Inferno Gets harder as you go - No Flat Diff

  • #186
    Alot of people did some cheating with WoW too though; a number of the original 60's on US-Arthas took advantage of going into the non-instanced area of Maraudon while it was still closed off, and leveled off mobs that could be one shot.
    a shade of timelessness~
  • #187
    Quote from Bogatog

    Quote from jaclashflash

    Quote from Bogatog

    Quote from Shrieker

    Quote from Razboss

    People are yelling that they nerfed Inferno...wheres the nerf? if anything they buffed it... they never said Act1 was gonna be easier...If anything Act 1 is prolly still lvl 61 mobs, and they get HARDER in later acts... So its actually better than the flat level. I only see this as a good thing.


    We made Act III and Act IV really, really brutally hard, for the most elite players only. It felt wrong to make ALL of Inferno that brutally hard.

    Where's the buff? They're saying that everything was brutally hard(as Act II and Act IV is now) and that felt wrong, meaning they nerfed it.


    The reason people keep saying it is a buff is that Bashiok said it felt wrong for Act 4 boss to be the same difficulty as Act 1 boss. Then he said that line people love to quote from above. We cannot know for certain which way they tweaked it.

    Option 1: Everything was a 10 and they nerfed Acts 1, 2, 3 to make it a slope ending in Act 4 as a 10 now.
    Option 2: Everything was a 10 and they buffed Acts 2, 3, 4 to make it a slope ending in Act 4 as a 14 now.

    I don't see anything that proves which of those options has occurred, or if some other option was chosen. All we truly know is that there is a difficulty ramp from 1-4 currently. Base and end values of difficulty relative to before are completely unknown to US.

    Because you are blinded by bias.
    Its obviously the first option.


    I never actually said which option I believe it is. I'm just pointing out that we have no way to know. I think it could be either way, probably more likely the first option but there is no way to know for sure.

    Edit: What makes it obviously the first option anyway? Your interpretation of a post? Your bias?
    The fact you would even consider the 2nd as a possibility in of itself is absurd.

    Usually blizzard is pretty vague, but on occasions such as this the message is crystal clear.
    One is never hurt by being given additional choices, only by taking them away.
    A QUADRILLION MAGIC FIND is worthless if you can't kill shit!
  • #188
    Quote from jaclashflash
    Usually blizzard is pretty vague, but on occasions such as this the message is crystal clear.


    I agree that the nerf to Act 1 is clearly communicated. The question is more if the average difficulty in inferno went up, stayed the same or went down - that is the ambiguity (and implicit in that question is also how deep the nerf went - is act 2 also nerfed compared to before et cetera).
  • #189
    this is an amazing change. killing an act 1 zombie should not be just as hard as an act 4 crazy elite demon from hell.
  • #190
    I think it is a horrible change. It will make us grind act 3 and 4 most of the time at some point. We was going to go through difficulties through normal, nightmare and hell. What is the point of having another. Inferno supposed to give us two things:
    - make all areas equally viable to grind
    - make all monsters of all acts equally difficult in their own way
    I don't think this will be a problem currently as they are going to release 2 expansions. But after they do they better add new difficulty level (Ubber :)) which let us grind in all acts with flat difficulty. They should actually add it now and make it as difficult as last act of inferno flat. Maybe they shouldn't call it a difficulty, just a special mode which you can turn on when you finish Inferno.
    [Edit] wariord: I understand your point. But this was no point on inferno. Your point is realized through first 3 difficulties. Inferno supposed to be more like a new mode of playing game. I believe now they should make all items available on hell or like I described above add new mode after inferno which would make difficulty flat. This way we would have best of both worlds.
  • #191
    But I still hope it was April's fool day joke. Though it was not April when it was announced. Well not in USA, maybe somewhere else though.
  • #192
    Maybe I have some problem with logic here, but let me say what I believe.

    So, basically, we have a flat difficulty inferno - what does it mean? this need to be (to some extent at least) beatable in Hell gear. Why? Because when you first come to inferno, you need to have a possibility to beat something to start getting inferno loot. And as the first zombie in Act 1 is the same difficulty as some demon in Act 4, both of these are beatable by Hell gear. (ok, maybe it is something on the lines of 1 champion pack = 2 hours of trying/crying/rage.. but still, beatable)

    On the other hand, you have Act 4 in this non flat inferno. This means that you can really put some crazy champions packs to the Act 3 and 4, that won't be beatable without a load of Inferno gear already farmed for you character. Is this bad? I'd say, that this definitely helps to even make possible this Inferno++ difficulty. Because with flat inferno, you don't even have the possibility for it being this hard.

    As for whether this is the case, or it was really a nerf to Act 1 and 2 - we'll see, when we get there. However I can't see a point in bashing this change, as it really enables us to get to something even more hard than before. And for those who don't believe blizzard can do something this hard.. Some hard modes in WoW are good example (talking about these modes in appropriate ilvl gear, not doing them 2-3 patches later on)

    PS: Oh, as for the farming - I've got a feeling that it will be basically a tradeoff.. you can either kill mobs in Act1 Inferno faster, without possibility to get the finest top level gear - however, you'll get more of the bit lower level of inferno gear - and this can be even more effective, given the total randomnes of affixes,. Or you can aim for the absolute top in Act4.. but will spend much more time for that - maybe it won't even be rentable, as you'll spend too much on repairs.. We'll see
  • #193
    Quote from maninel

    Maybe I have some problem with logic here, but let me say what I believe.

    So, basically, we have a flat difficulty inferno - what does it mean? this need to be (to some extent at least) beatable in Hell gear. Why? Because when you first come to inferno, you need to have a possibility to beat something to start getting inferno loot. And as the first zombie in Act 1 is the same difficulty as some demon in Act 4, both of these are beatable by Hell gear. (ok, maybe it is something on the lines of 1 champion pack = 2 hours of trying/crying/rage.. but still, beatable)

    On the other hand, you have Act 4 in this non flat inferno. This means that you can really put some crazy champions packs to the Act 3 and 4, that won't be beatable without a load of Inferno gear already farmed for you character. Is this bad? I'd say, that this definitely helps to even make possible this Inferno++ difficulty. Because with flat inferno, you don't even have the possibility for it being this hard.

    As for whether this is the case, or it was really a nerf to Act 1 and 2 - we'll see, when we get there. However I can't see a point in bashing this change, as it really enables us to get to something even more hard than before. And for those who don't believe blizzard can do something this hard.. Some hard modes in WoW are good example (talking about these modes in appropriate ilvl gear, not doing them 2-3 patches later on)

    PS: Oh, as for the farming - I've got a feeling that it will be basically a tradeoff.. you can either kill mobs in Act1 Inferno faster, without possibility to get the finest top level gear - however, you'll get more of the bit lower level of inferno gear - and this can be even more effective, given the total randomnes of affixes,. Or you can aim for the absolute top in Act4.. but will spend much more time for that - maybe it won't even be rentable, as you'll spend too much on repairs.. We'll see


    Ok first off, why do you guys keep splitting the acts into 2 groups?
    Act1

    The wording is crystal clear, and so is the logic. They nerfed entry level inferno. I knew this would happen long ago, because the idea of an end game that was impossible for a huge portion of their playerbase does not fit with the blizz dev game style. Its also a terrible, terrible, terrible, utterly failsauce idea from a business stand point as well.

    The people who bought into the inferno hype of it being impossible are just gullible. It was all propaganda, and they told you exactly what you wanted to hear, and you bought it hook, line and sinker without a second though. They are probably the same people who planned on leeching, and are now QQ'ing because the MF group system is fair. They simply want to oppress other players, because they think that makes them better. Well NEWSLFASH: Its a game, a really really easy game that is based more on luck than anything else.



    There are 3 real possibilities.
    An old model scale of 1-20, where inferno was a flat 20.

    Possibility 1:
    Act1 = 17
    Act II = 18
    Act III = 19
    ActIV = 20

    Possibility 2:
    Act1 = 18
    Act II = 19
    Act III = 20
    ActIV = 21

    Possibility 3: (Not likely)
    Act1 = 19
    Act II = 20
    Act III = 21
    ActIV = 22

    You can fudge with the #s if you like, as long as entry into inferno is lower. Though such an exercise would be pretty futile without more information.

    ActIV and maybe Act III might increase in difficulty from the previous model, but it won't be anything insane like others are suggesting. However, given that you will be able to farm inferno level gear more easily in the earlier acts this is not a problem. In fact, relatively speaking, it might not be an increase in difficulty at all.
    Do you want to get scammed? Perhaps a nice keylogger?
    "Just google "diablo 3 gold guide" and magical rainbow covered demons will assault your eyes."
  • #194
    Might also be 20, 21, 22, 23 =)

    We just don't know yet
  • #195
    Quote from Veggie50

    Might also be 20, 21, 22, 23 =)

    We just don't know yet


    We do know the wording is as plain as day.....ITS NOT!
    Stop drinking the kool-aid.
    Do you want to get scammed? Perhaps a nice keylogger?
    "Just google "diablo 3 gold guide" and magical rainbow covered demons will assault your eyes."
  • #196
    Maybe I was a bit unclear.. what I was trying to say is that this non flat inferno gives blizzard more possibilities.

    Because even if they make it something like 16 in act 1, they can stil make it 22 in act 4.. where it wouldn't be possible to make it 22 flat in the inferno

    I haven't ever said that they made it that way, or they won't - I just pleainly don't know yet, so I will wait and see. However I stand by the idea, that this non flat inferno gives the possibility for the higher difficulty on the end game (even if it means that real end game will only mean act 4 inferno)
  • #197
    At some point we will grind for only the best gear. Then Act 1 and 2 will be obsolete.
    It was always alright if we had to grind hell for best items to be able to somehow beat the inferno. At the beginning it would be tough but as we get inferno gear it would get easier. So flat inferno was almost absolutely fine.
    The only problem with inferno was that you could get there better gear which kind of suggested it supposed to be another difficulty level and not flat mode. They should keep inferno as they now want but still give us flat inferno mode to choose from after we finish it. If this is impossible I would still rather had flat inferno as I wouldn't have to grind just one or two acts and when first expansion is released most probably only last act 5 will be grind to death if they go further down this road.
  • #198
    Btw, it's WoW way of doing things which is not the best road for D3 which is not subscription based and won't get even 10% as much of further content.
  • #199
    Quote from rozmata

    At some point we will grind for only the best gear. Then Act 1 and 2 will be obsolete.
    It was always alright if we had to grind hell for best items to be able to somehow beat the inferno. At the beginning it would be tough but as we get inferno gear it would get easier. So flat inferno was almost absolutely fine.
    The only problem with inferno was that you could get there better gear which kind of suggested it supposed to be another difficulty level and not flat mode. They should keep inferno as they now want but still give us flat inferno mode to choose from after we finish it. If this is impossible I would still rather had flat inferno as I wouldn't have to grind just one or two acts and when first expansion is released most probably only last act 5 will be grind to death if they go further down this road.


    You are assuming you will never try to progress into Act III and just farm the first two acts.

    Even late into D2, people had their bots farm every Act.
    Do you want to get scammed? Perhaps a nice keylogger?
    "Just google "diablo 3 gold guide" and magical rainbow covered demons will assault your eyes."
  • #200
    Below two great sarcastic quotes from blizzard forums:

    1 - "It's perfect. Love playing it, love unlocking, love not having to grind stupid items to make my build. I can just play, have fun, and get to my build. I have enough things to grind for as is. Perfect, keep it, don't screw it up with stupid farming."

    2 - "lol wont need to have MF chars,uhuuuuu"

    This ^ is exactly what this change is going to do to D3 (more or less).
  • #201
    Quote from Mysticjbyrd

    Quote from rozmata

    At some point we will grind for only the best gear. Then Act 1 and 2 will be obsolete.
    It was always alright if we had to grind hell for best items to be able to somehow beat the inferno. At the beginning it would be tough but as we get inferno gear it would get easier. So flat inferno was almost absolutely fine.
    The only problem with inferno was that you could get there better gear which kind of suggested it supposed to be another difficulty level and not flat mode. They should keep inferno as they now want but still give us flat inferno mode to choose from after we finish it. If this is impossible I would still rather had flat inferno as I wouldn't have to grind just one or two acts and when first expansion is released most probably only last act 5 will be grind to death if they go further down this road.


    You are assuming you will never try to progress into Act III and just farm the first two acts.

    Even late into D2, people had their bots farm every Act.


    I don't know what you mean. I've never said (or at least didn't mean) I wouldn't farm act 3 or 4. I would progress into all of them so I have later on, all 4 acts to choose from to grind, without drawbacks of not being able to get the best possible items from all acts.
  • #202
    Quote from wariord

    this is an amazing change. killing an act 1 zombie should not be just as hard as an act 4 crazy elite demon from hell.


    this
  • #203
    Quote from TheGerman

    Quote from wariord

    this is an amazing change. killing an act 1 zombie should not be just as hard as an act 4 crazy elite demon from hell.


    this


    this ^ you have for three first difficulty levels, this ^ should not be the end game which is item based
  • #204
    but well, I don't care that much anymore. I suppose that when Titan comes out they will give us what we want as all WoW lovers will switch to it. Possibly even sooner than that
  • #205
    They should make it so that you have to go through inferno once as the monster levels progress throughout it. After that, you have the choice to keep all monsters and bosses at the same level, or to keep it the same way (monster level progression).
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