Has anyone ever though about making an entry in this this thread? The only high-ranked wizard there is using a WoW, which is being mocked as laughably slow in the thread over at Battle.Net. However, there's not a single entry using this spec there with a respectable time...
Has anyone ever though about making an entry in this this thread? The only high-ranked wizard there is using a WoW, which is being mocked as laughably slow in the thread over at Battle.Net. However, there's not a single entry using this spec there with a respectable time...
The "competition" fell out of relevance since there were numerous rule changes and the thread never caught traction. I believe the best time was in the low 30s (by a Woh wizard) but i know many people didn't even bother running the competition.
Has anyone ever though about making an entry in this this thread? The only high-ranked wizard there is using a WoW, which is being mocked as laughably slow in the thread over at Battle.Net. However, there's not a single entry using this spec there with a respectable time...
I cleared 10 Rifts in about 33 minutes. I do not want to record and upload it to my YouTube channel just for the sake of such a competition. Personally, i would have preferred the rules to be zero Shrines, zero Pylons. I believe I was able to get that time solely because 3/10 RGs had Conduits active. A few Empowered and Powers littered throughout the runs obviously helped. Then again, the only way a Woh build can be competitive with a standard Firebird build is by utilizing Gloves of Worship and multiple Empowered Shrines.
Using no Shrines and no Pylons, one of my sessions (10 runs) was around 37 minutes.
I already have a speed run video here, even though it is just one run.
Then again, the only way a Woh build can be competitive with a standard Firebird build is by utilizing Gloves of Worship and multiple Empowered Shrines.
I can confirm that. Have been playing for weeks with GoW (High CC, CHD, CDR) and a 2.5k WoW. Without a doubt, it is very strong and I personally like this style more but it cannot compete with FB-Blizzard in terms of AoE damage. Just running resp. teleporting around and placing Blizzards...
On topic, I do not like PE because it lacks group support and I play in groups almost exclusively like Bagstone. Also, my spec differs a bit from the suggested one. Nonetheless, well written guide for beginners.
Edit: Forgot to mention that I use the Toxin Gem instead. The haste proc from PE is quite useless as well.
PE's IAS buff is useless yes.
I am saying to use Zei / PE / TOX. So it does benefit the group by using TOX as well.
PE is an extra "black hole" every second. For me its about ~930% damage per second. It wipes the floor on T6.
The way this build supports groups is to destroy enemies and carry groups. If groups want to run more leisurely, then by all means modify the build, but as per title, the build is for players that have a firm grasp on vanilla FB builds and want to push them and their game play to the next level =)
I've included this response to a question on the US bnet forums regarding my choice of RORG/Cindercoat vs Endless Walk set. Probably not a common problem to have since finding a end game Endless Walk set isn't the easiest thing to acquire anyways, but still can be relevant to some people.
From bnet forums: "Boozor, I recall that you have very good Endless Walk set. For T6 farming, can I ask your preference between SOJ and Endless Walk set, to be paired with RORG?
Between my own Endless Walk (my compass rose does not have CHD so it's not optimal) and SOJ, SOJ is already worse against whites but of course better against elites.
Is the more balanced SOJ preferable or go for white damage in T6?
Also perhaps taking into account playing in group rifts where whites/elites take longer to die.
Edit: My SOJ is 19% Fire and 26% Elite with INT (No CC/CD) "
The comparison I did for both set ups were the following:
-Compass rose / Travellers Pledge (basically max items - avgdmg/CHD/CHC/socket ring and Fire%/CHD/CHC amulet)
-Magic weapon - conduit
-FB chest
I used BDF's spreadsheet to show the damage break down between the fire portion of total damage and the gem DOT damage portion.
With increases in fire elemental % (80% compared to 60%) and the extra 10% from Force weapon, it ended up that the Cindercoat variation did more total DPS compared to Endless Walk set with similar playability in regards to the AP spending.
The travellers set does have some upsides, mainly, eHP related. Extra 250VIT and extra eHP roll on the FB chest, gives it a bit more survivability for what its worth.
The damage output is very close however, from gear alone (no gems) Cindercoat/RORG/force weapon had about ~6.5% stronger DOT. It got a bit more complicated when factoring in the damage from Pain Enhancer and Toxin as well since these were damage sources that did not benefit from the additional 20% fire from Cindercoat. So that needed to be calculated as well, but in the end it appeared the extra fire and force weapon % increases out weighed the gem DOTs.
Keep in mind, this is with near max Endless Walk set. So for people without items like this, RORG will win more decisively. So it makes sense to use the Endless walk set just for extra EHP, and use Conduit rune.
In all scenarios, we keep SOJ because it offers tremendous upside even if some combinations can out perform 20% elemental on the ring, the extra 30% against elites is the kicker and is a noticeable loss.
During this past EXP weekend, I found myself using both Cindercoat and Conduit rune together since AP management was even more important due to speed farming trash. So this is another option I am playing around with right now as well.
Will there be anything changed the way a wizard speedfarms T6 Rifts with 2.1.2? I only know the boss range nerf, but it shouldnt affect well geared T6 group runs?
Thanks
Currently this build is under some review.
It works fine as is, but I want to improve its efficiency especially with the increases to monster density.
Right now, I would suggest using Conduit instead of Force Weapon for better resource management, and to sacrifice some HP and defensive stat rolls for either skill % or area % rolls on gear.
The gains are marginal, but right now we don't need the extra toughness from all the defensive stats.
Though i was wondering : we're talking about T6 efficiency, so most mobs would die with a single Apocalypse. What's the point of the 6 pieces bonus set of the firebird ? You might trigger the DoT against elites, but wouldn't that be a waste if you could instead have 2 pure offense items ?
the set bonus stacks itself by applying fire damage.
so your blizzard does damage for a second. then firebird repeats the damage + blizzard tick and so on...
read the setbonus... not the part with , when the 3000% damage are applied it will bleed to death.. but the part before...
The set bonus will repeat the fire damage dealt to the target in a 3 seconds frame. This effect Stacks...
Thats why the white mobs hp bar empties slowly in the beggining and every more quickly over time, just when casting one blizzard.
That is not the final 3000% dot, but the stacking firebird dot UNTIL 3000%.
if you would remove the 6piece bonus you will not have enough damage in your blizzard to kill the mob.
As Jalatiphra stated, the effect stacks until the infinite DOT threshold is reached and then the 3000% burn kicks in.
Until then there are stacking temporary DOTs that occur as you cast blizzard and other fire skills.
Yes in many situations the monster will die in a single cast of blizzard. Mainly this happens in solo, sometimes multi players. However, I keep in mind that I am almost always running in 4-man groups so I would like to be able to kill elite packs by myself. Many people will say that you have overkill DPS even for groups... however, I aim to KILL the elite as I run through them without missing a step, so that is why the gearing seems a bit over kill. In some cases, you spam all your abilities, you reach the 3000% burn DOT right away and it does give you some extra damage to finish off the elite. So the 6 piece is a MUST use.
I've re-visited some of the calculations, and since I do not own a Ancient Furnace (which is still best in slot) and am currently using an Ancient Devastator and Ancient Firebird Off hand. The highest damage set up for ONE HANDER is RORG/SOJ / Cindercoat/Magefists. So overall I still would choose SOJ/RORG set up over Endless walk set. For two handed set up, the Endless walk set will lose a lot of its value since CHD you gain from the Endless Walk set won't have as big of an impact on the overall DPS compared to a 1-handed set up. Same idea applies to Increasing fire% in 1 handed and 2 handed set ups.
I do have to say my wiz rolls thru T6 like a well geared Barb and its a little different than the standard Wiz mold. I love her, though. Lotsa fun to be had.
The highest damage set up for ONE HANDER is actually Endless Walk set with SOJ, using Cindercoat, and Magefists. The downside to this is I prefer using Leoric's Crown, 25% CDR or the EXP or MF boosts are much nicer then another 4-5% damage. So overall I still would choose SOJ/RORG set up over Endless walk set. For two handed set up, the Endless walk set will lose a lot of its value since CHD you gain from the Endless Walk set won't have as big of an impact on the overall DPS compared to a 1-handed set up. Same idea applies to Increasing fire% in 1 handed and 2 handed set ups.
It's impossible to have SoJ + Endless walk, and Cindercoat + Magefist. That's 5-piece firebird without RoRG.
What about hexing pants vs Magefist? With the hotfix on firebird, the dot is dynamic and hexing pants works on firebird dot. Hexing pants give 25% class A buff while magefists give 20% fire damage, which we have a lot of in a devastator setup. The AP regen bonus is a nice perk as well for T6 farming. What do you think?
Keep up the good work man!
From what I read about hexing pants is that the DOT updates abnormally fast. So any kind of stop/cast motion, and it will decrease the size of the DOT.
I haven't revisited hexing pants since 2.0 so I can't be 100% sure how it works now but that is what I read about it thus far.
For a Wand of WOH explosive blast build it definitely would challenge for a spot since your constantly on the go.
Devastator, because it has lower attack speed (resulting in higher damage range on weapon and that's the only thing that counts as Blizzard's damage does not factor in attack speed).
[quote="Boozor"]From what I read about hexing pants is that the DOT updates abnormally fast. So any kind of stop/cast motion, and it will decrease the size of the DOT.
I haven't revisited hexing pants since 2.0 so I can't be 100% sure how it works now but that is what I read about it thus far.
For a Wand of WOH explosive blast build it definitely would challenge for a spot since your constantly on the go.
Well yeah, the DOT will drop the moment you stop moving or when you cast spells. But on the other hand, hexing pants buffs ALL our dps instead of only firebird, that 25% applies to toxin and PE, which is nice against white mobs. It's a playstyle change and you gotta keep in mind to move at all times, but the dps increase is there.
To give some numbers, I have :
* 5M5 fire sheet dps with hexing pants + fb hands when I move
* 3M9 fire sheet dps with hexing pants + fb hants when I don't move
* 5M1 fire sheet dps with magefist + fb pants
My magefist aren't perfect so the 5M1 can be improved (I lack 0.5% CHC, 3% CHD, and I have 642 int on them).
_____________________________________________________________
I am a big fan of the hexing pants, but it was in builds that could utilize the benefits of the it without really suffering the negatives (pet doctor/ shot gun crusader).
The 25% applies to the gem DOTS your right, but it also decreases them as well. Your stats with the pants on show a small gain with active as well, leading me to lean towards consistency as opposed to potential.
In any event, do we have any information on whether a stop/cast motion (example cast blizzard) will cause the drop in FB DOT? There is usually a slight moment where you stop, but the buff is still active from what I remember.
If the buff is still active when casting blizzard or blackhole, then this definitely becomes a much more attractive and fun option.
Thats a change I was considering, putting on my Hexing Pants. it will require dropping the Illusory Boots or the Cindercoat to maintain the FB DOT. I like the boots and would actually have synergy with the pants. Do you think the Hexing Pants will be a good tradeoff with the Cindercoat?
Basically it's worth it if you play with devastator+firebird eye (high fire % bonus, bonus from cindercoat is relatively small), not worth it with a 2hander. If I remember my calculations correctly, switching from ancient firebird legs and almost perfect cindercoat into hexing pants would give me a ~6% dmg boost. If you don't use glass cannon or force weapon the boost is even higher.
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
To post a comment, please login or register a new account.
-
View User Profile
-
View Posts
-
Send Message
ModeratorThe "competition" fell out of relevance since there were numerous rule changes and the thread never caught traction. I believe the best time was in the low 30s (by a Woh wizard) but i know many people didn't even bother running the competition.
But i'll give a try this weekend.
-
View User Profile
-
View Posts
-
Send Message
Wise ElderUsing no Shrines and no Pylons, one of my sessions (10 runs) was around 37 minutes.
I already have a speed run video here, even though it is just one run.
Armory | YouTube | Twitter | Clan Site
I am saying to use Zei / PE / TOX. So it does benefit the group by using TOX as well.
PE is an extra "black hole" every second. For me its about ~930% damage per second. It wipes the floor on T6.
The way this build supports groups is to destroy enemies and carry groups. If groups want to run more leisurely, then by all means modify the build, but as per title, the build is for players that have a firm grasp on vanilla FB builds and want to push them and their game play to the next level =)
Here is the spreadsheet i linked earlier in this thread.
https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1rjwD6R88t3URghqfDK1NPCtknNGXgMAR8D6I1kPClWE/edit#gid=0
PE easily out damages BOTP, and TOX is about hte same as BOTP. This is assuming Furnace set up.
From bnet forums:
"Boozor, I recall that you have very good Endless Walk set. For T6 farming, can I ask your preference between SOJ and Endless Walk set, to be paired with RORG?
Between my own Endless Walk (my compass rose does not have CHD so it's not optimal) and SOJ, SOJ is already worse against whites but of course better against elites.
Is the more balanced SOJ preferable or go for white damage in T6?
Also perhaps taking into account playing in group rifts where whites/elites take longer to die.
Edit: My SOJ is 19% Fire and 26% Elite with INT (No CC/CD) "
The comparison I did for both set ups were the following:
-Compass rose / Travellers Pledge (basically max items - avgdmg/CHD/CHC/socket ring and Fire%/CHD/CHC amulet)
-Magic weapon - conduit
-FB chest
vs
-RORG / Generic Amulet (max RORG / Fire%/CHD/CHC amulet)
-Magic weapon - Force weapon
-Cindercoat
I used BDF's spreadsheet to show the damage break down between the fire portion of total damage and the gem DOT damage portion.
With increases in fire elemental % (80% compared to 60%) and the extra 10% from Force weapon, it ended up that the Cindercoat variation did more total DPS compared to Endless Walk set with similar playability in regards to the AP spending.
The travellers set does have some upsides, mainly, eHP related. Extra 250VIT and extra eHP roll on the FB chest, gives it a bit more survivability for what its worth.
The damage output is very close however, from gear alone (no gems) Cindercoat/RORG/force weapon had about ~6.5% stronger DOT. It got a bit more complicated when factoring in the damage from Pain Enhancer and Toxin as well since these were damage sources that did not benefit from the additional 20% fire from Cindercoat. So that needed to be calculated as well, but in the end it appeared the extra fire and force weapon % increases out weighed the gem DOTs.
Keep in mind, this is with near max Endless Walk set. So for people without items like this, RORG will win more decisively. So it makes sense to use the Endless walk set just for extra EHP, and use Conduit rune.
In all scenarios, we keep SOJ because it offers tremendous upside even if some combinations can out perform 20% elemental on the ring, the extra 30% against elites is the kicker and is a noticeable loss.
During this past EXP weekend, I found myself using both Cindercoat and Conduit rune together since AP management was even more important due to speed farming trash. So this is another option I am playing around with right now as well.
It works fine as is, but I want to improve its efficiency especially with the increases to monster density.
Right now, I would suggest using Conduit instead of Force Weapon for better resource management, and to sacrifice some HP and defensive stat rolls for either skill % or area % rolls on gear.
The gains are marginal, but right now we don't need the extra toughness from all the defensive stats.
Will update after more time for testing.
http://youtu.be/1jh9BUnpVTE
Runs ranging from 1:20 to 2:16, all using same build listed in this thread with slight variations for group synergy.
the set bonus stacks itself by applying fire damage.
so your blizzard does damage for a second. then firebird repeats the damage + blizzard tick and so on...
The set bonus will repeat the fire damage dealt to the target in a 3 seconds frame. This effect Stacks...
Thats why the white mobs hp bar empties slowly in the beggining and every more quickly over time, just when casting one blizzard.
That is not the final 3000% dot, but the stacking firebird dot UNTIL 3000%.
if you would remove the 6piece bonus you will not have enough damage in your blizzard to kill the mob.
As Jalatiphra stated, the effect stacks until the infinite DOT threshold is reached and then the 3000% burn kicks in.
Until then there are stacking temporary DOTs that occur as you cast blizzard and other fire skills.
Yes in many situations the monster will die in a single cast of blizzard. Mainly this happens in solo, sometimes multi players. However, I keep in mind that I am almost always running in 4-man groups so I would like to be able to kill elite packs by myself. Many people will say that you have overkill DPS even for groups... however, I aim to KILL the elite as I run through them without missing a step, so that is why the gearing seems a bit over kill. In some cases, you spam all your abilities, you reach the 3000% burn DOT right away and it does give you some extra damage to finish off the elite. So the 6 piece is a MUST use.
I've re-visited some of the calculations, and since I do not own a Ancient Furnace (which is still best in slot) and am currently using an Ancient Devastator and Ancient Firebird Off hand. The highest damage set up for ONE HANDER is RORG/SOJ / Cindercoat/Magefists. So overall I still would choose SOJ/RORG set up over Endless walk set. For two handed set up, the Endless walk set will lose a lot of its value since CHD you gain from the Endless Walk set won't have as big of an impact on the overall DPS compared to a 1-handed set up. Same idea applies to Increasing fire% in 1 handed and 2 handed set ups.
Edited post due to 5 piece bonus calculations!
I do have to say my wiz rolls thru T6 like a well geared Barb and its a little different than the standard Wiz mold. I love her, though. Lotsa fun to be had.
http://us.battle.net/d3/en/profile/pantherdane-1591/hero/39933784
I haven't revisited hexing pants since 2.0 so I can't be 100% sure how it works now but that is what I read about it thus far.
For a Wand of WOH explosive blast build it definitely would challenge for a spot since your constantly on the go.
-
View User Profile
-
View Posts
-
Send Message
ModeratorNeither does it for firebirds. If you do enough damage, you'll trigger the endless DoT.
To give some numbers, I have :
* 5M5 fire sheet dps with hexing pants + fb hands when I move
* 3M9 fire sheet dps with hexing pants + fb hants when I don't move
* 5M1 fire sheet dps with magefist + fb pants
My magefist aren't perfect so the 5M1 can be improved (I lack 0.5% CHC, 3% CHD, and I have 642 int on them).
_____________________________________________________________
I am a big fan of the hexing pants, but it was in builds that could utilize the benefits of the it without really suffering the negatives (pet doctor/ shot gun crusader).
The 25% applies to the gem DOTS your right, but it also decreases them as well. Your stats with the pants on show a small gain with active as well, leading me to lean towards consistency as opposed to potential.
In any event, do we have any information on whether a stop/cast motion (example cast blizzard) will cause the drop in FB DOT? There is usually a slight moment where you stop, but the buff is still active from what I remember.
If the buff is still active when casting blizzard or blackhole, then this definitely becomes a much more attractive and fun option.
Thats a change I was considering, putting on my Hexing Pants. it will require dropping the Illusory Boots or the Cindercoat to maintain the FB DOT. I like the boots and would actually have synergy with the pants. Do you think the Hexing Pants will be a good tradeoff with the Cindercoat?
http://us.battle.net/d3/en/profile/pantherdane-1591/hero/39933784
Basically it's worth it if you play with devastator+firebird eye (high fire % bonus, bonus from cindercoat is relatively small), not worth it with a 2hander. If I remember my calculations correctly, switching from ancient firebird legs and almost perfect cindercoat into hexing pants would give me a ~6% dmg boost. If you don't use glass cannon or force weapon the boost is even higher.