AND quantity", I actually liked where it was at release, but many people complained about all sorts of things.

    As of now, loot quality was nerfed multiple times, to the point where farming is simply inefficient compared to flipping. Even though I still play D3, I think I've only found one $10 item (lacunis) this entire month. Pretty terrible from a loot perspective, though I still have fun playing.

    -----

    At this point, I really don't think it's possible to save the softcore economy. It's simply broken, and still without a loot sink of any sort for decent items. Personally, I'd like to see a self-found ladder server, ‚Äč preferably cross region for a larger player base (sort of like PTRs).

    I don't think the AH itself is a bad idea, as it simply simplifies trading. So if trading is allowed in the game, I feel like the AH also has a spot in the game. However, I think a no-trade and no-AH ladder that resets regularly (maybe every 1-2 months) would be both fun and exciting, simply to see how many people manage to do MP10 on SELF-found gear in that time frame.

    I'm hoping Blizzard adds in some sort of separate server with a Ladder. While I'd appreciate ANY ladder system, I do wish they put in a self-found only one.
    Too casual to upload anything new these days.
  • #42
    "I think we would turn it off if we could," Wilson said during his talk. But the problem is "not as easy as that;" with all of Blizzard's current players, he says the company "has no idea" how many players like the system or hate it"


    tally the people who sold items and people who bought items OMG im a genius
  • #43
    Quote from Telsak

    How about a new feature that would let the player soulbind items to their toon. The process would make the item bound to the character or account. Once bound, the item could begin acquire exp, like the materia system in FFVII. Each item could have a single unique bonus affix that would level up like paragon levels as you gain xp with the item equipped. These item affixes would only show up as part of the soulbound thing. There would be an npc (mystic) that would assist with soulbinding/unbinding items. They would also allow you to change what affix your soulbound item currently has. Changing the affix could be done for free, but would reset the item back to 0 xp.

    Once you put up a soulbound item on the AH, a warning is shown and the item is displayed with it's base stats and if it sells it's stripped of its stats and no longer bound. The new buyer has to soulbind it to his own toon in order to start earning xp.


    Excellent idea. I would prefer a more simple idea though: Being able to enchant items, thus making them bound to character or account, for a gold price. Then it should be possible to undo the enchantment and unbind them, again for a gold price. If the undo price is high enough it can be both a gold sink and a gear sink. Either players will undo and sell on AH or just sell to vendor because the undo price is too high compared to the value of the item.
  • #44
    Even better, they could put a soulbound timer on all AH purchases. Once you buy and item the timer runs... 1 month for mats for example, 3 months for rares and 6 months for legendaries. it could be adjusted for the economy. Of course better yet would be to kill the AH but I'm dreaming :)

    N.B. : only kill GAH not RMAH... RMAH has lawsuit implication, you wouldn't want that... this told from me which hates the AH and has never even set foot in the RMAH so no I won't lose profits or anything else.
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