magic find without being 60

  • #1
    So I've been leveling a witch doctor on mp7. I have 30% magic find at level 48 not counting what I get from monster power. Is it just me or does it seem that magic find doesn't scale properly unless you have 5 stacks of neph valor?
    Barbarians. who hurl themselves into the fray, the very teeth of danger, armed with nothing more than the biggest weapons and armored with the absolutely heaviest armor we can find. Hey, we're not stupid -- we're just crazy.
  • #2
    What the hell? You don't get Nephalem Valor before level 60. I don't get it.

  • #3
    I think I understand what he is saying.
    He says that you can have 100% MF and i will be a lot worse than 0%+5 stacks of NV.
    That normal MF is a lot worse than the NV.
  • #4
    MF is MF, it doesn't matter if it comes from your gear, your follower's gear (20%), a shrine, paragon level, or nephalem buff. All the same.

    The only difference is that NV5 gives you at least a 4-affix rare item for a killed elite pack. You don't have any equivalent thing before hitting 60 to ensure rare drops when killing mobs. The only 100% chance for rare drops are, afaik, the very first quest kill of act bosses (final and intermediate ones, so Leoric and Butcher for example).
  • #5
    It scales just fine at lower levels, but you only have 30% base compared to the 75% you'd get from NV. Also, with a relatively low MF value, the guaranteed rare from elites with 5 NV makes up a pretty significant portion of rares you find from elites, so that's probably what you're seeing.

    Also, I'm not sure that elites drop the same number of items on lower difficulties.
    My EHP and DPS Spreadsheet, mostly useful for wizards.
    My wizard, mostly useful for killing demons and collecting loot.
    Wizard CM DPS Simulator, written in Matlab, release version 1.01
    Comprehensive CMWW Guide, including gear and build suggestions, plus Uber strats
    Arcane Mines Guide, detailed guide for the highest dps wizard build, including vids
  • #6
    They drop exactly the same number of items but because of the low MF and the lack of NV stacks you usually end up with 2 white and 1 blue item.
    Sequence number Drop (#) Guaranteed? Average distribution
    1 Gear (1) Yes Mostly blue, some yellow
    2 Gear (2) Yes Mostly white, some blues (1-affix dominates)
    3 Tome /NoDrop No -
    4 Gear (3) /NoDrop No Mostly white, some blues
    5 Gem /NoDrop No -
    6 Potion / NoDrop No -
    7 Gear (4) Yes Mostly blue, some yellow (same as Gear (1))
    8 Gear (NV) See --> Requires 5xNV buffs - guaranteed yellow [/code]


    Gear slot 3 is not guaranteed and gear slot 5 requires 5NV stacks.
    You can check this with a lvl60 character. Once you get 5NV you get 4-5 items.

    I'm leveling a DH at MP10 (100% extra MF) that is now lvl25 and out of all the elites I killed so far (198) only 5 dropped a rare item.
    If we take that with 0% MF you have a 10% chance for a rare item then with 100% you have a 20% chance. That's not really alot.
  • #7

    They drop exactly the same number of items but because of the low MF and the lack of NV stacks you usually end up with 2 white and 1 blue item.


    I am actually still under the impression that (for elite packs) gear slot 4 is only added in inferno difficulty. I haven't played much lately, but elites usually drop 2-3 items sub-inferno difficulty, even when you are level 60. Entering inferno this changes to 3-4 items. Of course, if you should gain 5xNV, an extra item will drop in addition to these.
  • #8
    The first champ pack after 5NV dropped 3 rares, 1 blue, 1 white and a chipped topaz. I was on ACT II Normal on my barb that is Plvl78, 234% MF.
  • #9

    So I've been leveling a witch doctor on mp7. I have 30% magic find at level 48 not counting what I get from monster power. Is it just me or does it seem that magic find doesn't scale properly unless you have 5 stacks of neph valor?


    MF works the same. The issue is that the item slots that are going into play are different.

    For elites:

    Item slot 1 2 3 4 5 (NV)
    Major item quality at 0 MF Magic White White Magic Rare
    Major item quality at high MF Rare Magic Magic Rare Rare

    Drop chance for
    Difficulty = Inferno 100% 100% 50% 100% Requires 5xNV
    Difficulty = Sub-inferno 100% 100% 50% 0% Requires 5xNV


    Put another way: When you play on inferno, MF will seem to have the biggest impact on item slot 1 and 4 (that drop all the time) if you farm rare items. If you leave the NV drop out of the discussion this corresponds to roughly 60% of items dropped from elites (since slot 3 has 50% drop chance).
    When playing on lower difficulty MF will seem to have the biggest impact on item slot 1 alone if you farm rare items (or focus on rare items). This corresponds to roughly 40% of all items dropped from elites. This might be the reason why MF appear to be worse: If you just judge it on the appearance of rare items it naturally seem like there is an improper scaling.

    Hope this helped.
  • #10

    The first champ pack after 5NV dropped 3 rares, 1 blue, 1 white and a chipped topaz. I was on ACT II Normal on my barb that is Plvl78, 234% MF.


    Hm, then they have changed it. Either that or MP has an effect.
  • #11


    The first champ pack after 5NV dropped 3 rares, 1 blue, 1 white and a chipped topaz. I was on ACT II Normal on my barb that is Plvl78, 234% MF.


    Hm, then they have changed it. Either that or MP has an effect.


    Just tested it quickly.
    Doing normal on a lvl 60 character (plvl 25) I cleared ~15 elites with MP0. Not once did they drop above 4 items even with 5xNV on.
    When doing nornam on the same character I cleared ~12 elites with MP10. Twice did they drop 5 items, but most of the time they dropped the estimated 3 or 4.

    My hunch is telling me it's the MP.
  • #12


    The first champ pack after 5NV dropped 3 rares, 1 blue, 1 white and a chipped topaz. I was on ACT II Normal on my barb that is Plvl78, 234% MF.


    Hm, then they have changed it. Either that or MP has an effect.

    Maybe because the character was 60?
    I don't remember any champ/elites dropping more than 3 items on the low level char.
    Or one of the champs dropped the extra item and I didn't notice.
    I can't check now, I'll test tomorrow cause I think you are right about the 3+1 slots.

    Edit: You posted before me :P . I was trying at MP10.
  • #13
    The bonus drop from MP level is only from normal mobs though, not elites, so it shouldn't have an impact.
    My EHP and DPS Spreadsheet, mostly useful for wizards.
    My wizard, mostly useful for killing demons and collecting loot.
    Wizard CM DPS Simulator, written in Matlab, release version 1.01
    Comprehensive CMWW Guide, including gear and build suggestions, plus Uber strats
    Arcane Mines Guide, detailed guide for the highest dps wizard build, including vids
  • #14
    thanks for the help everyone. It definitely brought clarity to the issue.
    Barbarians. who hurl themselves into the fray, the very teeth of danger, armed with nothing more than the biggest weapons and armored with the absolutely heaviest armor we can find. Hey, we're not stupid -- we're just crazy.
  • #15

    The bonus drop from MP level is only from normal mobs though, not elites, so it shouldn't have an impact.

    I wasn't talking about the bonus drop from MP level. That only works in inferno mode.
    What I meant was that when you kill the first or second champion or any of the adds of an elite pack, they sometimes drop items.
    I tested it today and the fifth item is indeed coming from them. I didn't notice it before because I was one-shooting them.
    This time I killed one at a time.
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