They're inept for not including something they don't feel is good enough to put their name on and isn't something the vast majority of D3 players don't care about? Again, I really do get your personal frustration, but drawing a larger parallel of that to Blizzard's decision-making seems...I don't know. Overreaching? Dramatic?
I can assure you I'm not frustrated. I really don't care about PvP. I only think it's revealing about the company itself. I think they're inept cause they've enjoyed a really long luxurious development cycle that most other developers can only dream of. And they constantly scrapped and revised systems while constantly telling the public about it instead of just shutting up about it and focusing on developing the game.
To say you'd rather have a really crummy PvP system at launch seems silly to me.
Well at any rate, I'm not one of the people saying that. Like I said I don't care PvP isn't coming out at launch. I never played Diablo for PvP. I only think it's interesting what it reveals about Blizzard itself.
I would argue though, that them telling the public about systems they weren't 100% was more of an experiment; They wanted to see if they could let us a little farther in to their development of a game, and I think we failed lol. I really do see them just shutting doors as far as info goes until release, of anything, in the future. Hopefully not, but meh probably.
That seems non-cosntructive and completely backward to me. I think pretty much every point of debate from the PvP side of this discussion has been answered logically and politely at some point. And some PvPers have been rational and talked constructively too. Then you have posts like this. In my experience, when someone starts raging and trying to bully their way through a debate on cheep insults and testosterone, it is because they know they don't have answeres and fall back on intimidation.
Sorry if I'm being equally non-cosntructive, but the character of this post is just highly annoying.
How dare you try to troll me by talking about testosterone!!!! =D
In all seriousness you're correct it just turns into a flamefest and nothing gets accomplished.
Whoa whoa whoa, I have to stop you there buddy. I usually glance past the obvious raging so as to not get sucked in, but well grats you sucked me in =D
Straight up calling people who like the PVM side nut huggers, ect is just going to start a flame war. I advise you try to be half civil while arguing.
The game has been in development for less than 6 years, closer to 5. Yelling out false facts just confuses people.
If it's anywhere close to D2 (which they said it is, in length and time of play) it will be FAR more than 8 hours to run through. MAYBE about 8 hours to run through normal? But there are 3 other difficulties and a level cap of 60.
Comparing a linear (while yes open, but nothing changes) game like skyrim, with fixed locations and dungeons, to a randomized ARPG such as D3 doesn't make sense, they are vastly different games. Is skyrim big? Sure. Do you want to try and do the math at how many potential dungeons and outside environments D3 has? I wouldn't want to either.
'Have their lead tester code the shit in it's that easy.' I'm... not even going into that one. In fact, I suspect you are trolling sir, and I'm quite angry I've spent the time I have on this.
Ok, so those wanting an even bigger pvp experience, let me ask you this. If they came out with a SC3, and I started getting mad because I want them to pay more attention to the PVE (first player) aspect, and started saying that the PVE aspect has always been a huge chunk of the endgame, wouldn't that seem ridiculous? SC was made with a cool storyline and PVE, but it's PVP focused, you can't argue that.
You can get mad at the PvE aspect of that game because SC2 campaign sucked and I wish they put a lot more effort into it. I would 100% agree and back you up with that point that they completely lacked storyline in their solo player game and it's not up to par of what it should be.
But wait wait wait.. End game SC? No, that doesn't work for this arguement because it's not an RPG or MMO game. They are completely different game types. You just seem to be ignoring the fact that PvP WAS a big deal in D2 and people who PvPed in D2 are feeling really let down about D3 because it's not up to par of what it should be. Is Diablo a PvE focused for game the majority of the game? Yes. Will PvP be a large part of the end game for players in D3? Absolutely. Will it be supported the way it should be for the D2 to D3 community? Not at all.
I'm confused when you say 'will it be supported the way it should be for D2 to D3 community? Not at all.' How exactly was it supported in D2? If you took the pvp features from D2 and D3 and compared them, you would have arena with multiple maps, multiple pvp modes, and an internal ranking ladder, compared to... griefing in D2.
What I'm saying and what I THINK a lot of people here are trying to say is, D3 IS getting a lot of pvp attention, without going overboard. Most of us who are arguing this don't want to see this suddenly get turned into a huge balancing act, all the way down to PVP only items to whatever other extreme it could have.
I agree, PVP will be a big endgame, it's the alternative to farming, and I will defiantly be playing it, a lot. But I also think that D3 has more than enough for pvp attention, without causing what I said above to happen. But I'm still confused as to why I'm hearing that D3 hasn't gotten the pvp attention that it deserves 'like' D2 did, because D1 and D2 had NO pvp attention. Hell even the ladders were for PVE.
Ok, so those wanting an even bigger pvp experience, let me ask you this. If they came out with a SC3, and I started getting mad because I want them to pay more attention to the PVE (first player) aspect, and started saying that the PVE aspect has always been a huge chunk of the endgame, wouldn't that seem ridiculous? SC was made with a cool storyline and PVE, but it's PVP focused, you can't argue that.
Now reverse; D3 is a PVE focused game. Yes it has a PVP part, which they've given a LOT more attention to this time around, but the game, the end game, any part of the game has been PVE, another point you can't argue, well mostly because the developers themselves MADE the game for PVE.
D1 had ganking
D2 had griefing
D3 will have multiple arenas, game modes, a (while maybe not visible) internal ladder to better match you against an opponent.
I'm confused as to what the argument is. If you like pvp in a mostly, 95% (made up) PVE game, and they are putting in a lot of options for pvp'ers, why any complaining?
Edit: Stole some of succubus_queen's points =P
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
To post a comment, please login or register a new account.
I would argue though, that them telling the public about systems they weren't 100% was more of an experiment; They wanted to see if they could let us a little farther in to their development of a game, and I think we failed lol. I really do see them just shutting doors as far as info goes until release, of anything, in the future. Hopefully not, but meh probably.
How dare you try to troll me by talking about testosterone!!!! =D
In all seriousness you're correct it just turns into a flamefest and nothing gets accomplished.
Whoa whoa whoa, I have to stop you there buddy. I usually glance past the obvious raging so as to not get sucked in, but well grats you sucked me in =D
Straight up calling people who like the PVM side nut huggers, ect is just going to start a flame war. I advise you try to be half civil while arguing.
The game has been in development for less than 6 years, closer to 5. Yelling out false facts just confuses people.
If it's anywhere close to D2 (which they said it is, in length and time of play) it will be FAR more than 8 hours to run through. MAYBE about 8 hours to run through normal? But there are 3 other difficulties and a level cap of 60.
Comparing a linear (while yes open, but nothing changes) game like skyrim, with fixed locations and dungeons, to a randomized ARPG such as D3 doesn't make sense, they are vastly different games. Is skyrim big? Sure. Do you want to try and do the math at how many potential dungeons and outside environments D3 has? I wouldn't want to either.
'Have their lead tester code the shit in it's that easy.' I'm... not even going into that one. In fact, I suspect you are trolling sir, and I'm quite angry I've spent the time I have on this.
I'm confused when you say 'will it be supported the way it should be for D2 to D3 community? Not at all.' How exactly was it supported in D2? If you took the pvp features from D2 and D3 and compared them, you would have arena with multiple maps, multiple pvp modes, and an internal ranking ladder, compared to... griefing in D2.
What I'm saying and what I THINK a lot of people here are trying to say is, D3 IS getting a lot of pvp attention, without going overboard. Most of us who are arguing this don't want to see this suddenly get turned into a huge balancing act, all the way down to PVP only items to whatever other extreme it could have.
I agree, PVP will be a big endgame, it's the alternative to farming, and I will defiantly be playing it, a lot. But I also think that D3 has more than enough for pvp attention, without causing what I said above to happen. But I'm still confused as to why I'm hearing that D3 hasn't gotten the pvp attention that it deserves 'like' D2 did, because D1 and D2 had NO pvp attention. Hell even the ladders were for PVE.
Edit; 1337 post atm =D
Now reverse; D3 is a PVE focused game. Yes it has a PVP part, which they've given a LOT more attention to this time around, but the game, the end game, any part of the game has been PVE, another point you can't argue, well mostly because the developers themselves MADE the game for PVE.
D1 had ganking
D2 had griefing
D3 will have multiple arenas, game modes, a (while maybe not visible) internal ladder to better match you against an opponent.
I'm confused as to what the argument is. If you like pvp in a mostly, 95% (made up) PVE game, and they are putting in a lot of options for pvp'ers, why any complaining?
Edit: Stole some of succubus_queen's points =P