Did I say that Marius was a rogue? No.
The Rogues also happen to guard the path that leads to the East. Marius might have needed to pass through the monastery. And I am sure although he was male he would have been granted passage.
Recall that Warriv (and other caravan owners) used this route to journey to Lut Gholein or other trade cities.
"I'm glad to know that once again caravans are free to travel through the Western Pass." - Jerhyn
Rogue Monastery != Eastern Gate and
Eastern Gate == Monastery Gate
The entire caravans with its camels and vagons couldn’t pass through a Monastery. Rogue Monastery is a place in the Eastern (Monastery) Gate's vicinity, and that gate was controlling by the Sisterhood. There is no reason for the Rogues to allow outside people to hang about their ancestral monastery.
It was Diablo who summoned her, (how can you come up with rogues having to summon her, now that's a laugh, you seem to be loosing your grace).
Your speculations are founded on the speculations of Deckard Cain who didn’t witness summonning of Andariel. You yourself know the Prime Evils was exiled by Lesser Evils, So Diablo is a master of Andariel no more. So Diablo couldn’t even hope that Lesser Evils would agree to help them. Obviously, Andariel and Duriel was tired of internal conflicts of ignorant Belial and Azmodan and realized that they should help Prime Evils to return. Andariel and Duriel have fought the Three because they were indignant of stopping of the Great Conflict, no more. Of course, all Rogues hardly have a great discussion in order to decide to summon a demoness. But there is no obstacles for doing it either one/two rogues, or by Andariel herself without any help of the mortals. Were the Rogues summoned demoness or not it is not important. In adition, By assuming you own words, Hero of Tristram have lost himself after summoning Andariel.
I can’t say that your speculations are not logical, and you also can’t say that MY speculations are not logical. Also you can’t say that logical speculations are truthfull, but you can say that logical speculations may (have a chance to) be truthfull. Your logical speculations can’t solve that great contradictions in the plot, but it can give a lot of meaningless and small contradictions to MY speculations. On the contrary, my logical speculations can solve the great contradictions in the plot and it is easier to decline some small flaws in my 'theory' in order to solve the great contradictions. And all your great and considerable arguments I have already disproved and you didn’t comment it.
Your speculations present Marius as a brave and stubborn die-hearted passed through a great and/or dangerous obstacles in his way (sea, jungles, entering and escaping Durance of Hatred and etc.). Of course, you didn’t say that Marius is a brave and volitional man, but WHAT you didn’t say (or intentionally avoided) is a logical conclusions I made from your speculations. So stop posting such an indignant words as “WHERE?! WHERE I said…” or “Did I say…” What you didn’t say is the contradictions in your speculation you can’t explain.
By saying “May I guess, my stubborness is a quality you don't have, isn't it?” I mean that you are also stubborn, according to your fanatical desire to disprove my point of view, my speculations with a help of your way of logical speculations and conclusions.
By saying “These are the words of who are loosing” I mean that you should calm yourself and stop offending me. A presence of your negative emotions in your posts and your insulting confirm that you fear smth., and feel uncertainty. These are the actions of a hesitating person.
By saying “I'm enjoying of your hot temper.” I mean that I guessed your uncertainty because of a presence of your negative emotions in your posts. In such a way you can’t keep any constructive discussion.
You’re trying to pick a mote out from my eye while there is a huge log in you eye. Since now I will refrain from further commenting your supercilious and emotional posts and will wait for the comments of other people to your and my points of view. So, use a moment, you may post your offensive words and other ways of manipulations in this discussion and even then I will not comment it.
One of the principles I hold in my theory is “If a mount couldn’t come to Muhammed, Muhammed should come to a mount”. “If Marius couldn’t get in Durance of Hatred, Durance of Hatred should be a place where Marius was in his dreams” and so on.
I can not avoid this any longer, your stubborness is fascinating. You really made me loose my temper.
You are an idiot.
These are the words of who are loosing. May I guess, my stubborness is a quality you don't have, isn't it? I'm enjoying of your hot temper.
I didn't contradict my self you, lunatic!
I'm glad that you like my avatar.
WHERE?! WHERE I said tricked. Actually you said it. At first Inarius hesitated, because he was facing his greatest fear obviously, but he managed to shake out of it and dismantled Diablo, because his is of a greater status and can see those things, I didn't say that he was with the permanent impression that Tyrael was paying him a visit.
1) Diablo's fear was a clue which allowed Inarius to recognize him and understand that he faced Lord of Terror himself. Can you disprove that?
2) Diablo can rule the fear (so, he can turn it off) Can you disprove that?
3)Diablo are able to turn his "fearing aura" off when he faced Tyrael. Can you disprove that?
Now allow me to tell the story of Blood Raven. She was the closest friend of Kashya. Blood Raven led a band of rogues to battle Diablo in the labyrinth beneath Tristram. But she fell pray to Diablo's corruption and brought an evil influence back with her. there should be some events which should happen before she became a lienutenant of Andariel.
you didn't pointed it out.for example, the Rogue(s) should summon Andariel.
Later on she became a lieutenant of Andrariel and which ultamately turned her against the Sisterhood. After that she is found rasing the dead in the monastery graveyard.
These all facts can't prevent her from being a Raven - seer, who foretelling bad prophecy. YOu yourself know that Hero of Tristram have dreams, visions and cried out during his sleeping, and he mentioning about strange things that a simple people couldn't understand. She also could did the same. AGAIN, her being a seer is not a foundation of my theory. I can even decline it if I want. But Marius's being a looser, who couldn't use his gift, is a foundation of my theory.
And his words confirm that
Were these the demons from my dreams, or were they born... within the Wanderer?
Why did I follow him? I don't know. Why do things happen as they do in dreams?
1) There is no reason for Diablo to have intention to make Marius know about him and warn him of the horrors that were in store for him in future, even if he have chosen Marius as his victum and a weapon. It'd better for Diablo keep Marius in ignorance.
(It concerns that vision about Tal Rasha's binding.)
2) There is no reason for Diablo to have intention to tell the mortal that he searching for a demon in order to set loose him upon the world. A hero, who couldn't make differ between his own thought and demon's, make more sense.
3) Marius saw his nightmares before they passed the Estern Gate.
4) The Evil have claimed Rogue Monastery after the Wanderer passed the Eastern Gate (Warrive's words).
5) So Marius saw his "memories" of Rogue Monastery before the Evil claimed it.
Marius was obviously there in the company of other rogues.
1) Rogue Monastery is a residence of a female Rogue, not male. (there is no male Rogue)
2) Marius is a male
3) Marius have no right to be in Rogue Monastery and so he could't witness its coruption.
And yeah, Doomscream, you contradicted yourself once and Archantyrael quoted that.
Twice!!!! Second one is concerning the powerfull weapon of Diablo - Fear. Which hardly could trick Inarius, because every angel know who is master of terror and fear.
2 Doomscream
Are serious, ffs? This is the killer argument that got me all scared and running away? LOL!
You are only person who says so, while some people think that there are a lot of arguements you are not able to disprove.
but what troubles me is that you seem to be trying to make yourself some sort of a loremaster now, am I right? You really like to repeat how many times you have read this and that and what not.
Anyone can be a lore master if he loves diablo world much enough (Love is a great power).
As for "how many times": I am one of the foreign people translating diablowiki lore to his own in order to inform other people who doesn't know English because english sites are realy proved sources of the lore of this English Game. There were a times when my english was more bad than now and I had to read every senctences of diablowiki several times in order to translate it to my own... In addition, you are so picky!
Marius and Blood Raven being prophets? WTF. Marius didn't have glimpses of the future, only nightames of the horrors he had witnessed.
I have already posted:
After all, even if she was not a seer, this fact cannot to prevent Marius to be a seer, who might warn the Roques of the Evil that would claimed their Monastery.
and
According to Warrive's words the evil fiends spread all over the lands soon after Dark Wanderer passed 2 WEEKS ago. So, Rogue Monastery was fallen after the Wanderer passed the Eastern Gate.
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Are you acually trying to mock me by calling me a boy (wow I am 3 years younger and I am made fun at)
Excuse me, I didn't know this word means only a young male of little age. Now thanks to you I know that:
"a smart boy" is an offencive words which can be used in order to mock a younger male.
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I love this game but its world I love more much. That's why I don't want accept that plot holes... Keep in mind I have not made this theory in order to asure you that it is indisputable truth. My theory don't contradict cannon lore, only generally accepted conclusions can contradict it. Don't forget, that there were a times of the wrong conclusions which we made untill Blizz gave us new details. With every new details Blizz gives us, we have to change our gennarally accepted conclusions and opinions.
for example, 1) There were a times when we mistakenly thought that angels are kind and liberal guys. 2) When we was playing Diablo I, we was sure that the Soulstones of Mefisto and Baal were burried under the sands of eastern deserts (Book I: of Heaven and Hell) untill Diablo II was released. Now, according to the same timeline, Mefisto was burried in the jungle of Kehjistan soon after he was defeated in the Kehjistan. 3) When we was playing Diablo II, we was sure that the Worldstone was a protection of Sanctuary without knowing what kind of protection is this untill Sin War Trilogy was published. We was making wrong conclusions about the protection of the Worldstone. But now we know, the Worldstone was a manner to make nephalem to bereft of their power in order to prevent Lilith's intentions (she was so interested in human's power), later, also the plots of the Prime Evils and Lucion. Only thanks to this Trylogy we know that there was a link between Inarius and the Worldstone which give him a power, allowed him somehow to rule Sanctuary - thanks to it we may guess that in fact Baal have intention to link himself with the Worldstone in order to rule Sanctuary as Inarius did it many centuries ago.
According to this trylogy we know that
"The Balance is the even distribution of Light and Dark. Its essence is most significant to Sanctuary, but it goes beyond, to all of creation. A world where Dark rules would burn itself up. A world where Light commands would eventually stagnate. If either gained enough control of Sanctuary so that the other could not match it again, then that would be the end of all things…"
Which means that THE HUMANITY IS REALY AN ABOMINATION OF ALL CREATION, THE UNIT, WHICH CAN BE A REASON OF THE END OF ALL THINGS BECAUSE ONLY HUMANITY CAN ALLOW ONE OF THE SIDES TO TAKE THE CONTROL OF ALL.
So the Worldstone was just a manner which prevented a humanity from a great responcibility which come with a great power.
I can write many examples like these but I'm not sure that you will read it all to the end.
Did you find the replies for you questions, anyway in post 21?
No. You are hopeless. I am tired of repeating the same things all over again and then repeating them once more.
This was answer to my
Yes, I knew it before you tell me about this. but thing is that, there is some obstacles which prevent Marius from running out of the tomb alone because that chamber was not opened by either Tyrael or the Wanderer according to your words!!!
or it was for all of what i have written in post 21? If so, I should say that you are generalizing. I hate such a thing. I have point out your points which contradicts to your own arguements and you didn't comment it.
DON'T THINK THAT YOU ARE SUCH A SMART BOY WHO ONLY UDERSTAND ALL PLOT AND LORE OF DIABLO. WHAT YOU WAS POSTING WAS WHAT I HAVE ALREADY READ MANY TIMES IN DIABLOWIKI AND I ALWAYS KEEP IN MIND ALL OF THIS WHEN I WAS MAKING THAT THEORY. I have took into my consideration all big and small things in lore. I have took into consideration all contradictions and absurdities which can be appeared in my theory. So stop writting these offencive words such as "narrow-minded" and so on. THing is that you can't keep in mind all complexity of the events in question at once.
I will refrain from further posting. You intentionally avoid some of my points. I have answered all of those in my post.
I HAVE EDITED MY POST 21 SO YOU MAY READ IT AGAIN. I HOPE YOU WILL FIND A REPLIES TO ALL YOUR QUESTIONS. if you don't find one, just tell me, and i'll try to reply
I didn't not contradict any of my previous posts at any time and none of your pathetic argruments managed to "annihilate" any of mine.
you should read my post 21, there you'll find what i mean by saying "your own arguements annihilate your another ones".
No! Noone helped him. He ran out of the tomb alone, simple as that!
Yes, I knew it before you tell me about this. but thing is that, there is some obstacles which prevent Marius from running out of the tomb alone because that chamber was not opened by either Tyrael or the Wanderer according to your words!!!
^
^
But you also was suggesting that the Wanderer could teleport to secret chamber by saying that Tyrael did it the same way. But you can't EXPLAIN how twO companions entered this secret chamber.
SO YOUR NEXT WORDS
I have answered all of those in my post. I can also see that your English is quite poor (no offence please) and you can't understand even the most basic things in my arguments.
ARE NOT CORRECT. YOUR SHOULD ANSWER THOSE OF MY QUESTIONS. DO NOT ESCAPE.
You intentionally avoid some of my points
Because my other arguments annihilate that "some of your points" which "I intentionally avoid" and... sometimes, your own arguements annihilate your another ones.
If you think that I can't express my thoughts well because my english is bad, you are wrong. Somehow I've been doing this all this time. I HAVE uderstood all of you post, and my only problem is my poor bag of English words.
• Marius' second dream. Well he even said it rather clearly in the "Desert Journey" cinematic. "However the dreams returned but this were clearly not my own". And surprise surprise who was his companion? - Diablo. He could easily extract the dream in Marius' fragile mind. And when Marius finally awoke from his dream, Diablo told him "Now you know what I seek, Marius. This is my brother". And it is damn obvious that he was referring to Baal.
CONTRADICTS THIS:
And you are sure that he talked about his deeds and feats in the Great Conflict because? He obviously tried to some how deceive Marius he told him of the life of the Wanderer, by possesing his body and soul he had access to all of the memories of the host. Diablo is not concerened with keeping Marius entertained by his stories as long as Marius tags along with him.
THINK ABOUT 5 OR 6 TIMES BEFORE MAKE SOME ACTION!
Inarius hardly could recognize Diablo, when he show himself as an archangel Tyrael. An angel even proudly said that diablo couldn't mislead him. If diablo can't mislead an angel, he would never try to do so, and Inarius would never said that diablo never could trick him. Does he afraid that diablo realy can trick him?
That's because Diablo used his strongest weapon against Inarius - fear. While during the meeting with Tyrael within Tal'Rasha's Tomb he didn't have the powers to do so again.
You're right! The fear was what allowed Inarius to recognize him as Lord of Terror!!! his strongest weapon was a clue, which let Inarius recognize him. YOu yourself contradict to your own arguements.
So can you answer me after reading these?
Why Marius? Why Marius was exactly who Diablo needed? Only for setting the Lord of Destruction frees? Apparently Diablo foresaw he would meet an obstacle in the tomb. If Diablo need a man who frees Baal while an archangel battling the Wanderer, it would be rational to find someone in Lut Gholein and not to drag someone through the desert (one never knows hour: Marius could perish in the way).
WHY?
Please note, after the rumors about the Dark Wanderer have spread, Lord Jerhyn forbade all ships from leaving port. Your can check it by going to talk Meshif and listen to his introduction.
There were no RUMORS. The Dark Wanderer visited Lut Gholein and asked around about the Tomb's location. He ordered the ships ported because of the demons that were entering his palace from the Arcane Sanctuary.
I have written so, because Lord Jerhyn was mentioning dark wanderer in his introduction, and this fact is not a foundation of my theory so it can't be an argument against my theory. This note was just note, no more, in order to note, that ships were forbidden from leaving a port. Don't be so picky.
Wait, what? Did I say that? We saw him run out of the tomb at the end of the cinematic. Just because we didn't saw him run the whole way back doesn't mean he had teleported...
Do you mean by saying this that someone help him to get out of there? Tyrael, Diablo and Baal themselves? In order to let him go away? Cinematics shows the scene, when Marius reached outwards of the tomb... Or you mean that Marius did it only after the heroes opened that chamber? Are you sure that this way of an explanations make more sense?
At the time he was still fighting with Diablo within his soul (a battle that was doomed to be lost) and he thought that he might end all of this. That's why he traveled east, he passed the Monastery guarding the way to the East. where Marius was unfortunate to encounter him and the horrors that he unleashed in his wake, and then entered the Inn (where yet again Marius was present) that's when his soul was consumed and Diablo continued the journey to free his imprisoned brother with Marius joining him when the Wanderer beckoned, he really didn't have a clue why he was following him, out of fear most likely...
This all don't contradict my theory I know all of this before you post this.
Marius could have sneaked upon a ship. So what? You don't know for sure how he managed to get on a ship - he might have payed or he might have signed as a deckhand if that will get him to Kurast. Is that really that important?! He was alone in his quest, Tyrael didn't aid him, he was left to complete his task all by himself.
So answer me, after reading this
Entering the recesses of the Temple. The adventurers were able to get in the Durance of Hatred only after killing the corrupted Council Members and destroying the Compelling Orb - a magical artifact which was used to control the Zakarum Priests and their followers. How did Marius manage to sneak in there? And most importantly, how did he get back? Where were the guardians at that while?
HOW DID HE GET IN THE DURANCE OF HATRED?
Diablo was defeated at the end of this year (1264,Esunar). Baal was defeated 2-4 month later after diablo's defeat (Vasan);
It's still the next year. Don't be so picky you know exactly what I meant.
Anyway, if so, there are just 2-4 months between Diablo's Defeat and the destruction of the Soulstone. In 1265, Kathon (after Esunar, 1264) adventurers just heard of a news that demonic army was marching upon Arreat. Who know how many months pass after entering demonic army the barbarian lands. maybe it was in Esunar, when Diablo was just defeated, and Marius, being in the asylum heard of this great event from his... from simple persons who keep that asylum... If such simple persons knew about this event... these stories of diablo couldn't be forgotten even by their children... Without mentioning that Baal have already transformed into another form... when he led his army while the heroes was killing Diablo. While Baal was searching for Marius he was hooded and did have two legs, not four or eight.
P.S. ALL OF YOUR EXPLANATIONS OF DIABLO PLOT WAS ONCE MY EXPLANATIONS UNTILL I MADE THIS THEORY.
• Next stop. Marius being a prophet. Well... sorry to ruin your conclussions but he isn't. He is not having dreams of the future. Marius is a lesser man. He has nightmares from the horrors he had seen in the Monastery and the Evil which it claimed it. So this makes him a firsthand witness of the corrupting of the Monastery. The poor guy was just a victim of sheer terror and it was inevitable that he will haunted by his memories.
According to Warrive's words the evil fiends spread all over the lands soon after Dark Wanderer passed 2 WEEKS ago. So, Rogue Monastery was fallen after the Wanderer passed the Eastern Gate.
• This concerns the upper argument as well. Diablo possibly took full control over the Wanderer in Inn where he met Marius. From that moment on the Wanderer = Diablo.
of course, that is a true no matter that he said to Marius that he had once been a great warrior... he meant in fact, that he was a great warrior of Hell during Great Conflict and now a dark sacred burden weigh heavily upon him. So this dark burden is his mission to rescrue his brother.
• I can find it hard to believe that Tyrael opened the gates of the tomb in order to allow the Wanderer to enter. Tyrael can pop up (materialize, teleport etc) wherever he wants (He came out of the ceiling in the Worldstone's Chamber after all). Tyrael always intervened in the affairs that took part on Sanctuary so it's not unsual for him to attempt to prevent Diablo from freeing his brother.
Of course, and Marius have used teleport to get out of this tomb.
• Diablo's encounter with Tyrael. Well Tyrael didn't know the hero from Diablo (he know of him but he didn't met him) and he most likely can see through the guise of him mortal anchor. He is an archangel ffs. He can recognize Diablo in any form.
Inarius hardly could recognize Diablo, when he show himself as an archangel Tyrael. An angel even proudly said that diablo couldn't mislead him. If diablo can't mislead an angel, he would never try to do so, and Inarius would never said that diablo never could trick him. Does he afraid that diablo realy can trick him?
- Lord Jerhyn ordered the ships ported because of the demons coming out of the Arcane Sanctuary in the palace, he ordered the royal guard to take care of them, that's why he also hired Greiz to keep the security in the city. The Dark Wanderer came to Lut Gholein before he made his journey with Marius to find the Tomb of Tal'Rasha.
- No prophetic drams ever occured to Marius. We don't know how Marius managed to get to Kurast, well what's obvious is obvious, he must have used a ship, but that remains unaccounted for and I don't mind that. What's important is that he managed to get there in a ordinary way - like using a ship, which doesn't translate to necessary using Meshif's ship, there might be other ships that made sail to Kurast, noone knows for sure.
Of course, in this fantasy realm people are so kind and liberal that with plesure help a stranger like Marius to sail Kurast even if he has no gold. "Please, help me to get Rome, there a great evil is awaited me to be destroyed by me..."
Well how then was Marius able to learn about the defeat of Diablo. Simple: story inconsistency, nothing cosmicly overcomplicated. But if you have payed attention to http://eu.blizzard.c...ld/timeline.xml you will se that in 1264
Diablo was defeated at the end of this year (1264,Esunar). Baal was defeated 2-4 month later after diablo's defeat (Vasan);
P.S. A lot of your arguements was a sophistical one. You tryed to disprove what I even didn't mention in my theory.
It is cannon. Blizzard even mentioned that they will do the same in Diablo 3 with the Diablo 2 characters because it was a really good way to tell the story.
No matter were Blood Raven a Rogue from DiabloI or not, this fact can't prevent her to be a seer. According to the Bible the prophets has risen even amongst the simple shepherds. If she wasn't a seer, Blizz could have given her another name, for example, Mistresss of Zombies, Zombie's Lady, Lady Zombiemaker After all, even when she was not a seer, this fact cannot to prevent Marius to be a seer, who might warn the Roques of the Evil that would claimed their Monastery.
According to Cain's Journal the advunturers had to sail ashore of barbarian lands.
Diablo is dead. I have long desired to hear these words, but now that they come, I feel little joy. News has also reached us of demonic army marching upon Arreat. This a Baal's doing, no doubt. We depart for north with the tide.
It is obvious that in fact Tyrael have opened portal back to Kurast, not to Harrogat. Your also see that they have heard news about marching of demonic army upon Arreat, not its coming to Sescheron's gate.
Also at the 20th day of Esunar (1263) Cain was siting, caged, amongst the screams and the hellfire. At the 2nd day of Kathon (1264) he was rescued.
So I figured out that Esunar is a last month of year and Kathon is first one anno Khejistani. (1)
1 Kathon
2 Solmaneth
3 Lycanum
4 Vasan
5 Jerharan
6 Damhar
7 Ratham
8 Esunar
I'm not sure, it could be in another cequence: (2)
1 Kathon
2 Vasan
3 Solmaneth
4 Lycanum
5 Jerharan
6 Damhar
7 Ratham
8 Esunar
---------- 1st day of Ratham (1264) - by this day Mefisto was already defeated. 4th day of Kathon (1265) - by this day Diablo was already defeated (in fact it was Esunar (the end of 1264) when he was won by heroes). 2nd day of Vasan (1265) - the adventureres are in Harrogat. 10th day of Vasan (1265) - Baal was defeated. This is a day of the destruction of the Worldstone
Approximately, Vasan is second or fourth month after Kathon (diablo's defeat). So there are 2-4 month between Diablo's defeat and the destruction of the Worldstone (Baal's defeat). Let's assume that Baal has formed his army soon after Mefisto's defeat (Damhar-Ratham). So Baal's army has reached Harrogat approximatly in 6(1) or 4(2) months after Mefisto's defeat. You shouldn't forget that barbarians didn't let demonic army reach Mount Arreat by easy way.
P.S. This 5 and 6 soon make me crazy. I had to edit this post several times because I made an errors with these years several times.
Ah, how may you discuss this article without reading it and knowing of its main ideas?
I read every word of the article, and I must say that I enjoyed it! I think I now understand what you meant, and I guess it could be interpreted in a way that Marius simply could not understand his visions, and therefore wasn't sure what was real and what was not! But, the Diablo timeline tells us that the events from the first two games span across three years, which you already implied! If Baal was indeed visiting Marius before Diablo was defeated, then it must have been in a short amount of time! Then again, if Marius told this to Baal, and Diablo was still alive, why wouldn't Baal go to Hell and aid his brother if he knew that Marius' visions were true? Or did he just thought that the future, even if it is foreseen by a human, could never be changed?
You definitly should read my words with attention
Pay attention to this:
Demonic gambit. Thus, Marius told Baal what would be happened in the future believing that these are events of the past. Taking this course of affairs into the consideration, the Three hastened to be regrouped soon after their reunion. Defeats of Diablo and Mephisto was a Queen's gambit in a chess game, which allowed Baal to make a few smart moves and checkmate “the protection” of Sanctuary - nature of Soulstone has been corrupted, then this ancient artifact was destroyed by Tyrael.
and to this:
Three Evils originally expected failure: this world is defending itself during the millennia; the heroes always won darkness and did it also at this time. But what remains of the powerful protection of Sanctuary now as the Worldstone have been destroyed?
P.S. Finally I have found a true English equivalent of what I meant by words "Hand of Doom"! Providence... yes, that is what I meant. I understand that "Doom" means in most part a death, not a Fate.. Me should edit that my post as soon as possible....
P.S. I think this article lack a visual pictures. I will try to find a time for editing this post and make a visual images to it.
In some of his vision he even have took part: his vision was showed with his presence in it... I need a screenshots of his "memories" from cinematics "sister's lament" and "enter the hell".
^
^
No! You don't understand me. You should read at least the last two points of the article! Marius himself said that he heard later about Diablo's defeat because he belived in it in order to soften the pangs of his conscience and thanks to his gift of vision of the future which he considered as his memories (DREAMS, MEMORIES... I COULDN'T TELL THE DIFFERENCE ANY MORE!). Ah, how may you discuss this article without reading it and knowing of its main ideas?
Rogue Monastery != Eastern Gate and
Eastern Gate == Monastery Gate
The entire caravans with its camels and vagons couldn’t pass through a Monastery. Rogue Monastery is a place in the Eastern (Monastery) Gate's vicinity, and that gate was controlling by the Sisterhood. There is no reason for the Rogues to allow outside people to hang about their ancestral monastery.
Your speculations are founded on the speculations of Deckard Cain who didn’t witness summonning of Andariel. You yourself know the Prime Evils was exiled by Lesser Evils, So Diablo is a master of Andariel no more. So Diablo couldn’t even hope that Lesser Evils would agree to help them. Obviously, Andariel and Duriel was tired of internal conflicts of ignorant Belial and Azmodan and realized that they should help Prime Evils to return. Andariel and Duriel have fought the Three because they were indignant of stopping of the Great Conflict, no more. Of course, all Rogues hardly have a great discussion in order to decide to summon a demoness. But there is no obstacles for doing it either one/two rogues, or by Andariel herself without any help of the mortals. Were the Rogues summoned demoness or not it is not important. In adition, By assuming you own words, Hero of Tristram have lost himself after summoning Andariel.
I can’t say that your speculations are not logical, and you also can’t say that MY speculations are not logical. Also you can’t say that logical speculations are truthfull, but you can say that logical speculations may (have a chance to) be truthfull. Your logical speculations can’t solve that great contradictions in the plot, but it can give a lot of meaningless and small contradictions to MY speculations. On the contrary, my logical speculations can solve the great contradictions in the plot and it is easier to decline some small flaws in my 'theory' in order to solve the great contradictions. And all your great and considerable arguments I have already disproved and you didn’t comment it.
Your speculations present Marius as a brave and stubborn die-hearted passed through a great and/or dangerous obstacles in his way (sea, jungles, entering and escaping Durance of Hatred and etc.). Of course, you didn’t say that Marius is a brave and volitional man, but WHAT you didn’t say (or intentionally avoided) is a logical conclusions I made from your speculations. So stop posting such an indignant words as “WHERE?! WHERE I said…” or “Did I say…” What you didn’t say is the contradictions in your speculation you can’t explain.
By saying “May I guess, my stubborness is a quality you don't have, isn't it?” I mean that you are also stubborn, according to your fanatical desire to disprove my point of view, my speculations with a help of your way of logical speculations and conclusions.
By saying “These are the words of who are loosing” I mean that you should calm yourself and stop offending me. A presence of your negative emotions in your posts and your insulting confirm that you fear smth., and feel uncertainty. These are the actions of a hesitating person.
By saying “I'm enjoying of your hot temper.” I mean that I guessed your uncertainty because of a presence of your negative emotions in your posts. In such a way you can’t keep any constructive discussion.
You’re trying to pick a mote out from my eye while there is a huge log in you eye. Since now I will refrain from further commenting your supercilious and emotional posts and will wait for the comments of other people to your and my points of view. So, use a moment, you may post your offensive words and other ways of manipulations in this discussion and even then I will not comment it.
I'm glad that you like my avatar.
1) Diablo's fear was a clue which allowed Inarius to recognize him and understand that he faced Lord of Terror himself. Can you disprove that?
2) Diablo can rule the fear (so, he can turn it off) Can you disprove that?
3)Diablo are able to turn his "fearing aura" off when he faced Tyrael. Can you disprove that?
These all facts can't prevent her from being a Raven - seer, who foretelling bad prophecy. YOu yourself know that Hero of Tristram have dreams, visions and cried out during his sleeping, and he mentioning about strange things that a simple people couldn't understand. She also could did the same. AGAIN, her being a seer is not a foundation of my theory. I can even decline it if I want. But Marius's being a looser, who couldn't use his gift, is a foundation of my theory.
And his words confirm that
1) There is no reason for Diablo to have intention to make Marius know about him and warn him of the horrors that were in store for him in future, even if he have chosen Marius as his victum and a weapon. It'd better for Diablo keep Marius in ignorance.
(It concerns that vision about Tal Rasha's binding.)
2) There is no reason for Diablo to have intention to tell the mortal that he searching for a demon in order to set loose him upon the world. A hero, who couldn't make differ between his own thought and demon's, make more sense.
3) Marius saw his nightmares before they passed the Estern Gate.
4) The Evil have claimed Rogue Monastery after the Wanderer passed the Eastern Gate (Warrive's words).
5) So Marius saw his "memories" of Rogue Monastery before the Evil claimed it.
1) Rogue Monastery is a residence of a female Rogue, not male. (there is no male Rogue)
2) Marius is a male
3) Marius have no right to be in Rogue Monastery and so he could't witness its coruption.
This is what my theory don't contradict.
Twice!!!! Second one is concerning the powerfull weapon of Diablo - Fear. Which hardly could trick Inarius, because every angel know who is master of terror and fear.
2 Doomscream
You are only person who says so, while some people think that there are a lot of arguements you are not able to disprove.
Anyone can be a lore master if he loves diablo world much enough (Love is a great power).
As for "how many times": I am one of the foreign people translating diablowiki lore to his own in order to inform other people who doesn't know English because english sites are realy proved sources of the lore of this English Game. There were a times when my english was more bad than now and I had to read every senctences of diablowiki several times in order to translate it to my own... In addition, you are so picky!
I have already posted:
and
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Excuse me, I didn't know this word means only a young male of little age. Now thanks to you I know that:
"a smart boy" is an offencive words which can be used in order to mock a younger male.
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I love this game but its world I love more much. That's why I don't want accept that plot holes... Keep in mind I have not made this theory in order to asure you that it is indisputable truth. My theory don't contradict cannon lore, only generally accepted conclusions can contradict it. Don't forget, that there were a times of the wrong conclusions which we made untill Blizz gave us new details. With every new details Blizz gives us, we have to change our gennarally accepted conclusions and opinions.
for example,
1) There were a times when we mistakenly thought that angels are kind and liberal guys. 2) When we was playing Diablo I, we was sure that the Soulstones of Mefisto and Baal were burried under the sands of eastern deserts (Book I: of Heaven and Hell) untill Diablo II was released. Now, according to the same timeline, Mefisto was burried in the jungle of Kehjistan soon after he was defeated in the Kehjistan. 3) When we was playing Diablo II, we was sure that the Worldstone was a protection of Sanctuary without knowing what kind of protection is this untill Sin War Trilogy was published. We was making wrong conclusions about the protection of the Worldstone. But now we know, the Worldstone was a manner to make nephalem to bereft of their power in order to prevent Lilith's intentions (she was so interested in human's power), later, also the plots of the Prime Evils and Lucion. Only thanks to this Trylogy we know that there was a link between Inarius and the Worldstone which give him a power, allowed him somehow to rule Sanctuary - thanks to it we may guess that in fact Baal have intention to link himself with the Worldstone in order to rule Sanctuary as Inarius did it many centuries ago.
According to this trylogy we know that
"The Balance is the even distribution of Light and Dark. Its essence is most significant to Sanctuary, but it goes beyond, to all of creation. A world where Dark rules would burn itself up. A world where Light commands would eventually stagnate. If either gained enough control of Sanctuary so that the other could not match it again, then that would be the end of all things…"
Which means that THE HUMANITY IS REALY AN ABOMINATION OF ALL CREATION, THE UNIT, WHICH CAN BE A REASON OF THE END OF ALL THINGS BECAUSE ONLY HUMANITY CAN ALLOW ONE OF THE SIDES TO TAKE THE CONTROL OF ALL.
So the Worldstone was just a manner which prevented a humanity from a great responcibility which come with a great power.
I can write many examples like these but I'm not sure that you will read it all to the end.
This was answer to my
or it was for all of what i have written in post 21? If so, I should say that you are generalizing. I hate such a thing. I have point out your points which contradicts to your own arguements and you didn't comment it.
DON'T THINK THAT YOU ARE SUCH A SMART BOY WHO ONLY UDERSTAND ALL PLOT AND LORE OF DIABLO. WHAT YOU WAS POSTING WAS WHAT I HAVE ALREADY READ MANY TIMES IN DIABLOWIKI AND I ALWAYS KEEP IN MIND ALL OF THIS WHEN I WAS MAKING THAT THEORY. I have took into my consideration all big and small things in lore. I have took into consideration all contradictions and absurdities which can be appeared in my theory. So stop writting these offencive words such as "narrow-minded" and so on. THing is that you can't keep in mind all complexity of the events in question at once.
I HAVE EDITED MY POST 21 SO YOU MAY READ IT AGAIN. I HOPE YOU WILL FIND A REPLIES TO ALL YOUR QUESTIONS. if you don't find one, just tell me, and i'll try to reply
you should read my post 21, there you'll find what i mean by saying "your own arguements annihilate your another ones".
Yes, I knew it before you tell me about this. but thing is that, there is some obstacles which prevent Marius from running out of the tomb alone because that chamber was not opened by either Tyrael or the Wanderer according to your words!!!
^
But you also was suggesting that the Wanderer could teleport to secret chamber by saying that Tyrael did it the same way. But you can't EXPLAIN how twO companions entered this secret chamber.
SO YOUR NEXT WORDS
ARE NOT CORRECT. YOUR SHOULD ANSWER THOSE OF MY QUESTIONS. DO NOT ESCAPE.
Because my other arguments annihilate that "some of your points" which "I intentionally avoid" and... sometimes, your own arguements annihilate your another ones.
If you think that I can't express my thoughts well because my english is bad, you are wrong. Somehow I've been doing this all this time. I HAVE uderstood all of you post, and my only problem is my poor bag of English words.
CONTRADICTS THIS:
THINK ABOUT 5 OR 6 TIMES BEFORE MAKE SOME ACTION!
You're right! The fear was what allowed Inarius to recognize him as Lord of Terror!!! his strongest weapon was a clue, which let Inarius recognize him. YOu yourself contradict to your own arguements.
So can you answer me after reading these?
WHY?
I have written so, because Lord Jerhyn was mentioning dark wanderer in his introduction, and this fact is not a foundation of my theory so it can't be an argument against my theory. This note was just note, no more, in order to note, that ships were forbidden from leaving a port. Don't be so picky.
Do you mean by saying this that someone help him to get out of there? Tyrael, Diablo and Baal themselves? In order to let him go away? Cinematics shows the scene, when Marius reached outwards of the tomb... Or you mean that Marius did it only after the heroes opened that chamber? Are you sure that this way of an explanations make more sense?
This all don't contradict my theory I know all of this before you post this.
So answer me, after reading this
HOW DID HE GET IN THE DURANCE OF HATRED?
Anyway, if so, there are just 2-4 months between Diablo's Defeat and the destruction of the Soulstone. In 1265, Kathon (after Esunar, 1264) adventurers just heard of a news that demonic army was marching upon Arreat. Who know how many months pass after entering demonic army the barbarian lands. maybe it was in Esunar, when Diablo was just defeated, and Marius, being in the asylum heard of this great event from his... from simple persons who keep that asylum... If such simple persons knew about this event... these stories of diablo couldn't be forgotten even by their children... Without mentioning that Baal have already transformed into another form... when he led his army while the heroes was killing Diablo. While Baal was searching for Marius he was hooded and did have two legs, not four or eight.
P.S. ALL OF YOUR EXPLANATIONS OF DIABLO PLOT WAS ONCE MY EXPLANATIONS UNTILL I MADE THIS THEORY.
According to Warrive's words the evil fiends spread all over the lands soon after Dark Wanderer passed 2 WEEKS ago. So, Rogue Monastery was fallen after the Wanderer passed the Eastern Gate.
of course, that is a true no matter that he said to Marius that he had once been a great warrior... he meant in fact, that he was a great warrior of Hell during Great Conflict and now a dark sacred burden weigh heavily upon him. So this dark burden is his mission to rescrue his brother.
Of course, and Marius have used teleport to get out of this tomb.
Inarius hardly could recognize Diablo, when he show himself as an archangel Tyrael. An angel even proudly said that diablo couldn't mislead him. If diablo can't mislead an angel, he would never try to do so, and Inarius would never said that diablo never could trick him. Does he afraid that diablo realy can trick him?
Of course, in this fantasy realm people are so kind and liberal that with plesure help a stranger like Marius to sail Kurast even if he has no gold. "Please, help me to get Rome, there a great evil is awaited me to be destroyed by me..."
Diablo was defeated at the end of this year (1264,Esunar). Baal was defeated 2-4 month later after diablo's defeat (Vasan);
P.S. A lot of your arguements was a sophistical one. You tryed to disprove what I even didn't mention in my theory.
No matter were Blood Raven a Rogue from DiabloI or not, this fact can't prevent her to be a seer. According to the Bible the prophets has risen even amongst the simple shepherds. If she wasn't a seer, Blizz could have given her another name, for example, Mistresss of Zombies, Zombie's Lady, Lady Zombiemaker
It is obvious that in fact Tyrael have opened portal back to Kurast, not to Harrogat. Your also see that they have heard news about marching of demonic army upon Arreat, not its coming to Sescheron's gate.
Also at the 20th day of Esunar (1263) Cain was siting, caged, amongst the screams and the hellfire. At the 2nd day of Kathon (1264) he was rescued.
So I figured out that Esunar is a last month of year and Kathon is first one anno Khejistani.
(1)
1 Kathon
2 Solmaneth
3 Lycanum
4 Vasan
5 Jerharan
6 Damhar
7 Ratham
8 Esunar
I'm not sure, it could be in another cequence:
(2)
1 Kathon
2 Vasan
3 Solmaneth
4 Lycanum
5 Jerharan
6 Damhar
7 Ratham
8 Esunar
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1st day of Ratham (1264) - by this day Mefisto was already defeated.
4th day of Kathon (1265) - by this day Diablo was already defeated (in fact it was Esunar (the end of 1264) when he was won by heroes).
2nd day of Vasan (1265) - the adventureres are in Harrogat.
10th day of Vasan (1265) - Baal was defeated. This is a day of the destruction of the Worldstone
Approximately, Vasan is second or fourth month after Kathon (diablo's defeat). So there are 2-4 month between Diablo's defeat and the destruction of the Worldstone (Baal's defeat). Let's assume that Baal has formed his army soon after Mefisto's defeat (Damhar-Ratham). So Baal's army has reached Harrogat approximatly in 6(1) or 4(2) months after Mefisto's defeat. You shouldn't forget that barbarians didn't let demonic army reach Mount Arreat by easy way.
P.S. This 5 and 6 soon make me crazy. I had to edit this post several times because I made an errors with these years several times.
Pay attention to this:
and to this:
P.S. Finally I have found a true English equivalent of what I meant by words "Hand of Doom"! Providence... yes, that is what I meant. I understand that "Doom" means in most part a death, not a Fate.. Me should edit that my post as soon as possible....
In some of his vision he even have took part: his vision was showed with his presence in it... I need a screenshots of his "memories" from cinematics "sister's lament" and "enter the hell".
^
No! You don't understand me. You should read at least the last two points of the article! Marius himself said that he heard later about Diablo's defeat because he belived in it in order to soften the pangs of his conscience and thanks to his gift of vision of the future which he considered as his memories (DREAMS, MEMORIES... I COULDN'T TELL THE DIFFERENCE ANY MORE!). Ah, how may you discuss this article without reading it and knowing of its main ideas?
^
but according to this article Baal have listened to the story of Marius BEFORE DIABLO'S DEFEAT!!! You're should read all of this to the end!
P.S. Hand of Doom is a cursor of your mouse when you're playing diablo!:)