So, I jumped back for Season 1 and had a lot of fun leveling fresh new characters. But the same thing is still keeping me away from sinking hours into the game.
The lack of variety in viable builds (and the lack of complaint about it as well) and the game progress relying way to much on luck.
Am I missing something or the top GRifters are all using the same 1-2 builds with few variations of them?
And the fact that those builds are 80% (I just made that number.. I know, but ..whatever..) based on luck to get the gear to use those builds.
Where is the fun in hoping for luck to get to use the 1-2 only viable builds out of of so many possibilities that are just plain useless?
I don't get why Blizz don't just simply buff all of those unused skills?
I'm sure I'm missing something here, so could someone explain to me why the game is still suffering from the lack of builds variety?
And why everyone is alright with the game being almost purely based on luck as far as gear is concerned (Diablo must involve luck indeed, but based only on it.. that sounds bad for a 2014 game) ?
The builds you do see, are the best, because of the power of the skills and synergy with items. Buffing/adding skills and items that have synergy will not help, but only change the build. Just imagine any skill that is not used at the moment, add a huge damage buff to it, and it will be so strong the others will not be used. Finding that perfect sweetspot would make every skill the same (because you need the same amount of damage, aoe, buff potential, ...). Don't get me wrong, I would love for different builds, but either you take any working build and don't care about ranking, or you care about ranking and go for the best build, and there will always be 1 best build. I don't think anyone would say "I know, this build can only put me on position 10 on the leaderboard, but I'll use it to rank".
Same goes with the luck. If you take away every aspect of luck, you will have the same monsters on the same map 100% of the time. I agree the RNG is a bit much now, but either it becomes boring doing the same run over and over (fields of misery vanilla...) or there is some part RNG needed.
As for gear, it is not "only luck". I got several 600+ paragon players on my list, and they are all running with best in slot items, including furnace, tasker, starmetal, ... (at least on their main char). That you don't have all bis items within 100 paragon is normal and good. Also, 600 is kinda the sweetspot to max out your damage with paragon, if you are lower you miss so much that it will be hard to rank on the leaderboards anyway. So while the moment when your item drops is pretty RNG based, I'm pretty sure it balances out at p600 (and probably sooner).
So, I jumped back for Season 1 and had a lot of fun leveling fresh new characters. But the same thing is still keeping me away from sinking hours into the game.The lack of variety in viable builds (and the lack of complaint about it as well) and the game progress relying way to much on luck.
Am I missing something or the top GRifters are all using the same 1-2 builds with few variations of them?
And the fact that those builds are 80% (I just made that number.. I know, but ..whatever..) based on luck to get the gear to use those builds.
Where is the fun in hoping for luck to get to use the 1-2 only viable builds out of of so many possibilities that are just plain useless?
I don't get why Blizz don't just simply buff all of those unused skills?
I'm sure I'm missing something here, so could someone explain to me why the game is still suffering from the lack of builds variety?
And why everyone is alright with the game being almost purely based on luck as far as gear is concerned (Diablo must involve luck indeed, but based only on it.. that sounds bad for a 2014 game) ?
Thanks guys.
Why? Because they dont have to. This game brings them no money. Be grateful for one big patch every 8 months. They could abandon it as it is, they dont care that they promised pvp and their reputation is ruined already, so whatever.
This is exactly it. It is literally impossible to make more than a couple builds be "the best". The word itself is exclusive of significant numbers.
There are shit tons of possible, and completely viable, builds that you can make. Each class has several dozen ways of completing T6. The problem is that when people like you, OP, say "viable" what you really mean is "better than everything else". The problem with this definition is that, by it's very nature, you exclude most of the builds that are out there.
It's like this. Say you have five builds. Build A is 100% effective. It is the best and it pounds things to sand in a heartbeat. Build B is 99% effective. It also pounds things into sand in a heartbeat. Builds C, D an F are 90% effective. All three still pound things into sand in a heartbeat. BUT because they are ever so slightly less effective than the top two builds, people like you say that they are not viable and bitch about how there is no build diversity because everyone is using A and B.
[quote=FEIF81;/members/90979-feif81]
There will alway be 1-3 builds that ppl will use.
It's like this. Say you have five builds. Build A is 100% effective. It is the best and it pounds things to sand in a heartbeat. Build B is 99% effective. It also pounds things into sand in a heartbeat. Builds C, D an F are 90% effective. All three still pound things into sand in a heartbeat.
Well, I might be mistaken here, but from what I saw so far there is no build say for the DH that comes 90% as efficient as Mara. Thats an example and maybe and exception to your rule. If its the case then too bad for DHs I guess, but its a good example as for what I can't understand that hasn't been "fixed".
Honestly I really doubt your "there are at least 3 builds 90% as efficient as the best build". But maybe you're right, I'm not playing the game enough to have any credibility as you might have to be honest. But the thing is, when you look at certain runes for skills, a lot of them are just plain useless or almost if compared to their most used runes, and that I can't understand 2 years + after launch.
I'm pretty sure Blizz can draw evidence of skills that are so unused at maxed level character, they don't need to try and buff 'em to reach the top 10% used builds, but ... at least give them a chance ffs
Maybe they just put to much skills available to chose from into the game...
Well, I might be mistaken here, but from what I saw so far there is no build say for the DH that comes 90% as efficient as Mara.
You are right that, currently, for greater rifts, Mara is the only way to go. That being, there are different mara builds: Lightning with helltrapper and meticulous bold, cold with etrayu and bombardier, a firebuild with bombardier and i think a slow 2h, while kridershot is an option, or going for a good calamity at the 4.15 breakpoint. So I would say more viable builds than any other class, since they all go with the full set anyway.
For T6, I've had some fun with the full nat set and danetta's as well, working very good, as long as your kill speed is high enough.
Also, the "old" build with cluster arrow with cindercoat and magefist also still works for T6.
So I guess that's a lot of viable builds already.
Soon there will be a new set, hopefully as powerful as mara, and not stronger. But, as said earlier, there can only be 1 "best", so we will see.
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
To post a comment, please login or register a new account.
But the same thing is still keeping me away from sinking hours into the game.
The lack of variety in viable builds (and the lack of complaint about it as well) and the game progress relying way to much on luck.
Am I missing something or the top GRifters are all using the same 1-2 builds with few variations of them?
And the fact that those builds are 80% (I just made that number.. I know, but ..whatever..) based on luck to get the gear to use those builds.
Where is the fun in hoping for luck to get to use the 1-2 only viable builds out of of so many possibilities that are just plain useless?
I don't get why Blizz don't just simply buff all of those unused skills?
I'm sure I'm missing something here, so could someone explain to me why the game is still suffering from the lack of builds variety?
And why everyone is alright with the game being almost purely based on luck as far as gear is concerned (Diablo must involve luck indeed, but based only on it.. that sounds bad for a 2014 game) ?
Thanks guys.
The builds you do see, are the best, because of the power of the skills and synergy with items. Buffing/adding skills and items that have synergy will not help, but only change the build. Just imagine any skill that is not used at the moment, add a huge damage buff to it, and it will be so strong the others will not be used. Finding that perfect sweetspot would make every skill the same (because you need the same amount of damage, aoe, buff potential, ...). Don't get me wrong, I would love for different builds, but either you take any working build and don't care about ranking, or you care about ranking and go for the best build, and there will always be 1 best build. I don't think anyone would say "I know, this build can only put me on position 10 on the leaderboard, but I'll use it to rank".
Same goes with the luck. If you take away every aspect of luck, you will have the same monsters on the same map 100% of the time. I agree the RNG is a bit much now, but either it becomes boring doing the same run over and over (fields of misery vanilla...) or there is some part RNG needed.
As for gear, it is not "only luck". I got several 600+ paragon players on my list, and they are all running with best in slot items, including furnace, tasker, starmetal, ... (at least on their main char). That you don't have all bis items within 100 paragon is normal and good. Also, 600 is kinda the sweetspot to max out your damage with paragon, if you are lower you miss so much that it will be hard to rank on the leaderboards anyway. So while the moment when your item drops is pretty RNG based, I'm pretty sure it balances out at p600 (and probably sooner).
There are shit tons of possible, and completely viable, builds that you can make. Each class has several dozen ways of completing T6. The problem is that when people like you, OP, say "viable" what you really mean is "better than everything else". The problem with this definition is that, by it's very nature, you exclude most of the builds that are out there.
It's like this. Say you have five builds. Build A is 100% effective. It is the best and it pounds things to sand in a heartbeat. Build B is 99% effective. It also pounds things into sand in a heartbeat. Builds C, D an F are 90% effective. All three still pound things into sand in a heartbeat. BUT because they are ever so slightly less effective than the top two builds, people like you say that they are not viable and bitch about how there is no build diversity because everyone is using A and B.
GRs just bottleneck builds but there is build variety, especially now that T6 is easier, you'd see much more different people in normal rifts.
It's like this. Say you have five builds. Build A is 100% effective. It is the best and it pounds things to sand in a heartbeat. Build B is 99% effective. It also pounds things into sand in a heartbeat. Builds C, D an F are 90% effective. All three still pound things into sand in a heartbeat.
Well, I might be mistaken here, but from what I saw so far there is no build say for the DH that comes 90% as efficient as Mara. Thats an example and maybe and exception to your rule. If its the case then too bad for DHs I guess, but its a good example as for what I can't understand that hasn't been "fixed".
Honestly I really doubt your "there are at least 3 builds 90% as efficient as the best build". But maybe you're right, I'm not playing the game enough to have any credibility as you might have to be honest. But the thing is, when you look at certain runes for skills, a lot of them are just plain useless or almost if compared to their most used runes, and that I can't understand 2 years + after launch.
I'm pretty sure Blizz can draw evidence of skills that are so unused at maxed level character, they don't need to try and buff 'em to reach the top 10% used builds, but ... at least give them a chance ffs
Maybe they just put to much skills available to chose from into the game...
You are right that, currently, for greater rifts, Mara is the only way to go. That being, there are different mara builds: Lightning with helltrapper and meticulous bold, cold with etrayu and bombardier, a firebuild with bombardier and i think a slow 2h, while kridershot is an option, or going for a good calamity at the 4.15 breakpoint. So I would say more viable builds than any other class, since they all go with the full set anyway.
For T6, I've had some fun with the full nat set and danetta's as well, working very good, as long as your kill speed is high enough.
Also, the "old" build with cluster arrow with cindercoat and magefist also still works for T6.
So I guess that's a lot of viable builds already.
Soon there will be a new set, hopefully as powerful as mara, and not stronger. But, as said earlier, there can only be 1 "best", so we will see.