So some conclusions I've drawn after many more hours of playing with these builds:
DW is really strong as long as both weapons are high dps so that hota hits hard enough to 1-2 shot elites.
Sunkeeper + EF + SOJ is really strong because the 40% dmg to elites melts them.
Hitting the 2.0 attack speed breakpoint without wotb basically trivializes fury gen and makes sure your tornadoes clean up all stragglers.
Thunderstrike + overpower + charge is the fastest combo. Charge + OP kills many elites on its own, and thunderstrike 1) stops runners by stunning and 2) generates a ton of fury.
If you can't or don't want to by a lifesteal weapon, a little bit of life on kill goes a long way.
Your stopwatch program in that video shows it as being 83.5 m/hr, which is very consistent with what I'm getting with this set up. I noticed you dropped rend/hota for bash and it didn't slow you down, because you're doing so much damage from WW/tornadoes. I wonder if you could drop bash but keep Merciless Assault, because it generates so much fury, and use merciless assault and momentum to keep a high WOTB uptime. At this point this is diverging a lot from the original point of the thread, but I think its worth trying.
mby u didn't boost ur burst factor high enough to actually oneshot elites with single HotA crit? atk speed makes ur dmg fake, u have gloves and ammy with IAS and no CD so instead of one-shotting you were prolly two-shotting them (it takes more time to twoshot sth with 1.3 APS than oneshot sth with 1.09 APS, while twoshoting sth with 1.6 APS is faster than twoshotting sth with 1.3 APS)
also show me da skorn bro, mby it was not good enough
and I have to say that the results are improved for me over using the Skorn.
numbers my brother, we want numbers
Hope I didn't strike a nerve, just sharing my experiences.
I swapped in IAS gear after I switched to a DW set up in order to hit the 2.0 WW/tornado breakpoint w/o WOTB. I was doing enough damage with my Skorn to one shot elites IF I crit. However, because you aren't always at full fury, critting isn't necessarily guaranteed. Also, packs split up, etc, so you can't always get them all in 1 or even 2 hits. I found with the Skorn's slow attack speed that things like that posed more of a problem, because attacking at 1.17 instead of 2.0 is a really big difference. Things can happen between slow hits, like getting hit by a Golgor's attack that knocks you back, or having the mob pop shielding, or whatever. Here's the Skorn I was using: http://i.imgur.com/FvaUj.jpg
As for numbers, my average with the Skorn was in the 70-73 mil/hr range. With the DW setup, I'm consistently getting in the 80-83 mil/hr range. I've never been able to reproduce Aerialis's 90-100mil xp/hr numbers, but I don't have a leorics and his gear is better than mine.
Here's a video of me doing about 71 mil/hr with the Skorn that I posted on page 3 of this thread:
Here's a video I made last night of me getting a little over 80 mil/hr using my DW setup:
It's not a complete apples to apples comparison, but its the best I can show you and the results have been very consistent for me. Since switching from the Skorn my runs have gone from low 70s to low 80s, or up by about 12.5%. Also, as you can see I am sure, this isn't my best run with the DW set up... I messed around and wasted a ton of time in the keep depths. So this is the low end of my new runs at about 80 mil/hr, and it can be a few of mil/hr higher than that.
I'm posting this with a little embarassment because I've been a big cheerleader for using Skorns and 2 hand builds, but yesterday/today I tried using the exact same build but with two high DPS 1 handers, and I have to say that the results are improved for me over using the Skorn.
As you can see, I'm still using the exact same spec that we're talking about here, and I'm playing it exactly the same way that I was playing it with the Skorn. It's just that on MP0 with good enough DPS you really don't need the Skorn's high base damage to 1 shot the trash, and the DW setup makes elites faster because there is less delay. It also generates more rage because of the higher tick rate on WW and the tornadoes.
Anyways, I still think this is the best build for farming XP/items on MP0, but as much as I like Skorn I'm not sure that's better for this build than using a DW setup unless you are on a budget.
Have you guys settled on a spec? For now I think I like Merciless Assault + Overpower the best, leaving out Leap, and using Thunderstrike over Rend. But Aerialus it looks like your profile is back to rend?
Also, where do you guys go after Tower of the Damned 1 in your Alkaizer route? The standard route is Crater 2, but I hate going there with less than 5 stacks.
Even ww spec, tbh, if you kill stuff with first crit, I'm not quite sure if ias skorn and overall ias gear is mandatory for this. Trash dies to first tornado crits anyways, if they crit for over 100k at mp0. So you get no benifit of it ticking faster, in terms of fury generation. There is also passive fury generation that is big part of this build.
I feel like with seriously overgearing content, no wotb build ias might not be that important, even for ww/tornado build.
I don't think IAS matters for this build at all either. I also want to suggest again that you guys give Merciless Assault another shot. It doesn't gain speed, because of the animation stall at the end, but I don't think it loses it either... I think the increased speed from the charge itself cancels out with the stall and its the same as if you had just run that distance. But what it does do is #1 increase your fury generation significantly, meaning you can drop animosity and run both ruthless and weapon master, and #2 do near instant 195% weapon damage to an entire elite pack. Instead of overpower, my combo is to leap > rend > charge, making sure sprint is active. if you point it the right direction this will kill all but the highest HP elite packs without losing any time. I think being able to run both DPS passives along with the extra 30% weapon dmg on charge vs overpower more than makes up for any DPS loss from the killing spree bonus.
That comes out to a little over 71m XP/hour. To get to 80m XP/hour you would need to shave the run time down 15-30 seconds and end up with 8.5mil XP. I think this is doable, but probably not consistently. My personal average is pretty close to 70, but I've been tracking it manually. I'm going to start using that tool you posted since it will be more accurate. Thanks for making that.
Sure, but its better for max item farming.
DW is really strong as long as both weapons are high dps so that hota hits hard enough to 1-2 shot elites.
Sunkeeper + EF + SOJ is really strong because the 40% dmg to elites melts them.
Hitting the 2.0 attack speed breakpoint without wotb basically trivializes fury gen and makes sure your tornadoes clean up all stragglers.
Thunderstrike + overpower + charge is the fastest combo. Charge + OP kills many elites on its own, and thunderstrike 1) stops runners by stunning and 2) generates a ton of fury.
If you can't or don't want to by a lifesteal weapon, a little bit of life on kill goes a long way.
Your stopwatch program in that video shows it as being 83.5 m/hr, which is very consistent with what I'm getting with this set up. I noticed you dropped rend/hota for bash and it didn't slow you down, because you're doing so much damage from WW/tornadoes. I wonder if you could drop bash but keep Merciless Assault, because it generates so much fury, and use merciless assault and momentum to keep a high WOTB uptime. At this point this is diverging a lot from the original point of the thread, but I think its worth trying.
Hope I didn't strike a nerve, just sharing my experiences.
I swapped in IAS gear after I switched to a DW set up in order to hit the 2.0 WW/tornado breakpoint w/o WOTB. I was doing enough damage with my Skorn to one shot elites IF I crit. However, because you aren't always at full fury, critting isn't necessarily guaranteed. Also, packs split up, etc, so you can't always get them all in 1 or even 2 hits. I found with the Skorn's slow attack speed that things like that posed more of a problem, because attacking at 1.17 instead of 2.0 is a really big difference. Things can happen between slow hits, like getting hit by a Golgor's attack that knocks you back, or having the mob pop shielding, or whatever. Here's the Skorn I was using: http://i.imgur.com/FvaUj.jpg
As for numbers, my average with the Skorn was in the 70-73 mil/hr range. With the DW setup, I'm consistently getting in the 80-83 mil/hr range. I've never been able to reproduce Aerialis's 90-100mil xp/hr numbers, but I don't have a leorics and his gear is better than mine.
Here's a video of me doing about 71 mil/hr with the Skorn that I posted on page 3 of this thread:
Here's a video I made last night of me getting a little over 80 mil/hr using my DW setup:
It's not a complete apples to apples comparison, but its the best I can show you and the results have been very consistent for me. Since switching from the Skorn my runs have gone from low 70s to low 80s, or up by about 12.5%. Also, as you can see I am sure, this isn't my best run with the DW set up... I messed around and wasted a ton of time in the keep depths. So this is the low end of my new runs at about 80 mil/hr, and it can be a few of mil/hr higher than that.
Here's my current profile: http://us.battle.net/d3/en/profile/Morphos-1475/hero/19237630
As you can see, I'm still using the exact same spec that we're talking about here, and I'm playing it exactly the same way that I was playing it with the Skorn. It's just that on MP0 with good enough DPS you really don't need the Skorn's high base damage to 1 shot the trash, and the DW setup makes elites faster because there is less delay. It also generates more rage because of the higher tick rate on WW and the tornadoes.
Anyways, I still think this is the best build for farming XP/items on MP0, but as much as I like Skorn I'm not sure that's better for this build than using a DW setup unless you are on a budget.
Have you guys settled on a spec? For now I think I like Merciless Assault + Overpower the best, leaving out Leap, and using Thunderstrike over Rend. But Aerialus it looks like your profile is back to rend?
Also, where do you guys go after Tower of the Damned 1 in your Alkaizer route? The standard route is Crater 2, but I hate going there with less than 5 stacks.
I don't think IAS matters for this build at all either. I also want to suggest again that you guys give Merciless Assault another shot. It doesn't gain speed, because of the animation stall at the end, but I don't think it loses it either... I think the increased speed from the charge itself cancels out with the stall and its the same as if you had just run that distance. But what it does do is #1 increase your fury generation significantly, meaning you can drop animosity and run both ruthless and weapon master, and #2 do near instant 195% weapon damage to an entire elite pack. Instead of overpower, my combo is to leap > rend > charge, making sure sprint is active. if you point it the right direction this will kill all but the highest HP elite packs without losing any time. I think being able to run both DPS passives along with the extra 30% weapon dmg on charge vs overpower more than makes up for any DPS loss from the killing spree bonus.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iXPHVIorv4g&feature=plcp
That comes out to a little over 71m XP/hour. To get to 80m XP/hour you would need to shave the run time down 15-30 seconds and end up with 8.5mil XP. I think this is doable, but probably not consistently. My personal average is pretty close to 70, but I've been tracking it manually. I'm going to start using that tool you posted since it will be more accurate. Thanks for making that.
BTW here is the variant I use: http://us.battle.net/d3/en/calculator/barbarian#chXSUR!ZYh!bZYZZY
Here's my profile: http://us.battle.net/d3/en/profile/Morphos-1475/hero/19237630