Perception. Perception. Perception. It's all how you look at things. Evil is evil if you believe it is evil and good is good if you believe it is good. My evil and your evil are not the same, and never will be.
No no, Bacon.... Evil and Good have a lot of meaning in life. I feel that there are some absolutes in good and evil.... but the rest of the story can be defined as gray.
You can't look at generalized actions like "Murder" and "Theft"... those are too broad, as the intent behind why those actions can be either good or evil.
The act of physical rape, however (in my book at least), is purely wrong... it's the act of harming another person, knowing the serious ramifications for the act, purely for self amusement // entertainment. It's the act of preying on the weak for no real cause.
Remember, it's all about justification.
On a different note, remember, Morality is seperated into three catagories: Cultural, Societal, and Personal. What I believe is right and wrong may not be what society believes is right and wrong... but as humans, we have to work within the confines of societal boundries when in public. Cultural morality is nothing more than a common thread between all of the societies since when this country was founded. We may try and buck the system, but it's still there, ever present.
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
------------------------------------------- Those who stand for nothing will fall for anything.
-------------------------------------------
do you think that evil could actually be the good?
Based solely on the definitions of the word, no.
To go beyond that though it becomes greatly complicated by WHY things are done instead of the act itself. Which if we want to go by WHY things are done then a lot of "evil" people become "good". It's just too uncertain.
If you classify "good" as someone doing something with good intentions then you may as well through Hitler in there. He thought what he was doing was for the greater good. A lot of serial killers fall into this category too. The ones that believe they were directly doing God's work.
If you TRULY believe you're doing God's work can you really be labeled "evil"?
That's kind of why we have to take things at face value and use logic instead of thinking too much on it.
And if you don't believe in god, well, then another problem arises- you have to create your own standard of good, and, by effect of opposites, evil.
Exactly.
Which if you believe everyone is equal is pretty much majority vote so things stay basically the same as they are.
Or you can believe what you want to, but if you kill someone and your only defense is "I personally don't think it's evil or wrong." It's not going to work out so well.
theres some moral theories that attempt to answer what is right and what is wrong, and what is good and what is bad (evil).
three theories ive studied are: natural law theory (NLT), consequentialism (utilitarianism), and Kantian moral theory.
to put briefly, NLT is by St. Thomas Aquinas, so its religion based on what is 'natural' and that is what makes actions or events right, good, wrong, evil.
utilitarianism is the overall good accomplished vs. the overall bad
and Kant is that you must respect all other rational beings when it comes to actions, and do good instead of bad.
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
Remember the String of Ears
"to the worm in horseradish, the world is horseradish."
I'd probably agree with the last one the most, personally, although there would obviously be limits. Utilitarianism sounds like... If the end is good, it justifies the means? Is that right? I feel like I've seen that term numerous times before, but I don't really know what it means. And NLT I'm very familiar with, it's the mindset my parents have for the most part...
I'd probably agree with the last one the most, personally, although there would obviously be limits. Utilitarianism sounds like... If the end is good, it justifies the means? Is that right? I feel like I've seen that term numerous times before, but I don't really know what it means. And NLT I'm very familiar with, it's the mindset my parents have for the most part...
utilitarianism considers all beings involved, and the total good - utility, to determine what is right or wrong; you can kinda give choices like, a numerical value, such as killing someone is a -90 but if that someone is a bad person maybe its a +100 so the overall is +10, but then you have to consider everyone in this, so all people affected require values as well. i think all theories say that human life, or humanity (Kant) is intrinsically good.
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
Remember the String of Ears
"to the worm in horseradish, the world is horseradish."
utilitarianism considers all beings involved, and the total good - utility, to determine what is right or wrong; you can kinda give choices like, a numerical value, such as killing someone is a -90 but if that someone is a bad person maybe its a +100 so the overall is +10, but then you have to consider everyone in this, so all people affected require values as well. i think all theories say that human life, or humanity (Kant) is intrinsically good.
S: (n) utilitarianism (doctrine that the useful is the good; especially as elaborated by Jeremy Bentham and James Mill; the aim was said to be the greatest happiness for the greatest number)
Yeah, found it. That sounds good to me on the surface, but since history has shown on more than one account that the thoughts of the minority are often the revolutionary ones, or more correct ones, this would be, in my mind, counter-productive to a good system of morals for a good government.
P.S.: Are we talking about in reference to government? Because to me, it seems like these terms inevitably lead there.
originally by Bentham, revised later by Mill. so yes.
Yeah, found it. That sounds good to me on the surface, but since history has shown on more than one account that the thoughts of the minority are often the revolutionary ones, or more correct ones, this would be, in my mind, counter-productive to a good system of morals for a good government.
P.S.: Are we talking about in reference to government? Because to me, it seems like these terms inevitably lead there.
it has a use in government...but i like it better as a theory for everyday life concerning morals and ethics. Mill and Bentham were hedonist, so the theory itself is hedonistic in principles.
EDIT: AHAHA i think i recognise that quote in your siggy saiynoq...i think i do!
oh, and in response to the question prposed in the survey: has anyone heard of 'the problem of evil?'
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
Remember the String of Ears
"to the worm in horseradish, the world is horseradish."
To post a comment, please login or register a new account.
Killing one man to save a thousand is considered evil because of the act of killing, but the intent is good.
Saving a man who you knew was about to blow up a school is considered good because you saved a life, but the intent is evil.
*shrug* Gray is everywhere.
-------------------------------------------
Those who stand for nothing will fall for anything.
-------------------------------------------
You're right!
Do you know why?
Because in relativity there is no right or wrong answer, just stupid answers...:P
Evil that disguised as good is still Evil, and wasn't good in the first place.
The reverse is true.
Just because you classified something as evil doesn't necessary make it so. (Evil is evil, but you can alway falsely classified it as good, ect).
You can't look at generalized actions like "Murder" and "Theft"... those are too broad, as the intent behind why those actions can be either good or evil.
The act of physical rape, however (in my book at least), is purely wrong... it's the act of harming another person, knowing the serious ramifications for the act, purely for self amusement // entertainment. It's the act of preying on the weak for no real cause.
Remember, it's all about justification.
On a different note, remember, Morality is seperated into three catagories: Cultural, Societal, and Personal. What I believe is right and wrong may not be what society believes is right and wrong... but as humans, we have to work within the confines of societal boundries when in public. Cultural morality is nothing more than a common thread between all of the societies since when this country was founded. We may try and buck the system, but it's still there, ever present.
-------------------------------------------
Those who stand for nothing will fall for anything.
-------------------------------------------
K E E P UP the convos bois.. good thread so far
Which Final Fantasy Character Are You?
Final Fantasy 7
Based solely on the definitions of the word, no.
To go beyond that though it becomes greatly complicated by WHY things are done instead of the act itself. Which if we want to go by WHY things are done then a lot of "evil" people become "good". It's just too uncertain.
If you classify "good" as someone doing something with good intentions then you may as well through Hitler in there. He thought what he was doing was for the greater good. A lot of serial killers fall into this category too. The ones that believe they were directly doing God's work.
If you TRULY believe you're doing God's work can you really be labeled "evil"?
That's kind of why we have to take things at face value and use logic instead of thinking too much on it.
Which if you believe everyone is equal is pretty much majority vote so things stay basically the same as they are.
Or you can believe what you want to, but if you kill someone and your only defense is "I personally don't think it's evil or wrong." It's not going to work out so well.
and yes, i did just this thread.
"to the worm in horseradish, the world is horseradish."
But no, please elaborate.
three theories ive studied are: natural law theory (NLT), consequentialism (utilitarianism), and Kantian moral theory.
to put briefly, NLT is by St. Thomas Aquinas, so its religion based on what is 'natural' and that is what makes actions or events right, good, wrong, evil.
utilitarianism is the overall good accomplished vs. the overall bad
and Kant is that you must respect all other rational beings when it comes to actions, and do good instead of bad.
"to the worm in horseradish, the world is horseradish."
"to the worm in horseradish, the world is horseradish."
Siaynoq's Playthroughs
Yeah, found it. That sounds good to me on the surface, but since history has shown on more than one account that the thoughts of the minority are often the revolutionary ones, or more correct ones, this would be, in my mind, counter-productive to a good system of morals for a good government.
P.S.: Are we talking about in reference to government? Because to me, it seems like these terms inevitably lead there.
it has a use in government...but i like it better as a theory for everyday life concerning morals and ethics. Mill and Bentham were hedonist, so the theory itself is hedonistic in principles.
EDIT: AHAHA i think i recognise that quote in your siggy saiynoq...i think i do!
oh, and in response to the question prposed in the survey: has anyone heard of 'the problem of evil?'
"to the worm in horseradish, the world is horseradish."