Disappointed by the incoherence [SPOILERS]

  • #1
    I just couldn't stand idle anymore, i had to speak out what has been gnawing my mind since i finished the Diablo 3 campaign storyline.

    There are huge gaping holes in the storyline and the plot itself feels super hasty.
    The earlier games had mostly to do with the soulstones and now there's this new ultimate soulstone
    used to trap all the evils inside, but we don't know squat about it. Adria was last seen in Diablo 1,
    and it just feels super stupid that she has been "tagging" the souls to be used in the creation of the Black Soulstone. How is she supposed to "tag" the souls since the souls were inside the earlier soulstones or
    if they weren't they were lingering in the dark recesses of Hell or the Abyss. The only explanation for this is that Adria is somehow truly familiar with Zoltun Kulle, and that both of them or at least Adria has been corrupted by Diablo for the purpose of making the soulstone and tagging the souls inside it. Still there is a question of how the Adria was able to tag the souls if they were in the Abyss, in Hell or in the soulstones.
    Maybe she is really truly evil and powerful to be able to walk freely in Hell or Abyss.

    The game is also feeling so much different from the earlier ones.. like does Starcraft 2 in comparison to the original. Diablo 1 and 2 are grim, gritty and mysterious. Diablo 3 feels like too-much-in-your-face.
    Angels are now just angels.. nothing odd or mysterious there. The nephalems are the true gods of the universe, the game is so easy on normal, i can just walk around and spit destruction all over the place and collect the "rewards" I know it gets really much harder later on, and gets more rewarding also.
    The ultimate diablo fight is just a toned down version of Diablo 2 - diablo fight. Same moves, only slower and even more powerless, at least on normal. Also, the plot was HASTY. We were fighting Belial and Azmodan for 3 acts, then suddenly it takes 30 mins for us to fight ourselves to the main boss and beat the hell out of him in 5 mins without any problems.

    The biggest difference is still in the overall feeling of the game. Earlier Diablo's are oozing gothic dread and mystery. Diablo 3 is a hollywood style horror story that even has the horrible peptalk ending cinematic... jesus that felt SO LAME. The cinematic was really cool but the talk was just plain horrible.

    Let's make a comparison. Starcraft 1 had political and spacefaring mystery plot with
    really twisted,mysterious and power hungry characters always plotting against each other, abusing each other and so on. You didn't know what was going to happen next. And it was also moving fast forward, without actually feeling like it was working on just 1-trick but a whole bag of them.
    Starcraft 2 is not so much a space-opera as it is a SOAP-OPERA with dumbed-down characters.
    Jim Raynor and Zeratul look, sound and act totally different to the Starcraft 1 characters.
    The scale of the battle and complexity of the plot is so much dumbed down it feels totally retarded
    in comparison to the original. The problem is not in the actual plot, but the LINEARITY of it. Almost always we know what is going to happen next. Nothing really unexpected or exciting happens in the course of the whole game. The only "mysterious" moment in the new SC game was the encounter with Zeratul in the spaceship. Whereas in Starcraft 1 we are constantly surprised and introduced to new characters and motives and some of those twists still make me have goosebumps.

    The same goes, in part, for the new Diablo. In Diablo 2, the evil was winning the whole game trough and we were desperately trying to repair and mend the damage and put and end to the horror, just in the end, for a fleeting moment, actually succeeding in defeating the evil.

    In Diablo 3 we are godlike nephalems, never really having any problems with the all-too-transparent plottings of the evils. There is absolutely no moments of despair in Diablo 3. It's a hollywood-story all over again, laden with humorous characters making the game feel even more ridiculous in comparison to the earlier dread. Don't get me wrong, i love the new black-humour tone of the game, but the plot is just... well i was just left with the feeling that there was no point in the game where the evil was really having the upper hand. The feeling could have been there, but it wasn't conveyed to me, convincingly.
    In Mass Effect 3 there is a feeling of true despair when in the near-end of the game, player is made to live trough a failed mission. This is what Diablo 3 is missing. The lord of terror's plot is great, and it has depth in it, whereas Azmodan and Belials plots are working on just one trick. Belial is working on illusions to hold grasp over Caldeum, while Azmodan is hiding behind his endless, disposable army. It also feels like when Belial is disposed, then we are moving onto Azmodan, no problem. What's next? Let's kill Trag Oul and the whole Angiris Council, maybe after that we could have peace. What about the "most dangerous man in the world" - Zoltun Kulle? Disposed of, easily. Why didn't the evils have a plan B? Could they really be so stupid? Diablo actually used the other evils prime motives against themselves, that was ingenious. Only ingenious plot thing in the game IMHO.

    Diablo 1 ends up in Aidan screaming in agony, having inserted the soulstone in his head in the feeble attempt to contain the soul of Diablo in himself.

    Diablo 2 ends in Baal walking out of ASYLUM, burning it in a hellish fire, with screams filling the air.
    Diablo 2 LOD ends in destruction of a worldstone, a mysterious artifact that was the only barrier between hell and sanctuary. Baal was defeated, but the evil's plot was still fruitful, since the WS was corrupted and Tyrael had no choice but to destroy it.

    Starcraft 1 BW storyline ended up with Kerrigan's words "i stand atop the broken bodies of my enemies..." mysterious music and Kerrigan gazing over the depths of space, with an uneasy feeling of future, even as she has just defeated all of her enemies.

    Now to the current day Blizzard:

    Starcraft 2 - Raynor saves his girlfriend and walks into the sunset. WTF.

    Diablo 3 - Tyrael giving us a Hollywood-peptalk with everything well - evil banished forever, player-nephalem having unlimited godlike powers, angels and men, flowers and sunser all over again. WHAT THE FUCK.

    All i can say is the Joker line from the Dark Knight. "What happened..?" "Did your balls drop off?"
  • #2
    10/10 good read
    Witch Doctor Inferno Soloing - Pre 1.0.3
    http://www.diablofan...inferno-videos/
  • #3
    Only read the end of your post but 10/10 as well. Gonna read the rest later. Completely agree and it's been something that's been bothering me for some time now.

    Ha. Bagstone.

  • #4
    I also want to point out that if one of the motives behind the "dumbing down the plot", reducing the overall feel of dread and darkness
    and making the cinematics more hollywoodian/approachable, without voiceover acting/much of gore/horror is that the game is more approachable and friendly to younger audience then i simply don't feel that this is the way of doing it, since no one is going to reminisce a story like this when they grow older (you remember that brilliant story? no i don't... why should i? there was nothing brilliant about it except maybe for the feeling of disappointment. as it stands now, it conveys no unexpected twists in plot or feelings that would be memorable) and i don't believe that by making some of the key points "softer" is going to introduce the game for larger audience or making it more scary, dread-inducing, gothic and gory and complex-plotted is going to prevent it from being played by the large audience. Quite the opposite. Making the plot more complex would introduce the game to gamers that love playing the game simply because of the story, as the plot stands now - i don't believe a casual story-hungry player would play the game simply because of the story. And oh - stories are powerful selling points - look at Mass Effect. The gameplay is nothing special, but the story and how it is told is. And also, the younger audience loves a game that is for some reason "forbidden" I remember that Diablo 2 was a game that my mother told me not to play. What did i do - i played it still and i'm glad for it and now my mother looks at me playing Diablo 3 and has no objection to it whatsoever as i am grown up to be a productive and stable adult as would anyone else who would play their games in moderation. Actually, i believe that making the game "forbidden" in some way could make it's pull even more powerful. Remember those talks about movies that were supposed to be "so scary that you would not sleep the next night" and the excitement of getting the movie and watching it, maybe sleeping badly or having a moment of fear or two after it, getting over the fear and seeing how safe the experience was, after all..

    I didn't think Blizzard, of all companies, should fear the making their dark-fantasy horror-themed game more adult-oriented and scary.
    Their games are played because of the brilliance of gameplay, but i hope that i, as a fan of their earlier lore and stories don't have to hang my head in shame when it comes to these new games. I would like to enjoy the games trough and trough.
    Seems that my fear of their fear was not misplaced, however.

    If the Blizzard, as a company wants to make memorable game experiences, they need to forget dumbing down the plot, softening down the experience of horror and concentrate on weaving a complex plot that is true to it's roots instead of something that is trying to please everyone without actually pleasing anyone (but maybe themselves?)

    If the style of the stories continue like they have now, i can't say that i would be a fan of Blizzard's stories anymore. All of their games plots and background stories start to remind of each other, and all of it is more or less unoriginal, softened up for larger audience.
    I want a story that, even when i'm older, i can say i'm proud to be a fan of - that is more or less realistic, cunning and has unexpected twists of plot and dark tone that pulls me to experience fear and despair and overcome it gloriously. Blizzard has no reason to make any plot points hasty or making a game that covers a gigantic story arc at once, they can build it up in peace and release it as sequels and expansions, staying true to the roots of the earlier games. Now i feel just sad that from defeating Azmodan, i'm taking a 30min stroll trough hopelessly powerless hordes of Hell to fight Diablo, who is totally powerless against me. Where is the despair and dread i should feel? Why is an ingenious plan from a lord of Hell overcome in 30 mins by a mere mortal? Why is a Prime Evil's plan that took 3 games to come to a fruition, ended up so fast and without a feeling that he was actually winning in some point? If he planned this for such an eternity, maybe he had a plan B. I seriously hope so.. because in earlier games, killing Diablo and his brothers was a mere setback and ultimately only a part of their original plan.

    Now it stands like - unstoppable machine kills lord of hell A, lord of hell B, lord of hell C captured an innocent being and used A and B and some others to empower himself - goes forth to heaven to destroy, is stopped by unstoppable machine. Sunset and angels with peptalk.

    Expansions is shaping up to be - save Princess Leah from a castle where her hideous grandmother Adria is making her do all the household work. Diablo is a doormat that you walk over to gather some loot.

    Continuing the story in this fashion is a huge underestimation of the fans of the original games AND the new fans.
    The story, after all, is the thing everything in the game connects to. Don't make us shameful of the thing we felt so connected to.
    Please.
  • #5
    I have to disagree. I felt the plot was sound and enjoyable. And if you payed attention to the lore from the prequels and what not, the Nephalem were basically gods. If you read about Uldyssian, you will find out that he was stronger than even the combined hosts of the High Heavens and the Burning Hells. And that was also after years of flourishing. Though I do admit, how can we gain so much power in just twenty years? It is also never stated how long Uldyssian was flourishing so it could be close to the same time.

    On the topic of the overall stories, Diablo was the introduction to the series. Aidan thought he could contain Diablo but was wrong, that was Diablo's plan. Diablo 2 is where we try to fix his mess but also trying to prevent the Lords of Hell wrecking havoc. Though we did ultimately succeed, it was at the price of loosing the Worldstone. And that actually unlocked the Nephalem powers in those that had it. But it is also stated that Diablo 3 is the end of this storyline. Excluding the incoming expansions. In the first we were on the defensive. In the second we were kinda on an offensive defense. But in the third, we are on the offense. We aren't sitting idly, waiting for the demon lords to come to us. We are going after them to finish this. "But what about a Plan B?" If you ever paid attention to the Lords of Hell, they were all arrogant fools. They believed themselves to be the strongest and that nothing can stop them. Diablo was probably the only one that wasn't all arrogant. But he believed that if he became the Prime Evil, that nothing could stop him. Hell, he broke the fucking Diamond Gates, that have been attacked countless times by the Burning Hells, with a single scream. That was just proof that he had more power than the High Heavens. So with his master plan fully realized, what need did he have for a Plan B?

    Finally, on the topic of the ending. Yes, it seemed like evil was banished forever. But did you see the Black Soulstone destroyed? I know I didn't. I just saw it falling, and I bet that it can survive that fall. But as I've already stated, excluding expansions, Diablo 3 is the end of this storyline. How else are they suppose to end it? Make the bad guys win and have us wanting another Diablo just for them to milk it? I know that the original Diablo 2 ended with us killing Diablo but then finding out that Baal just got his Soulstone. But as I've already stated, if you paid enough attention, you can clearly see the plot hasn't been wrapped up, allowing for more story, but the characters believe that they finally won.
    I don't always burn. But when I do, I use hellfire.
  • #6
    What can I say? I completely agree. I'm not gonna elaborate because you already did a great job at it. It feels like a story a parent would tell to his child to make him go to sleep. I mean, it almost ends with the "and they lived happily ever after" line.

    I'd like to add that I hate what they did to Tyrael. They had a winged Tyreal for years in their previous site, and we never get to see him except in cinematics. They completely ruined the you-can't-see-his-face aspect of him. When he fights with you, he's incredibly weak, even though he was an archangel; apparently his sword is powerful enough to break the seals on a couple of doors, but not enough to kill a fallen in a reasonable amount of time. Also, since "Justice has been made", he's now the Archangel of Wisdom... really? Why would the Angiris Council allow him back in the first place? He was responsible for helping Adria re-birth Diablo, and he didn't help at all with the fight in Heaven. Plus, he's a mortal. And why does he represnt Wisdom now? It doesn't make any sense. I'm siding with Imperius here.
  • #7
    I wasn't actually disappointed of the plot, overall, but the execution of the plot. They key points are fine but it's lacking coherence.
    What i basically mean, being 7-evils in one and doing enormous amount of plotting, the 30 mins from Az to Big-D to beat him atop heaven seems like a bit too hasty to me. Also, i really am complaining that since Diablo is known for his corrupting power, not his martial prowess, it's weird that he just rushed in to destroy heaven instead of slowly corrupting the whole place upside down.
    Particularly the lord of terror's plot to use the evils own goals "against themselves" but furthering all of their goals trough his own was absolutely ingenious. I just find Azmodan and Belials plans really feeble and transparent.

    I'm beginning to think that this whole "destroy heaven" thing is just to make Imperius furious. That Diablo is planning to turn Imperius into Mephisto. That the close-call situation in Heaven in the end of D3 is just to mock Imperius. That could be his plan B. He also thrusted his hand trough Imperius, maybe that means something.

    I read the book of cain, i know about Uldyssian. I just thought that he was just exception. That he alone became the ultimate Nephalem and his Edyrem followers WITH him were succesful in meeting both Hell's and Heaven's forces in battle and turn the tide in their favor.
    It's a really good point though, Worldstone is destroyed, no more dampening of Nephalem powers and allowing forces of Hell to freely invade Sanctuary. 20 years since WS shattering and already one of humans turns into Nephalem, becoming more powerful than all forces of Heaven and Hell.

    My key point is that this is the only Diablo game that, for me, feels too hasty and has no sense of dread and no point in story where i would actually feel that we are losing, that the forces of hell would be one step ahead. This ultimately leads to me thinking that it was no big deal that i played trough it. When it's a long way to the top of the Heaven and trough despair and loss that i could manage to pull off a victory that i would feel it was worth it, that both sides were equal. Now i feel that i was just strolling my way trough it.

    Also, i find it odd that since Belial and Azmodan both plotted against Prime Evils, they didn't work together to invade Sanctuary and further each other's goals. Maybe it's just the way demons work.. i don't know.
  • #8
    I feel like the plot was ok, but ok only. I expected more, that's for sure. All this theorycrafting and everything before the release, only to left out with slight disappointment. I don't think the lore was horrible, it was just ok. The darkest and therefore the best moments for me, was upto the butcher. Really like the skeleton king lore and his mansion added a lot to the atmosphere. Zoltun Kulle was also amazing, one of my favorite characters in Diablo 3. After that Belial and Azmodan didn't feel as dark and evil as they should and act 4 felt like lacking quite a lot, with very medicore happy ending (yet with holes that can be filled with an expansion).

    The story is also lacking more angels. With Book of Caine introducing us too the Angiris Council and the short animated "Wrath" I thought they would play a bigger role and I really hope we'll see more of them in an expansion (especially Imperius, such an amazing character, but outside of 2 cutscenes, not such a big role :-( )
  • #9
    I'm on the same lines with you Bor. Maybe this is, and was the prequel to the true threat, Imperius turned into wrath, Mephisto..
    Maybe the pride we feel from vanquishing the Prime Evil will be our downfall, after all we will fall from much higher now that our Nephalem powers are blooming. I hope that now that Diablo is cast out of heaven, he will just use people, Nephalem and corrupt them to fight against Imperius, who will be more or less the true threat, and in the end both sides, Nephalem and Imperius will be revealed to be manipulated by Prime Evils.

    All in all, i'm disappointed by the hastiness and some incoherence, but it's nothing that could not be mended with a superbly crafted expansion. I sure hope they don't let us down a second time with the story.
  • #10
    Well I think they did a pretty good job. They took a game series 10+ years old, that had very little lore in the game and tried to tie it together with the lore from the books as well. You can only do so much in one game. There are some things I wish they would have touched on or took their time with but it's an action RPG it can only be so long, I think they mentioned it's likely the last game in the series too? I may be misremembering but if that's the case they need to tie up a bunch of loose ends.

    We still have the mystery of where Malthael, Inarius, Trag'Oul, and Lilith are. We have Adria who isn't dead, we have Imperius who we never see how he reacts after we defeat Diablo, the fact that balance has been thrown completely off after killing the seven lords of hell. There is a lot of little things left unsaid that I'm hoping they'll cover in a expansion or two.

    I agree it felt a little rushed but I don't think this is all they have up their sleeves. I also don't agree about the cinematics. I thought they were wonderful and yeah the ending was sort of "And they lived happily ever after." But we know that's not true, so it gives me a sense of peace for the time being that I know isn't going to last though. If there is something worse than a happy ever after ending it's an obvious one where the camera like zooms in on something and you already know the plot for the next movie/game/etc.

    I can't wait to see where the story goes from here, it looks really promising.
  • #11
    Yeah, i truly agree that it can go anywhere from here, and that's the beautiful thing, since now i feel that i haven't really gone anywhere i like. I don't mean to say that it all should be doom and gloom and only in the end we should feel a hint of joy - no. I'm saying that i don't feel the dread and the twist in these new Blizzard games, that i felt in Diablo 1&2 and Starcraft 1. I don't mean that the plot should be all twist either, but the way it's told could me more unlinear. There could be more characters, longer stories and more than one motive per character. So far only Diablo is the only evil with a deep character of his own. Azmodan was a warmongering sinful beast that poured endless armies from hell to conquer the sanctuary and the BSS. I could see more to a "Lord of Sin" than just warmongering over a stone.
    The strengths of evil is the power of corruption and corruption that comes with power. In earlier Diablo games the evils used mankind against themselves. It was not all about demons.

    I agree to Bor about the Skeleton King/ Leoric thing too. It's all so dreadful because he was a human before he turned to madness.
    We could see more of this sort of thing happening. It's mostly concentrated on demons in D3.
    Not everything should be shoved onto the players lap either, that's why i'm glad there are some sidequests in the game in the form of random encounters in the dungeons. Diablo 2 had one too: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Elizabeth_B%C3%A1thory
    Not random, but still very very dreadful and entertaining. I will always remember it.

    The cinematics are superb. Tyrael's sacrifice - i got something in my eye there. I have no objection to the ending cinematic either if it wasn't in such a stark contrast of the earlier events and like pointed out it's in the fashion of "and they lived happily ever after" which really doesn't fit into Diablo IMO. In the earlier games the cinematics were a really mood setters, they conveyed a real horror. The wanderer losing his humanity, ultimately turning into Diablo in a grisly scene of transformation. These old cinematics still beat every new one i have seen. They also tell the story of the world of Diablo in a very unlinear way. They aren't about characters or happenings next to the player. Maybe the old games had the feeling of mystery and dread conveyed trough means of things NOT told to the player. This new game has nothing of the sort in the story that had me not expect it. Bring in more characters and give them more motives, twist them around. Now it's more like children's sunday afternoon cartoon with the evil skeleton wanting his own army of little zombies twisting the nearby farm areas for crop.

    It could be more like: the skeleton king had a mother who locked him inside a cupboard when he was a little boy, he starved and now takes his vengeance upon the people by stealing their crops and making them starve. Imagine the scene of walking into a town of all starved people telling horrible stories of horrors walking in the fields and people turning inside out and mad in hunger. When you confront the skeleton, you realize he's a little boy in a cupboard, you are forced to put him out of his misery, then his mother awakens and takes his wrath to you before you have the chance to stop the skeletal boy. The mother comes and the boy is totally horrified - he starts to cry that it wasn't his intention, the mother storms to for your throat and the skeletal boy is revealed to be totally corrupted by demons and starts to knife your back. there's some real tragedy and horror when you kill both and rid the village of the problem. More akin to the earlier Diablo games.
  • #12
    The story of Lazarus being influenced by Mephisto to travel to Westmarch and help Diablo try to find a suitable host which ended up driving Leoric insane to the point where he had his own wife killed and tortured the townsfolk, and was finally killed by one of his most loyal guards. Lazarus then lured townsfolk into the cathedral when Albrecht went missing and let the Butcher have them. Diablo finally took hold of a young boy and possessed him. Then Leorics oldest son has to travel into the depths of the cathedral and kill his own father and brother.

    That's pretty grim, and most of that story was fleshed out in Diablo 3.

    What about the tormented beings in Arreat Crater in Act 3? That seemed pretty grim.

    What about Zoltun Kulle, a mage who betrayed the horadrim and was immortal so in order to kill him they had to cut him into pieces and even hide part of him in another realm to keep him from resurrecting?

    What about Ghom having the people in Bastion's Keep dragged away and killed and feeding them to their own soldiers? Then when they start to notice he kills the ones who noticed and is going to fatten them all up to feast on?

    Or Fuad the guy who was trapped in the cellar in Act 2 and his group slowly ate one another until only he remained and then he kept waiting for more people to eat because he had developed a taste for human flesh now?



    I guess my point is besides the art direction which I know some have issues with, the game is just as grim if not more grim than ever, you just have to look in the lore for it
  • #13
    First of all, learn to format your posts better. Talk about incoherence.

    Secondly, the bulk of the plot behind Diablo I and II are in the manuals, very little of it in the games. Aside from pursuing the Dark Wanderer, there is little in the way of story arcs; except for a few cases, the majority of the Quests were self-contained and had little to do with the overarching plot. From what I can gather in DIII, however, many of the Quests are interconnected.


    As for the Black Soulstone and the containment of the Greater Evils, I agree that it was poorly executed. My pet theory is that the Black Soulstone was crated by Zoltun Kulle to be attuned to the Black Abyss, where angels and demons go to die. The original Soulstones were derived from the Worldstone, which stood at the crossroads of all plains and realities, which includes the Abyss. The Black Soulstone was simply attuned to this reality in particular.

    Adria was a disciple of Diablo, and learned much from Deckard Cain about Zoltun Kulle and the Black Soulstone. She probably performed some dark rituals to bind the souls of the Prime Evils to the small corner of the Black Abyss represented by the Black Soulstone.


    What gets me is that there was emphasis on the fact that the Black Soulstone could contain both demons and ANGELS... yet do we know of any angels imprisoned in it??
    Be it through hallowed grounds or lands of sorrow
    All in the Forger's wake is left bereft and fallow
    Is the residuum worth the cost of destruction and maiming;
    Or is the shaping a culling and exercise in taming?
    The road's goal is the dark Origin of Being
    But be wary through what thickets it winds.
    -Excerpt from the Litany of Residuum;
    As Translated by He Who Brings Order
  • #14
    Quote from Jinshin

    What gets me is that there was emphasis on the fact that the Black Soulstone could contain both demons and ANGELS... yet do we know of any angels imprisoned in it??


    Not only do we not, we're not even sure what became of Imperius after the celestial dust settled up there in Heaven. He and his retinue just sort of passed out or something as Diablo began to corrupt the Crystal Arch, and then everybody was too busy fighting or making speeches to bother about what became of him.

    What happened? Why would have they built him up so just to drop him like that? Did I miss something?
    Wizard's Orb, the prime Diablo III fansite!
  • #15
    Quote from Jinshin

    As for the Black Soulstone and the containment of the Greater Evils, I agree that it was poorly executed. My pet theory is that the Black Soulstone was crated by Zoltun Kulle to be attuned to the Black Abyss, where angels and demons go to die. The original Soulstones were derived from the Worldstone, which stood at the crossroads of all plains and realities, which includes the Abyss. The Black Soulstone was simply attuned to this reality in particular.

    Adria was a disciple of Diablo, and learned much from Deckard Cain about Zoltun Kulle and the Black Soulstone. She probably performed some dark rituals to bind the souls of the Prime Evils to the small corner of the Black Abyss represented by the Black Soulstone.


    Hmm I thought the Black Abyss was only where Demons go? Wheras Angels go to the crystal spire upon death (assuming they haven't been too corrupted).

    Furthermore the black soulstone doesn't actually capture the lords of hell until Koule activates it. Adria was not directly sending the lords into the black soulstone, only marking their souls so they would be set up for when the stone activated (maybe just drawing their proximity to the black soulstone chamber? which is kind of far from the abyss as the chamber seems to be within sanctuary.)
  • #16
    The plot point of Adria marking the souls of the 7 great evils to the black soulstone was a bit ham-fisted. The plot points aren't really that bad, but it seems crucial ones are extremely poorly developed. WHat I find most disappointing about this is that with all the dialogue options you have with NPCs (which I loved, btw), they could have easily allowed for some explanations to some of the more rather muddy plot lines.
  • #17
    Quote from Jinshin

    Adria was a disciple of Diablo, and learned much from Deckard Cain about Zoltun Kulle and the Black Soulstone. She probably performed some dark rituals to bind the souls of the Prime Evils to the small corner of the Black Abyss represented by the Black Soulstone.


    The whole section of the OP about 'How did Adria mark these souls?' I think is explained by the fact that she's been working for Diablo at least since the Wanderer (Diablo) fathered Leah in her. So, yeah, she probably does have some unusual powers, since evidently the whole Black Soulstone thing is Diablo's scheme. If you watch the lore in the game carefully, who even brings up the Black Soulstone and Zultan Kulle? Adria does, and whose creature is she? Diablo's.

    If you don't watch carefully, you will miss some of it, I'm sure.
  • #18
    Hey, are we ever given an explanation as to why we have to fight and kill Izual? Again?
    Be it through hallowed grounds or lands of sorrow
    All in the Forger's wake is left bereft and fallow
    Is the residuum worth the cost of destruction and maiming;
    Or is the shaping a culling and exercise in taming?
    The road's goal is the dark Origin of Being
    But be wary through what thickets it winds.
    -Excerpt from the Litany of Residuum;
    As Translated by He Who Brings Order
  • #19
    Quote from Drkclone

    I have to disagree. I felt the plot was sound and enjoyable. And if you payed attention to the lore from the prequels and what not, the Nephalem were basically gods. If you read about Uldyssian, you will find out that he was stronger than even the combined hosts of the High Heavens and the Burning Hells. And that was also after years of flourishing. Though I do admit, how can we gain so much power in just twenty years? It is also never stated how long Uldyssian was flourishing so it could be close to the same time.

    On the topic of the overall stories, Diablo was the introduction to the series. Aidan thought he could contain Diablo but was wrong, that was Diablo's plan. Diablo 2 is where we try to fix his mess but also trying to prevent the Lords of Hell wrecking havoc. Though we did ultimately succeed, it was at the price of loosing the Worldstone. And that actually unlocked the Nephalem powers in those that had it. But it is also stated that Diablo 3 is the end of this storyline. Excluding the incoming expansions. In the first we were on the defensive. In the second we were kinda on an offensive defense. But in the third, we are on the offense. We aren't sitting idly, waiting for the demon lords to come to us. We are going after them to finish this. "But what about a Plan B?" If you ever paid attention to the Lords of Hell, they were all arrogant fools. They believed themselves to be the strongest and that nothing can stop them. Diablo was probably the only one that wasn't all arrogant. But he believed that if he became the Prime Evil, that nothing could stop him. Hell, he broke the fucking Diamond Gates, that have been attacked countless times by the Burning Hells, with a single scream. That was just proof that he had more power than the High Heavens. So with his master plan fully realized, what need did he have for a Plan B?

    Finally, on the topic of the ending. Yes, it seemed like evil was banished forever. But did you see the Black Soulstone destroyed? I know I didn't. I just saw it falling, and I bet that it can survive that fall. But as I've already stated, excluding expansions, Diablo 3 is the end of this storyline. How else are they suppose to end it? Make the bad guys win and have us wanting another Diablo just for them to milk it? I know that the original Diablo 2 ended with us killing Diablo but then finding out that Baal just got his Soulstone. But as I've already stated, if you paid enough attention, you can clearly see the plot hasn't been wrapped up, allowing for more story, but the characters believe that they finally won.


    This provides such a complete summation of my thoughts that I have little else to add.

    The developers stated YEARS ago that they viewed Diablo 3 as the 3rd part of a trilogy, and that the current storyline that began with the events of Diablo 1 would end with this game (although they were careful to point out that it didn't mean there would never be another Diablo game, just that the current storyline would be coming to a close). Considering that information, how do you want it to end? Yes, Diablo 2 ended with Baal walking away with his soulstone, and LoD ended with the uncertainty over the destruction of the worldstone. But if this is supposed to be a true ending to a trilogy of stories, do you really want it to end with a cliffhanger or with evil appearing to have won? What a horrible ending that would have been - 15 years and all those demons fought, and we don't finally end in victory? No thanks.
  • #20
    I guess a lot of the anger and disappointment with the plot is the way certain aspects of the storyline were handled...Cain's death, for example. After all the old fellow's done and been through, he deserved a better ending than he got even if he did realize his time was nearly up.

    Then we have the character responsible for his death. I don't object to Maghda's presence in the storyline, just the way she was designed. As many have said, she looked like a rejected Disney character. Awful, awful, awful...and the wrong kind of awful to boot.

    And Tyrael is another story. I think the monumental decision to renounce his heavenly authority to help the nephalem is awesome, but his behavior at the end of the story still has me confused. He declares himself Wisdom, ascends in his chosen mortal shell. and states that Justice has been served. What if Malthael returns and wants his job back?

    Just a few of the questions running through my head this rainy morning.

    :)
    Wizard's Orb, the prime Diablo III fansite!
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