Spellbooks featured strongly in the original Diablo as being the only way for a character to learn new skills. Each character, regardless of class, was limited in his spellcasting abilities simply by the amount of spellbooks he or she discovered in the course of the game. This of course resulted in much imbalance and added not a small amount of tedium to the game as a whole. In short, it wasn’t very well implemented; more suited to its roguelike predecessors rather than action RPGs of which Diablo was the first of its kind. Bashiok speaks:
That came back in Diablo II too eventually in the form of rune words, and I don't think it really worked out too well in the end. I do think it actually could be designed and implemented properly; balanced, etc. but...
For me the more important question though is what impact does it have on the class you're playing and also our knowledge of the Diablo world? Is a class nothing more than someone who read from a book, or is holding a specific item? No, they're very specific and very iconic figures (heroes even) from very distinct styles and backgrounds. The characters we play are these concentrated images of their cultures, beliefs, etc. Everything they do resembles who they are and where they're from, and what does it mean to then piecemeal that out to any one who just happens to throw a couple runes in to an item.
It worked better in Diablo (1) I think. Conceptually it was a bit easier to digest just because of the basic pen and paper underpinnings, and the heroes were far more generic. It was also far less obtrusive.
In Diablo II though, for me anyway, it always undermined the uniqueness of playing a specific class, and also what it meant to be that character. Aside from everything else it caused.
"The characters we play are these concentrated images of their cultures, beliefs, etc. Everything they do resembles who they are and where they're from"
bashiok stole the words from my mouth here
That's what was so cool about the classes in D2 .... if books return i will be sad ans go sit on a rainbow to cry a little bit
Technically, you could still use spellbooks and remain having a unique character.
Each character class could only use class-specific spellbooks to gain skill levels for skills in their own unique skill tree. And an interesting concept for that is having to trade for hard-to-find spellbooks that would give skill levels to a player class' highest skills. So basically - the higher the skill, the harder to increase with spellbooks.
You could also make things challenging by only allowing the use of say, 100 spellbooks. That way, you'd have to look for specific books to travel down the skill trees "branches" and achieve the higher skills without wasting spellbooks on skills you wouldn't use.
I'll miss the spell books still. I wished they had them in Diablo II, albeit implemented better. Oh well. Other than that, with the lateral with Runewords, I can see his point and appreciate it.
Whirlwinding For Dummies, we could come up with these all day. xD But yeah, Spellbooks gone is a good thing in my eyes, I hated having to find certain books to level skills.
Aw man, I loved runewords =/ they were fun, making like 20 countess runs until finally you got the runes you wanted and the item with the right amount of sockets and then you were awesome for a little while until you found something else to go for hehe
And I disagree with the idea that weapons detract from the uniqueness of a char, I mean look at the stories, theres heaps of examples of people with fancy-as rare-as-hens-teeth weapons like excallibur and king arthur. Thor and mjollnir. And every third samurai has a fancy weapon that some old man on top of a mountain was supposed to make for them
I dunno, I loved that extra dimension to the item game
if theres anything i dont wanna see anymore its OP runewords. spellbooks i didnt really care about as duping in D1 is just too easy and made things unbalanced anyways.
as for D2. I think duping ruined that game for me. High runes and them poofing was down right dumb and the runewords that they made really lost focus on the game. What i dont get is how so many people want complain about the animation and art of D3 when your all enigma freaks teleporting like this is freakin dragon ball z. Runewords in many ways killed D2 for me. Merc aura stacking and enigma really did kill this game for me and i dont want to see this in D3.
i will ask for a 125% price refund if the D3 reaches this low point.
Personally I liked the spell books in D1, it was cool to be able to read the book, hear that little I’ve just learned a spell sound. It added to the mystery of and excitement of finding new loot, like you were on an adventure and didn’t know what you were going to find. As one might hope would be the case in real life.
To me D1's loot seemed more interesting than D2 because some of the unique items were really cool and rare. I remember finding a staff with an Apocalypse spell attached to it. That was a real game changer for me against Diablo, I was able to wipe out so much with that staff. I never found that staff again in any of my other games.
In D2 I was annoyed with the sorceress spells all being based in only fire, ice and electricity. Really limiting, the loot became too predictable at times and so much was only good for selling. It would be nice in D3 to find a wide mix of really diverse and powerful items.
"Mastering Maces For Blockheads"
"Complete Idiots Guide to Axes and Swords"
the masteries have to come from somewhere, right?
hahahaha agreed
i think adding books are better for trades + interest in the game other then having ding lvl skill point goes in BLANK kinda makes it challenging thou haha and trade friendly.
one thing u have to watch about replacing books for skills is whats the benefit in gaining lvl then? only stat points? if it means that then NO
maybe if u add books as a way for cross skilling to other class skills and instead of runewords that will be crazy hahaha i'll like that. make sure u make books HARD TO FIND THEN!!
but then again we have classes becoming other classes issue again but didn't diablo always do that
i liked it more custom is better anyways
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
"I Do not Consider myself to do Justice, But I Do not conside myself to do Evil Either."
well the use of skill books is usefull but they must respect the unicitty of the char
Example maybe your barb is stupid and doesnt now how to read so they must invent something like meditation or something like that
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
When All the Corrupted Souls Will Fall In To My Hands No Angel Or The Bravest Hero Cant Defeat Me
Im The Essence Of Darkness
Beware Foolish Mortals The Death Nearly Aprochesee[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
I have mixed feelings about this at the moment, I find it logical to keep each ability exclusive to a class but for lore reasons I'd like that each class had a "forgotten" skill which could only be learned through ancient tomes, or if not, at least presented to players through that. And concerning runewords, in a way I find it good that people will have to rely more or skill and tactics more than equipment (by this I mean anyone has a chance against anyone else), but I liked the way some runewords gave new skills to a class, I'm not referring to oskill, but to skills on hit/death. I found that genious first time I played and I'd like to see it born anew in the next game.
blizzard always arrived with new statics and cool things im pretty shure that they will make a nice face ,and all will be satisfied but thats a graet ideea angellium with the lost knoledge is very interesting
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
When All the Corrupted Souls Will Fall In To My Hands No Angel Or The Bravest Hero Cant Defeat Me
Im The Essence Of Darkness
Beware Foolish Mortals The Death Nearly Aprochesee[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
I don't understand the reasoning behind losing spellbooks. Just about any kind of RPG has scrolls or spellbooks. Unless the sorcerer learns his new abilities from inate power, there is no other way to learn spells unless he visits his master (assuming he's an apprentice).
In regards to the runewords, good riddance. They took all of the excitement out of the game for me. It should be a little difficult to find excellent equipment...
The reason it worked in D1 was because books were the only source of skills. This basically made it so books were only useful for those with high enough energy to use them, usually sorcerer. Besides books, in D1 you just used items and stats, and either shot your bow or swung your weapon. There were some convenient spells to have like town portal, but most were not used or just sold.(warrior/rogue) I like the setup where you add to a skill as well as stats every level, so I prefer D2's setup, but in my opinion books worked in D1 because they did not have this system. Overall in D3 no books is best, Books of lore to read along the way would be cool though, like in D1.
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
"This is the triumph of man:
Where there is truth, he must find.
Where there is destruction, he must rebuild.
Where there is love, he must protect."
World's Fair Exhibit
"God gave us memories, that in life's garden we may have June roses in December."
im glad theres no stupid spell books or spell scrolls. They were so useless and annoying. Why wud u use a system from a game 10 years old and just change it up? we need somthing completely different.
Hellforge: Forging a passion for video games.
Though I really don't miss them. Diablo 3 is fine without them.
bashiok stole the words from my mouth here
That's what was so cool about the classes in D2 .... if books return i will be sad ans go sit on a rainbow to cry a little bit
It's the decisions you make when you have no time to make them that define who you are.
Each character class could only use class-specific spellbooks to gain skill levels for skills in their own unique skill tree. And an interesting concept for that is having to trade for hard-to-find spellbooks that would give skill levels to a player class' highest skills. So basically - the higher the skill, the harder to increase with spellbooks.
You could also make things challenging by only allowing the use of say, 100 spellbooks. That way, you'd have to look for specific books to travel down the skill trees "branches" and achieve the higher skills without wasting spellbooks on skills you wouldn't use.
They could of made some sort of class specific "spellbook" for the barbarian though.
Won't really miss them.
And I disagree with the idea that weapons detract from the uniqueness of a char, I mean look at the stories, theres heaps of examples of people with fancy-as rare-as-hens-teeth weapons like excallibur and king arthur. Thor and mjollnir. And every third samurai has a fancy weapon that some old man on top of a mountain was supposed to make for them
I dunno, I loved that extra dimension to the item game
as for D2. I think duping ruined that game for me. High runes and them poofing was down right dumb and the runewords that they made really lost focus on the game. What i dont get is how so many people want complain about the animation and art of D3 when your all enigma freaks teleporting like this is freakin dragon ball z. Runewords in many ways killed D2 for me. Merc aura stacking and enigma really did kill this game for me and i dont want to see this in D3.
i will ask for a 125% price refund if the D3 reaches this low point.
To me D1's loot seemed more interesting than D2 because some of the unique items were really cool and rare. I remember finding a staff with an Apocalypse spell attached to it. That was a real game changer for me against Diablo, I was able to wipe out so much with that staff. I never found that staff again in any of my other games.
In D2 I was annoyed with the sorceress spells all being based in only fire, ice and electricity. Really limiting, the loot became too predictable at times and so much was only good for selling. It would be nice in D3 to find a wide mix of really diverse and powerful items.
hahahaha agreed
i think adding books are better for trades + interest in the game other then having ding lvl skill point goes in BLANK kinda makes it challenging thou haha and trade friendly.
one thing u have to watch about replacing books for skills is whats the benefit in gaining lvl then? only stat points? if it means that then NO
maybe if u add books as a way for cross skilling to other class skills and instead of runewords that will be crazy hahaha i'll like that. make sure u make books HARD TO FIND THEN!!
but then again we have classes becoming other classes issue again but didn't diablo always do that
i liked it more custom is better anyways
Example maybe your barb is stupid and doesnt now how to read so they must invent something like meditation or something like that
Im The Essence Of Darkness
Beware Foolish Mortals The Death Nearly Aprochesee[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
Im The Essence Of Darkness
Beware Foolish Mortals The Death Nearly Aprochesee[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
In regards to the runewords, good riddance. They took all of the excitement out of the game for me. It should be a little difficult to find excellent equipment...
Where there is truth, he must find.
Where there is destruction, he must rebuild.
Where there is love, he must protect."
World's Fair Exhibit
"God gave us memories, that in life's garden we may have June roses in December."
John Barrie