Duels and Hostility in *Private Only*

Poll: Should dueling and/or hostility be enabled in *Private* games?

Dueling and Hostility in Private Games

Should dueling and/or hostility be enabled in *Private* games? - Multiple Choice

  • Neither 30.6% of Users - 34 votes
  • Just dueling enabled 36.9% of Users - 41 votes
  • Just hostility enabled 2.7% of Users - 3 votes
  • Both dueling and hostility enabled 33.3% of Users - 37 votes
  • #61
    I wouldn't mind the option, that fine with me since its bilateral PVP.

    But I don't think it will happen. Maybe duels at one point at best.
  • #62
    Quote from Kodachii

    How can you say that (time and time again) with the way the votes are stacked up here alone. It's almost two to one. I understand resources, but also understand that a good many people see this as worth the (limited amount of) resources it'd take to implement in a patch or expansion down the road. I mean to be honest a lot of people who care about pvp have all but given up discussing it here because everytime they come post a handfull of people who want little to nothing to do with pvp in general come and smack them upside the head with pvm, which is cool and all, but this is the pvp forum after all as well. I didn't come into the pvp forum to talk about how we should save more resources for pvm :( The argument started out as "one player should not be able to ruin another player's gaming experience" to "blizzard doesn't have time to cater to both parties, my party wins, stop posting beating dead horse".


    The majority are for hostility? Even in private games, the majority of votes in this poll alone show that they are not for hostility. I'd be also interested to see how many people would even care at all about dueling in private games if Arena offered a 1v1 duel option. Its not like Blizzard blindly decided to implement Arenas as the form of PvP for Diablo 3 either. Its a system that works very well in WoW, and has the potential to introduce a lot more players that would otherwise ignore PvP into it.

    Why do people keep coming into the PvP forums and shooting down suggestions? Its because the majority of the threads are started as complaints revolving around Diablo 3 not being Diablo 2 with better graphics. I'm sorry, but I cannot agree to that kinda thing. I would rather see a duel option in Arena as Arena is how Blizzard plans on developing integrated PvP for Diablo 3. Open world games are PvM games and I've heard no good argument to the contrary. You may have to join a new game to PvP, but the majority of players did that anyways in Diablo 2 even...so where's the issue?
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  • #63
    I don't really care what other people have complained about. I've made polls about ideas for change whether be an idea of my own making or someone else's. I'm also fine with more features being added to arena to the same effect as you well know. With that said, this could also work and it wouldn't ruin anyone's gameplay experience just the same. All those votes for either hostility and duels could have been simply hostility, seeing as how hostility is just another way to duel to the death, but it also shows people are still enthusiastic about pvp and will take whatever they can get.

    The way I see it, they are basically two ways of going about the same thing. PvP doesn't always have to be instanced to be done right, as private games are instances in themselves and particular to games like diablo and not typical modern mmorpg's. I just don't think it's right for you to flip flop on your own idea because you started to believe it might trick more players into asking for a griefing system in the oh so precious public quest system (which after everything I have read on these forums, I probably will rarely ever venture into.)
    The strong must rule if we are to survive.
  • #64
    Quote from Kodachii

    I don't really care what other people have complained about. I've made polls about ideas for change whether be an idea of my own making or someone else's. I'm also fine with more features being added to arena to the same effect as you well know. With that said, this could also work and it wouldn't ruin anyone's gameplay experience just the same. All those votes for either hostility and duels could have been simply hostility, seeing as how hostility is just another way to duel to the death, but it also shows people are still enthusiastic about pvp and will take whatever they can get.

    The way I see it, they are basically two ways of going about the same thing. PvP doesn't always have to be instanced to be done right, as private games are instances in themselves and particular to games like diablo and not typical modern mmorpg's. I just don't think it's right for you to flip flop on your own idea because you started to believe it might trick more players into asking for a griefing system in the oh so precious public quest system (which after everything I have read on these forums, I probably will rarely ever venture into.)


    Why develop a system for a game mode that is not meant to be PvP when they could just implement it for Arena instead? I see very little benefit to implementing dueling for private PvM games. Especially when Blizzard is putting the effort towards a full PvP system integrated into the game. Seems adding a private duel system would be counter productive if they want to drive people to Arenas.

    I changed my mind because the more I thought about the whole thing, the more I thought it was a rather pointless addition. I'd rather see the resources put towards making Arena better then towards a feature that muddies the focus of PvM.
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  • #65
    but it also shows people are still enthusiastic about pvp and will take whatever they can get.

    And they'll be getting arena, a dedicated PvP experience. You'd think people would actually be happy with that instead of calling for more more more. I mean multiple arenas, a matchmaking system, and probably a few modes of pvp playstyles. Yup, definitely not enough to satisfy a PvPer, but apparently enough for a un "Real PvPer" such as myself. Seriously is there something wrong with waiting for more info versus being dissatisfied with something there's no perfectly concrete information on just a design scheme. I mean if Arena comes out and it has issues then I can see reason to vent, but until then aren't all these 'alternatives' or 'necessary features' kind of preemptive.

    The way I see it, they are basically two ways of going about the same thing.

    I'm just quoting this as I see it also applies to why not to give the private game pvp. It's essentially doing the same thing a player will likely get in arena. The most it does is start to break up the PvP community ( I know silly me I know nothing about people and how they'll gravitate to like minded groups and consider all other outsiders). After all why play in the arena when you can just duel/hostility and make up your own rules, matches, etc. in a private game? It kind of makes having arena pointless then doesn't it? Instead of a gateway to promote experiencing the full on PvP mode it just becomes an alternative PvP mode. Is an alternative really something that has to even be brought up at this time when nobody but the developers have any insight into the final product?

    oh so precious public quest system (which after everything I have read on these forums, I probably will rarely ever venture into.)
    Um self-awareness. You're saying we're ruining pvp based on the idea we think that you are ruining pvm. When oddly enough we're trying to promote the idea that what Blizz has proposed isn't bad for either side and that most of this tacked on baggage of ideas of what PVP is/was from D2 doesn't actually work with that and that maybe just maybe that D3 as it's been stated is better in the end for it. Then we have the audacity to ask questions and provide counterpoints to things people have stated as part of an ongoing discussion. Oh and oddly enough a few of the people that have voiced against the various PvP ideas have been PvPers so despite some prominent/memorable PvMers sticking more out in your mind this isn't a PvM vs. PvP debate it's a discussion on ideas of PvP and how it could/might affect the game and its community (which has no reason to be defined as either PvP or PvM. It's a community it can do both) or at least I thought so.
  • #66
    This might be a good time to point out that all we've been promised thus far is a bare bones arena system with no additional utility beyond its 3v3 function.
    The strong must rule if we are to survive.
  • #67
    Quote from Kodachii

    This might be a good time to point out that all we've been promised thus far is a bare bones arena system with no additional utility beyond its 3v3 function.

    Poor poor chip, getting jumped by all of the PvM'ers.

    My argument still stands, there should be a waypoint to the arena in game. We should not have to leave the game to duel, it is a cumbersome design and I fully expect them to correct it. We should also have the option to customize the arena into different rule sets. 1v7 - 4v4 should all be applicable and in game for us to decide on.
  • #68
    Quote from Adon

    Poor poor chip, getting jumped by all of the PvM'ers.

    My argument still stands, there should be a waypoint to the arena in game. We should not have to leave the game to duel, it is a cumbersome design and I fully expect them to correct it. We should also have the option to customize the arena into different rule sets. 1v7 - 4v4 should all be applicable and in game for us to decide on.


    It's not a cumbersome design actually. Given the design of the game overall, moving PvP to its own game-mode actually is the only viable way to have a public PvP system. Implementing a private only PvP system into PvM only confuses people, can be used for griefing, and diverts resources. The design of Diablo 3 is that you are either PvPing or you are PvMing. You aren't meant to be doing both at the same time, period. Considering this design, it would be better for those that want more out of PvP to be asking for additional Arena features and not trying to change PvM so they can PvP in it.
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  • #69
    Quote from ecutruin

    Quote from Adon

    Poor poor chip, getting jumped by all of the PvM'ers.

    My argument still stands, there should be a waypoint to the arena in game. We should not have to leave the game to duel, it is a cumbersome design and I fully expect them to correct it. We should also have the option to customize the arena into different rule sets. 1v7 - 4v4 should all be applicable and in game for us to decide on.


    It's not a cumbersome design actually. Given the design of the game overall, moving PvP to its own game-mode actually is the only viable way to have a public PvP system. Implementing a private only PvP system into PvM only confuses people, can be used for griefing, and diverts resources. The design of Diablo 3 is that you are either PvPing or you are PvMing. You aren't meant to be doing both at the same time, period. Considering this design, it would be better for those that want more out of PvP to be asking for additional Arena features and not trying to change PvM so they can PvP in it.

    It is cumbersome. The way you are seeing it and saying it is that you either want to do 1 or the other. You are drawing a picture that NO ONE would EVER want to PvP while they are PvMing, and that NO ONE would EVER become upset because they suddenly decided "Oh hey, lets duel real quick" and then find out they have to make a new game to do just that.

    You also seem to forget how the community of Diablo operates. It is a competitive game, whether you want to think so or not or whatever Blizzard wants to think. People are competing to become the best player, they compete with killing monsters, they compete with gear, compete with riches, and compete in PvP. They will argue, and they will fight...A LOT, and they will want to duel to settle it, just like they have for the past 12+ years. Making them have to jump through hoops to do so will only piss the community off, face it. It is a shotty design and it will be corrected, just wait.
  • #70
    Quote from Adon

    It is cumbersome. The way you are seeing it and saying it is that you either want to do 1 or the other. You are drawing a picture that NO ONE would EVER want to PvP while they are PvMing, and that NO ONE would EVER become upset because they suddenly decided "Oh hey, lets duel real quick" and then find out they have to make a new game to do just that.

    You also seem to forget how the community of Diablo operates. It is a competitive game, whether you want to think so or not or whatever Blizzard wants to think. People are competing to become the best player, they compete with killing monsters, they compete with gear, compete with riches, and compete in PvP. They will argue, and they will fight...A LOT, and they will want to duel to settle it, just like they have for the past 12+ years. Making them have to jump through hoops to do so will only piss the community off, face it. It is a shotty design and it will be corrected, just wait.


    You forget that your style of playing isn't the average gamer anymore. Sure heavy competition may have been the case back when Diablo 2 was popular...now days though, the general gamer tends to play games on a cell phone more often then their PC. I played through every class in D3 already around 5-10 times, almost completely via public games. Guess what...no arguing really, no competing over gear, no competing over gold, nothing like that. People just wanted to play and have fun. If I got a really kewl piece of gear and linked it...people never tried to fight me for it. So no... I don't think people will want to constantly fight other players the way you describe, at least not the majority of players. Heck, a good example is WoW (as WoW is a large RPG with dueling)...I've never once in my seven or so years of playing it had a duel request to settle a dispute. Any duel request I've ever had has either been griefing, or messing around outside of town with a couple friends. I don't see duels serving the purpose you suggest they will at all.

    Face it, Adon...you're a minority in the gamer community now. That isn't a bad thing, but gaming has changed and evolved. Blizzard is just keeping up with that evolution by catering more to what the new community wants. Those people like yourself that want the hardcore elitist PvP are a minority of a minority. This is especially true in a game like Diablo where the primary focus is the storyline/campaign. In games like this, PvP is an extra for those that want it. I'd say that Blizzard is actually doing great with its design as their Arena system actually has hardcore PvM players mildly interested in PvP and that says something.

    Since you won't likely read my two paragraphs above, I'll make it simple.... YOU....ARE....WRONG.
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  • #71
    Quote from ecutruin

    Quote from Adon

    It is cumbersome. The way you are seeing it and saying it is that you either want to do 1 or the other. You are drawing a picture that NO ONE would EVER want to PvP while they are PvMing, and that NO ONE would EVER become upset because they suddenly decided "Oh hey, lets duel real quick" and then find out they have to make a new game to do just that.

    You also seem to forget how the community of Diablo operates. It is a competitive game, whether you want to think so or not or whatever Blizzard wants to think. People are competing to become the best player, they compete with killing monsters, they compete with gear, compete with riches, and compete in PvP. They will argue, and they will fight...A LOT, and they will want to duel to settle it, just like they have for the past 12+ years. Making them have to jump through hoops to do so will only piss the community off, face it. It is a shotty design and it will be corrected, just wait.


    You forget that your style of playing isn't the average gamer anymore. Sure heavy competition may have been the case back when Diablo 2 was popular...now days though, the general gamer tends to play games on a cell phone more often then their PC. I played through every class in D3 already around 5-10 times, almost completely via public games. Guess what...no arguing really, no competing over gear, no competing over gold, nothing like that. People just wanted to play and have fun. If I got a really kewl piece of gear and linked it...people never tried to fight me for it. So no... I don't think people will want to constantly fight other players the way you describe, at least not the majority of players. Heck, a good example is WoW (as WoW is a large RPG with dueling)...I've never once in my seven or so years of playing it had a duel request to settle a dispute. Any duel request I've ever had has either been griefing, or messing around outside of town with a couple friends. I don't see duels serving the purpose you suggest they will at all.

    Face it, Adon...you're a minority in the gamer community now. That isn't a bad thing, but gaming has changed and evolved. Blizzard is just keeping up with that evolution by catering more to what the new community wants. Those people like yourself that want the hardcore elitist PvP are a minority of a minority. This is especially true in a game like Diablo where the primary focus is the storyline/campaign. In games like this, PvP is an extra for those that want it. I'd say that Blizzard is actually doing great with its design as their Arena system actually has hardcore PvM players mildly interested in PvP and that says something.

    Since you won't likely read my two paragraphs above, I'll make it simple.... YOU....ARE....WRONG.

    Yea great, it has hardcore PvM'ers interested...they will surely support such a feature and enhance the longevity of it(NOT).
    It's ok, with the race for drops taken out of the game it will solve a lot of the fighting. There will still be arguing though, that I am confident of. I didn't play 12+ years with millions of players in this community to not get a feel for how they act. You might not see it now, but later on it will come, it always does.

    Arguing over who is wrong or right is pointless, you seem to be basing everything off of the here and now, which you are correct. Everything will be peachy here and now. I am talking about the longevity of the game, the prime years if you will. In which case my experience will prove me correct.
  • #72
    Quote from Adon

    Yea great, it has hardcore PvM'ers interested...they will surely support such a feature and enhance the longevity of it(NOT).
    It's ok, with the race for drops taken out of the game it will solve a lot of the fighting. There will still be arguing though, that I am confident of. I didn't play 12+ years with millions of players in this community to not get a feel for how they act. You might not see it now, but later on it will come, it always does.

    Arguing over who is wrong or right is pointless, you seem to be basing everything off of the here and now, which you are correct. Everything will be peachy here and now. I am talking about the longevity of the game, the prime years if you will. In which case my experience will prove me correct.


    Actually, you do realize that your experience with the game actually proves me correct. You've talked about harassing players with hostility, beating people in completely unfair 1v7's, etc. Your experiences there are the exact reasons why an integrated and separated PvP system is better for the game. Thanks. ^-^
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  • #73
    Quote from ecutruin

    Quote from Adon

    Yea great, it has hardcore PvM'ers interested...they will surely support such a feature and enhance the longevity of it(NOT).
    It's ok, with the race for drops taken out of the game it will solve a lot of the fighting. There will still be arguing though, that I am confident of. I didn't play 12+ years with millions of players in this community to not get a feel for how they act. You might not see it now, but later on it will come, it always does.

    Arguing over who is wrong or right is pointless, you seem to be basing everything off of the here and now, which you are correct. Everything will be peachy here and now. I am talking about the longevity of the game, the prime years if you will. In which case my experience will prove me correct.


    Actually, you do realize that your experience with the game actually proves me correct. You've talked about harassing players with hostility, beating people in completely unfair 1v7's, etc. Your experiences there are the exact reasons why an integrated and separated PvP system is better for the game. Thanks. ^-^

    Yea I guess you wouldn't want a big bad level 29 joining your game and taking 7 level 80's out. That would be unfair. Much better idea to hold the hands of those level 80's and tell them it will be alright because the big bad level 29 is stuck in the arena, he can't hurt you anymore.
  • #74
    Quote from Adon

    Quote from ecutruin

    Quote from Adon

    Yea great, it has hardcore PvM'ers interested...they will surely support such a feature and enhance the longevity of it(NOT).
    It's ok, with the race for drops taken out of the game it will solve a lot of the fighting. There will still be arguing though, that I am confident of. I didn't play 12+ years with millions of players in this community to not get a feel for how they act. You might not see it now, but later on it will come, it always does.

    Arguing over who is wrong or right is pointless, you seem to be basing everything off of the here and now, which you are correct. Everything will be peachy here and now. I am talking about the longevity of the game, the prime years if you will. In which case my experience will prove me correct.


    Actually, you do realize that your experience with the game actually proves me correct. You've talked about harassing players with hostility, beating people in completely unfair 1v7's, etc. Your experiences there are the exact reasons why an integrated and separated PvP system is better for the game. Thanks. ^-^

    Yea I guess you wouldn't want a big bad level 29 joining your game and taking 7 level 80's out. That would be unfair. Much better idea to hold the hands of those level 80's and tell them it will be alright because the big bad level 29 is stuck in the arena, he can't hurt you anymore.


    Lol... I sense an Outlier / Extremist reply in this one.

    The incredibly slim probability of a level 29 coming in and taking out level 80s is freaking low. You were losing the argument so you pulled this one COMPLETELy out of your asshole. Even if it does happen ... thats not what you want hositility for.. .and thats not what 99.999% of griefers used it for.
  • #75
    Quote from Adon


    Yea great, it has hardcore PvM'ers interested...they will surely support such a feature and enhance the longevity of it(NOT).
    It's ok, with the race for drops taken out of the game it will solve a lot of the fighting. There will still be arguing though, that I am confident of. I didn't play 12+ years with millions of players in this community to not get a feel for how they act. You might not see it now, but later on it will come, it always does.

    Arguing over who is wrong or right is pointless, you seem to be basing everything off of the here and now, which you are correct. Everything will be peachy here and now. I am talking about the longevity of the game, the prime years if you will. In which case my experience will prove me correct.


    I could could care less about PvP, but Adon is right. PvP is the prime focus on longevity for a Diablo game. The benefits I see from D3 is I might actually play an public game and I'll probably get into arena when I'm maxed and bored.

    Seriously though watching you two talk is hilarious.
    Playing Diablo since 97. I know nothing and having nothing good to say, I be a troll.
  • #76
    Quote from Sabvre

    Quote from Adon

    Quote from ecutruin

    Quote from Adon

    Yea great, it has hardcore PvM'ers interested...they will surely support such a feature and enhance the longevity of it(NOT).
    It's ok, with the race for drops taken out of the game it will solve a lot of the fighting. There will still be arguing though, that I am confident of. I didn't play 12+ years with millions of players in this community to not get a feel for how they act. You might not see it now, but later on it will come, it always does.

    Arguing over who is wrong or right is pointless, you seem to be basing everything off of the here and now, which you are correct. Everything will be peachy here and now. I am talking about the longevity of the game, the prime years if you will. In which case my experience will prove me correct.


    Actually, you do realize that your experience with the game actually proves me correct. You've talked about harassing players with hostility, beating people in completely unfair 1v7's, etc. Your experiences there are the exact reasons why an integrated and separated PvP system is better for the game. Thanks. ^-^

    Yea I guess you wouldn't want a big bad level 29 joining your game and taking 7 level 80's out. That would be unfair. Much better idea to hold the hands of those level 80's and tell them it will be alright because the big bad level 29 is stuck in the arena, he can't hurt you anymore.


    Lol... I sense an Outlier / Extremist reply in this one.

    The incredibly slim probability of a level 29 coming in and taking out level 80s is freaking low. You were losing the argument so you pulled this one COMPLETELy out of your asshole. Even if it does happen ... thats not what you want hositility for.. .and thats not what 99.999% of griefers used it for.

    Oh it is not as low as you would think. Not even close, good times. Yea maybe 99.999% didn't use it for that, but those 99.999% weren't anything to worry about, trust me. Only thing I loved more then hunting loud mouths down, was taking them out when they tried to hunt me down. Again though, im clearly the minority and my opinion or experience doesn't mean jack.
  • #77
    Quote from Slayerviper

    I could could care less about PvP, but Adon is right. PvP is the prime focus on longevity for a Diablo game. The benefits I see from D3 is I might actually play an public game and I'll probably get into arena when I'm maxed and bored.

    Seriously though watching you two talk is hilarious.


    Adon may be right about Diablo 2. However, that doesn't really apply to Diablo 3. I expect that we'll see quite a bit of both PvM and PvP content to extend the life of the game. I mean, Blizzard already made posts stating they expect to be able to do monthly / bi~monthly PvM content updates due to the added funds generated by the RMAH.

    As for the hilarity, I can only agree. ^-^
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  • #78
    Quote from ecutruin

    Quote from Slayerviper

    I could could care less about PvP, but Adon is right. PvP is the prime focus on longevity for a Diablo game. The benefits I see from D3 is I might actually play an public game and I'll probably get into arena when I'm maxed and bored.

    Seriously though watching you two talk is hilarious.


    Adon may be right about Diablo 2. However, that doesn't really apply to Diablo 3. I expect that we'll see quite a bit of both PvM and PvP content to extend the life of the game. I mean, Blizzard already made posts stating they expect to be able to do monthly / bi~monthly PvM content updates due to the added funds generated by the RMAH.

    As for the hilarity, I can only agree. ^-^

    I hope they add real content unlike how they neglected and shunned Diablo 2. Their track record doesn't bode well for them in this case, but ill be optimistic just this once.
  • #79
    Quote from ecutruin

    Quote from Slayerviper

    I could could care less about PvP, but Adon is right. PvP is the prime focus on longevity for a Diablo game. The benefits I see from D3 is I might actually play an public game and I'll probably get into arena when I'm maxed and bored.

    Seriously though watching you two talk is hilarious.


    Adon may be right about Diablo 2. However, that doesn't really apply to Diablo 3. I expect that we'll see quite a bit of both PvM and PvP content to extend the life of the game. I mean, Blizzard already made posts stating they expect to be able to do monthly / bi~monthly PvM content updates due to the added funds generated by the RMAH.

    As for the hilarity, I can only agree. ^-^


    When did they say they were going to add content? From all the blue posts i've seen ... our only content updates are xpacs. The updates wil be items being added.....
  • #80
    Quote from ecutruin


    Adon may be right about Diablo 2. However, that doesn't really apply to Diablo 3. I expect that we'll see quite a bit of both PvM and PvP content to extend the life of the game. I mean, Blizzard already made posts stating they expect to be able to do monthly / bi~monthly PvM content updates due to the added funds generated by the RMAH.

    As for the hilarity, I can only agree. ^-^


    I'm curious on what "useful" content updates will be unless it's a significant upgrade or large scale balance change I don't see how monthly content upgrades can keep me into a game... just reminds me of people sucking on the WoW tit. In most cases once content is masted the default option is to PvP. I get that the RMAH will help with additional patches but to what extent?
    Playing Diablo since 97. I know nothing and having nothing good to say, I be a troll.
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