Sounds like some bad rng to me. I was able to get my first rorg within 25 minutes doing 12 normal a1 runs the second i hit 70. as for my lucky dh friend it only took him 6 cachs to get it after he hit 70 too.
I think it's more a case of you being really lucky than me being unlucky
So i started a new seasons Crusader and i am so frustrated because i can't get a RoRG. All other legendary items from Act I cache have already dropped 4 times. (Amulet, Bracer, Shoulder, Mace). I still havent dropped a single RoRG.
Is my luck that bad or there is something wrong?
I've been running act 1 bounties on t6 and between my own experience and all the posts that have popped up here about the poor drop rate, I would guess it's somewhere around 2-3%. I opened about 25 caches before seeing my first ring and have never gotten another one since then. Unless you can run them on t6 to get the guaranteed legendary drop I'd say it's not even worth trying to get it unless you have a lot of free time.
It wouldn't go away, because both Conflag's and Firebird's DOTs are refreshed by ANY fire damage, so basically you can throw 1 MM without Mirrorball - and both DOTs will never expire, since they refresh each other, while Firebird's one gets progressively stronger.
That's just awesome ... but unfortunately, I doubt that it's intended, which means it will probably get fixed.
I have the same feeling about conflag+firebird, and if that's the case is there any reason to keep using Magic Missile? I'm not opposed to actually relying on AP spenders for damage, but I hope if that's the intention they can do a bit better than the "cautiously optimistic" Meteor buff.
Everything dropping with a guaranteed socket is definitely a better solution than the current implementation of RG. The issue here is that its use is counter-intuitive, regardless of whether or not you can see that. I don't understand how you perceive this as complaining. If the goal is 5 affixes and a socket there's several good ways to achieve that:
1. All weapons drop with 5 affixes, user can roll one into a socket
2. All weapons drop with 4 non-socket affixes, RG is used to add socket
3. All weapons drop with 4 affixes, RG can be used to add a 5th, user can roll any of the 5 into a socket if there isn't one
ALL of these are better ways to handle it than:
4. Weapons drop with 4 affixes, RG can be used to add a socket IF there isn't one
This isn't a complaint and I have no idea how you are construing it as that. The issue is that the use of RG in its current form is counter-intuitive. If the goal is to get a socket on your weapon, rolling the existing socket off your weapon should not be a part of that process. It's just illogical.
As for you salvaging items with awesome stats and no sockets, Reaper of Souls features a Mystic NPC that can be used to enchant your gear. She is very useful for just such a situation, and can transform your "almost awesome" socket-less item into an awesome socketed one. You can find more information here: http://www.diablowiki.net/Mystic
Unreal, people... who cares if items are rendered useless after the gift is implemented... its designed to make a shitty item with no socket useful... you're using your current weapon now, right? Who cares if you already rolled a different stat? In 2 months after the patch hits its not gonna matter. New items drop every day. *wait for it* work for a better weapon, what's the problem? You wanna know a solution to this? Save weapons that roll well minus a socket, and has a stat you can roll to whatever you want. There are no 'problems' with this item. You people need to wake up and stop complaining about having to work to get things.
What makes you think nobody worked to get the weapons they currently have? *wait for it* Maybe that's why people are upset the weapon they worked for will be rendered useless.
Lol@ this... the fact that people worked hard is irrelevant, people worked hard for their level 60 gear which became useless At RoS launch... so your point is moot... are you done farming or are you going to continue to do so? Finding a new weapon is simply a matter of time... and as I said before, start saving possible options now and quit cryin
Ok, so if finding the right weapon is a matter of time, fine. Why even have a RG ? Why not just make sure the existing issues in weapons affixes are fixed in 2.1 and leave it at that. Afterall, a better weapon will drop to those who are patient so why would you even need to RG anything ?
RG as it is addresses a specific group of issues but in the process, causes imbalance.
Because as it stands, weapons drop with 4 primaries... their solution is to allow you to roll 1 useless stat, and still be able to put a socket in the weapon.. no matter how you slice it, you'll still need a weapon to roll perfect in order for a preferred set of stats to be on it. This is a quicker, easier fix than fiddling with stat rolls on weapons. People are gonna bitch regardless so they might as well take the easier route
How is this the easy route? If the problem is that weapons drop with 4 primaries and they should drop with 5 then just make every weapon drop with 5, and let the user roll the worst one into a socket exactly like we've already been doing. All this does is make a socket automatically the worst possible affix and force you to reroll it so you can use RG to get your fifth affix. Do you not see how counter-intuitive that is? You are forced to roll off the socket so you can then add the socket with RG. That makes no sense.
What they did with firebirds adds so much versatility to the set. I can't wait to dump AT and start using it!
I just got done testing on the PTR with Mirror Ball+Firebirds and I can say things are beginning to look good for wizards.
based on what`? that you do more damage on the PTR than on live? you don't need to "test" that. it's given. but there are still TONS of problems with the wizard, i wouldn't say it does look good, especially as it looks like the devs really have no ideas on the direction in which they want to move wizards. i don't think much will change in 2.1. more damage, but the old problems keep existing (2-3 mandatory "active passives", bad coefficients since the CM nurf, bad distribution of "good" and "bad" skill (just look at our primaries), et cetera).
You posted the same crap in my other thread, have you tested the set yet?
This issue isn't whether or not the set is good, it's the core mechanics of the class. Maybe this set makes us the best class in the game in solo greater rifts; that is still not indicative of Blizzard addressing the fundamental problems with our class. It will be great if Firebird is good and gives us a viable spec or two, but that does nothing for the people who want to play cold/lightning/arcane, or anything besides MM Firebird for that matter.
Unreal, people... who cares if items are rendered useless after the gift is implemented... its designed to make a shitty item with no socket useful... you're using your current weapon now, right? Who cares if you already rolled a different stat? In 2 months after the patch hits its not gonna matter. New items drop every day. *wait for it* work for a better weapon, what's the problem? You wanna know a solution to this? Save weapons that roll well minus a socket, and has a stat you can roll to whatever you want. There are no 'problems' with this item. You people need to wake up and stop complaining about having to work to get things.
What makes you think nobody worked to get the weapons they currently have? *wait for it* Maybe that's why people are upset the weapon they worked for will be rendered useless.
MM in offhand, TF in mainhand (will probably replace it with Sankis because I have sickly rolled one in my stash just waiting to socket it)
As of skills MM+BH blazar+Mammoth Hydra and buff trifecta (force wep, prism armor and sparkflint)
Melting T6, highest greater rift I got was 28, didn't have any trouble completing it but I got DC so no idea how far I could go with this setup.
Also I've tried some legendary gems, especially the one that increases Signature damage by 50% (rolled socket in my amu instead of %Fire Damage) and I've felt like I'm doing less damage than before - does %fire affect power of burning effect?
With the latest changes the 50% gem only works on generators not on signature spells (like DD)
It's awesome that they keep adding these items that make me think "this would be awesome for my build", then promptly forbid our class from using them.
This change is very disheartening. Yesterday I was enjoying the debate in the other thread about using Firebird vs. non-set items, and what situations each would be superior in. That's the kind of decision making I enjoy; several viable options, each superior in some ways and weaker in others. I was looking forward to using the host of interesting non-set items like the new Depth Diggers, Cindercoat, Magefist, etc. Others were looking forward to adding Hydras to their build or perhaps even dumping MM/Conflag all together for Hydra/ET or something else unique.
Today I look at the patch notes and Conflag has been neutered, Depth Diggers now has some illogical caveat, Hydra doesn't proc the new Firebird bonus, and despite that Firebird seems like it may be the only viable option for a fire spec (though it's still a bit early to say). I honestly feel quite gutted.
Before we even address the question of why these changes in particular were chosen, I'd really like to know why any of this was necessary in the first place. I'd particularly like to echo the sentiment of the others in this thread that have reminded us it's not sufficient to look at the Wizard class in a vacuum; it must be looked at in comparison to the other classes as well. With that said, does it really matter if the new changes allowed us to farm t6.. like every other class can do as well? Our numbers on the PTR were not in any way out of line in comparison to the other classes, nor were wizards seeing any particular success in greater rifts compared to anyone else. Honestly though, that is all beside the point. Even if MM/Conflag was completely out of hand, what made it so destructive that the only option was to completely gut it?
If the combination of conflag + the firebird bonus was problematic why not simply change that interaction (e.g. disallow them from proccing each other)? That type of change isn't exactly elegant but it is a simple fix that likely will not alienate anyone. If Magic Missile itself was too powerful why not simply revert the damage buff they gave it in the prior build? Why did the changes have to be some that will in all likelihood remove the build as a viable option? I cannot imagine this was the only way to address whatever the perceived problem was.
To summarize, my issue is not the changes themselves but the logic Blizzard has taken in making changes. This is not a subtle effort at increasing the number of viable builds. This is a strong message that they do not want MM/Conflag to be a viable build. Whether you liked the build or not, I do not see any harm in leaving it as an option. If it was too close to feeling like the "mandatory build" then address it as such and bring it more in line with other options (or more better yet, bring the other options in line with MM/Conflag). This brings me to my next point.
Our other options still suck.
Hydra is clunky and its inability to proc the new Firebird bonus is likely the nail in the coffin for the build if it's not a bug. Energy Twister is too situationally dependent to be a reliable primary source of damage. Lightning and Cold are still just awful. WoW builds were buffed, but already face significant issues in harder content. Channeling spells were buffed, but face the same issue and being encouraged to stand still for 3+ seconds to take advantage of the new mechanics will certainly not help that.
What does that leave us?
To be clear, I do not mean that rhetorically. I really just feel like our class is running out of options. I would love to hear what people are finding success with in this new build.
The way I understand the Firebird set effect is that everytime you deal Fire Damage you apply a debuff that deals 100% weapon damage over 3 seconds which can be stacked up to 3000% weapon damage over 3 seconds (30 stacks). Once it reaches 30 stacks, the debuff becomes "deal 3000% weapon damage per second untill the target dies".
Whatever way we understand it, it's probably going to change before it hits live servers, so let's not get too deep into theorycrafting with it... yet.
Not exactly :
"Fire damage will now cause enemies to start burning for the same amount of damage over 3 seconds", not 100% weapon damage (which is just bad).
Basically, we can say that Firebird will provide a 100% damage bonus over 3s. Now we have to determine if swapping gear to reach the 6p bonus is worth it or not. (and why not theorycrafting ? it's fun after all :p)
Considering you lose about 100% Magic Missile damage by dropping Depth Diggers alone, nevermind a potential 60% fire damage from Cindercoat, Magefist, and Andariel's Visage.. that doesn't bode well for Firebird. It's worth considering though that Conflag should also be building towards the 3000%/sec, so calculating how quickly you'll get there isn't entirely straightforward. I think it's fair to say that for mobs with less than X amount of HP non-set items will be strictly better, and Firebird will be superior for mobs with over X HP. The question is the value of X, and where you encounter mobs with that amount of HP. Barring some serious changes, it's likely it'll only be useful in high level greater rifts.
With that in mind, how the later level greater rifts are tuned will likely have a large impact on whether this set is worth using. In the current iteration of mobs with four trillion HP Firebird may be our only way to combat those numbers. If they change how difficulty is scaled (and I hope they do) that may no longer be the case. I believe there is some value in theorycrafting but right now there's so many unknown variables that it may be premature to pursue hard data.
Greater rifts also introduce an intangible element of practicality into the equation, as has been mentioned by others. Even if non-set items do outdamage Firebird on paper, if greater rifts remain tuned in such a way that kiting and avoiding being hit entirely is our only option then the passive damage of the DOT may be superior in practice. I can imagine a build that forgoes Magic Missile entirely for kiting around Hydras, thus opening up the use of the Firebird orb and another non-set armor piece. Who knows where 2.1 will take us?
It's nice to see they're addressing this but I'm hesitant to say it will be better than just running the superior non-set pieces like Cindercoat, Magefists, Andariel's Visage, Depth Diggers, Aughild's, etc. You are really giving up a ton of good stats to use some pretty bad pieces of gear (I mean dear god look at the shoulders..) just for the set bonus.. and that set bonus, at least on the surface, still does not look amazing. Realistically how often are you actually going to hit something enough to stack up to 3000% damage before it just dies anyway? I can see this being good for a grift build where you manage to max stack the dot on mobs with four trillion HP then go afk for a few hours until they die but for normal t6 rift farming and such I think it'll be preferable to just wear non-set pieces and one shot the mobs with magic missile.
I don't really think there needs to be another pet class. The classes should be unique, with elemental magic being the Wizard's focus as you said. I don't really see how homogenizing Wizard by making it more like Demon Hunter is the way to accomplish that. That said, your other ideas are interesting. I think it would be best if some of the unique and iconic Wizard elemental spells were buffed. Time Warp is certainly one of those. Shock Pulse and Spectral Blades are fun as well but given what it would take to make someone choose one over MM with Mirrorball makes me think any feasible changes are a lost cause. To see what I think is the primary problem with Wizard one need only to look at the top builds:
Chainpocalypse
MM/Conflag
Archon
All of these builds have one thing in common: they essentially ignore Arcane Power.
The real problem I see here is that our AP spenders are, quite frankly, total shit. We are currently better off simply using Magic Missile as our primary attack or sacrificing whatever necessary for CDR to increase Archon uptime than using an arcane spender. A lot of them are so awful that the AP cost isn't even the reason they are bad; they just aren't as good as MM/Conflag with Mirrorball regardless. This is a pretty sad state of affairs.
I don't think the skills are fundamentally bad. I think most of the Arcane Orb runes are pretty cool, as well as Meteor and the like. The problem is they just don't do enough damage for their cost to be anything more than a colorful addition to a build. Maybe this will improve a bit in 2.1, but personally I was absolutely gutted to see that Arcane Orb wasn't buffed AT ALL considering how utterly useless it is right now.
Ok so, you were right to wonder what the heck he was doing using +phys and fire skills at the same time .. but it's not hard to fix! Just change the zombie dogs rune to the damage redux one (it's physical), and the garg one to a different rune (if you even want to keep it). +phys will increase all of your skills that are physical in nature, and it will effect the psychos from your passive. Also, it's way easier to spec for your gear, than gear for your spec.. just saying.
Also, for your helm ... while indeed you are wearing a mask of jeram, you are wearing the wrong one! You are looking for the legendary one, NOT the set one. The difference being the legendary one has the +pet dmg affix, and the set one does not .. and itmakes a HUGE difference.
That's sort of what I suspected. I'm tempted to go fire because I have some good gear I can steal from my wizard but there's no way for me to change the element of my psychos right? I'll switch the entire build over to physical thenso things make a little more sense. About the Mask, I was gambling for a Mask of Jeram, got that one, and got super excited for about three seconds until I realized it's the wrong one. It's still the best helm I've gotten so far though so I'm just using it until I get the right one. Thanks for the advice!
Quote from ManWithHat»
You shouldn't use magefists because you already have the extremely rare T&T which are awesome for a Petdoc. Two other things you should look for are the Tall Man's Finger ( Ring that gives you one big fat zombiedog) and a ceremonialknife called Starkukri Metal which lowers the cd of your Big Bad Vodoo by one sec each time your fetishes deal dmg. In my opinion it is OK to use the wrathful protector as this beast deals tons of dmg no matter if you have %firedmg or not. Especially when his AI gets fixed next patch.
Right, good point. The Tasker and Theo totally slipped my mind. I will keep my eyes out for those items as well as the correct Mask of Jeram. Wrathful Protector certainly does do a lot of damage and the cooldown hasn't been much of an issue thanks to the -cooldown passive. I'll test out a physical runed Gargantuan just for testing's sake then decide from there I guess. Thanks again!
Long story short, I copied this build from someone's armory and have been playing around with it, but looking closer I have some questions about whether this really makes sense.
I don't really understand the interaction of various types of damage. It seems most of my damage is fire (burning zombie dogs, wrathful gargantuan) but the guy's gear had only physical damage. I assume this is to benefit the fetishes. Does it also increase the zombie dog's standard melee damage, or is that fire too? Because I do have a significant amount of fire damage should I try to get some fire damage % on my gear as well?
What this all really comes down to is the build just feels all over the place to me. There's physical damage, fire damage, poison damage.. would it not be beneficial to streamline it all into one or two elements? I just came to this character from playing Wizard so I don't really know what I'm doing, but I do have a lot of good fire damage gear like Cindercoat, Magefists, etc. I could use.
I actually agree with him. It's not a matter of keeping anything interesting you find.. the chances of you even finding a wand of woh to begin with are astronomically low.I have several Thundfurys, Shard of Hate,and every wand except WoW. The swords are great but they don't make a build. Keeping every wand, source and wizard hatdoesn't really matter when they're all useless and the way this patch is shaping up so far, will remain useless.It wouldn't be such a problem if there were more build-creating items like WoW but quite frankly there aren't. There's Mirrorball, WoW, maybe Vyr (though it's usually run in conjunction with Mirrorball).. and that's about it. One desirable item in two of the three item types unique to Wizard, nevermind the fact that there isn't a single wizard hat worth more than a forgotten soul. Compare this with the plethora of build-around items that Witch Doctors get in all three of their slots. It's no wonder this class is in such a sad state.
The reason we all dream about WoW, whether or not it even lives up to the hype in t5/t6, is because it's the only unique thing we have to work for after Mirrorball. And the vast majority of us will never, ever find one. Yay for wizards.
1. All weapons drop with 5 affixes, user can roll one into a socket
2. All weapons drop with 4 non-socket affixes, RG is used to add socket
3. All weapons drop with 4 affixes, RG can be used to add a 5th, user can roll any of the 5 into a socket if there isn't one
ALL of these are better ways to handle it than:
4. Weapons drop with 4 affixes, RG can be used to add a socket IF there isn't one
This isn't a complaint and I have no idea how you are construing it as that. The issue is that the use of RG in its current form is counter-intuitive. If the goal is to get a socket on your weapon, rolling the existing socket off your weapon should not be a part of that process. It's just illogical.
As for you salvaging items with awesome stats and no sockets, Reaper of Souls features a Mystic NPC that can be used to enchant your gear. She is very useful for just such a situation, and can transform your "almost awesome" socket-less item into an awesome socketed one. You can find more information here: http://www.diablowiki.net/Mystic
Today I look at the patch notes and Conflag has been neutered, Depth Diggers now has some illogical caveat, Hydra doesn't proc the new Firebird bonus, and despite that Firebird seems like it may be the only viable option for a fire spec (though it's still a bit early to say). I honestly feel quite gutted.
Before we even address the question of why these changes in particular were chosen, I'd really like to know why any of this was necessary in the first place. I'd particularly like to echo the sentiment of the others in this thread that have reminded us it's not sufficient to look at the Wizard class in a vacuum; it must be looked at in comparison to the other classes as well. With that said, does it really matter if the new changes allowed us to farm t6.. like every other class can do as well? Our numbers on the PTR were not in any way out of line in comparison to the other classes, nor were wizards seeing any particular success in greater rifts compared to anyone else. Honestly though, that is all beside the point. Even if MM/Conflag was completely out of hand, what made it so destructive that the only option was to completely gut it?
If the combination of conflag + the firebird bonus was problematic why not simply change that interaction (e.g. disallow them from proccing each other)? That type of change isn't exactly elegant but it is a simple fix that likely will not alienate anyone. If Magic Missile itself was too powerful why not simply revert the damage buff they gave it in the prior build? Why did the changes have to be some that will in all likelihood remove the build as a viable option? I cannot imagine this was the only way to address whatever the perceived problem was.
To summarize, my issue is not the changes themselves but the logic Blizzard has taken in making changes. This is not a subtle effort at increasing the number of viable builds. This is a strong message that they do not want MM/Conflag to be a viable build. Whether you liked the build or not, I do not see any harm in leaving it as an option. If it was too close to feeling like the "mandatory build" then address it as such and bring it more in line with other options (or more better yet, bring the other options in line with MM/Conflag). This brings me to my next point.
Our other options still suck.
Hydra is clunky and its inability to proc the new Firebird bonus is likely the nail in the coffin for the build if it's not a bug. Energy Twister is too situationally dependent to be a reliable primary source of damage. Lightning and Cold are still just awful. WoW builds were buffed, but already face significant issues in harder content. Channeling spells were buffed, but face the same issue and being encouraged to stand still for 3+ seconds to take advantage of the new mechanics will certainly not help that.
What does that leave us?
To be clear, I do not mean that rhetorically. I really just feel like our class is running out of options. I would love to hear what people are finding success with in this new build.
With that in mind, how the later level greater rifts are tuned will likely have a large impact on whether this set is worth using. In the current iteration of mobs with four trillion HP Firebird may be our only way to combat those numbers. If they change how difficulty is scaled (and I hope they do) that may no longer be the case. I believe there is some value in theorycrafting but right now there's so many unknown variables that it may be premature to pursue hard data.
Greater rifts also introduce an intangible element of practicality into the equation, as has been mentioned by others. Even if non-set items do outdamage Firebird on paper, if greater rifts remain tuned in such a way that kiting and avoiding being hit entirely is our only option then the passive damage of the DOT may be superior in practice. I can imagine a build that forgoes Magic Missile entirely for kiting around Hydras, thus opening up the use of the Firebird orb and another non-set armor piece. Who knows where 2.1 will take us?
Chainpocalypse
MM/Conflag
Archon
All of these builds have one thing in common: they essentially ignore Arcane Power.
The real problem I see here is that our AP spenders are, quite frankly, total shit. We are currently better off simply using Magic Missile as our primary attack or sacrificing whatever necessary for CDR to increase Archon uptime than using an arcane spender. A lot of them are so awful that the AP cost isn't even the reason they are bad; they just aren't as good as MM/Conflag with Mirrorball regardless. This is a pretty sad state of affairs.
I don't think the skills are fundamentally bad. I think most of the Arcane Orb runes are pretty cool, as well as Meteor and the like. The problem is they just don't do enough damage for their cost to be anything more than a colorful addition to a build. Maybe this will improve a bit in 2.1, but personally I was absolutely gutted to see that Arcane Orb wasn't buffed AT ALL considering how utterly useless it is right now.
Right, good point. The Tasker and Theo totally slipped my mind. I will keep my eyes out for those items as well as the correct Mask of Jeram. Wrathful Protector certainly does do a lot of damage and the cooldown hasn't been much of an issue thanks to the -cooldown passive. I'll test out a physical runed Gargantuan just for testing's sake then decide from there I guess. Thanks again!
My armory: http://us.battle.net/d3/en/profile/futility-1576/hero/45302418
I don't really understand the interaction of various types of damage. It seems most of my damage is fire (burning zombie dogs, wrathful gargantuan) but the guy's gear had only physical damage. I assume this is to benefit the fetishes. Does it also increase the zombie dog's standard melee damage, or is that fire too? Because I do have a significant amount of fire damage should I try to get some fire damage % on my gear as well?
What this all really comes down to is the build just feels all over the place to me. There's physical damage, fire damage, poison damage.. would it not be beneficial to streamline it all into one or two elements? I just came to this character from playing Wizard so I don't really know what I'm doing, but I do have a lot of good fire damage gear like Cindercoat, Magefists, etc. I could use.
Any help would be appreciated. Thank you!
The reason we all dream about WoW, whether or not it even lives up to the hype in t5/t6, is because it's the only unique thing we have to work for after Mirrorball. And the vast majority of us will never, ever find one. Yay for wizards.