I remember joining Tristram Runs, Tomb Runs and Baal Runs to level up ASAP in D2 because it was boring as hell and i see no problem doing that in D3 too.
In Diablo 3, the leveling process is just to get used to your class, but after a couple of character leveled up, you just want to be as fast as you can to reach the real deal at max level. It's up to you if you want to level up the old way or get boosted by a friend.
I remember uber tristram runs and hitting level 80-85 after like a half hour
Guaranteed legendaries stop at 60 so I don't really see an issue with this. I don't think power leveling will be an issue. It requires you to already have 1 character to 60. You also miss out on all of the fun guaranteed legendaries from bosses.
I'm not really too familiar with "guaranteed" legendaries beyond leveling a few new toons on the PTR, and resetting my quests with my endgame SC Monk, that was kinda fun. Found I got more legendaries from Leoric than I did from the Butcher, oddly enough.
Anyways, I want to be aggravated by this, but here's the thing...
In a game like Diablo 2, I hated the idea of powerleveling...mainly because part of the replayability was leveling a brand new character from scratch. If you don't like that aspect, it's not the game for you. But people did it in droves, and while I think that kinda sucked, well...clearly the D2 devs did nothing to stop it. Powerleveling, that is.
In Diablo 3, you're not busy rerolling brand new shiny toons in Softcore for new builds. Dying isn't punishing, and you keep your gear, and gear is a primary way to build a playstyle...thus, once you level a Softcore toon to 70? Great. You never have to level a class to that level ever again. So while you've gained a TON of XP really really fast...that's also a lot of Adventure Mode, Bounties, Rifts, Gambling, and other stuff you could've been doing to build up resources and collect new items, plans, etc. Your loss.
With Hardcore, I suppose it could be considered a tiny bit more of an exploit, but again...gear is a big part of builds, so if your Hardcore character dies and loses some sweet gear, leveling a new toon to the cap in 15 minutes, again, is a series of missed opportunities for you to build resources and gold and materials, collect items, etc.
So in a way...I'm almost glad that an unfortunate accident/feature like that is there. Part of the reason the requirement of going through the game 4 whole times per EVERY difficulty was removed was because playing the game over and over the same exact way was largely boring. If people really want to miss out on all those opportunities for gold, gems, materials, items of all levels, etc., I guess that's their choice.
After all...part of the changes is that Paragon Leveling has its cap removed, and can go almost to forever. So if people want to instantly circumvent content...just like the AH...they're missing out, and it's their own fault.
My only hope is that they don't blast forward to level 70 on a class they're not familiar with, start begging chat channels what the best builds are, then flooding the forums with QQ because they don't know how the class works, when they could've easily gotten more familiar with it DURING the leveling process, and learned its ins and outs.
love the idea going from 0-60 in 15 minutes. why take it away? In d3 is all about item anyway. The only different between 0 and 60 is you can wear level 60 item. You cannot kill anything naked anyway.
I don't understand the logic that "It's okay to powerlevel, this is a Diablo game."
What kind of uproar would there be if this was any other game with this kind of exploit.
If you want to be 60, just play the freakin' game the way it's supposed to be played.
You are if you are playing it at the highest difficulty since the monsters scale to your level. And if in multiplayer the monsters get even more difficult to kill but you do get more bonuses as well.
This is not an exploit, since you are not gaining anything except some time. DIII is not a competitive game there are no prices to the first person to max level or anything.
Another thing is starting a new character and not using anything in the stash and playing at torment 6. That is quite exciting and tough.
You can power level in DII even in single player. It was easier in single player since you can play at players 8.
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I don't understand the logic that "It's okay to powerlevel, this is a Diablo game."
What kind of uproar would there be if this was any other game with this kind of exploit.
If you want to be 60, just play the freakin' game the way it's supposed to be played.
The rational behind that, at least to me, is that the only gains one gets from leveling from 0-60 themselves are personal gains. Level 60 items are better than those of lower item levels, and paragon doesn't kick in until level 60 (assuming you aren't playing ROS).
If someone decides they don't care about the leveling process, no matter what the reason, it doesn't hinder anyone else in any way. It'd be different if there were ladder seasons and competitions for the fastest character to level to 60, that had rewards, but there aren't. I, for one, will probably both play through the game a bunch and power level, depending on what I'm doing and why I'm doing it.
To me the Devs decide what the way the game is "supposed" to be played. If they patch the game to eliminate power leveling, that's how it's supposed to be played. If there are methods for power leveling that are left in the game, that's a legitimate way to play the game as well.
I don't understand the logic that "It's okay to powerlevel, this is a Diablo game."
What kind of uproar would there be if this was any other game with this kind of exploit.
If you want to be 60, just play the freakin' game the way it's supposed to be played.
ARPGs aren't like other games. The appeal of Diablo isn't leveling - it's the grinding and the motif of constantly getting stronger. Unlike other games, killing monster still gives direct power to the player even at level 60/70. In a traditional RPG, the level cap IS the cap in power your base character has. It's just not the same. Even without help, you can quickly level 1-60 in just a few hours.1-10 takes about 5 minutes in torment 6 with Hellfire ring, 10-42 in Master or torment 1, 42(with a 1k+ dps weapon)-50 or so in Torment 6, then scale back as you reach 60.
Is it a problem that you can be power leveled with a second player? Sure. Will they fix it? Probably. Is it their top priority a month before launch? You must be insane.
Did you guys know that power leveling existed in Vanilla? Not in fifteen minutes, but you could get to 60 in three maybe four hours pending on your setup.
You could power level in every single Diablo release so far....
I'd certainly agree that 15 minutes to lvl 60 is a problem. However, power leveling is nothing new and if players choose to dampen their game experience, so be it. It does kind of suck to know that someone can just create a max level character so quickly, even though they would need the resources to gear them and need to know the class build to make one off the bat. But ultimately, if you just play yourself and your friends, you won't have to come across the "n00b" half geared trying to run Torment. Sometimes random grouping is fun though if you just want a quick run.
That being said, I'm sure something will be done about it. It's not terribly difficult to implement power-leveling barricades.
Also, keep in mind that it's good people are pushing exploits like this because these are obviously the ones nobody wants to see on release. Imagine how many people would be pressured to insta-level to 70 if they could if it was "breaking news" on release. Reminds me when Burning Crusade came out and there were videos about someone who had their clan boost them to lvl 70 in a few hours the day it came out.
Again, ONE dev (who is mainly working on Crusader and endgame stuff) did not know about this. Not every single Blizzard employee has the time to read each and every forum thread. Of course Blizzard knows about powerleveling, but the question is if it's worth it to put any restrictions on a feature that was present since the very first days of the entire franchise and no one ever bothered anyone.
It's also not a "bug", it's not even an "exploit", it's just creative use of game mechanics.
It sure did travel up the chain of command, but apparently they don't think it's a problem. If they think it is, they'll do something about it before March 25. But I really don't get why people are going crazy about a "feature" that is as old as the franchise itself, and all of the sudden identify the "feature" as a "bug"/"exploit".
Ok...could you all just let this sink in and them reply:
If the vast majority of sophisticated players are trying to find ways to skip the story and leveling process, what do you think it's worse:
- The story being so bad and shallow that doesn't add anything or any desire to be seen again AND the leveling process is really negligible compared to end-game at 60/70 that you don't have to pay any attention at all;
OORRR
- People using/borking game mechanics to speed up the chores of passing by the above stages so they actually start playing the game and having fun.
ALSO...if someone just take their time, read and pay attention to every dialogue, go to every place and take like 10hs to get a char 1>60 solo and "legitimaly" and I do the same "legitimate" way/path but not reading anything, not checking anything, just rushing my way to xp and get my char 1>60 in 5h or if I'm really good in like 3h.
Am I "power leveling"? What is it that I'm doing "against the game rules"? How do you measure what I'm doing and what you're doing if we're going the same route?
Also not many people will be leveling new characters that often unless it is Hardcore Characters and using some of the power leveling tricks might make it more riskier for a death for the character.
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It's also not a "bug", it's not even an "exploit", it's just creative use of game mechanics.
An exploit is generally using creativity to get results otherwise unattainable (or at a rate that is not otherwise possible) via other methods or intended design of gameplay/leveling. Now this is just my opinion, but I don't believe the developers intended for anyone to just pick up the game and hit top level in 15 minutes. People who are doing so are exploiting the leveling system by taking outside help to kill things they would never be able to kill even if they had 2 hours and unlimited health (just one example, granted). Sure you can power level in the previous titles or perhaps other ARPG's but you should consider the fact it is not the same group of people involved in all of these titles. Therefore, what is the logic in that reasoning? Power-leveling isn't exclusive to the franchise and it certainly isn't a "feature", imho, however there aren't many complex designs out there without a few holes in it somewhere.
Am I "power leveling"? What is it that I'm doing "against the game rules"? How do you measure what I'm doing and what you're doing if we're going the same route?
I even said it in my first post; if that's how people want to play the game then fine. If you wish to run the same screen for the same easy environmental dmg on a high lvl pack or have a high level friend run you through the same part 50 times in 3 hours for some XP and you're not holding your breath then good for you. Why not formally request a button to just click all the way to max lvl? It just deviates from the intention of the design. One could argue it discourages other player's in the way that they feel there is no true effort behind their accomplishments of building their character when someone can achieve somewhat similar results effortlessly. You might think, "who cares?", but for developers who dedicate all of their time to this they want it to be perfect for the community.
I don't believe that people will want to rush through the game or find it such a drag on their first few playthroughs, though a veteran may wish to get other classes to higher levels. Think of choosing a main or first class as some kind of commitment; it will take time to max level other mew characters. At least with Paragon 2.0, that won't be as true now.
Am I "power leveling"? What is it that I'm doing "against the game rules"? How do you measure what I'm doing and what you're doing if we're going the same route?
I even said it in my first post; if that's how people want to play the game then fine. If you wish to run the same screen for the same easy environmental dmg on a high lvl pack or have a high level friend run you through the same part 50 times in 3 hours for some XP and you're not holding your breath then good for you. Why not formally request a button to just click all the way to max lvl? It just deviates from the intention of the design. One could argue it discourages other player's in the way that they feel there is no true effort behind their accomplishments of building their character when someone can achieve somewhat similar results effortlessly. You might think, "who cares?", but for developers who dedicate all of their time to this they want it to be perfect for the community.
I don't believe that people will want to rush through the game or find it such a drag on their first few playthroughs, though a veteran may wish to get other classes to higher levels. Think of choosing a main or first class as some kind of commitment; it will take time to max level other mew characters. At least with Paragon 2.0, that won't be as true now.
You clearly didn't read my post...
If a player takes his time and go very slowly, reading everything, exploring everything and is simply slower than me and takes 10hs to get 1>60 and I don't stop to pick anything, don't check everything and rush as much as I can and level alone by myself doing the exact same acts and following the story and get to 1>60 in 5hs...Am I breaking the game? Am I not? I'm leveling twice as fast as someone else...is that powerleveling? Why is it not?
That's why your reasoning fails. You simply can't measure it. If the player uses a glitch or a bug, like finding a mob that in some situation or place gives more XP than Devs programed it to give or somehow manage to kill monsters way stronger than him without being able to be hit or immune, or glitching them in the scenary and so on...then that's abusing and should not be allowed, otherwise your argument doesn't hold water.
Also would like to add that I already pleveled people in Hardcore and some people simply died in a blink... I still remember a guy that had full Cain's with gems and whatnot being pleveled by me got Vortexed into 3 pools of Desecrator. By chance I was streaming and he died in 0.8secs.
While it certainly doesn't happen often, pleveling has it drawbacks and difficulties, and the game is completely working as it should...
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Anyways, I want to be aggravated by this, but here's the thing...
In a game like Diablo 2, I hated the idea of powerleveling...mainly because part of the replayability was leveling a brand new character from scratch. If you don't like that aspect, it's not the game for you. But people did it in droves, and while I think that kinda sucked, well...clearly the D2 devs did nothing to stop it. Powerleveling, that is.
In Diablo 3, you're not busy rerolling brand new shiny toons in Softcore for new builds. Dying isn't punishing, and you keep your gear, and gear is a primary way to build a playstyle...thus, once you level a Softcore toon to 70? Great. You never have to level a class to that level ever again. So while you've gained a TON of XP really really fast...that's also a lot of Adventure Mode, Bounties, Rifts, Gambling, and other stuff you could've been doing to build up resources and collect new items, plans, etc. Your loss.
With Hardcore, I suppose it could be considered a tiny bit more of an exploit, but again...gear is a big part of builds, so if your Hardcore character dies and loses some sweet gear, leveling a new toon to the cap in 15 minutes, again, is a series of missed opportunities for you to build resources and gold and materials, collect items, etc.
So in a way...I'm almost glad that an unfortunate accident/feature like that is there. Part of the reason the requirement of going through the game 4 whole times per EVERY difficulty was removed was because playing the game over and over the same exact way was largely boring. If people really want to miss out on all those opportunities for gold, gems, materials, items of all levels, etc., I guess that's their choice.
After all...part of the changes is that Paragon Leveling has its cap removed, and can go almost to forever. So if people want to instantly circumvent content...just like the AH...they're missing out, and it's their own fault.
My only hope is that they don't blast forward to level 70 on a class they're not familiar with, start begging chat channels what the best builds are, then flooding the forums with QQ because they don't know how the class works, when they could've easily gotten more familiar with it DURING the leveling process, and learned its ins and outs.
What kind of uproar would there be if this was any other game with this kind of exploit.
If you want to be 60, just play the freakin' game the way it's supposed to be played.
This is not an exploit, since you are not gaining anything except some time. DIII is not a competitive game there are no prices to the first person to max level or anything.
Another thing is starting a new character and not using anything in the stash and playing at torment 6. That is quite exciting and tough.
You can power level in DII even in single player. It was easier in single player since you can play at players 8.
If someone decides they don't care about the leveling process, no matter what the reason, it doesn't hinder anyone else in any way. It'd be different if there were ladder seasons and competitions for the fastest character to level to 60, that had rewards, but there aren't. I, for one, will probably both play through the game a bunch and power level, depending on what I'm doing and why I'm doing it.
To me the Devs decide what the way the game is "supposed" to be played. If they patch the game to eliminate power leveling, that's how it's supposed to be played. If there are methods for power leveling that are left in the game, that's a legitimate way to play the game as well.
Is it a problem that you can be power leveled with a second player? Sure. Will they fix it? Probably. Is it their top priority a month before launch? You must be insane.
You could power level in every single Diablo release so far....
/thread
That being said, I'm sure something will be done about it. It's not terribly difficult to implement power-leveling barricades.
Also, keep in mind that it's good people are pushing exploits like this because these are obviously the ones nobody wants to see on release. Imagine how many people would be pressured to insta-level to 70 if they could if it was "breaking news" on release. Reminds me when Burning Crusade came out and there were videos about someone who had their clan boost them to lvl 70 in a few hours the day it came out.
EDIT: WoW has guilds, not clans. Yeah...lol
It's also not a "bug", it's not even an "exploit", it's just creative use of game mechanics.
If the vast majority of sophisticated players are trying to find ways to skip the story and leveling process, what do you think it's worse:
- The story being so bad and shallow that doesn't add anything or any desire to be seen again AND the leveling process is really negligible compared to end-game at 60/70 that you don't have to pay any attention at all;
OORRR
- People using/borking game mechanics to speed up the chores of passing by the above stages so they actually start playing the game and having fun.
ALSO...if someone just take their time, read and pay attention to every dialogue, go to every place and take like 10hs to get a char 1>60 solo and "legitimaly" and I do the same "legitimate" way/path but not reading anything, not checking anything, just rushing my way to xp and get my char 1>60 in 5h or if I'm really good in like 3h.
Am I "power leveling"? What is it that I'm doing "against the game rules"? How do you measure what I'm doing and what you're doing if we're going the same route?
I don't believe that people will want to rush through the game or find it such a drag on their first few playthroughs, though a veteran may wish to get other classes to higher levels. Think of choosing a main or first class as some kind of commitment; it will take time to max level other mew characters. At least with Paragon 2.0, that won't be as true now.
If a player takes his time and go very slowly, reading everything, exploring everything and is simply slower than me and takes 10hs to get 1>60 and I don't stop to pick anything, don't check everything and rush as much as I can and level alone by myself doing the exact same acts and following the story and get to 1>60 in 5hs...Am I breaking the game? Am I not? I'm leveling twice as fast as someone else...is that powerleveling? Why is it not?
That's why your reasoning fails. You simply can't measure it. If the player uses a glitch or a bug, like finding a mob that in some situation or place gives more XP than Devs programed it to give or somehow manage to kill monsters way stronger than him without being able to be hit or immune, or glitching them in the scenary and so on...then that's abusing and should not be allowed, otherwise your argument doesn't hold water.
While it certainly doesn't happen often, pleveling has it drawbacks and difficulties, and the game is completely working as it should...