Diablo 3 and Poorly Implemented Difficulty

  • #21
    Quote from Veritaas

    Quote from Theungry

    You've basically declared that the fundamental appeal of the Diablo franchise: gear whoring, is a design flaw.


    I don't mean to say that it's a design flaw. I think it's a great draw! The problem is that the higher difficulty is more about having bigger numbers instead of having more skill.

    I realize that for a game revolving around gear whoring this would make sense, but Diablo 1 and 2 never had this issue.


    Firstly, most of your comparisons are relying on the idea that it's supposed to be like Diablo 2. This is a brand new game with completely different mechanics and play style. It's not supposed to be like D2.

    Second, the reason you're dying all the time is because you're not geared up. Trust me when I say that I was getting extremely frustrated by dying over and over again by what I thought to be easy mobs. But I failed to realize I was focusing on the wrong stats - I needed far more Armor and Vitality than I had. I am very surprised that inferno requires that you have at least 70% damage reduction. If you don't, it's time to farm Hell or at least do Dank runs.

    Lastly, I appreciate your candor, but it's a little rash to say the entire game is flawed due to it being to hard.
    "All generalizations are false, including this one." -Mark Twain
  • #22
    The thing is, gear and skill are both required. Fantastic gear is not going to let you faceroll Inferno; you're still going to have to have a good, thought-out build and be able to execute it well. By the same token, even if you're the best player in the world, you're going to hit a wall where you need better gear to progress. This, to me, is what makes the Diablo franchise so great.
    i would choose my own religion and worship my own spirit, but if he ever preached to me i wouldn't want to hear it. i'd drop him, a forgotten god, languishing in shame; and then if i hit stormy seas, i'd have myself to blame. Zhaph#1849
  • #23
    Quote from Theungry

    Quote from Sephrie

    omg I +1 you so hard man, that's exactly what I thought about difficulty of this game put into a video


    Embedding yourself into a forum to market links doesn't work if you only comment on the links you're promoting. You have to pretend to be a member of the community to fool anyone.

    Nice try dude, but I don't even know this guy :) Go pretend you're smart somewhere else. And why the hell would he try to fool anyone with commenting on his own video when he already have tons of other people supporting him?
  • #24
    Quote from CherubDown

    Quote from Veritaas

    Quote from Theungry

    You've basically declared that the fundamental appeal of the Diablo franchise: gear whoring, is a design flaw.


    I don't mean to say that it's a design flaw. I think it's a great draw! The problem is that the higher difficulty is more about having bigger numbers instead of having more skill.

    I realize that for a game revolving around gear whoring this would make sense, but Diablo 1 and 2 never had this issue.


    Firstly, most of your comparisons are relying on the idea that it's supposed to be like Diablo 2. This is a brand new game with completely different mechanics and play style. It's not supposed to be like D2.

    Second, the reason you're dying all the time is because you're not geared up. Trust me when I say that I was getting extremely frustrated by dying over and over again by what I thought to be easy mobs. But I failed to realize I was focusing on the wrong stats - I needed far more Armor and Vitality than I had. I am very surprised that inferno requires that you have at least 70% damage reduction. If you don't, it's time to farm Hell or at least do Dank runs.

    Lastly, I appreciate your candor, but it's a little rash to say the entire game is flawed due to it being to hard.


    HIs only comparison with D2 was that it was a good game.
    I don't think he said it was too hard, but its a joke. The only aspect of difficulty is not getting 1 shotted....thats it.
    Do you want to get scammed? Perhaps a nice keylogger?
    "Just google "diablo 3 gold guide" and magical rainbow covered demons will assault your eyes."
  • #25
    Quote from Theungry



    Inferno = an extra mode for you to chew on if you like to grind impossible content.


    if this were the case gear with a level 60 req would drop in hell. even regeants to make lvl 60 wepons from the blacksmith or to upgrade gems only drop inferno (the books). unless im wrong and lvl 60 legendaries and set peices can drop in hell, inferno is not extra. if they can drop in hell though, ignore this.
  • #26
    what i dont like is that when i encounter fire chains/arcane enchanted/ desecrator/molten i dont die freom stand in fire, inbetween the chain or in the fire on the floor but from mere melee attack...
    with all those affixes you'd expect them to be the thing that prevents you from overcoming a challenge but instead you get owned by simple melee attack -.-

    Edit: for those of you saying go farm hell if you cant handle inferno, you guys realize elites and bosses in inferno act 1 with 5 stacks of NV mostly drop items that have level requirement 57 or lower, and no those items dont have a mod reducing level requirement so farming hell is pointless

    to get gear for act 2 of inferno you need to farm atleast act 3 if not act 4 on inferno diff obviously.
  • #27
    Quote from Mysticjbyrd

    Quote from CherubDown

    Quote from Veritaas

    Quote from Theungry

    You've basically declared that the fundamental appeal of the Diablo franchise: gear whoring, is a design flaw.


    I don't mean to say that it's a design flaw. I think it's a great draw! The problem is that the higher difficulty is more about having bigger numbers instead of having more skill.

    I realize that for a game revolving around gear whoring this would make sense, but Diablo 1 and 2 never had this issue.


    Firstly, most of your comparisons are relying on the idea that it's supposed to be like Diablo 2. This is a brand new game with completely different mechanics and play style. It's not supposed to be like D2.

    Second, the reason you're dying all the time is because you're not geared up. Trust me when I say that I was getting extremely frustrated by dying over and over again by what I thought to be easy mobs. But I failed to realize I was focusing on the wrong stats - I needed far more Armor and Vitality than I had. I am very surprised that inferno requires that you have at least 70% damage reduction. If you don't, it's time to farm Hell or at least do Dank runs.

    Lastly, I appreciate your candor, but it's a little rash to say the entire game is flawed due to it being to hard.


    HIs only comparison with D2 was that it was a good game.
    I don't think he said it was too hard, but its a joke. The only aspect of difficulty is not getting 1 shotted....thats it.


    If you're getting 1-shotted you don't have the right gear on. Go farm Hell, buy loot off the AH, or use the Blacksmith.
    "All generalizations are false, including this one." -Mark Twain
  • #28
    The blacksmith is a bad joke. It costs 50k + mats to make an item that is more than likely shit.

    As a DH pretty much no amount of gear is going to stop you from getting one shotted in late inferno. Everyone I know of in this stage of the game completely ignores defense, as you are gonna get one shotted any fucking way, and goes for straight dps.
    Do you want to get scammed? Perhaps a nice keylogger?
    "Just google "diablo 3 gold guide" and magical rainbow covered demons will assault your eyes."
  • #29
    Second, the reason you're dying all the time is because you're not geared up. Trust me when I say that I was getting extremely frustrated by dying over and over again by what I thought to be easy mobs. But I failed to realize I was focusing on the wrong stats - I needed far more Armor and Vitality than I had. I am very surprised that inferno requires that you have at least 70% damage reduction. If you don't, it's time to farm Hell or at least do Dank runs.

    Well, in my opinion it shouldn't be like that. In most games nowadays (games that actually mean something in the gaming world) it ALWAYS should be skill > gear. Of course gear should be important, but not AS important as it is, compared to skill. It takes no skill to do 100 bossruns or whatever, I know farming is the part of the game though.
    The thing is, there are no other factors in the late game, the game doesn't require you to get much more skilled, it just requires you to get more gear with defensive stats. There are no more mechanics forcing you to learn the fight from scratch, there is no learning curve, you just have to either get lucky (as it was with first inferno diablo kill - the wizard got lucky, because he didn't get the curse that one-shots him: he was doing 0 vita strat and the curse was countering it) or have a lot of good gear. I mean, it takes some skill to actually NOT get hit by some one shot ability, but people are avoiding it in normal already.
    Also the next thing - how come elite packs and rares are actually harder than bosses? I know blizzard wanted us to do "story" and dungeons to get gear, not farm bosses (that's why elites drop better gear) but seriously, it doesn't even make sense. Bosses are supposed to be the ultimate challenge, not "the icing on the cake". I think the guy talking here is right, but imo there is nothing we can do right now. Blizzard won't re-make the game, they can just implement new stuff in expansion, but the whole difficulty system is screwed already.

    Edit: cleaning my wall of text :P
  • #30
    Demon Souls does not rely on slot mechanics satisfaction. Diablo 3 does. I think it was designed that way...
  • #31
    Quote from Mysticjbyrd

    The blacksmith is a bad joke. It costs 50k + mats to make an item that is more than likely shit.

    As a DH pretty much no amount of gear is going to stop you from getting one shotted in late inferno. Everyone I know of in this stage of the game completely ignores defense, as you are gonna get one shotted any fucking way, and goes for straight dps.


    The part I bolded is what I'm talking about. You MUST have defense. You won't get 1-shotted.
    "All generalizations are false, including this one." -Mark Twain
  • #32
    Quote from not_kurt_russel

    Quote from Theungry

    Inferno = an extra mode for you to chew on if you like to grind impossible content.


    if this were the case gear with a level 60 req would drop in hell. even regeants to make lvl 60 wepons from the blacksmith or to upgrade gems only drop inferno (the books). unless im wrong and lvl 60 legendaries and set peices can drop in hell, inferno is not extra. if they can drop in hell though, ignore this.


    I have no idea how that's suppose to be relevant. You can stop playing after normal if you want. The reason to keep playing is if you want more and more difficult challenges with the same content.
    I grew up gaming without internet forums. The entire phenomenon of being upset with a game developer makes no sense to me. No sense. I cannot imagine spending my time and energy being upset about something I choose to do for recreation.
  • #33
    Quote from CherubDown

    Quote from Mysticjbyrd

    The blacksmith is a bad joke. It costs 50k + mats to make an item that is more than likely shit.

    As a DH pretty much no amount of gear is going to stop you from getting one shotted in late inferno. Everyone I know of in this stage of the game completely ignores defense, as you are gonna get one shotted any fucking way, and goes for straight dps.


    The part I bolded is what I'm talking about. You MUST have defense. You won't get 1-shotted.


    Yeah, there's a lot of assumptions here, and the OP is blaming stuff on the game, when in fact, he's doing it wrong.

    Ergo, 'bad design' is not true.
  • #34
    Quote from CherubDown

    Quote from Mysticjbyrd

    The blacksmith is a bad joke. It costs 50k + mats to make an item that is more than likely shit.

    As a DH pretty much no amount of gear is going to stop you from getting one shotted in late inferno. Everyone I know of in this stage of the game completely ignores defense, as you are gonna get one shotted any fucking way, and goes for straight dps.


    The part I bolded is what I'm talking about. You MUST have defense. You won't get 1-shotted.


    So you know of a DH who stacks defense and can survive in inferno?
    Do you want to get scammed? Perhaps a nice keylogger?
    "Just google "diablo 3 gold guide" and magical rainbow covered demons will assault your eyes."
  • #35
    Quote from Sephrie

    Second, the reason you're dying all the time is because you're not geared up. Trust me when I say that I was getting extremely frustrated by dying over and over again by what I thought to be easy mobs. But I failed to realize I was focusing on the wrong stats - I needed far more Armor and Vitality than I had. I am very surprised that inferno requires that you have at least 70% damage reduction. If you don't, it's time to farm Hell or at least do Dank runs.

    Well, in my opinion it shouldn't be like that. In most games nowadays (games that actually mean something in the gaming world) it ALWAYS should be skill > gear. Of course gear should be important, but not AS important as it is, compared to skill. It takes no skill to do 100 bossruns or whatever, I know farming is the part of the game though.
    The thing is, there are no other factors in the late game, the game doesn't require you to get much more skilled, it just requires you to get more gear with defensive stats. There are no more mechanics forcing you to learn the fight from scratch, there is no learning curve, you just have to either get lucky (as it was with first inferno diablo kill - the wizard got lucky, because he didn't get the curse that one-shots him: he was doing 0 vita strat and the curse was countering it) or have a lot of good gear. I mean, it takes some skill to actually NOT get hit by some one shot ability, but people are avoiding it in normal already.
    Also the next thing - how come elite packs and rares are actually harder than bosses? I know blizzard wanted us to do "story" and dungeons to get gear, not farm bosses (that's why elites drop better gear) but seriously, it doesn't even make sense. Bosses are supposed to be the ultimate challenge, not "the icing on the cake". I think the guy talking here is right, but imo there is nothing we can do right now. Blizzard won't re-make the game, they can just implement new stuff in expansion, but the whole difficulty system is screwed already.

    Edit: cleaning my wall of text :P



    You're missing the point. It shouldn't be the way you want, because you don't want Diablo. Play the games you want to play. Complaining that apples aren't oranges makes no sense whatsoever.
    I grew up gaming without internet forums. The entire phenomenon of being upset with a game developer makes no sense to me. No sense. I cannot imagine spending my time and energy being upset about something I choose to do for recreation.
  • #36
    You're confusing the games anyway. Demon souls for example. If you can dodge every attack in the game because you are fucking spiderman, you only need a stick and pajamas for gear. In diablo, you need the fucking gear. The game is about collecting items, with stats that you want, not just items that are strong, but items that work for YOU. If you expected something else, you should have played more D2.
  • #37
    Inferno tho aint just about gear.

    For mages+DH its all about kiting. Their HP doesnt mean anything, meaning they could kite untill the rare mob pack enrages.
    Why make inferno easier for ranged? I mean they have a much easier time farming gear.

    Inferno should be called BONUS Kiting level or something. My friend which is a DH doesn't even really wanna play with me (monk) cuz I slow him a lot down since I can't tank the mobs, and when I dps for that 4 sec immune its hardly noticable.

    Now the Mages and DH can infact get gear for their alt's monks or barbarians and just rape Inferno act 2.

    Should I really make a Mage to keep my self into the game?
  • #38
    Quote from Theungry

    I have no idea how that's suppose to be relevant. You can stop playing after normal if you want. The reason to keep playing is if you want more and more difficult challenges with the same content.

    There is no "challenge", thats the whole point.
  • #39
    Quote from CherubDown

    Quote from Mysticjbyrd

    The blacksmith is a bad joke. It costs 50k + mats to make an item that is more than likely shit.

    As a DH pretty much no amount of gear is going to stop you from getting one shotted in late inferno. Everyone I know of in this stage of the game completely ignores defense, as you are gonna get one shotted any fucking way, and goes for straight dps.


    The part I bolded is what I'm talking about. You MUST have defense. You won't get 1-shotted.


    There is no amount of defensive stats a DH could have where they wouldnt get one shot in inferno. Like none. Barbs are barely doing it with full def gear AND full def skills/runes/passives.

    Guess what DHs dont have? any defensive skills/runes/or passives. The only exception to this is shadow power, which is life regen and doesn't cut it at all in inferno. And of course SS, which has now been neutered into not being usable with ANY rune.

    If you attempt to stack defensive stats other than some vitality as a DH, then you are a complete idiot.
  • #40
    I think the difficulty of the game works nicely. I think the very small amount of outdoor randomization and items being incredibly dull is where blizzard missed the mark.
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