I am nearing the date for my religion vs. science debate, and I would hope to get some statistics before I go onto the debate.
So over the course of the forums I'm part of, getting some insight on what people generally believe would be nice (though I might have to leave out the fact that this is a Diablo forum ). So just post up your views on evolution on whether you think it's real or not (there is no "in between answer for this poll, as I want either yes or no)
yes. Nobody can deny evolution to some degree. Humans themselves have even evolved within the last couple hundreds of years that have been documented. Way back when, the avg height of a human was around 5'6". Then with technology and abundance of resources, avg male height reached around 6'2". however, this can cause physical problems with bones and organs and have since been lowered to an avg of 5'10". This is evolution and has been documented.
However, if we are talking about humans once being monkeys and all life once being single-celled organism, that is much different. That is why a yes or no answer cannot be used on whether or nor evolution exists. At least not the way you presented it.
I believe that you cannot deny the fact that things evolve. The evidence for it is all around us. But that we evolved from a one cell organism, I don't buy it.
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I think the question should have been "do you believe in macroevolution?" It's impossible to deny that evolution on a small scale, such as genetic changes in one organism, exist, as it is observed daily. What people have a problem accepting is fish becoming mammals, eyes evolving, prehistoric apes evolving into Homo Sapiens and so forth.
yes. Nobody can deny evolution to some degree. Humans themselves have even evolved within the last couple hundreds of years that have been documented. Way back when, the avg height of a human was around 5'6". Then with technology and abundance of resources, avg male height reached around 6'2". however, this can cause physical problems with bones and organs and have since been lowered to an avg of 5'10". This is evolution and has been documented.
That's not evolution, that's humans simply having much more favorable living conditions than in prehistoric times, thus allowing bodies to grow taller. The ability to grow as tall as we are today have been there for a long time, but poor food, health, living conditions etc. haven't allowed us to actually utilize that potential. There is no way an evolutionary difference in height measured in decimeters could increase and then decrease over just a few hundred years given any evolutionary theory.
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It's just logical. A random mutation occurs in an individual. Most of them are disadvantageous, and that would diminish the chance of survival of that individual compared to others of his species. In the long term, that mutation will disappear from the genetic pool because that individual (or its offspring, in case he managed to have them) will just die earlier, and have less of a chance of reproducing, thus killing the mutation with themselves.
If on the contrary the mutation is advantageous, the individual will have a better chance of surviving than his fellow members of the species, and in case the mutation is carried on to its offspring, so will they. Again, in the long term, this will give the mutated, or evolved if you wish, a longer lifespan, more chance to reproduce and carry the mutation on to more members of the species, in the end outnumbering the unevolved ones.
This is easily explained with an example. Imagine a bird species with short beaks that feeds on fruit from bushes. Blueberries if you wish. As long as the food is abundant, the birds will keep on reproducing with no problem. Eventually there will be too many birds and the fruits won't be so easy to obtain. Slower birds will start to die. Now imagine one bird that randomly mutated and was born with a longer beak. It will be able to reach fruit from inside the bush that the other birds don't reach, in addition to the outer fruit every bird can eat. This will obviously give him an advantage over the other birds, it will have food ensured for the rest of his life. See second paragraph for the end of the story.
It's pure survival of the fittest. And it's not like the bird wanted to get a longer beak, it was just a mutation among millions that turned out to be great for it. Every species on earth is the consequence of mutation. And mutation is random. That's some food for thought
Evolution is the explanation for the diversity of life. It makes complete sense, and is absolutely logical. Go to google and type "Observed Instances of Speciation" and hit "I'm feeling lucky". They explain it far better then I ever could.
Maybe evolution is more than just a theory. But until something is done about the law of biogenesis I'll remain a skeptic.
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humans didnt evolve from apes, i really dont understand why people think evolution states that. apes and humans branched off from a common ancestor that was neither ape or human.
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The thing about evolution is it has yet to be disproven. Most theories we operate on as the current paradigm until something else comes along and disproves it. Scientists aren't trying every day to prove things, they're trying to disprove things. And there's way more evidence that supports evolution than disproves it. And did you know more women each day are being born with a hymen? Many consider that a human evolution. And how we get goosebumps when we're scared or cold, many believe that's just a leftover trait from when we were foragers and had to protect ourselves from predators. So the hair all over our bodies would stand up when we were frightened to show our enemies we were bigger than they thought. Stuff like that. Interesting.
The thing about evolution is it has yet to be disproven. Most theories we operate on as the current paradigm until something else comes along and disproves it. Scientists aren't trying every day to prove things, they're trying to disprove things. And there's way more evidence that supports evolution than disproves it. And did you know more women each day are being born with a hymen? Many consider that a human evolution. And how we get goosebumps when we're scared or cold, many believe that's just a leftover trait from when we were foragers and had to protect ourselves from predators. So the hair all over our bodies would stand up when we were frightened to show our enemies we were bigger than they thought. Stuff like that. Interesting.
Maybe it doesn't disprove it but the law of biogenesis definitely gives the theory of evolution a bit of a flat tire.
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"I want to say something but I'll keep it to myself I guess and leave this useless post behind to make you aware that there WAS something... "
-Equinox
"We're like the downtown of the Diablo related internet lol"
-Winged
not quite sure what u mean by law of biogenesis. evolution doesnt give an explanation on the beginning of life, just on the origin of species.
if u want origin of life, heres an interesting story:
the recent nobel prize winner in medicine was over at my uni a couple weeks back, he did research on the origins of lipid bilayers and mechanisms by which they can expand, and how simple early earth nucleic acid sequences had some sort of self-replicating machinery. now, instead of early forms of lipids, hes trying something with chiral hydrocarbons or something.
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Remember the String of Ears
"to the worm in horseradish, the world is horseradish."
But doesn't the idea of evolution somewhat imply the idea that life could come from something non living, hence the idea of evolving?
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"I want to say something but I'll keep it to myself I guess and leave this useless post behind to make you aware that there WAS something... "
-Equinox
"We're like the downtown of the Diablo related internet lol"
-Winged
Law of Biogenesis, that living beings come from other living beings. Theory of Evolution, explanation for the diversity of life. Why do they effect each other?
Edit: Nevermind, carambolage de charogne beat me to it.
Edit x2: And no, Evolution isn't where life came from, just how it became as diverse as it is.
But doesn't the idea of evolution somewhat imply the idea that life could come from something non living, hence the idea of evolving?
besides, the law of biogenesis is old stuff now. infact, depending on your definition of life, weve created viruses in the lab, as well as fully functioning bacteria, albeit with a lot of borrowed cellular components.
edit: the guys name, Jack Szostak, hes working on this type of stuff.
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So over the course of the forums I'm part of, getting some insight on what people generally believe would be nice (though I might have to leave out the fact that this is a Diablo forum ). So just post up your views on evolution on whether you think it's real or not (there is no "in between answer for this poll, as I want either yes or no)
So let the flame war begin
However, if we are talking about humans once being monkeys and all life once being single-celled organism, that is much different. That is why a yes or no answer cannot be used on whether or nor evolution exists. At least not the way you presented it.
"to the worm in horseradish, the world is horseradish."
I believe that you cannot deny the fact that things evolve. The evidence for it is all around us. But that we evolved from a one cell organism, I don't buy it.
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Whether our ancestors were monkeys or our descendants will be flying pigs matter little to me.
The present state of our species suits me just fine.
And yes, the theory of evolution seems credible to me.
Btw what happened to the Religion vs. Science thread.
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Rise and rise again, until lambs become lions
That's not evolution, that's humans simply having much more favorable living conditions than in prehistoric times, thus allowing bodies to grow taller. The ability to grow as tall as we are today have been there for a long time, but poor food, health, living conditions etc. haven't allowed us to actually utilize that potential. There is no way an evolutionary difference in height measured in decimeters could increase and then decrease over just a few hundred years given any evolutionary theory.
If on the contrary the mutation is advantageous, the individual will have a better chance of surviving than his fellow members of the species, and in case the mutation is carried on to its offspring, so will they. Again, in the long term, this will give the mutated, or evolved if you wish, a longer lifespan, more chance to reproduce and carry the mutation on to more members of the species, in the end outnumbering the unevolved ones.
This is easily explained with an example. Imagine a bird species with short beaks that feeds on fruit from bushes. Blueberries if you wish. As long as the food is abundant, the birds will keep on reproducing with no problem. Eventually there will be too many birds and the fruits won't be so easy to obtain. Slower birds will start to die. Now imagine one bird that randomly mutated and was born with a longer beak. It will be able to reach fruit from inside the bush that the other birds don't reach, in addition to the outer fruit every bird can eat. This will obviously give him an advantage over the other birds, it will have food ensured for the rest of his life. See second paragraph for the end of the story.
It's pure survival of the fittest. And it's not like the bird wanted to get a longer beak, it was just a mutation among millions that turned out to be great for it. Every species on earth is the consequence of mutation. And mutation is random. That's some food for thought
EDIT: 500th post! Awesome.
-Equinox
"We're like the downtown of the Diablo related internet lol"
-Winged
"to the worm in horseradish, the world is horseradish."
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Maybe it doesn't disprove it but the law of biogenesis definitely gives the theory of evolution a bit of a flat tire.
-Equinox
"We're like the downtown of the Diablo related internet lol"
-Winged
if u want origin of life, heres an interesting story:
the recent nobel prize winner in medicine was over at my uni a couple weeks back, he did research on the origins of lipid bilayers and mechanisms by which they can expand, and how simple early earth nucleic acid sequences had some sort of self-replicating machinery. now, instead of early forms of lipids, hes trying something with chiral hydrocarbons or something.
"to the worm in horseradish, the world is horseradish."
-Equinox
"We're like the downtown of the Diablo related internet lol"
-Winged
Edit: Nevermind, carambolage de charogne beat me to it.
Edit x2: And no, Evolution isn't where life came from, just how it became as diverse as it is.
edit: the guys name, Jack Szostak, hes working on this type of stuff.
"to the worm in horseradish, the world is horseradish."