System Changes

  • #42
    Here's an excellent post by one of the people on the original thread (not a blue post). Pretty much sums up my feelings:

    Quote from »
    All the support for Jay's post and for Blizzard seems like a case of Stockholm Syndrome to me. There's a huge difference between being committed to quality and being obsessive-compulsive, and with this latest information it certainly appears that Blizzard is beginning to exhibit symptoms of the latter.

    Its commendable that Blizzard has such a strong stance on quality - but lets look at the facts. According to wikipedia development on Diablo 3 begun back in 2001 when Blizzard North was still in operation. Over 10 years later and they're still not finished. The posts stating that it should not be compared to DNF - perhaps your right, but keep in mind DNF was in development for 15 years. D3 is quickly closing on that gap. While I expect the quality of D3 to greatly outdo DNF, I think even if DNF was the game we were all hoping it would be it would still carry the stigma of being vaporware.

    Lets look at some recent releases - namely Skyrim, since I feel its a good indication of a deep and compelling game. Again referring to Wikipedia - development on Skyrim begun in 2008 after the release of Fallout 3. In under 3 years Bethesda managed to create a game whose scope is more than likely larger than Diablo 3. Its growing increasingly likely that we will see the release of games like Guild wars 2 and Torchlight 2 before Diablo 3's release, and I have no qualms about saying that the quality of those two games will be comparable to the quality of D3. At this rate, I wouldn't be the least surprised if those games overshadowed the relase of D3.

    It would be naive to say that fans of Blizzard and the Diablo franchise aren't starting to get irritated, and this white-knighting for Blizzard and their delays is only doing more to hurt the fans then help. Its telling Blizzard that not only is it okay to give the impression that a game is nearing completion only to come back months later and say that numerous game systems were undergoing massive changes, thereby eliminating any estimate of a possible release date. It's telling them its okay to create incentives for their customers to throw money at, either via the Annual Pass, pre-orders, collector editions, etc...and then respond with this waterfall-behavior of game design.

    The fact of the matter is the systems that are now being revised should have been changed months ago, either before the beta or shortly after. Changing it this far into the release cycle jeopardizes the game - it discourages the fans and it gives the impression that Blizzard is no longer the competent game designer that we've all grown to love.

    At this point - it doesn't even matter to me. I opted for the annual pass - which I do, to some extent, regret doing. Seeing as there's no way for me to backout I have no choice but to wait it out. However, I don't expect that when D3 is released I'll feel the same joy and excitement when D2 came out - or D2:LoD, the feeling of finally being able to see and play SC2. Personally this is the death of the Diablo franchise for me, it'll be another game I install - play for some time, then quietly forget as I move onto better games.

    And for me - that is a terribly depressing realization.

  • #43
    Holy S%#t! So much changes... now i see why they delay release so much... i hope it will work out ;)
  • #44
    So, first they thought going back to town every 3 minutes to sell all your items was uncool, so they added the Cauldron of Jordan. I thought that was a great idea. I'm glad they took all this time to change that system and make it exactly the same as Diablo 2 after all these very important iterations. Now we get mountains of useless items and have to constantly go back to town if we want to sell them. So yeah, now tons of crap will be left on the floor. Mission accomplished? And now, instead of quickly identifying items for free with Cain, we have to spend two seconds staring at each item. What is the point of this? What a waste of time. Oh, but you can TP all you want... big difference from Diablo 2, right? Those TP scrolls were really expensive!

    At this point, it's pretty clear they don't know what they're doing. Everything that is not a tried-and-true formula is either iterated til it becomes one, or simply removed (see charms, see Mystic). They're just endlessly iterating and second-guessing themselves, and it's become a rather boring thing to watch. How can anyone even be excited about the game at this point?

    This game will not even be close to done when Q1 ends. Expect late 2012, if anything. That much is painfully obvious. Save yourself the grief, just don't even bother having expectations. These guys are determined to crush them.

    lol @ "No one will remember if the game is late". Stories about the time it's taking for Blizzard to make this game will be told to our grandchildren, Jay.
  • #45
    Quote from lorien1973

    So my barbarian picks up an unidentified wand, stares at it for 5 seconds and says "Butt scratcher, perhaps?" Finds a monk fist weapon and ponders, "Why do demons carry back scratchers?"
  • #46
    while I normally support blizzard's stance in taking their time for perfection, at this point, it just seems that they're doing a lot of unnecessary nit-picking
  • #47
    the bashiok post where he says all those changes are already in the game should make you guys freak out a little less.
  • #48
    I thought that TL2 and D3 would at least have different mechanics, making for a different-feeling gameplay experience at the cores.

    With today's news, I guess that isn't the case. What's next? A permanent pet in D3?
  • #49
    No one will remember if the game is late, only if it's great.

    Horseshit. I remember every game, good or bad, that came out obnoxiously late. I won't ever forget their gross tardiness.
  • #50
    With today's news, I guess that isn't the case. What's next? A permanent pet in D3?

    Every class, save barbarian, has the option for one at some point. Wizard: familiar. Hunter: Ferret (runed at least), WD: everything.
  • #51
    ~FACE-PALM~ :facepalm:
  • #52
    Dont get me wrong, I like these changes, but to be doing this much overhaul this late in development makes me think "WTF HAS BEEN GOING ON ALL THIS TIME"_
  • #53
    Quote from TheAdziK

    Holy S%#t! So much changes... now i see why they delay release so much... i hope it will work out ;)

    That's what everyone is thinking after reading that article :)

    But if you read updated Daeity's blog you see that he thinks that those are comparable very small changes which just were made to look big for everyone and hide the real reason for the delay. And I can agree with that. Removal of scroll, UI changes, Cube and Jordan - all all minor changes. The only bigger change is stats revamp, but this is just a math, it can't take that long to balance.

    I mean, do they really delay the game for 3+ months just to get those changes? That's sounds funny.

    Edit: and Daeity's post has just been delete from his blog.. strange.
    You should never underestimate the predictability of stupidity.
  • #54
    So, all the delay was becasue of this, not because of the Korea issue.
    Yeah, right.

    The WoW Annual Pass will expire and Diablo III won't have launched at this rate. They're talking like they're months aways from a possible release.
    Imagination is the only weapon in the war against reality.
  • #55
    I have a sneaking suspicion this is all an experiment hosted by a group of psychology phds studying how long they can tease people with a video game until people snap and a line is drawn... Step out you lab coats, I caught you.
  • #56
    Quote from Gealic

    Dont get me wrong, I like these changes, but to be doing this much overhaul this late in development makes me think "WTF HAS BEEN GOING ON ALL THIS TIME"_

    Agreed. I was expecting:


    What i got was: Stuff that should have happened a year ago.
  • #57
    As a beta player I am really getting bored with the game. I have found and reported aprox. 12 different bugs/problems, but they have all been fixed/resolved. With TERA (May 1st), Firefall and a few others games on the horizon, I find myself getting less and less excited about the game. Today I just reduced my 2 collector's edition pre-orders down to 1 regular edition. This was before reading this post. This post, as something I agree with and some I do not, pretty much means the game isn't going to be out until Juneish.


    No i'm not giving anyone my beta account.

    Edit: Some spelling and grammer
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  • #58
    overall the changes dont seem to insanely drastic as they made it sound. the real thing that is going to delay the game is the skill n runestone changes. soon as those are done it will ship.
    "once the pretty hardcore gamers we had testing inferno found it fairly difficult, we then we doubled it" -trolololol jay wilson
  • #59
    Ugh. What a bunch of noodling.
    Pros: No ID scrolls. Good. Maybe they can get rid of the ID mechanic entirely. "Unwrapping your present" is when you finally have a spare moment to stop, open your bag, and read all of the stats on your new shiny. If the combat is as fast and constant as they promise, then you shouldn't have a lot of downtime to stare at your gear.

    Cons: Everything else. There's a very good reason they changed the stats and made them only do one thing at a time. Barbarians/monks/hunters become defensive/dodging stalwarts AND can dish out the pain w/o any trade-off. Wizards/Doctors secondary benefits aren't very helpful most of the time. This is a dumb change.

    Mystic wasn't broken beyond repair, you just can't use the same stupid stats for enchants as you did for gems. Besides, they still need a good rune sink (unless runes are removed from the game).

    Cube/Cauldron gone, blech. I don't want to go to town. They were right the first time, I WANT TO KILL STUFF, not chat w/ the damn blacksmith. Maybe some tweaks? (Cauldron gives you a fraction of the vendor sell price? You pay a penalty for convenience).

    I have a sinister, sinking sensation that skill points/levels are back again, and +skill gear is back. I really, really hope I'm wrong. If they bring back skill points, they're even more spineless than I figured, and we might actually get Diablo 2.5, which would suck.
  • #60
    • Scrolls of Identification are gone - players can now identify rares/legendary items without them.
    • Weird... used to Cain identifying.

    • Button '5' is now dedicated to potions.
    • Don't care, was probably going to leave potions there anyways.

    • The Mystic artisan has now been removed from the game.
    • Good, I always believed she was a glorified jeweler.

    • The Cauldron of Jordan and Nephalem have been removed.
    • Not a big loss, I don't mind going to town as I'm used to it from D2. I like that it will make it so we don't WANT to pick up everything. We're treasure hunters, not carpet cleaners.

    • The Stone of Recall is now a button at the bottom and has been renamed "Town Portal".
    • Cool. Running out of TP scrolls wasn't exciting in D2, and the stone didn't make a lot of sense.

    • The Blacksmith is now responsible for salvaging players' items.
    • Common (white colored) items are no longer salvageable.
    • Cool.

    • Character Attributes have been changed. Stats are now broken down as follows:
    • YEAHHHHH! D2 attributes!

    • Character stats are now placed in the same place as the inventory panel and the old dedicated stats panel has been removed.
    • Much easier than D2.
  • #61
    This is not securing a quality product. This is telling us they dont know how they want the game to appear on release.

    * I bet you all that in 2 months from now we will get a new update telling us about a new attributes system and the removal of the Jeweler.
    * I bet you all that in 1 month from now we will see a new and fantastic Beta wave. Woohoo!
    * Finally, I bet Activision is really happy with how the game progresses and the complete farce this whole situation has become.

    I wonder what EA would have done with Bioware if Bioware would have struggled like this when SWToR was in beta? Whoopish!!
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