With the recent changes, we can pretty much spam Gloom. The new perfectionist and boar increase our defenses even more.
Keep in mind that our dodge is pretty much a 50% damage mitigation right off the top. I'm now at > 50% dodge.
Lastly, we still have the best defensive skill in the game even though most of us no longer use it. Smoke screen gives complete invulnerability. Before the original nerf to SS, it was the most OP skill in the game.
You ask what to do in your first paragraph and then list in detail what you should be doing, but don't do, in your second paragraph.
You already know the answer to your question. Use Gloom. Use Smokescreen. Get more resists. Items with resists are very cheap, atm. Drop the Windforce and get another bow.
Your build doesn't make sense. You're using Sharpshooter but you have almost no Crit Damage, so it's being wasted. Get a bow with crit damage and a socket. Kill faster. It might be time to lose the MF if it's impacting your build to the point where you can't survive.
The mobs don't hit harder until a few MP levels in. Anything under MP3 and you'll barely notice a difference. They might even hit for less.
I use Vault mainly to get away from things, occasionally for the damage. Otherwise this character is a constant work in progress.
I'm going to rate it a 6/10, just for the lack of defense and any DH specific extras. You've got no resists, no additional hatred regen, and no additional discipline, which is really gonna hurt when you start climbing MP.
Nice start, but you don't need to neglect other areas to concentrate so much on Dex.
A couple things that don't show up on the sheet. I have 623 physical resists to go along with 479 AR. I, also, have 10% melee damage reduction which lets me tank a lot of mobs. I've gotten a little lazy from doing this and am going to have trouble getting used to kiting again and not relying on ToC to burn everything.
It depends on what you mean by "farm". Are you talking about farming for items or farming for XP because there is a big difference.
If you're talking XP, then I would agree that the Alkaizer route may still be good.
If you're talking about items, then some of the older runs with packed elites will probably be the new runs (VotA, Watchtower, etc.)
The sweet spot completely depends on your gear. At first glance, I thought MP 7 looked like the best due to the additional MF and XP.
Edit... I'm not sure if mobs in Act 1 are going to have less health than the mobs in Act 3. Remember that they need to, first, bump these mobs to level 63 and then add the additional %'s for MP. You can see what I mean if you look at the other thread with bosses (skeleton king and butcher have more health than most other bosses).
But tomorrow or when 1.0.5 is released everything will change. I've done a lot of testing and such on PTR and what I know for a fact, monster power is the nerf natalya legacy needs. Because when handleing higher monster levels such, you wont have the damage high enough with the lagecy peices. The damage difference between natalya legacy and then new natalya or random peices is such a huge deal. I would gain about 90k+ damage just from taking off my natalya legacy set and put on the other.
Because really what is natalya legacy all about today, everyone you ask it is all about speed/vault. But after the patch? if you play monsterpower 7-10? speed wont really matter because it will be slow enough. You may not even be playing with vault because 24% movement speed will do enough.
With the patch 1.0.5 the speed will come from how much damage you have, pure damage output. The more damage you have the faster you will farm. It wont be about how fast you can get disc back. So my two cents is. Get as much damage as you can, and stop compareing natalya legacy or not. Because people will soon see what a nerf it is to miss out on the damage you gain from the other gear rather then natalya legacy. And with the buffs to Natalya's embrace i saw in news yesterday, it seems it will get even more dex/vitality, so legacy will stand even less chance. Seems mempo helmet is getting buffed insanely much also.
I see a problem in your reasoning. I agree with the first paragraph as today it really is not about damage but rather how fast you are moving from one pack to another.
It is the later argument I do not agree with. You reason that with higher monster power--7 to 10--you will need more damage to be efficient. However, it is quite obvious that the hp scaling currently in place is so harsh that no amount of additional damage will allow you to maintain same efficiency (understand as kill speed) as in 1.04. This is a point where Natalya's legacy 4P bonus come into play again due to inherent DH mechanics built into D3.
DH is using discipline to fuel all tactical and defensive skills in the game. These skills generally help you to mitigate or avoid damage and keep monsters at distance from the character. Current monsters (1.0.4) have damage and HP values scaled in a way that corresponds with required expenditure of discipline during an encounter. The better is your gear, ie. damage, the faster you kill your enemy and the less discipline you spend on survival or maintaining the distance between you and the enemy. Now consider the changes in 1.0.5 that will introduce monster power that is no longer maintaining the balance between damage required to kill a monster and the expenditure of discipline to survive or keep monster at bay. This is an issue of higher monster powers, lets say 7 to 10, where HP scaling is very harsh. Azmodan can be used as an example: 1.0.4 - 7.7m HP; 1.0.5 - 43,5m HP.
Once you realize that you can not increase your DPS output enough, you will have to resort to increase your longevity, ie. discipline-fueled tactical and defensive skills, in order to succeed. This is where Natalya's legacy 4P will shine again.
I have a character with roughly 110k character sheet DPS (w/o SS). There is only few monsters in 1.0.4 that give me a challange but exactly those monsters are the ones that put hard strain on my discipline usage. Examples are tremors, accursed and the infamous phasebeasts. These monster types require extensive use of traps, smoke screen and/or shadow power in order to be defeated because they are either fast, durable, hard hitting or any combination of those characteristics together. I still kill them now (in 1.0.4) because my damage output is sufficient to dish out enough damage before I run out of discipline. Now fast forward to 1.0.5 when those monsters suddenly have 10x or more HP but your DPS can not be increased anywhere near that amount. This is where superior discipline regeneration from Natalya's legacy 4P bonus will be extremely useful again.
The only good point about this is that Blizzard was smart enough to design monster power in a way that you are not required to play on high MP levels to get the best loot. The loot is the same on MP1 as is on MP10. You get a bonus to MF/GF but the loot is of the same quality. Therefore, you are not forced to play on those high MP levels to inevitably face issues with discipline and be put against impossible option to obtain the unobtainable or fail--obviously you can spend billions of gold to buy legacy Natalya set but since the amount of available pieces is finite now, large portion of DH population will never be able to obtain it.
Both posts make good points. We're really going to have to see how it goes and do some extensive testing, but contrary to Baron's opinion, I think the new set will be better at higher MP levels.
My opinion.... The discipline regen of the old set won't outweigh the stats of the new set +20 additional disc. At higher MP levels, anyone using the old Nat's without high AR will basically be back to the days of glass canon. Even permanent nerfed Gloom won't be able to handle the 300%+ damage increase without resists and this is where the new set shines. Taken as individual pieces, the new set blows the old set away. The ONLY reason to have the legacy set is for the regen and everyone that has, or had, the old set knows they were gimping some of their stats by having it. With the nerfs to Gloom and ToC, they are removing most of the reason of having infinite discipline pools. As Wonsie said, most of the reason for the regen was to increase farming speed and running from elite to elite, which disappears at higher MP levels.
Besides, you can still practically have permanent gloom with the new set if you have +10 on your quiver, chest, or ammy and use Prep. Changing the cooldown from 3 seconds to 5 seconds is a huge impact when you have 60 discipline.
You can check them at Diabloprogress, but the link in the OP is just the standard profile from the official boards. If you're logged in, you can click on anyone's name to see their profile.
holy *curseword*! i didnt know "the grand vizier"!
its so awesome for her 0o
i was looking for a sunkeeper.... but thats 1h
thanks
Azmo dropped a Grand Vizier for me the other night and now my Enchantress is even more help...
I used the Templar during the entire time I was leveling, but he became worthless when I got to Inferno.
I used Scoundrel for the next few hundred hours and gave him a cold damage bow, which worked out great.
I've been using the Enchantress for a while now just because of the MF. I have her weapon and all items just pumped with MF and her extra IaS and defense help. Her armor buff is going to be nerfed in the patch, so I'll probably go back to Scoundrel since I won't need the MF as much.
Snuh, I was hoping the infernal machine thing would grant something new like a new socketable. Unity is marginally better than the set rings.
Having said that, every once in a while something pops up in d3 that is an improvement on d2. Monster power looks to be one of those things (essentially integrating /players 8 into multiplayer, but allowing it to work in coop). I wonder if it is specifically improving mf bonus from nv or actually improving drop rates?
You guys are much more optimistic than me. From the way that I read it, the IM and the ring are just like the Staff of Herding. Farm the same mobs over and over for pieces, which lets you create a staff with one purpose. Sounds to me like the ring is the same thing... farming for pieces to create a ring that has one purpose... making a few select bosses available.
There is a technical difference between the servers being up and the game being up. So, the status page is probably correct in that the servers are up, but the portal or the game is down for maintenance.
It would be nice to have a game status page and not just a server status.
I can't imagine it being today, but I could be wrong. The notes on the 10th announcing the patch said we'd get more details in the coming weeks and we haven't heard a word.
In patch 1.0.5, we will be fixing a bug with Trail of Cinders that is causing the rune to deal five times more damage than intended. As a result of this fix, the amount of damage done by Trail of Cinders will be reduced from its current value (1500% weapon damage over 3 seconds) to the value we originally designed for 1.0.4, which is 300% weapon damage over 3 seconds. While this bug was discovered very quickly after 1.0.4 released and is capable of being hotfixed, we didn't want to move forward with the fix without giving players proper notice. We also know that players are having fun using Trail of Cinders in their builds, so -- although this is an important issue we want to address -- we're opting to wait for the next client patch to make any adjustments.
We recognize that some builds which currently use Trail of Cinders will no longer be viable once this bug is fixed. Ultimately, we want to continue to provide players with more build options and ways to feel creative with their skill/gear selections, but not at the expense of going against our design goals or creating situations which can encourage players to limit themselves defensively.
Discipline-based skills were never intended to trump Hatred-based skills when it comes to dealing damage. Instead, Discipline should be something you build up and save to use defensively, or to provide utility in addition to dealing damage. Allowing Trail of Cinders to remain in its current form goes against this philosophy, and in addition creates risky scenarios for players (after all, if you’re incentivized to spend all your Discipline doing damage, it won’t be available when you need it to keep yourself alive with skills like Smoke Screen or Shadow Power).
We don't yet have a date for when 1.0.5 will be released, but we'll provide more information as the development process continues. We'll also update this thread with a reminder once we're close to releasing the patch.
A new quiver is all you might need. The DML's are so expensive and so in demand that any rare quiver is a tough sell. There were some on the AH last night with 200+ Dex, 100+ Vit, and 9+ crit chance for under 20m. Getting one of those and upgrading some of your gems will be a big boost for relatively cheap.
If there's any problem, it's that the gems are extremely expensive, possibly even more so than they intended. The reason I say this is the drop off of players was likely not anticipated, so they originally thought there would be a lot more people playing/farming and a lot more gems in circulation. Current cost for a Radiant Star emerald is 19-20mil, so often times these gems are as much or more than the gear you are putting them in. Kind of silly
The cost of gems has nothing to do with the amount of players. The cost of gems is defined by the cost to craft a gem (+ or - a little).
I'd love to have gems add 300 to my primary stat. It would mean that I could sleep while I facerolled Act 4. Nothing like having an 80% dodge chance and 200k dps.
Red should be changed to % Damage from static damage. That should fix the issues it has with high end weapons. Because just boosting the numbers to be good on 60 would make devastatingly great gems for leveling...
Also, i dont believe changing the helm effects to be good. Right now its a nice balance: XP, MF, GF, all three not affecting your numbers. If suddenly Red went from XP to Crit chance, it would have even worse balance than right now.
Good answer. I think only the red and yellow gems need to be modified for weapons. I don't know why this thread started talking about helms, but I don't see anything wrong with the helm gems as they're probably the most diverse, now. Sure, MF gems will become obsolete if everyone hits Paragon 100, but I don't really see that happening. There is a good mix of people using MF, life, gold, and XP.
This theory of ...."not in Vault of assasin" is FALSE.
I have got two legendary items from VotA and are level 10 and level 12.
I never get a legendary if I do not start a complete game from the beggining. With 30 runs only on VotA 0 legendary. 1 complete run in act 2 = 1 legendary .
At least , this is my little test.
I don't know if the ring is in VotA. It's not about the ilvl of any legendary that drops, it's about the ilvl of the rings that drop. The ring will only drop in VotA if other rings of the same level drop. So, if you're not getting blue rings of the same level as the legendary, the legendary won't drop. It really doesn't matter what ilvl drops for other items.
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Keep in mind that our dodge is pretty much a 50% damage mitigation right off the top. I'm now at > 50% dodge.
Lastly, we still have the best defensive skill in the game even though most of us no longer use it. Smoke screen gives complete invulnerability. Before the original nerf to SS, it was the most OP skill in the game.
You already know the answer to your question. Use Gloom. Use Smokescreen. Get more resists. Items with resists are very cheap, atm. Drop the Windforce and get another bow.
Your build doesn't make sense. You're using Sharpshooter but you have almost no Crit Damage, so it's being wasted. Get a bow with crit damage and a socket. Kill faster. It might be time to lose the MF if it's impacting your build to the point where you can't survive.
The mobs don't hit harder until a few MP levels in. Anything under MP3 and you'll barely notice a difference. They might even hit for less.
I'm going to rate it a 6/10, just for the lack of defense and any DH specific extras. You've got no resists, no additional hatred regen, and no additional discipline, which is really gonna hurt when you start climbing MP.
Nice start, but you don't need to neglect other areas to concentrate so much on Dex.
Fire away at mine...
http://us.battle.net/d3/en/profile/Vuron00-1127/hero/9876963
A couple things that don't show up on the sheet. I have 623 physical resists to go along with 479 AR. I, also, have 10% melee damage reduction which lets me tank a lot of mobs. I've gotten a little lazy from doing this and am going to have trouble getting used to kiting again and not relying on ToC to burn everything.
If you're talking XP, then I would agree that the Alkaizer route may still be good.
If you're talking about items, then some of the older runs with packed elites will probably be the new runs (VotA, Watchtower, etc.)
The sweet spot completely depends on your gear. At first glance, I thought MP 7 looked like the best due to the additional MF and XP.
Edit... I'm not sure if mobs in Act 1 are going to have less health than the mobs in Act 3. Remember that they need to, first, bump these mobs to level 63 and then add the additional %'s for MP. You can see what I mean if you look at the other thread with bosses (skeleton king and butcher have more health than most other bosses).
Both posts make good points. We're really going to have to see how it goes and do some extensive testing, but contrary to Baron's opinion, I think the new set will be better at higher MP levels.
My opinion.... The discipline regen of the old set won't outweigh the stats of the new set +20 additional disc. At higher MP levels, anyone using the old Nat's without high AR will basically be back to the days of glass canon. Even permanent nerfed Gloom won't be able to handle the 300%+ damage increase without resists and this is where the new set shines. Taken as individual pieces, the new set blows the old set away. The ONLY reason to have the legacy set is for the regen and everyone that has, or had, the old set knows they were gimping some of their stats by having it. With the nerfs to Gloom and ToC, they are removing most of the reason of having infinite discipline pools. As Wonsie said, most of the reason for the regen was to increase farming speed and running from elite to elite, which disappears at higher MP levels.
Besides, you can still practically have permanent gloom with the new set if you have +10 on your quiver, chest, or ammy and use Prep. Changing the cooldown from 3 seconds to 5 seconds is a huge impact when you have 60 discipline.
Azmo dropped a Grand Vizier for me the other night and now my Enchantress is even more help...
I used the Templar during the entire time I was leveling, but he became worthless when I got to Inferno.
I used Scoundrel for the next few hundred hours and gave him a cold damage bow, which worked out great.
I've been using the Enchantress for a while now just because of the MF. I have her weapon and all items just pumped with MF and her extra IaS and defense help. Her armor buff is going to be nerfed in the patch, so I'll probably go back to Scoundrel since I won't need the MF as much.
You guys are much more optimistic than me. From the way that I read it, the IM and the ring are just like the Staff of Herding. Farm the same mobs over and over for pieces, which lets you create a staff with one purpose. Sounds to me like the ring is the same thing... farming for pieces to create a ring that has one purpose... making a few select bosses available.
It would be nice to have a game status page and not just a server status.
We recognize that some builds which currently use Trail of Cinders will no longer be viable once this bug is fixed. Ultimately, we want to continue to provide players with more build options and ways to feel creative with their skill/gear selections, but not at the expense of going against our design goals or creating situations which can encourage players to limit themselves defensively.
Discipline-based skills were never intended to trump Hatred-based skills when it comes to dealing damage. Instead, Discipline should be something you build up and save to use defensively, or to provide utility in addition to dealing damage. Allowing Trail of Cinders to remain in its current form goes against this philosophy, and in addition creates risky scenarios for players (after all, if you’re incentivized to spend all your Discipline doing damage, it won’t be available when you need it to keep yourself alive with skills like Smoke Screen or Shadow Power).
We don't yet have a date for when 1.0.5 will be released, but we'll provide more information as the development process continues. We'll also update this thread with a reminder once we're close to releasing the patch.
http://www.diablofans.com/blizz-tracker/topic/233964-upcoming-change-to-trail-of-cinders/
The cost of gems has nothing to do with the amount of players. The cost of gems is defined by the cost to craft a gem (+ or - a little).
I'd love to have gems add 300 to my primary stat. It would mean that I could sleep while I facerolled Act 4. Nothing like having an 80% dodge chance and 200k dps.
Good answer. I think only the red and yellow gems need to be modified for weapons. I don't know why this thread started talking about helms, but I don't see anything wrong with the helm gems as they're probably the most diverse, now. Sure, MF gems will become obsolete if everyone hits Paragon 100, but I don't really see that happening. There is a good mix of people using MF, life, gold, and XP.
I don't know if the ring is in VotA. It's not about the ilvl of any legendary that drops, it's about the ilvl of the rings that drop. The ring will only drop in VotA if other rings of the same level drop. So, if you're not getting blue rings of the same level as the legendary, the legendary won't drop. It really doesn't matter what ilvl drops for other items.