We want to separate being in town and being out on a quest/adventure/dungeon as much as possible. Leaving the safety of a town should not be a decision you take lightly. We don?t want to remove the sense of suspense and danger by making town something you're always going back to pretty much whenever you like.
The intent is to create a greater separation from being in town, and not, and to make your time away from town a lot more tense.
Check point will not make it less challenging... They will take care of that, it will not be easy either and they will have penalties. I just see good point, no long coming back, no problem to take your corps... This new bring nothing, we already know for check point...
no potions no portal, more inventory space = no need to always return to town. If you want return in action where you just die, it's annoying to come back from town. With check point you'll be near and ready to continue the fight. For multiplayers it will be good.
I like the checkpoint system. One question that i have is what happens when you are in a party and you die? Do you wait untill some one in the party survives and gets to the next checkpoint and then you get to spawn at that check point? Or do you go back to your previous checkpoint right away? Or maybe if you are dead you are dead. Or maybe if you....
I like the checkpoint system. One question that i have is what happens when you are in a party and you die? Do you wait untill some one in the party survives and gets to the next checkpoint and then you get to spawn at that check point? Or do you go back to your previous checkpoint right away? Or maybe if you are dead you are dead. Or maybe if you....
wow, never thought about that. I'm sure they don't want to separate players, like if you die then you go back to the previous checkpoint and have to catch up with the group.
Maybe they could have a system like the Halo series co-op where once there is no threat anymore you could spawn back next to the person who is safe.
I also like the idea of spawning at the next checkpoint. The Halo system might be too easy.
I would assume that they would have the same system in place for sing and multi player. I think if you die in a group, you res at the last check point and run to catch back up with them.
Do we know whether or not you res naked and collect your corpse or full res at the last checkpoint. To me it sounds like you get all of your gear when you res.
I would also assume you would keep at least the items you collected from the last checkpoint when you die with no other way to save them but quit the game. How much would it suck to get a unique item, die and loose it or get a unique item and have to save and exit just to ensure you keep it.
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Ok to many posts to read but here are my ten cents.
They need to space the checkpoints out carefully, having a death reset you back a long way from where you started will piss a lot of people off making them not want to play especially if the area is really hard and you reset like 10 times.
Also when you die they need to make you invincible for like 5 seconds to regroup and not get killed right after.
Also when you are in a party and you are the only one in the party to die what the hell will they do.
Who would want to fight there way back to there party, that would take a while and there party would be leaps and bounds a head.
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I am cheese. I am loved by all. I go great with everything. Other foods hate me because I take all the glory. Like Nachos..Their just jealous cause no one eats them unless Im there. Shit..I even ruined broccili's rep. Broccili kept talkin shit so I was like. " You know what?, I think I might melt myself on some Broccilli. See how those humans enjoy that green [sexual slur censored] now." Shit...Now,People dont even touch him, unless Im all over that shit! Ahhh..Its not easy, being cheesy.. Peace. Cheese Out.
I don't think the monsters respawn so you wouldn't have to fight your way back. You would catch up to your group quickly because they are stopping to fight.
In the quote it mentions placing the checkpoints at the end of each "floor" in the dungeons. Does this mean we can expect a more dungeon crawling feel from D1 as opposed to the more openess of D2?
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I don't think the monsters respawn so you wouldn't have to fight your way back. You would catch up to your group quickly because they are stopping to fight.
If the monsters don't respond then how is that a penalty?
That just wastes your time to get back in the action.
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I am cheese. I am loved by all. I go great with everything. Other foods hate me because I take all the glory. Like Nachos..Their just jealous cause no one eats them unless Im there. Shit..I even ruined broccili's rep. Broccili kept talkin shit so I was like. " You know what?, I think I might melt myself on some Broccilli. See how those humans enjoy that green [sexual slur censored] now." Shit...Now,People dont even touch him, unless Im all over that shit! Ahhh..Its not easy, being cheesy.. Peace. Cheese Out.
First of all everyone is acting as if once you die and your sent back to the waypoint it takes 20 mintues for you to load and your group will be miles ahead and maybe in act 32 while your still waiting to respawn. Come on now lol. I'm sure its a like a 5 second respawn time. Can anyone tell me of any area in diablo 2 where there were no new locations or levels in an area? None. I'm willing to guess there will be mass checkpoints all through out the game. I like this new system already. You die, you suffer the consequences! Respawning with a piddly amount of health and slowly reginerating back to max sounds good to me. PLUS. If your playing with friends..how many times did you die and your friends said fuck you im going on ahead? lol come on. A simple yo, I died hold up, and im sure your friends will either hold there ground or venture back a ways to make sure the areas clear. CHill out lol. If your in a party who would go leaps and bounds ahead of you when you die in the first place. Your in the wrong party
What consequences? Oh yea low health watch your team members kill while you sit and regenerate.
Not meant to sound mean like it does. lol
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I am cheese. I am loved by all. I go great with everything. Other foods hate me because I take all the glory. Like Nachos..Their just jealous cause no one eats them unless Im there. Shit..I even ruined broccili's rep. Broccili kept talkin shit so I was like. " You know what?, I think I might melt myself on some Broccilli. See how those humans enjoy that green [sexual slur censored] now." Shit...Now,People dont even touch him, unless Im all over that shit! Ahhh..Its not easy, being cheesy.. Peace. Cheese Out.
I would like if possible to have some transition point between the death animation to seeing the character alive again. Being recreated fully clothed with no evidence of actual death is not fluid within the idea of "dying". Seems like a teleportation system to me.
I for one would like to stand up as a ghost from the corpse and have to run back to where the 'Resurrection Angel' (Or Glyth, but the angel makes more sense) which would be at the check point locations proposed (With 10% hp). There are advantages to this system over the current aswell you can't be swamped by mobs at the check point with low hp (Because you can see the check point). You feel like you have taken some punishment aswell as finding no value in the death location transition.
In summery the idea of death within the players mind must be synonymous with ghosts or in some kind of graphical context. It will seem less immerse I think without graphical context deviating life from death.
What consequences? Oh yea low health watch your team members kill while you sit and regenerate.
Not meant to sound mean like it does. lol
? I have not heard mention of a buff which would make these statements valid. It seems like you could use a pot straight after resurrection and or a health globe. Why would you be forced to wait without a debuff of some kind?
I've read through all the posts and I have to say that in D2 running past a bunch of dead monsters was completely pointless and time wasting.
I also think that dying once (with gold and exp penalties) was punishment enough, why die again when you are not equipped to fight? Its not skill; its how fast can I run around/teleport through this mob to get my body, then get out so I can recover, put my potions on my belt and get ready to fight again.
If you want to make dying be a punishment for lack of skill it should take skill to get back to where you were.
The D2 death penalty was easily one of the worst/stupidest I've ever encountered. All it did was make me spend a minute running back to my corpse. The gold loss was inconsequential, and the exp loss (for me, who usually didn't level beyond 80-85 because there wasn't any real incentive beyond that) amounted to a couple Baal runs. Let's not kid ourselves by saying the D2 penalty was hardcore in any way, shape or form; it wasn't. "Oh no! My corpse is surrounded by monsters that kill me before I reach it! What do I do?! Oh, wait, I'll just exit and make a new game."
And to those anyone who says WoW didn't have a death penalty, I'm guessing you didn't play much at high levels with a lot of purple gear. Dying meant your items would lose durability, which may not sound like a big deal, but it cost an ass ton to repair. This was especially bad for raiders who needed money for mats, pots, etc.
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"Everywhere the human soul stands between a hemisphere of light and another of darkness; on the confines of the two everlasting empires, necessity and free will." -Thomas Carlyle
The D2 death penalty was easily one of the worst/stupidest I've ever encountered. All it did was make me spend a minute running back to my corpse. The gold loss was inconsequential, and the exp loss (for me, who usually didn't level beyond 80-85 because there wasn't any real incentive beyond that) amounted to a couple Baal runs. Let's not kid ourselves by saying the D2 penalty was hardcore in any way, shape or form; it wasn't. "Oh no! My corpse is surrounded by monsters that kill me before I reach it! What do I do?! Oh, wait, I'll just exit and make a new game."
And to those anyone who says WoW didn't have a death penalty, I'm guessing you didn't play much at high levels with a lot of purple gear. Dying meant your items would lose durability, which may not sound like a big deal, but it cost an ass ton to repair. This was especially bad for raiders who needed money for mats, pots, etc.
Your point towards D2 death penalty is that it amounts purely to annoyance and not to punishment. The fact is that, an annoying death penalty is just one that is not severe enough to be felt as a punishment.
Both of those detriments work towards giving the player a constant (sometimes intense and adrenaline-rushing) pressure to STAY ALIVE and perfect the character skill-and-item-wise to achieve better survivability.
The balance in an RPG like this is to penalize the player here and there enough that the player is greatly contrived to worry about how he can make his character better, but still have those penalties moderate enough that they don't grief the players (too much).
@Blizzquote,
Personally like a few earlier posters, I feel that instant full-gear respawn does not by any means fit the conventional concept of "death", even when relative to any other RPG games.
We are role-playing in these video games, for god's sakes, we either play hard-core in which the role-playing is a bit extreme and when you die you die, or less than HC but still having the scene of death drawing your breath away and making you regret that last false move you did.
Checkpoint
- I find it great! More action!
- No change in difficulty what I can see.
Penalty
- Slow regen of health, I dont know about that one but I guess its the main penalty.
- Lost Gold, seems like a natural way to curse someone but It feels dramatic and kinda annoying.
- Respawn the latest monsters you have slayen, I guess this means more action and alot more deaths in both cases?
There isn't any evidence that there will, or will not be a HC in D3.
I'll look into this...
there will be hardcore mode.
it was hinted at during wwi 2008:
Quote from WWI q/a panel »
Q: Will there be Hardcore mode? A: We haven't decided yet, but I don't see why we wouldn't. It’s not a decision we need to make yet. We probably will, though.
Wilson also announced that there will be a hardcore mode for all of you bloodlusting realism players out there as well as 3 difficulty modes like previous in LOD.
[INDENT]Has anymore thought been put into Hardcore? Are any features decided-upon?[/INDENT']I think the last thing I heard from Jay on it in public was something along the lines of "Ok fine we'll just commit to a hardcore mode here and now" outside of that no details have been released.
and it was again brought up and confirmed at blizzcon 2009:
Quote from jaywilson »
Q: Adding any additional features that Hardcore players alone would have?
A: We do want Hardcore. It’s the only way to play right? In terms of additional features, we don’t have anything specific planned right now, but we’re open to ideas so hit the forums and share your ideas.
on topic, i don't like the checkpoint system.
i like being able to go to town when i want to, and this is part of an alternate setup that removes that convenience.
additionally i think this system does make softcore easier; this will inevitably lead to making the game harder to compensate, which i think could have detrimental effects on hc.
i'll give it a chance, I just am not a fan at the outset.
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they'll never see me coming.. life is a sequence of tragedies, inconsistent only by fleeting, elusive moments of pleasure,
serving only to ensure absolute vulnerability to the pain of their inevitable absence.
Jeru is right, we have all been using the checkpoint system in D2. everbody would cast tp to make body retrieval quicker than walking back from town. All the checkpoint system does is automatically give you that tp to get back quicker. If you say you do not like the check point system, then play D2 and only use tp's to go back to town and never cast one because you think you might die. After running all the way back from the latest waypoint a couple of times, tell me you don't like the checkpoint system.
The only draw back to the checkpoint system is not bein able to go to town as easily. However, when you died and went to town, it's not like you actually used the town. You would just leave it to get your body. It also sounds like they are minimizing need to go to town. No pots, random merchants to sell stuff. It seems like towns will be used kore for lore than gameplay now.
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Me too so what? Hell I lost my whole work at lvl 80 (hell) because of lag spikes and died like 6 times did I complain? No I took out my "second gear" leveled and got my stuff back.
Of course I want D3 using the same death mechanic as D2 because it worked really well why change it?
Some validation for that would be nice, because right now it looks loke they gonna create something LESS challenging.
And please don't start with bad game design aka achievements!
Lets face it:
- no stat customization
- skills capped at 5! -->WTH?!
- no "real" death penalty
- class sets --->introducing BiS items
- skill resetting
See my sig I'm REALLY concerned about the replayability of this game. You really think stuff like "rune farming" will keep the people as busy as the stat customization did? Sorry but strongly disagree with that.
Wooo stop... you find that normal dying many time and lose exp because of lag ?? I don't find it normal !
Where you see that will be LESS challenging ???
Skill capped at 5 ???? euhhh where you see that !! I'm not be noticed of that ?!
They said, they will have a penalties but they don't know actually what...
Sounds like an excellent system to me. Guys, games are supposed to be fun. If you like penalties and challenges that badly. Than I have something more fun and challenging for you, it's called life... so get off your computer, and go try to be a millionaire and do something more productive with yourself, and experience those penalties and challenges, I'm sure you'll find them extremely fun, since you love it so much.
I don't understand what the problem here is. It's simply logical, players do not want to die. No one logically finds entertainment in playing a game because "they want to die." Blizzard understands this. Dying in itself is the punishment.
Now the only problem you have to deal with is when a player sees the opportunity cost of dying as being lower than the reward they'd get from doing so. For instance, beating down a boss and killing him at the cost of dying 20 times is worth it to a person than not killing him at all.
In those instances this system self regulates because dying over and over again constantly puts you no where, and you make no progress. You aren't frustratedly "punished" for the death that you don't want to happen, you just simply "go nowhere." In the game. Something that works in its most pristine form, how awesome.
Us others who want to spend some of our free time having fun, we'll enjoy this game, and enjoy the escape from real world stress, challenges, and penalties. Something games are all about in the first place.
You other guys that love challenges and penalties all the time, should try to go raise 12 children, contract HIV, and try to be a millionaire all at the same time. According to you guys, all those challenges and penalties will be right up your ally, I'm sure of it.
Also when you are in a party and you are the only one in the party to die what the hell will they do.
Who would want to fight there way back to there party, that would take a while and there party would be leaps and bounds a head.
Blizzard already talk about that, they want the person who die, can rejoin the team fast and return to action quickly. They will have many Check point, so many and so close that you never running for a while before regroup your team.
I don't know why people ask it, all that informations is already know from long ago.
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Check point will not make it less challenging... They will take care of that, it will not be easy either and they will have penalties. I just see good point, no long coming back, no problem to take your corps... This new bring nothing, we already know for check point...
no potions no portal, more inventory space = no need to always return to town. If you want return in action where you just die, it's annoying to come back from town. With check point you'll be near and ready to continue the fight. For multiplayers it will be good.
wow, never thought about that. I'm sure they don't want to separate players, like if you die then you go back to the previous checkpoint and have to catch up with the group.
Maybe they could have a system like the Halo series co-op where once there is no threat anymore you could spawn back next to the person who is safe.
I also like the idea of spawning at the next checkpoint. The Halo system might be too easy.
Do we know whether or not you res naked and collect your corpse or full res at the last checkpoint. To me it sounds like you get all of your gear when you res.
I would also assume you would keep at least the items you collected from the last checkpoint when you die with no other way to save them but quit the game. How much would it suck to get a unique item, die and loose it or get a unique item and have to save and exit just to ensure you keep it.
Find any Diablo news? Contact me or anyone else on the News team
They need to space the checkpoints out carefully, having a death reset you back a long way from where you started will piss a lot of people off making them not want to play especially if the area is really hard and you reset like 10 times.
Also when you die they need to make you invincible for like 5 seconds to regroup and not get killed right after.
Also when you are in a party and you are the only one in the party to die what the hell will they do.
Who would want to fight there way back to there party, that would take a while and there party would be leaps and bounds a head.
In the quote it mentions placing the checkpoints at the end of each "floor" in the dungeons. Does this mean we can expect a more dungeon crawling feel from D1 as opposed to the more openess of D2?
Find any Diablo news? Contact me or anyone else on the News team
If the monsters don't respond then how is that a penalty?
That just wastes your time to get back in the action.
Not meant to sound mean like it does. lol
I for one would like to stand up as a ghost from the corpse and have to run back to where the 'Resurrection Angel' (Or Glyth, but the angel makes more sense) which would be at the check point locations proposed (With 10% hp). There are advantages to this system over the current aswell you can't be swamped by mobs at the check point with low hp (Because you can see the check point). You feel like you have taken some punishment aswell as finding no value in the death location transition.
In summery the idea of death within the players mind must be synonymous with ghosts or in some kind of graphical context. It will seem less immerse I think without graphical context deviating life from death.
? I have not heard mention of a buff which would make these statements valid. It seems like you could use a pot straight after resurrection and or a health globe. Why would you be forced to wait without a debuff of some kind?
I also think that dying once (with gold and exp penalties) was punishment enough, why die again when you are not equipped to fight? Its not skill; its how fast can I run around/teleport through this mob to get my body, then get out so I can recover, put my potions on my belt and get ready to fight again.
If you want to make dying be a punishment for lack of skill it should take skill to get back to where you were.
And to those anyone who says WoW didn't have a death penalty, I'm guessing you didn't play much at high levels with a lot of purple gear. Dying meant your items would lose durability, which may not sound like a big deal, but it cost an ass ton to repair. This was especially bad for raiders who needed money for mats, pots, etc.
"Everywhere the human soul stands between a hemisphere of light and another of darkness; on the confines of the two everlasting empires, necessity and free will."
-Thomas Carlyle
Your point towards D2 death penalty is that it amounts purely to annoyance and not to punishment. The fact is that, an annoying death penalty is just one that is not severe enough to be felt as a punishment.
Both of those detriments work towards giving the player a constant (sometimes intense and adrenaline-rushing) pressure to STAY ALIVE and perfect the character skill-and-item-wise to achieve better survivability.
The balance in an RPG like this is to penalize the player here and there enough that the player is greatly contrived to worry about how he can make his character better, but still have those penalties moderate enough that they don't grief the players (too much).
@Blizzquote,
Personally like a few earlier posters, I feel that instant full-gear respawn does not by any means fit the conventional concept of "death", even when relative to any other RPG games.
We are role-playing in these video games, for god's sakes, we either play hard-core in which the role-playing is a bit extreme and when you die you die, or less than HC but still having the scene of death drawing your breath away and making you regret that last false move you did.
- I find it great! More action!
- No change in difficulty what I can see.
Penalty
- Slow regen of health, I dont know about that one but I guess its the main penalty.
- Lost Gold, seems like a natural way to curse someone but It feels dramatic and kinda annoying.
- Respawn the latest monsters you have slayen, I guess this means more action and alot more deaths in both cases?
:: Enkeria [Twitter / Twitch / Website / Tattoos]
there will be hardcore mode.
it was hinted at during wwi 2008:
again during blizzcon 2008: confirmed by bashiok on the forums:
and it was again brought up and confirmed at blizzcon 2009:
on topic, i don't like the checkpoint system.
i like being able to go to town when i want to, and this is part of an alternate setup that removes that convenience.
additionally i think this system does make softcore easier; this will inevitably lead to making the game harder to compensate, which i think could have detrimental effects on hc.
i'll give it a chance, I just am not a fan at the outset.
they'll never see me coming..
life is a sequence of tragedies, inconsistent only by fleeting, elusive moments of pleasure,
serving only to ensure absolute vulnerability to the pain of their inevitable absence.
The only draw back to the checkpoint system is not bein able to go to town as easily. However, when you died and went to town, it's not like you actually used the town. You would just leave it to get your body. It also sounds like they are minimizing need to go to town. No pots, random merchants to sell stuff. It seems like towns will be used kore for lore than gameplay now.
Find any Diablo news? Contact me or anyone else on the News team
Wooo stop... you find that normal dying many time and lose exp because of lag ?? I don't find it normal !
Where you see that will be LESS challenging ???
Skill capped at 5 ???? euhhh where you see that !! I'm not be noticed of that ?!
They said, they will have a penalties but they don't know actually what...
I don't understand what the problem here is. It's simply logical, players do not want to die. No one logically finds entertainment in playing a game because "they want to die." Blizzard understands this. Dying in itself is the punishment.
Now the only problem you have to deal with is when a player sees the opportunity cost of dying as being lower than the reward they'd get from doing so. For instance, beating down a boss and killing him at the cost of dying 20 times is worth it to a person than not killing him at all.
In those instances this system self regulates because dying over and over again constantly puts you no where, and you make no progress. You aren't frustratedly "punished" for the death that you don't want to happen, you just simply "go nowhere." In the game. Something that works in its most pristine form, how awesome.
Us others who want to spend some of our free time having fun, we'll enjoy this game, and enjoy the escape from real world stress, challenges, and penalties. Something games are all about in the first place.
You other guys that love challenges and penalties all the time, should try to go raise 12 children, contract HIV, and try to be a millionaire all at the same time. According to you guys, all those challenges and penalties will be right up your ally, I'm sure of it.
Blizzard already talk about that, they want the person who die, can rejoin the team fast and return to action quickly. They will have many Check point, so many and so close that you never running for a while before regroup your team.
I don't know why people ask it, all that informations is already know from long ago.