After taking some time away from the game I returned a couple of weeks ago. I seem to be a little stuck on what to upgrade next. At this point I feel comfortable farming in MP7. I have jumped into MP8+ but it feels a little slow, and my lack of all res can make things interesting. I also feel like I'm stuck using a Skorn because the high amount of life steal is the only thing that keeps me alive. I've crafted some nice gloves, and after what feels like 1000 attempts, a pretty bad amulet.
Would it be better for me to buy a Skorn with higher dps, or go for a mainhand/off hand combo? Or is there something else that would be much more effective to upgrade? Ultimately I want to be in MP10.
I'm willing to spend maybe $40 +/-
To be in MP10 with Archon, you need about 600k buffed dps which requires at least 5-10 bil worth of gear. Otherwise it just won't be very efficient. You also want pretty high EHP, like 500-600k, buffed in Archon form.
Your AR really seems to be lacking, which is very important for higher MP. Using a 1h+OH should greatly improve your dps, but without more mitigation your survivability might suffer, mainly against RD mobs. You can cheese those a bit by stacking extra physical resist, or better yet, physical resist and AR on the same piece.
In addition to the 1h+OH, you should consider getting zuni 2 pc (boots+ring). That should raise your dps over the IC, and if you get AR on the boots, it will give you a decent amount of EHP.
I would have suggested starting with crafting bracers and shoulders over ammy or gloves. With a good pair of bracers you can gain decent EHP and then swap your pants for Inna's. You'll lose some HP from that switch though, but since your pants don't have any significant mitigation stats, it won't be too bad.
I'd drop the helm for a mempo. If you can't afford one with crit, since other slots might be a bit pricey, you can always spend 10 mil or less and just get one with 200+int and 50+vit. You also might need to use a Life% gem in the helm to better survive higher MP, but it's up to you.
Your chest has a wasted roll that could be extra vit, though AR+high vit tal chests are usually expensive, so I recommend armor+vit, like the one I have on. With pinpoint barrier I get about the same mit as a 60 AR chest, but it depends on your other stats.
Your belt is lacking in any significant defensive stats. I really like getting at least a high AR roll on the belt, but it's not cheap to find one with high CD and int rolls. The physical resist is nice though, so if you want to cheese the RD mobs, then your belt is decent.
One last note: if you decide to upgrade to a 1h+OH, similar to what most Archons use, I highly recommend looking for an OH with 70+vit or so. It's really helpful to get extra vit on the OH to make up for not having it on other pieces, like your pants.
^You're not going to outplay a comparably, price wise, equipped barb. You may get close but you will not out exp/hour one. On my new barb I'm at lv80 with just 36 hours played. That includes a handful of uber runs too so it'd be even quicker without those. I dont even use rend either, just ww/sprint with hota for elites. A rend barb that just killed trash mobs would be even quicker than me.
Kind of getting off topic here, but when we are talking about efficiency between classes we really should only talk about MP10. Otherwise why not MP6 or MP5 or MP1. IMO teleport archon is not efficient at MP10, unless you have some really truly godly gear. Also, ownzor you really need to link your profile in your signature so that people can look at your gear and skills to make up their own minds.
I am 560K buffed with scoundrel ( 580K ish against) elites, and my EHP is very high (especially against elites) and MP 10 doesn't give me much of a problem (especially when you factor in cold blooded), though MP9 would probably be more efficient.
As for the OP, not going to add much to what Loroese said, except to re-iterate that you should look at Jaetch's archon video, read Loroese's and Bagstone's threads on Archon and gearing and finally use d3UP, or Loroese's spreadsheet (my personal favorite) when making gearing choices. Look at how archon wizards gear (for example Loroese's or my profiles) for high MP levels. And feel free to ask further questions.
^You also play on a lower mp which means you have to kill more for the same exp so of course your kill count will be higher for that character. I've gone through multiple methods of leveling through all the patches (low mp, scoprion runs, various acts, etc) and I've never noticed less legs from skipping elites. I still get about the same number of legs. Makes sense as your'e killing more enemies in the same amount of time by not wasting time on elites. So in effect, the overall drop rate of legs is about the same.
This thread even documents legs found from skipping elites.
Thanks for the reply Loroese. To everyone else, you really did derail the *^$@ out of my thread.
I spent a bit of money and bought a new mainhand/offhand, pants, and some gold to get a couple gems and pay for more crafting etc. I tried to buy out a really nice witching hour with int/vit/ar but the auction failed for some reason. I'll have to try again later.
As far as crafting bracers first, I would have to disagree. My other slots were terrible in comparison at the time, and I love the movement speed on lacunis. I've checked out some innas pants, but chose the depth diggers over them for the high int/vit/ar. I've actually raised my ar enough to farm mp8 much more effectively solo or coop.
I really wanted to replace my helm with something that had ar, everything I found was way over budget though. This is again something I'll have to look at later. I can always watch the AH and maybe find something relatively cheap.
With these changes I'm sitting at 338k buffed, much better than before :Thumbs Up: RD mobs are a slight nuisance, nothing I can't work around though. And in the near future when I hopefully get ar on another piece or two, they won't be a problem at all.
Thanks again, and if anyone else has more advice or would like to critique my gear please chime in.
As far as crafting bracers first, I would have to disagree. My other slots were terrible in comparison at the time, and I love the movement speed on lacunis. I've checked out some innas pants, but chose the depth diggers over them for the high int/vit/ar. I've actually raised my ar enough to farm mp8 much more effectively solo or coop.
The problem with depth diggers/blackthornes etc are that they are pure EHP pieces. Not crit, crit dmg or attack speed. On the other hand lacuni's are generally pure dps pieces unless you can afford those with AR or armor, and even then they tend to be low ehp pieces. Your lacuni's have no AR or armor.
So currently you have pants which have low dps but high EHP and lacunis' that have low EHP but high dps.
If you craft bracers (like those on my wizard) you can almost makeup the dps from the lacuni's while having very high
EHP and then swap inna's pants in for high damage. So basically, you now have more damage and almost as good or better EHP then before. Of course the depth diggers do give you some MF while leveling paragon, but for an archon build you very rarely see depth diggers being used. Listen to Loroese, he knows what he is talking about.
As far as crafting bracers first, I would have to disagree. My other slots were terrible in comparison at the time, and I love the movement speed on lacunis. I've checked out some innas pants, but chose the depth diggers over them for the high int/vit/ar. I've actually raised my ar enough to farm mp8 much more effectively solo or coop.
The problem with depth diggers/blackthornes etc are that they are pure EHP pieces. Not crit, crit dmg or attack speed. On the other hand lacuni's are generally pure dps pieces unless you can afford those with AR or armor, and even then they tend to be low ehp pieces. Your lacuni's have no AR or armor.
So currently you have pants which have low dps but high EHP and lacunis' that have low EHP but high dps.
If you craft bracers (like those on my wizard) you can almost makeup the dps from the lacuni's while having very high
EHP and then swap inna's pants in for high damage. So basically, you now have more damage and almost as good or better EHP then before. Of course the depth diggers do give you some MF while leveling paragon, but for an archon build you very rarely see depth diggers being used. Listen to Loroese, he knows what he is talking about.
Yeah, that's the general idea. The combination of Inna's + crafted bracers should give the highest dps potential while keeping the 24% movement speed. You can use Lacuni for high dps and use some EHP pants, but your overall dps likely won't be as good. Sure the EHP of inna's is really bad, but you can get decent EHP on the bracers, hopefully, and make up the EHP on other pieces.
Other options are fine, if preferred. I just happen to like inna's + crafted, and it doesn't hurt that I have a couple decent crafted bracers. That and really good Lacuni are very expensive (high int, high CC, plus AR and/or vit). It doesn't hurt that Inna's without vit are dirt cheap.
1. Lacuni + Inna's Pros:
- Highest possible DPS combo (200 int, 9/6 Lacuni + 100 int Inna's) Cons:
- Wasted movement speed if you already run MS on boots (almost always)
- Horrible EHP unless you get double vitality Inna's or up to 100 vit + 80 AR Lacuni, but that will cost you in terms of DPS
2. Lacuni + Depth Diggers Pros:
- High DPS potential, but never as high as perfect Lacuni + Inna's
- Decent mitigation from the innate AR on Depth Diggers
- Can roll 300 int, 100 vit, 2 sockets or 300 int, 300 vit (no sockets) on Depth Diggers Cons:
- Must have MS on boots if 24% MS is important for you
- EHP isn't all that great unless you roll EHP on Lacuni, but again that will cost you DPS
3. Lacuni + Rare Pants Pros:
- Great balance if you focus all your DPS on Lacuni and get int+EHP on pants (up to 200 int, 300 vit, 854 total armor, 80 AR, 2 sockets) Cons:
- Difficult to manage because of the rarity of max DPS Lacuni and balanced DPS+EHP rare pants
- Must have MS on boots if 24% MS is important for you
4. Lacuni + Blackthorne's Jousting Mail Pros:
- Great balance if you focus all your DPS on Lacuni and get EHP on pants. Different combinations are viable for BT pants:
Up to 200 int, 200 vit, 80 AR, with 100 dex, 100 strength (for total 557 armor), and 12% life
Up to 200 int, 400 vit, 100 dex, 100 strength (total 557 armor), and 12% life
Up to 100 int, 100 vit, 80 AR, 100 dex, 100 strength + armor roll (for total 954 armor), and 12% life
Up to 100 int, 300 vit, 100 dex, 100 strength (total 557 armor), 12% life, and 2 sockets
etc.
- Mitigation will not be as good as Lacuni + rare pants, but much more base HP
- Great BT pants are generally cheaper than high vit+AR+armor rare pants Cons:
- Difficult to manage because of the rarity of max DPS Lacuni and perfect EHP BT pants
- Must have MS on boots if 24% MS is important for you
5. Rare Bracers + Inna's Pros:
- Great balance in terms of DPS and EHP (up to 100 int, 100 vit on Inna's; up to 330 int, 200 vit, 80 AR, 485 total armor, 6 cc)
- Inna's is flexible - can get up to 100/100 version, or up to 200 vit version, or 80 AR version for mitigation. Cons:
- Incredibly difficult to craft the best rare bracers
- Perfect 100/100 Inna's are very expensive
- Must have MS on boots if 24% MS is important for you
...
You can definitely put a lot more thought into what you want to go with. I have a high DPS Lacuni + high int/vit/sockets Depth Diggers at the moment. I also have 100 int, 296 vit, 2 socket BT pants (currently on my WD). And I also have 94/94 Inna's in my stash. From personal experience, I actually prefer my current Lacuni + Depth Diggers combo. It's about +1K DPS and +30K EHP more than my Inna's + rare bracers combo (290+ int, 70 AR, 350+ total armor, 6 cc). If I can roll the same bracers with high vitality, I'd probably go with Inna's + rare bracers.
I'll add this to another thread if people want to discuss this more. OP is not pants+bracers specific in terms of gear upgrades.
Would it be better for me to buy a Skorn with higher dps, or go for a mainhand/off hand combo? Or is there something else that would be much more effective to upgrade? Ultimately I want to be in MP10.
I'm willing to spend maybe $40 +/-
http://us.battle.net/d3/en/profile/Haze-1495/hero/8452487 my wiz profile
Your AR really seems to be lacking, which is very important for higher MP. Using a 1h+OH should greatly improve your dps, but without more mitigation your survivability might suffer, mainly against RD mobs. You can cheese those a bit by stacking extra physical resist, or better yet, physical resist and AR on the same piece.
In addition to the 1h+OH, you should consider getting zuni 2 pc (boots+ring). That should raise your dps over the IC, and if you get AR on the boots, it will give you a decent amount of EHP.
I would have suggested starting with crafting bracers and shoulders over ammy or gloves. With a good pair of bracers you can gain decent EHP and then swap your pants for Inna's. You'll lose some HP from that switch though, but since your pants don't have any significant mitigation stats, it won't be too bad.
I'd drop the helm for a mempo. If you can't afford one with crit, since other slots might be a bit pricey, you can always spend 10 mil or less and just get one with 200+int and 50+vit. You also might need to use a Life% gem in the helm to better survive higher MP, but it's up to you.
Your chest has a wasted roll that could be extra vit, though AR+high vit tal chests are usually expensive, so I recommend armor+vit, like the one I have on. With pinpoint barrier I get about the same mit as a 60 AR chest, but it depends on your other stats.
Your belt is lacking in any significant defensive stats. I really like getting at least a high AR roll on the belt, but it's not cheap to find one with high CD and int rolls. The physical resist is nice though, so if you want to cheese the RD mobs, then your belt is decent.
One last note: if you decide to upgrade to a 1h+OH, similar to what most Archons use, I highly recommend looking for an OH with 70+vit or so. It's really helpful to get extra vit on the OH to make up for not having it on other pieces, like your pants.
Crusader DPS and EHP Spreadsheet, meant for Crusaders
My Wizard
I am 560K buffed with scoundrel ( 580K ish against) elites, and my EHP is very high (especially against elites) and MP 10 doesn't give me much of a problem (especially when you factor in cold blooded), though MP9 would probably be more efficient.
As for the OP, not going to add much to what Loroese said, except to re-iterate that you should look at Jaetch's archon video, read Loroese's and Bagstone's threads on Archon and gearing and finally use d3UP, or Loroese's spreadsheet (my personal favorite) when making gearing choices. Look at how archon wizards gear (for example Loroese's or my profiles) for high MP levels. And feel free to ask further questions.
Pretty similar to your route. I stack up to 5 NV then skip elites after.
Vota just to 5 NV, oasis, ruins, channels, thats it.
This thread even documents legs found from skipping elites.
http://www.diablofans.com/topic/99734-experience-leg-farming-testing-zones/
Why dont you post your profile so we can see your gear and characters?
And sorry to the OP, this thread has been thoroughly derailed.
I spent a bit of money and bought a new mainhand/offhand, pants, and some gold to get a couple gems and pay for more crafting etc. I tried to buy out a really nice witching hour with int/vit/ar but the auction failed for some reason. I'll have to try again later.
As far as crafting bracers first, I would have to disagree. My other slots were terrible in comparison at the time, and I love the movement speed on lacunis. I've checked out some innas pants, but chose the depth diggers over them for the high int/vit/ar. I've actually raised my ar enough to farm mp8 much more effectively solo or coop.
I really wanted to replace my helm with something that had ar, everything I found was way over budget though. This is again something I'll have to look at later. I can always watch the AH and maybe find something relatively cheap.
With these changes I'm sitting at 338k buffed, much better than before :Thumbs Up: RD mobs are a slight nuisance, nothing I can't work around though. And in the near future when I hopefully get ar on another piece or two, they won't be a problem at all.
Thanks again, and if anyone else has more advice or would like to critique my gear please chime in.
Haze.
The problem with depth diggers/blackthornes etc are that they are pure EHP pieces. Not crit, crit dmg or attack speed. On the other hand lacuni's are generally pure dps pieces unless you can afford those with AR or armor, and even then they tend to be low ehp pieces. Your lacuni's have no AR or armor.
So currently you have pants which have low dps but high EHP and lacunis' that have low EHP but high dps.
If you craft bracers (like those on my wizard) you can almost makeup the dps from the lacuni's while having very high
EHP and then swap inna's pants in for high damage. So basically, you now have more damage and almost as good or better EHP then before. Of course the depth diggers do give you some MF while leveling paragon, but for an archon build you very rarely see depth diggers being used. Listen to Loroese, he knows what he is talking about.
Yeah, that's the general idea. The combination of Inna's + crafted bracers should give the highest dps potential while keeping the 24% movement speed. You can use Lacuni for high dps and use some EHP pants, but your overall dps likely won't be as good. Sure the EHP of inna's is really bad, but you can get decent EHP on the bracers, hopefully, and make up the EHP on other pieces.
Other options are fine, if preferred. I just happen to like inna's + crafted, and it doesn't hurt that I have a couple decent crafted bracers. That and really good Lacuni are very expensive (high int, high CC, plus AR and/or vit). It doesn't hurt that Inna's without vit are dirt cheap.
Crusader DPS and EHP Spreadsheet, meant for Crusaders
My Wizard
1. Lacuni + Inna's
Pros:
- Highest possible DPS combo (200 int, 9/6 Lacuni + 100 int Inna's)
Cons:
- Wasted movement speed if you already run MS on boots (almost always)
- Horrible EHP unless you get double vitality Inna's or up to 100 vit + 80 AR Lacuni, but that will cost you in terms of DPS
2. Lacuni + Depth Diggers
Pros:
- High DPS potential, but never as high as perfect Lacuni + Inna's
- Decent mitigation from the innate AR on Depth Diggers
- Can roll 300 int, 100 vit, 2 sockets or 300 int, 300 vit (no sockets) on Depth Diggers
Cons:
- Must have MS on boots if 24% MS is important for you
- EHP isn't all that great unless you roll EHP on Lacuni, but again that will cost you DPS
3. Lacuni + Rare Pants
Pros:
- Great balance if you focus all your DPS on Lacuni and get int+EHP on pants (up to 200 int, 300 vit, 854 total armor, 80 AR, 2 sockets)
Cons:
- Difficult to manage because of the rarity of max DPS Lacuni and balanced DPS+EHP rare pants
- Must have MS on boots if 24% MS is important for you
4. Lacuni + Blackthorne's Jousting Mail
Pros:
- Great balance if you focus all your DPS on Lacuni and get EHP on pants. Different combinations are viable for BT pants:
- Great BT pants are generally cheaper than high vit+AR+armor rare pants
Cons:
- Difficult to manage because of the rarity of max DPS Lacuni and perfect EHP BT pants
- Must have MS on boots if 24% MS is important for you
5. Rare Bracers + Inna's
Pros:
- Great balance in terms of DPS and EHP (up to 100 int, 100 vit on Inna's; up to 330 int, 200 vit, 80 AR, 485 total armor, 6 cc)
- Inna's is flexible - can get up to 100/100 version, or up to 200 vit version, or 80 AR version for mitigation.
Cons:
- Incredibly difficult to craft the best rare bracers
- Perfect 100/100 Inna's are very expensive
- Must have MS on boots if 24% MS is important for you
...
You can definitely put a lot more thought into what you want to go with. I have a high DPS Lacuni + high int/vit/sockets Depth Diggers at the moment. I also have 100 int, 296 vit, 2 socket BT pants (currently on my WD). And I also have 94/94 Inna's in my stash. From personal experience, I actually prefer my current Lacuni + Depth Diggers combo. It's about +1K DPS and +30K EHP more than my Inna's + rare bracers combo (290+ int, 70 AR, 350+ total armor, 6 cc). If I can roll the same bracers with high vitality, I'd probably go with Inna's + rare bracers.
I'll add this to another thread if people want to discuss this more. OP is not pants+bracers specific in terms of gear upgrades.
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