Gonna take a break from running the Beta for just a little while so I can go back to Paragon leveling in live.
Anyway, here's the progress I've made so far after re-importing and wiping my characters for like the third or fourth time. I decided to play around with a cold-based Meteor wizard and I think it does a pretty good job for normal farming runs.
Rift Guardian took forever, though. Oh, well.
Here's a full uncut Nephalem Rift run on Torment II.
I am amazed that you can get by on Torment 2 with less than 5m toughness. I have no chance of survival on Torment 1 with about 10m toughness and a combination of shield generation spells (Blades, Deflection). I think I'll send some feedback to Blizzard because it can't be that it's still so easy to chain-freeze enemies, but the defensive skills (i.e., shield generators) are so useless compared to frost elements.
Do you think this works without the new Frostburn Gloves or are they key? 1.3m DPS is insane, I think the game should aim for a different DPS/toughness ratio, it looks like glass cannons aren't just back, but they're the way to go once again. 1:3 DPS/EHP is a ratio I have seen on no one in beta so far, usually it's more like 1:10.
That's kinda strange. I'm running a frost build (with no chain freezing only thing that freezes is my ice armor and glacial spike) and I'm only running with 570k dps and 3m toughness
Maybe you have a couple of powerful legendaries? I've got zero, just rares. And I also haven't played in a while, but finally might have some time this week. Are you in the DFans clan? I'd love to talk to discuss some builds in-game and play with some wizards to compare performance...
Last time I logged in no one was there to join me on bounties, and solo I was getting my ass handed on Torment 1. After the 20th death or so I just logged out.
Yeah I'm in the Dfans clan so we can play/talk. As for the legendaries I havent gotten very lucky tbh. none that really increase my damage output with a special affix other than hellfire ring and that's sorta neglegable.
was that necessary or important to farm Nephalem Rift on T2? I mean wouldn't it be better if you farm on the difficult that you can one shot the withe monsters? Because from my experience on PTR, there are only 2 or 3 difficulties actually mean something, normal, T1, (or expert if I have the expansion). The best way for me to farm is pick up the difficulty that I can clean the withe monsters in 1 - 2 multishots and stack magic find as many as I can. Does the Nephalem Rift make any different?
was that necessary or important to farm Nephalem Rift on T2? I mean wouldn't it be better if you farm on the difficult that you can one shot the withe monsters? Because from my experience on PTR, there are only 2 or 3 difficulties actually mean something, normal, T1, (or expert if I have the expansion). The best way for me to farm is pick up the difficulty that I can clean the withe monsters in 1 - 2 multishots and stack magic find as many as I can. Does the Nephalem Rift make any different?
@Vyce223: Not online before 6pm CET on weekday, usually.
@raycommon: It probably wasn't "necessary", but there are many reasons why you wanna run T2. First of all, playing on the PTR doesn't mean to go for the path of least resistance. All these people who run 24/7 normal contribute almost zero to beta testing purposes. By running T2, the increased requirements to your character's gear, playstyle, and chosen spec allow you to really put these variables to the test. If you're one-shotting content, you can't really do that. Furthermore, hopefully it will be beneficial for you to run the highest possible difficulty there is, and not just Torment 1 all the time. It's a matter of tuning. Please let us never go back to the mindset of "let's do Alkaizer runs 24/7 on MP0" again. No one wants to see this ever again.
In RoS's current state I perceive that you really want to go to Torment 1 as fast as possible, but from there you just pick the Torment difficulty that feels right for you. A perfectly balanced game should allow you to get roughly the same XP/hour and items/hour regardless of difficulty, maybe slightly more on higher levels but not that much that people on T1 feel like they're wasting their time. The fact that WW barbs on MP10 @live make 500m XP/hour, but most of my friends can't get past MP7 and average about 30-50m XP/hour makes me sick. It makes me even more sick when people perceive anything but the "most efficient difficulty level" as "unnecessary and useless". It's just a mindset that I completely disagree with. Maybe Jaetch was just running T2 for fun, who knows...
It's just that the current difficulties make me kind of confuse. From what I experienced on the PTR, you don't have to play the highest difficulty as possible. The rewards are really slightly different and it's great. I mean, the monster power thing is a torture to me. I had to keep gearing up my characters for better rewards.
In the video, I saw that Jaetch was playing on T2 and it wasn't really fast or efficient ( no offense ). It makes me wonder if there is some kind of reason that he picked this difficulty. Like the reward is actually much better than I though, so even he wasn't doing the Nephalem Rift fast but the sweet rewards make everything worth. And Torment is just another monster power system, I have to keep gearing up my characters again.
The efficient way of farming wasn't the thing I was trying to find out. Sorry about the confusion.
It's not like on Torment 1 he would be one-shotting anything, not at all. Don't compare the level 60 PTR difficulty scaling with that on level 70. Actually, don't compare level 60 with level 70 at all. The PTR and beta share the same server, but that is the one and only commonality. Once you hit level 70 it's almost like an entirely new game.
I'm not sure if Torment 2 is a bit better in terms of loot/money/whatever, but it sure as hell should be once Blizzard's finished balancing. In the meantime, getting to higher Torment levels is the only goal in playing the beta. There's absolutely no point in spending all your time on Torment 1 or even Normal, it's boring and doesn't help to evaluate which skills are useless and which are overpowered.
@Bagstone - Yeah, I get by with crowd control. The Frostburn I rolled actually sucks compared to others (which I believe roll higher than 35% chance to freeze instead of chill). Basically everything I do has a chance to freeze. Ice Blades can freeze. Comet can freeze by default and also freeze if it doesn't happen to proc on its own. Ice Armor can freeze. Black Hole Absolute Zero can freeze. My Enchantress has ~18% chance to freeze. Her Erosion skill (AOE DoT spell) can also proc the freeze from her gear. I also have some minor stun on Frostburn and my Enchantress casts Charm often enough to help take some attention off me.
I used to rock the good ol' 10M toughness in previous iterations of the Beta. I went with crowd control this time and it's nowhere near where I want it to be since I know there are a lot of Frost Nova-based legendary items (Frost Hydra wizard hat, Winter Flurry, the Swami, this weapon I can't remember) and other cold based items out there (Azurewrath, Rimeheart). So yes, all this freezing is because of Frostburn and the wizard's huge arsenal of cold spells. However, the eDPS of this build isn't as great as some others, like Fire wizard builds (using Magefist, Cindercoat, other fire bonus items). But then again, it does make up for the eDPS loss with the crowd control.
@raycommon - I would normally run Torment I for the Torment only legendaries (still don't know which are which). However, for the sake of testing progression, I push myself to go toward higher difficulty levels. I even tried Torment III with this build. Works, but not nearly as well because of the lack of stats on gear. Things take double the time to kill and deal more damage.
Awesome info Jaetch. And it's very interesting to see the end-game differences of 2 different elements (Fire/Ice), I hope we see more of those on live.
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Anyway, here's the progress I've made so far after re-importing and wiping my characters for like the third or fourth time. I decided to play around with a cold-based Meteor wizard and I think it does a pretty good job for normal farming runs.
Rift Guardian took forever, though. Oh, well.
Here's a full uncut Nephalem Rift run on Torment II.
Gear:
Armory | YouTube | Twitter | Clan Site
Thank you for taking the time to post this for those of us who aren't fortunate enough to get into the beta.
They really need to do something with the Rift Guardians
Armory | YouTube | Twitter | Clan Site
Nice video. I laughed when the Rift Guardian just gave up.
rift guardiands are too weak and dumb....
I am amazed that you can get by on Torment 2 with less than 5m toughness. I have no chance of survival on Torment 1 with about 10m toughness and a combination of shield generation spells (Blades, Deflection). I think I'll send some feedback to Blizzard because it can't be that it's still so easy to chain-freeze enemies, but the defensive skills (i.e., shield generators) are so useless compared to frost elements.
Do you think this works without the new Frostburn Gloves or are they key? 1.3m DPS is insane, I think the game should aim for a different DPS/toughness ratio, it looks like glass cannons aren't just back, but they're the way to go once again. 1:3 DPS/EHP is a ratio I have seen on no one in beta so far, usually it's more like 1:10.
That's kinda strange. I'm running a frost build (with no chain freezing only thing that freezes is my ice armor and glacial spike) and I'm only running with 570k dps and 3m toughness
Maybe you have a couple of powerful legendaries? I've got zero, just rares. And I also haven't played in a while, but finally might have some time this week. Are you in the DFans clan? I'd love to talk to discuss some builds in-game and play with some wizards to compare performance...
Last time I logged in no one was there to join me on bounties, and solo I was getting my ass handed on Torment 1. After the 20th death or so I just logged out.
Yeah I'm in the Dfans clan so we can play/talk. As for the legendaries I havent gotten very lucky tbh. none that really increase my damage output with a special affix other than hellfire ring and that's sorta neglegable.
I'm also on currently and will be for a bit.
was that necessary or important to farm Nephalem Rift on T2? I mean wouldn't it be better if you farm on the difficult that you can one shot the withe monsters? Because from my experience on PTR, there are only 2 or 3 difficulties actually mean something, normal, T1, (or expert if I have the expansion). The best way for me to farm is pick up the difficulty that I can clean the withe monsters in 1 - 2 multishots and stack magic find as many as I can. Does the Nephalem Rift make any different?
@Vyce223: Not online before 6pm CET on weekday, usually.
@raycommon: It probably wasn't "necessary", but there are many reasons why you wanna run T2. First of all, playing on the PTR doesn't mean to go for the path of least resistance. All these people who run 24/7 normal contribute almost zero to beta testing purposes. By running T2, the increased requirements to your character's gear, playstyle, and chosen spec allow you to really put these variables to the test. If you're one-shotting content, you can't really do that. Furthermore, hopefully it will be beneficial for you to run the highest possible difficulty there is, and not just Torment 1 all the time. It's a matter of tuning. Please let us never go back to the mindset of "let's do Alkaizer runs 24/7 on MP0" again. No one wants to see this ever again.
In RoS's current state I perceive that you really want to go to Torment 1 as fast as possible, but from there you just pick the Torment difficulty that feels right for you. A perfectly balanced game should allow you to get roughly the same XP/hour and items/hour regardless of difficulty, maybe slightly more on higher levels but not that much that people on T1 feel like they're wasting their time. The fact that WW barbs on MP10 @live make 500m XP/hour, but most of my friends can't get past MP7 and average about 30-50m XP/hour makes me sick. It makes me even more sick when people perceive anything but the "most efficient difficulty level" as "unnecessary and useless". It's just a mindset that I completely disagree with. Maybe Jaetch was just running T2 for fun, who knows...
It's not like on Torment 1 he would be one-shotting anything, not at all. Don't compare the level 60 PTR difficulty scaling with that on level 70. Actually, don't compare level 60 with level 70 at all. The PTR and beta share the same server, but that is the one and only commonality. Once you hit level 70 it's almost like an entirely new game.
I'm not sure if Torment 2 is a bit better in terms of loot/money/whatever, but it sure as hell should be once Blizzard's finished balancing. In the meantime, getting to higher Torment levels is the only goal in playing the beta. There's absolutely no point in spending all your time on Torment 1 or even Normal, it's boring and doesn't help to evaluate which skills are useless and which are overpowered.
I used to rock the good ol' 10M toughness in previous iterations of the Beta. I went with crowd control this time and it's nowhere near where I want it to be since I know there are a lot of Frost Nova-based legendary items (Frost Hydra wizard hat, Winter Flurry, the Swami, this weapon I can't remember) and other cold based items out there (Azurewrath, Rimeheart). So yes, all this freezing is because of Frostburn and the wizard's huge arsenal of cold spells. However, the eDPS of this build isn't as great as some others, like Fire wizard builds (using Magefist, Cindercoat, other fire bonus items). But then again, it does make up for the eDPS loss with the crowd control.
@raycommon - I would normally run Torment I for the Torment only legendaries (still don't know which are which). However, for the sake of testing progression, I push myself to go toward higher difficulty levels. I even tried Torment III with this build. Works, but not nearly as well because of the lack of stats on gear. Things take double the time to kill and deal more damage.
Armory | YouTube | Twitter | Clan Site
Thanks for clearing that up for me.
Is that chantodo pre or post changes to reforging 60 items? I recall they planned on preventing such weapons but wasn't sure if anything happened yet.
Awesome info Jaetch. And it's very interesting to see the end-game differences of 2 different elements (Fire/Ice), I hope we see more of those on live.