Not really. See, that's the problem we have here with this being a wiki used as the medium.
Before the wiki started, I remember arguing for the inclusion of a feature that would allow us to lock articles for specific users, meaning only a select few (and admins) would be able to edit it. This was to ensure that people could write guides, and upload them into the wiki easily without running the risk of having them rewritten by other people, as only they would have the editing privileges of the guide article they originally created.
However, as it turned out, that wasn't possible to do, and it might have been a good thing. As it stands now, the wiki is open for editing, and it's supposed to be edited by anyone. If the guide is expressively written as if one person wrote it, it doesn't make any sense for someone else to edit it. It will appear as if the original author has made all edits, which he hasn't, and it's hard for another writer to keep continue writing on an article that is written from a personal perspective. In fact, they shouldn't, which is why the wiki is written in a more database-like manner.
Please tell me I explained that in a good manner.
Yes, that made a lot more sense. Thanks.
Well, generally you would expect someone to write a guide from their own experiences. It's hard to do anything else.
That isn't what I was saying. I said it was to provide backing for facts and figures. Not for my own input.
If a guide's validity is to be proved, it will do so in it's structure. By reading a guide, you will figure out whether the person who wrote it knows his stuff or not. If it is detailed and extensive, then the author has put in a lot of time. A guide is genuine by how it's written, not by the sources it puts out.
If you say so.
If sources are to be put in however, then it makes much more sense to include them as footnotes anyway in the wiki, and not as a section of it's own.
I wasn't aware of footnotes for the Wiki otherwise I would have done that. How do I do them?
Sarcasm? :rolleyes:
Yeah, I'm kind of pissed off at the moment and probably shouldn't be posting. I think I'm going to take a break for the time being after I finish posting this.
What I'm saying is, you can't take credit for it inside the article in the wiki. That's why we probably should have a guide forum as well. That way, we all win. Guide-writers can take credit for their work and keep it their own, and the wiki gets material to draw from to include in it's pages.
Well, just for further discussion's sake, would you mind if I tried to explain it a little differently, although now that you've said it all I understand why you're saying what you're saying?
Say someone invents a build. A specific build. If people go in and change stuff in it they will be changing what the build is and it will no longer be what it claims to be.
For instance, what if someone goes up to my article and changes the heavy investment in Energy to a heavy investment in Vitality? It will no longer be an ES build, a build focused around the use of ES as a shield against damage, it will be the typical tank build for the Sorceress. It will no longer be what the article claims to be.
Furthermore, if you created that build, wrote the meat of the article, got all the figures on your own, and tested it yourself, then what's wrong with puting your name here and there? I realize that you answered it in practical terms because anyone can edit the page, but that doesn't solve it on a moral level. Why can't it be locked? The front page of the Wiki is, isn't it? Is it just an issue with locking it and only letting a specific user edit it?
Your articles illustrates a problem with guides and the wiki. We can't have personal work put up there in personal form. What I mean is, you can't claim a written article as yours.
But I wrote it and gathered all of the information myself? That would be like saying a research paper isn't mine and I shouldn't receive a grade for it.
The opening paragraph is a great opener for a guide, but that's not a format we can use. An article, although it may well have been written by one person, cannot be claimed by that person just because he wrote it.
Why?
I also question the Version history and the Critical Notes section.
The version history doesn't make much sense, first because the history of the page is always kept in the history tab of the page, and second because there's no telling who will do the updates. neither does it make much sense to clutter up a build page with, eventually, increasingly long bits of text that do not actually add value to the article itself.
Yeah, I noticed that the last time I worked on it and I forgot to take it out.
The General information is similar. Sources feels a bit out of place; it's not as if the factual content is questioned or as if you're going to check the validity of the build.
It's there so that people know I didn't just make stuff up. It's critical to having a valid argument in any respect and respectable data.
Similar is the disclaimer. It is a wiki, and it is indended for the articles to be mutilated by whomever wishes to, which doesn't exacly make it your guide, even though you have written in.
Sure thing. Changing.
In essence, your guide is very good, but it isn't formatted for the wiki. I can understand your wishing to keep the guide yours, but if that's the case, then we need to set up a guide-forum here on Diablofans where you can put it up proper.
If you're saying I can't take credit for the massive amount of work that I put in to it, that's alright.
The wiki is supposes to only contain the essence, the relevant information from the game.
I'm not getting what you're saying here. Are you telling me that I'm not allowed to put any information up but straight facts? That would completely counteract the purpose of a guide. Guides are made to illustrate someone's build. A build someone likes or made or does personally different than others. You can't have a guide without personal input.
It's really simple but neat. It just stops everything around you. Of course, the time limit and the mana cost and everything all depends on its level, but it's fun to mess around with. If I run in to a large mob I just TS them and burn them to cinders with CS. On Superuniques, some later monsters in NM and Hell, and Bosses, though, TS doesn't completely stop them or stop them for long- it will usually just slow them alot. Still very useful, a very tactical skill that not only helps you, but your whole team, considerably in many circumstances.
Some of you may disagree but if you want to see how a good D2 character guide is put together then go check out the ones on jsp. Many of them are made by pro duelers and HC players and they have very extensive guides
I really think an in-depth guide on how to do one would be beneficial, maybe put it in the main builds page. What's there isn't all too helpful, really. Maybe a generic structure or something.
Also, I think it would be pivotal to include tons of links to other Wiki pages, like skill pages and item pages, where applicable. It will be nice once more of the item pages are finished.
And, Magistrate, I answer no to at least 2 of those questions, yet I enjoyed my own Lighting Sorceress very much... except it wasn't ES, I plan to do an ES... sometime.
The ES one is a lot of fun, too. Especially Time Stop, I loved that skill.
Dunno. I just started this one yesterday: http://wiki.diablofans.com/index.php/Lightning_Sorceress. I think I covered most of that (although I still have a lot of information to actually add), but like Pjanoo said, images would probably be good for more appeal.
Yes, that made a lot more sense. Thanks.
That isn't what I was saying. I said it was to provide backing for facts and figures. Not for my own input.
If you say so.
I wasn't aware of footnotes for the Wiki otherwise I would have done that. How do I do them?
Yeah, I'm kind of pissed off at the moment and probably shouldn't be posting. I think I'm going to take a break for the time being after I finish posting this.
Well, just for further discussion's sake, would you mind if I tried to explain it a little differently, although now that you've said it all I understand why you're saying what you're saying?
Say someone invents a build. A specific build. If people go in and change stuff in it they will be changing what the build is and it will no longer be what it claims to be.
For instance, what if someone goes up to my article and changes the heavy investment in Energy to a heavy investment in Vitality? It will no longer be an ES build, a build focused around the use of ES as a shield against damage, it will be the typical tank build for the Sorceress. It will no longer be what the article claims to be.
Furthermore, if you created that build, wrote the meat of the article, got all the figures on your own, and tested it yourself, then what's wrong with puting your name here and there? I realize that you answered it in practical terms because anyone can edit the page, but that doesn't solve it on a moral level. Why can't it be locked? The front page of the Wiki is, isn't it? Is it just an issue with locking it and only letting a specific user edit it?
But I wrote it and gathered all of the information myself? That would be like saying a research paper isn't mine and I shouldn't receive a grade for it.
Why?
Yeah, I noticed that the last time I worked on it and I forgot to take it out.
It's there so that people know I didn't just make stuff up. It's critical to having a valid argument in any respect and respectable data.
Sure thing. Changing.
If you're saying I can't take credit for the massive amount of work that I put in to it, that's alright.
I'm not getting what you're saying here. Are you telling me that I'm not allowed to put any information up but straight facts? That would completely counteract the purpose of a guide. Guides are made to illustrate someone's build. A build someone likes or made or does personally different than others. You can't have a guide without personal input.
Yep, that's what I said.
http://miyoshino.la.coocan.jp/eswiki/?Lightning%20Spells#eaa22a28
It's really simple but neat. It just stops everything around you. Of course, the time limit and the mana cost and everything all depends on its level, but it's fun to mess around with. If I run in to a large mob I just TS them and burn them to cinders with CS. On Superuniques, some later monsters in NM and Hell, and Bosses, though, TS doesn't completely stop them or stop them for long- it will usually just slow them alot. Still very useful, a very tactical skill that not only helps you, but your whole team, considerably in many circumstances.
I guess I'll go and take a look at that
Also, I think it would be pivotal to include tons of links to other Wiki pages, like skill pages and item pages, where applicable. It will be nice once more of the item pages are finished.
The ES one is a lot of fun, too. Especially Time Stop, I loved that skill.